“Born of water...” -- exactly what does it mean?
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Why did you say "no mention of water" when it was staring you in the face?
25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you. [THE WATER FOR THE NEW BIRTH]
And while this passage speaks about the future restoration of Israel, the New Covenant went into effect the day Christ died, and the Holy Spirit was poured out fifty days later.
25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you. [THE WATER FOR THE NEW BIRTH]
And while this passage speaks about the future restoration of Israel, the New Covenant went into effect the day Christ died, and the Holy Spirit was poured out fifty days later.
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1. The water is not baptism, I showed what the water was.
2. TYhat is not talking about the new covenant, It is talking about Isreal repentance and restoration. At that time God will sprinkle clean water on THEM (Israel) and cleanse them from all their sin that have been punished for since babylon first took them out.
2. TYhat is not talking about the new covenant, It is talking about Isreal repentance and restoration. At that time God will sprinkle clean water on THEM (Israel) and cleanse them from all their sin that have been punished for since babylon first took them out.
#1: "So this automatically cancels out any ordinary or natural agent -- ordinary water -- in the regeneration of a lost soul."
Are we absolutely sure about this statement?
Jesus apparently thought that ordinary water played a role in salvation when conjoined with faith in the gospel. ""He who has believed and has been baptized shall be saved." (Mark 16: 15)
According to Heb. 10: 22, while our bodies are washed with pure water (baptism?) our hearts are being sprinkled clean with the blood of Christ. (Heb. 9: 14)
Peter seemed to think that ordinary water played a role in salvation. "Baptism now save you." (1 Peter 3: 21)
God bless.
Are we absolutely sure about this statement?
Jesus apparently thought that ordinary water played a role in salvation when conjoined with faith in the gospel. ""He who has believed and has been baptized shall be saved." (Mark 16: 15)
According to Heb. 10: 22, while our bodies are washed with pure water (baptism?) our hearts are being sprinkled clean with the blood of Christ. (Heb. 9: 14)
Peter seemed to think that ordinary water played a role in salvation. "Baptism now save you." (1 Peter 3: 21)
God bless.
#1: "And if baptism was necessary for salvation, we would not have this statement by Paul (1 Cor 1:17): For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect."
Again, are we sure of this statement?
IMO 1 Cor. 1: 17 has nothing to do with the validity of baptism and everything to do with the claim of some to have been baptized by various ones and creating controversy about a non-issue.
God bless
Again, are we sure of this statement?
IMO 1 Cor. 1: 17 has nothing to do with the validity of baptism and everything to do with the claim of some to have been baptized by various ones and creating controversy about a non-issue.
God bless
Where is the water? [SUP]35 [/SUP]Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus. [SUP]36 [/SUP]And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized? [SUP]37 [/SUP]And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. [SUP]38 [/SUP]And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him. [SUP]39 [/SUP]And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.
The Holy Bible: King James Version. (2009). (Electronic Edition of the 1900 Authorized Version., Ac 8:35–39). Bellingham, WA: Logos Research Systems, Inc.
The Holy Bible: King James Version. (2009). (Electronic Edition of the 1900 Authorized Version., Ac 8:35–39). Bellingham, WA: Logos Research Systems, Inc.
Truly, truly, I say unto you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
(1) As far as I can find there is only one ordinance that deals with water--- baptism in water in the name of Christ.
(2) This baptism is for all nations, all creation, as many as God shall call to Himself.
(3) This baptism has biblical reference to becoming a disciple, repentance, forgiveness of sin. salvation, entering a relationship with Christ, dying with our Lord, being buried with our Lord, arising with our Lord, becoming a son of God, being clothed with Christ, receiving the Holy Spirit, appealing to God for a good conscience, perfecting our faith, etc.
(4) Water and Spirit are connected in Ez. 36: 25-27; Matt 3: 13-17; Acts 2: 37-39; Acts 10: 44- 48; Acts 8: 13- 15; Acts 19: 5,6.
So what to we do when looking for an understanding of this passage? We go to metaphors and doctrines and experiences.
May God bless us so that we might deny ourselves.
(1) As far as I can find there is only one ordinance that deals with water--- baptism in water in the name of Christ.
(2) This baptism is for all nations, all creation, as many as God shall call to Himself.
(3) This baptism has biblical reference to becoming a disciple, repentance, forgiveness of sin. salvation, entering a relationship with Christ, dying with our Lord, being buried with our Lord, arising with our Lord, becoming a son of God, being clothed with Christ, receiving the Holy Spirit, appealing to God for a good conscience, perfecting our faith, etc.
(4) Water and Spirit are connected in Ez. 36: 25-27; Matt 3: 13-17; Acts 2: 37-39; Acts 10: 44- 48; Acts 8: 13- 15; Acts 19: 5,6.
So what to we do when looking for an understanding of this passage? We go to metaphors and doctrines and experiences.
May God bless us so that we might deny ourselves.
The water Jesus talked about was not water baptisim, nor birth in the womb water. It was all about the Holy Spirit. ST. JOHN; 4; 13-14; Jesus answered and said unto her, Whosoever drinketh of this water shall thirst again; 14; But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life. ST. JOHN; 7; 37-38; In the last day ,that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried,saying, if any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink. 38. He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water. Jesus spoke of spiritual water which is the holy spirit. This was not carnal, only spiritual.
Learn what baptism is. no substance can cause you to be born again. The woman at the well ask for water substance that might have been different than the water she was drinking, but Jesus told her that with that kind of water ,she would thirst again. He told her that the water he had, she wold never thirst again. and that is spiritual and the Holy Ghost.
Unless explained otherwise baptism simply means to dip or submerge into water. Much like to bathe or shower means with water. If someone was to say that they were going to "take a bath" the tacit understanding would to be with water and not so other substance or in a metaphoric way.
With the woman at the well, Jesus was using water in a metaphoric sense. That is quite clear in the verbiage. Jesus makes no attempt to alter the meaning of water when dealing with Nicodemus. He does not use the accepted phrase "born of woman" to imply nature birth nor does He use "living water" as you are suggesting.
With the woman at the well, Jesus was using water in a metaphoric sense. That is quite clear in the verbiage. Jesus makes no attempt to alter the meaning of water when dealing with Nicodemus. He does not use the accepted phrase "born of woman" to imply nature birth nor does He use "living water" as you are suggesting.
Since we are on the subject of baptism, There are several kinds of baptism, not just water, but the most important is the baptism of the Holy Ghost, which only God can give. ST. MATTHEW; 20;22; But Jesus answered and said, Ye know not what ye ask ,Are ye able to drink of the cup that I shall drink of.,and to be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with?..Here everyone of his disciples had already been baptized with water. ST. MARK;1;4; John preached the baptism of repentance. Romans;6'4; Jesus death was a baptism..
None of this changes what Jesus said in John 3:5.
Jesus is not speaking of baptism in a metaphoric way to Nicodemus as He is in Matthew 20:22. In Acts 2:38 when Peter was asked "what must we do?" he commanded the only baptism that could be done, water. It was this baptism that was "so that your sins will be forgiven" and to "receive the gift of the Holy Spirit" was proclaimed.
It is this simple truth that is being expressed by Jesus in John 3:5.
Jesus is not speaking of baptism in a metaphoric way to Nicodemus as He is in Matthew 20:22. In Acts 2:38 when Peter was asked "what must we do?" he commanded the only baptism that could be done, water. It was this baptism that was "so that your sins will be forgiven" and to "receive the gift of the Holy Spirit" was proclaimed.
It is this simple truth that is being expressed by Jesus in John 3:5.