Be perfect as your heavenly Father is perfect

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R

Revelator7

Guest
#1
Perfection to me is not in how something looks but it is in how something works. Imagine a door. The door is made out of the finest wood and it has carvings of images of the most beautiful craftsmanship inlaid in it. The door has a knob that is made of crystal glass. The only problem is this door doesn't close right and it makes a horrible loud sound when you open and close it. Now imagine a door that is beat up and looks like it belongs in a run down shack. But the door closes right and is the quietest door, no squeaking. Which door is perfect? The one that works. It is my opinion that simple obedience to God in all things is what makes a Christian perfect. The Bible says the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience.
 
Oct 31, 2011
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#2
It is truly a balancing act. We are to be perfect, and not in our own eyes by our own standards but by the Lord's standards. This perfection requires works, and we will be judged by them and still compared to the Lord our works are as filthy rags. The Lord does not look at our works alone, but at our heart that inspires our works. We are to never tire or stop working at perfection, and at the same time know it is only the Lord who is perfect, we are born in sin and can never reach it.

We are to know all these things, but any time these things are not balanced they are in error.
 
Jan 19, 2013
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#3
Perfection to me is not in how something looks but it is in how something works.
In the NT, perfection is "completed."

It is my opinion that simple obedience to God in all things is what makes a Christian perfect.
And it is NT doctrine that no one does this (1Jn 2:8, 10).
 
J

JesusIsAll

Guest
#6
You been stayin' outa' rabbit holes?
Pert near. Jes a hurryin' ta waitin' fer da sun go down, tho, lessin' folk 'o da sabbit dun thro me too da rabbit, fer typin' dis heer PSee, et da folk on CC! Mercy!
 

wattie

Senior Member
Feb 24, 2009
3,040
1,027
113
New Zealand
#7
Yeah, guys.. whenever you see the word 'perfect' in the bible -- it is about completion, maturity, something lacking nothing necessary for completeness.

100 percent perfection in terms of sinlessness- is impossible for humans. Being a mature, biblically grounded christian in a good church is not impossible.. and this is what the bible is saying for us to be like.

Here is the strongs defintion:
G5048
τελειόω
teleioō
tel-i-o'-o
From G5046; to complete, that is, (literally) accomplish, or (figuratively)
consummate (in character): - consecrate, finish, fulfil, (make) perfect.
So the biblical definition isn't actually the same as what is generally thought as sinlessness- or lacking no imperfections. It's more about maturity and completion.
 
R

Revelator7

Guest
#8
In the NT, perfection is "completed."


And it is NT doctrine that no one does this (1Jn 2:8, 10).
First of all, in the NT in Matthew 5:48 Jesus commands his diciples to be perfect as God is perfect. For you to refute me with "NT doctrine" on this is contrary and contradicting to Jesus' doctrine in Matthew 5:48

To use 1 John as you have used 1 John on me: 1 Jn 3:9 declares that no one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God.

Biblically God's seed is Jesus the Word of the kingdom that was sown in the believer. If Jesus is really living in you, meaning the love of the Father is abiding in you, you will Love your God with all your heart mind soul and strength and you will love your neighbor as yourself.

Obedience to God's word is perfection. Obedience to the commandment of God to love (john 13:34-35).

Your words here only display your own strugge with sin and disobedence. You speak out of your limited experience. You have not experienced obedience so you speak against those who show you sound doctrine and the Way. You are not refuting me, but the very Scripture God has placed in your hand. i only speak this way to you because "Better is open rebuke than hidden love and faithful are the wounds of a friend' proverbs 27:5-6 biblically i would hate you if i didn't point these things out. if anything my words are to edify you so that you can see your error and move into the paradigm of the knowledge of God who says You can do ALL things to Christ who strengthens (perfects) you.

Ephesians 2:2

1And you were dead in your trespasses and sins, 2in which you formerly walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, of the spirit that is now working in the sons of disobedience. 3Among them we too all formerly lived in the lusts of our flesh, indulging the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, even as the rest...

you WERE dead in sins...which you FORMERLY walked... with the Devil (prince power of air), the very spirit that works in the sons of disobedience... Colossians 3:6 says The wrath of God is poured out on the sons of disobedience... those who follow the ways of the flesh...

much love, R
 
R

Revelator7

Guest
#9
[/QUOTE]
100 percent perfection in terms of sinlessness- is impossible for humans. Being a mature, biblically grounded christian in a good church is not impossible.. and this is what the bible is saying for us to be like.
[/QUOTE]

Bro, being MATURE (Huios) biblically grounded Christ follower is not impossible.. You just described a perfect sinless Christian right there. As humbly and as loving as i can say it, you contradicted yourself in that statement.
 
Jan 19, 2013
11,909
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#10
Elin said:
In the NT, perfection is "completed."

And it is NT doctrine that no one does this (1Jn 2:8, 10).
First of all, in the NT in Matthew 5:48 Jesus commands his diciples to be perfect as God is perfect. For you to refute me with "NT doctrine" on this is contrary and contradicting to Jesus' doctrine in Matthew 5:48
That's a failure to address 1Jn 2:8, 10.

The way I see it, you are contradicting the words spoken by the Son in these last days (Heb 1:1-2) through the NT writers in 1Jn 2:8, 10.
 
R

Revelator7

Guest
#13
That's a failure to address 1Jn 2:8, 10.

The way I see it, you are contradicting the words spoken by the Son in these last days (Heb 1:1-2) through the NT writers in 1Jn 2:8, 10.
I read 1 John 2:8, 10 and Hebrews 1:1-2. There is no relationship in those verses to what the topic is here.

Let me keep it simple: Be PERFECT therefore as your heavenly Father is PERFECT. The Words of Jesus <---

But as a general rule, I would not let the words of John or Paul to be more authoritative than Jesus. Not saying that they haven't written Scripture, just saying, when Jesus says something, you do it. That's called obedience.
 
R

Revelator7

Guest
#14
What I have learned from sharing in threads regarding this topic is that people (no matter what age) cannot handle the idea of being perfect. We live in a secular society that has always taught us since childhood that no body is perfect. It's an outright lie from Satan. It would be one his biggest lies. What he does is he reads Scriptures, memorizes them virbatim and finds "creative" ways to twist the truth. When he cannot twist a truth, he will make up a lie right of left field. As for the idea of perfection, he has tried to infiltrate the minds of Christian's through secular society. Even pastors preachers and teachers of the Bible don't believe in the doctrine of godliness. The doctrine of godliness as Paul wrote about is a doctrine of spiritual perfection. James wrote: Do not be a hearer of the Word only but be a DOER. That even the demons believe and shutter. To be a doer is to put it to action. That your faith and your actions are working together, as the spirit and the body work together. Christians need to understand with such a zeal that they were ONCE sinners, and now that they are born again (that they have started over again, from OLD to NEW) they are not sinners. They are not without sin in the since that they live in these bodies of flesh, and that means in these bodys we have the capacity to make a mistake. But Paul said he lived by faith in his mortal body. 6For I am already being poured out as a drink offering, and the time of my departure has come. 7I have fought the good fight, I have finished the course, I have kept the faith; 8in the future there is laid up for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous Judge, will award to me on that day; and not only to me, but also to all who have loved His appearing 2 Timothy 4.

He finished, He completed, He PERFECTED the course by keeping the faith. To walk away from the faith means you fell short.
 
M

Marian29

Guest
#15
Perfection to me is not in how something looks but it is in how something works. Imagine a door. The door is made out of the finest wood and it has carvings of images of the most beautiful craftsmanship inlaid in it. The door has a knob that is made of crystal glass. The only problem is this door doesn't close right and it makes a horrible loud sound when you open and close it. Now imagine a door that is beat up and looks like it belongs in a run down shack. But the door closes right and is the quietest door, no squeaking. Which door is perfect? The one that works. It is my opinion that simple obedience to God in all things is what makes a Christian perfect. The Bible says the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience.
I totally agree. That's a great illustration. We were born in sin, but we have the free will to receive Christ and obey God or not, and suffer its consequences.

I pray to The Lord to rescue the souls that are still lost in this world, without the mercy and love of Jesus. We're living a real spiritual battle nowadays.
 
J

JesusIsAll

Guest
#16
Down 'at ole rabbit hole agin!
Haylp! Haylp! Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious!!! Mad Hatter playin' wid da fire 'stingisher agin dis sabbit! Mercy 'o me, ah shudda' stay'd home!
 
M

Marian29

Guest
#17
Philipenses 3:

1 Finally, my brethren, rejoice in the Lord. To write the same things to you, to me indeed is not irksome, but for you it is safe.
2 Beware of the dogs, beware of the evil workers, beware of the concision:
3 for we are the circumcision, who worship by the Spirit of God, and glory in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh:
4 though I myself might have confidence even in the flesh: if any other man thinketh to have confidence in the flesh, I yet more:
5 circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew of Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;
6 as touching zeal, persecuting the church; as touching the righteousness which is in the law, found blameless.
7 Howbeit what things were gain to me, these have I counted loss for Christ.
8 Yea verily, and I count all things to be loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but refuse, that I may gain Christ,
9 and be found in him, not having a righteousness of mine own, [even] that which is of the law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which is from God by faith:
10 that I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, becoming conformed unto his death;
11 if by any means I may attain unto the resurrection from the dead.
12 Not that I have already obtained, or am already made perfect: but I press on, if so be that I may lay hold on that for which also I was laid hold on by Christ Jesus.
13 Brethren, I could not myself yet to have laid hold: but one thing [I do], forgetting the things which are behind, and stretching forward to the things which are before,
14 I press on toward the goal unto the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.
15 Let us therefore, as many as are perfect, be thus minded: and if in anything ye are otherwise minded, this also shall God reveal unto you:
16 only, whereunto we have attained, by that same [rule] let us walk.
17 Brethren, be ye imitators together of me, and mark them that so walk even as ye have us for an ensample.
18 For many walk, of whom I told you often, and now tell you even weeping, [that they are] the enemies of the cross of Christ:
19 whose end is perdition, whose god is the belly, and [whose] glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.
20 For our citizenship is in heaven; whence also we wait for a Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:
21 who shall fashion anew the body of our humiliation, [that it may be] conformed to the body of his glory, according to the working whereby he is able even to subject all things unto himself.
 
M

Marian29

Guest
#19
Please, be serious!