R We Hiding Behind the Word Baptism to Avoid Truth?

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A

Atwood

Senior Member
#1
May 1, 2014
4,995
53
48
#1
It is noted how persons go on talking about water-baptism. Why avoid translating the word? Are we not confusing the issue by saying baptism, which means quite different things to different persons? If it means immersion, why don't you say immersion?

So what happens to all the Presbyterians, Lutherans, Methodists, and Episcopalians [& other denominationals] who happen to trust Christ as Savior, but were sprinkled as babies and die without being actually being water-baptized (as defined by dipping, dunking, immersing)?

Are they roasted in the Lake of Fire with weeping, wailing, and gnashing of teeth?
 
A

Atwood

Senior Member
#2
May 1, 2014
4,995
53
48
#2
Atwood said:
It is noted how persons go on talking about water-baptism. Why avoid translating the word? Are we not confusing the issue by saying baptism, which means quite different things to different persons? If it means immersion, why don't you say immersion?

So what happens to all the Presbyterians, Lutherans, Methodists, and Episcopalians [& other denominationals] who happen to trust Christ as Savior, but were sprinkled as babies and die without being actually being water-baptized (as defined by dipping, dunking, immersing)?

Are they roasted in the Lake of Fire with weeping, wailing, and gnashing of teeth?
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Why is it so hard to get a straight answer to that question?
 
E

elf3

Guest
#3
#3
Look at your other forum on the same question....I answered... now you answer.
 
G

gzusfrk

Senior Member
#4
Aug 4, 2013
359
5
18
#4
Atwood said:
It is noted how persons go on talking about water-baptism. Why avoid translating the word? Are we not confusing the issue by saying baptism, which means quite different things to different persons? If it means immersion, why don't you say immersion?

So what happens to all the Presbyterians, Lutherans, Methodists, and Episcopalians [& other denominationals] who happen to trust Christ as Savior, but were sprinkled as babies and die without being actually being water-baptized (as defined by dipping, dunking, immersing)?

Are they roasted in the Lake of Fire with weeping, wailing, and gnashing of teeth?
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Can't say either way, that would make me the judge, Jesus Christ the Son of God will be the judge.
 
N

Nicee

Guest
#5
#5
Baptize by water or not. If God said u r entering his kingdom then u r. there r hundreds or more people in heaven who had never been baptized.
 
E

EmethAlethia

Senior Member
#6
Sep 8, 2014
244
26
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#6
Atwood said:
Why is it so hard to get a straight answer to that question?
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Getting an answer is not hard. Baptidzo is the Latin word for Immersion, which is how they translated the Greek Harpodzo.

You can baptize/Immerse cups and saucers, or people.

I see no issue. The words mean what they mean. Liking the meaning is a different thing altogether. They translated the word from Greek to Latin and transliterated the word from Latin to English. I guess no one wanted to be Harpodzoed. (Probably because it sounds like something that happened to an unfortunate whale.) If it makes you feel better, have a harpodzo service instead of a baptismal service.

You are correct in stating that our modern English meanings are not the same as the Greek and Hebrew meanings in scripture. It's kind of like the modern meaning that we have for the word adultery. David had 6 wives, and kids with 5 of them before he committed adultery. How many wives can you have before you commit adultery?

In biblical times, adultery was the destruction of an existing marital relationship to form a new one. A family was one husband, his wife/wives and all their kids. We again have a change of definition.

Anyone who wants truth can get to it. Those that just want to hold fast to their beliefs can gather the passages and facts that they want to support their beliefs, and to refute all opposing beliefs, and can interpret their "selected" data in the light of those beliefs. It depends on what you want.
 
E

elf3

Guest
#8
#8
Sola it's the same guy same question. Not sure what they are up to but they won't answer their own OP on either forum.
 
4enlightment

4enlightment

Banned
#9
May 15, 2013
4,307
27
0
#9
Atwood said:
It is noted how persons go on talking about water-baptism. Why avoid translating the word? Are we not confusing the issue by saying baptism, which means quite different things to different persons? If it means immersion, why don't you say immersion?

So what happens to all the Presbyterians, Lutherans, Methodists, and Episcopalians [& other denominationals] who happen to trust Christ as Savior, but were sprinkled as babies and die without being actually being water-baptized (as defined by dipping, dunking, immersing)?

Are they roasted in the Lake of Fire with weeping, wailing, and gnashing of teeth?
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I believe that we all must be cleanse from our evil desires, but I doesn't believe that washing with water which it is of a physical nature can't clean something of the spiritual nature. As its says that flesh gives birth to flesh, but the spirit only can give birth to spirit, and so does I believe that its work in the same way with being cleanse. I know that in the Book of Esther the women or the future bride had to goes through a series of treatments before meeting the king, and we must goes through a series of treatments as well.

Exodus 19:10 And the Lord said to Moses, “Go to the people and consecrate them today and tomorrow. Have them wash their clothes

Hebrews 9:14 How much more, then, will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself unblemished to God, cleanse our consciences from acts that lead to death, so that we may serve the living God!

Ephesians 5:27 and to present her to himself as a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless.

Revelation 19:7 Let us rejoice and be glad and give him glory! For the wedding of the Lamb has come, and his bride has made herself ready.
 
K

Kerry

Guest
#10
#10
The only way to be cleansed is by the cross. I meant faith in it and not what you do, what you do is caused by the Holy Spirit based on your faith in the cross and nothing else.
 
A

Atwood

Senior Member
#11
May 1, 2014
4,995
53
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#11
What About It Ye Who Proclaim Water-Bapt Saves?

It is noted how persons go on talking about water-baptism. Why avoid translating the word? Are we not confusing the issue by saying baptism, which means quite different things to different persons? If it means immersion, why don't you say immersion?


I am particularly interested in what the heretics who believe in salvation by works, especially by water-baptism, say to the OP:

What happens to all the Presbyterians, Lutherans, Methodists, and Episcopalians [& other denominationals] who happen to trust Christ as Savior, but were sprinkled as babies and die without being actually being water-baptized (as defined by dipping, dunking, immersing)?

Are they roasted in the Lake of Fire with weeping, wailing, and gnashing of teeth?
 
4enlightment

4enlightment

Banned
#12
May 15, 2013
4,307
27
0
#12
Luke 7:37 A woman in that town who lived a sinful life learned that Jesus was eating at the Pharisee’s house, so she came there with an alabaster jar of perfume. 38 As she stood behind him at his feet weeping, she began to wet his feet with her tears. Then she wiped them with her hair, kissed them and poured perfume on them.

I assuming that it was her tears that had Baptized her, because she was considered to be save that day and I think she didn't had time to jump into the tub.
 
N

newbirth

Banned
#13
Mar 28, 2014
4,300
31
0
#13
4enlightment said:
Luke 7:37 A woman in that town who lived a sinful life learned that Jesus was eating at the Pharisee’s house, so she came there with an alabaster jar of perfume. 38 As she stood behind him at his feet weeping, she began to wet his feet with her tears. Then she wiped them with her hair, kissed them and poured perfume on them.

I assuming that it was her tears that had Baptized her, because she was considered to be save that day and I think she didn't had time to jump into the tub.
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I would understand this as such....John came preaching about the messiah and repentance and baptism ...this woman believed probably repented and baptised and was so happy to meet the messiah which resulted in the anointing of the messiah...she knew what she was doing ...I don't think it was normal for people to around with an alabaster jar of perfume everyday
 
N

newbirth

Banned
#14
Mar 28, 2014
4,300
31
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#14
Re: What About It Ye Who Proclaim Water-Bapt Saves?

Atwood said:
It is noted how persons go on talking about water-baptism. Why avoid translating the word? Are we not confusing the issue by saying baptism, which means quite different things to different persons? If it means immersion, why don't you say immersion?
Click to expand...
the word cannot mean different things to different people...baptism means immersion....
1 Corinthians 1:10
Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.




I am particularly interested in what the heretics who believe in salvation by works, especially by water-baptism, say to the OP:
Click to expand...
we are saved by grace through faith....faith without works is dead....

What happens to all the Presbyterians, Lutherans, Methodists, and Episcopalians [& other denominationals] who happen to trust Christ as Savior, but were sprinkled as babies and die without being actually being water-baptized (as defined by dipping, dunking, immersing)?

Are they roasted in the Lake of Fire with weeping, wailing, and gnashing of teeth?
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they are not baptised as commanded by our Lord thus they are not believers....don't take my word ...search the scripture and see what happens to unbelievers...
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no one is avoiding anything...Jesus is our example when it comes to baptism...was he sprinkled or dunked as you put it? All those people you mention are they followers of Christ?...then let them do as he says....

[SUP]16 [/SUP]He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
 
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