Idols: Has the bible become an idol?

[VW]

Every physical gift that has been given to people by God has become an idol. One of the first was the ark of the covenant. At one point, the people of Israel actually took the ark and placed it out in front of themselves in battle, with the priests who tended the ark, saying to themselves that since it was from God, then God would fight for them, just because the ark which He had given them was in from of them, between them and their enemies. Of course, God is not bribed, nor is He forced into doing something. The priests were killed, and the ark was carried off by the Philistines.

Another idol was the tree which was lifted up in the wilderness with the serpent on it. The temple itself became an idol. The land itself became an idol. The heritage of Jacob who became Israel became an idol.

These things, some of them had spiritual qualities, the ark actually was and if it still exist, is holy. I mean, you could not even touch it or you died. The temple was the dwelling place for the glory of God, until He left because of all the idols of the people.

People will have idols, it is the nature of the fallen man.

The bible is inspired by God, breathed by His Spirit. It is of God, a gift given in His love. And yet, Peter writing about Paul's contribution to the scripture by the Spirit says that some twist his words to their own destruction. What place does the bible hold in your heart?

The new covenant is that God will write His laws upon our hearts and in our minds. He will write them in us. I cannot write His laws in my heart, only He can do this for me and in me. When God writes His words in our hearts, it then becomes alive to us.

Where do we look for our truth?

There are 3 choices:

1.)The science and tecknowledgy of the world
2)The bible and the teachers of the bible
3)The revelation of God, through the bible, or whatever means He chooses. (He chose an ass once to reveal His truth.)

I beg that any answers be in His peace,

 

[MahogonySnail]

The bible is basically a tree (as it is made of paper).. so yes another alternative to a tree idol it is posible.

 

[Ma-maa]

Depends what you mean. You mean the book itself or the words contained therein?

 

[imoss]

snail once again makes me laugh out loud.

 

[VW]

Depends what you mean. You mean the book itself or the words contained therein?

It is kinda hard to separate the book from the words contained in it. I guess the question is: what does the bible represent to us? The possibility is that we can hold the scripture as being God to us. Because we have this gift from Him, so easily obtained and read, that we might learn to lean upon and rely upon the scripture in place of the Lord. I am afraid that this is much more of a problem than we realize. I believe that Paul understood this danger, and took pains in his walk to make sure that it did not cause him trouble. He went so far as to tell those he was writing that when we came among them, he had determined to know nothing but Jesus Christ, and Him crucified. He was schooled in the scriptures before his conversion, being in training as a Pharisee, and after meeting Jesus he counted all of his training as waste.

I praise God for the scripture, and His word lives in me by His Spirit. I will never forget the beginning of my training in the scripture by the Spirit. My first book to study was of all things, Lamentations. I cried for a month. Not for the words, but for the heart of God, broken by those who hold other things above Him. "How shall I admonish you? To what shall I compare you, O daughter of Jerusalem? To what shall I liken you as I comfort you, O virgin daughter of Zion? For your ruin is as vast as the sea; who can heal you? Your prophets have seen for you false and foolish visions; and they have not exposed your iniquity so as to restore you from captivity. But they have seen for false and misleading oracles. All who pass along the way clap their hands in derision at you; they hiss and shake their heads at the daughter of Jerusalem. Is this the city of which they said, "The perfection of beauty, a joy to all the earth?" All your enemies have opened their mouths wide against you, they hiss and gnash their teeth. They say, "We have swallowed her up! Surely this is the day for which we waited; we have reached it, we have seen it."

Even if this word is not for us, the church, (which I believe it is,) it still shows the dangers of having anything above or in place of the Lord. "Remember my afflictions and my wandering, the wormwood and the bitterness. Surely my soul remembers and is bowed down within me. This I recall to my mind. Therefore I have hope, for the Lord's lovingkindnesses indeed never cease. For His compassions never fail. They are new every morning; great is Thy faithfulness. ' The Lord is my portion,' says my soul. Therefore I have hope in Him. To the person who seeks Him, it is good that he waits silently for the salvation of the Lord."

The cry of the Spirit now, in this day of darkness, "Seek Me, only Me."

 

[MyBagsRPacked]

A confusing and interesting post at the same time. I've never heard of any of those references made by VW as being idols...but I don't know everything lol
I think that in order for something to be an idol, you need to worship itABOVE God....and I really don't know anyone who worships the bible over God. The bible is a textbook for honourable living in a sinful world. You can NEVER have too much of it...God says so himself!

 

[Brackenzee]

I think to many that the Bible has definitely become an idol.

Or rather, parts of the Bible are uplayed and other parts downplayed. For example, much of the modern Evangelical community seems to be obsessed with what the Bible has to say about sex, while preaching very little on matters of helping the poor or avoiding pride. It is easy to make the letter of the book our idol while ignoring the message that God wanted to reveal--for example, when people debate whether or not it's literally scientifically possible for Jonah to have survived three days in the belly of a fish, while completley ignoring the point of the Book of Jonah--that God wants everyone to follow him, not just "our people".

 

[Ma-maa]

First off, it's actually very easy to seperate the book and the words. Things like the whole swearing on the Bible in court, that would be people idolising the book and ignoring it's words. See?

I'm afraid I don't understand your point. No, a study of Scripture does not replace a relationship with G-d, HOWEVER, G-d will never give you a 'revelation' that contradicts Scripture. A good grounding in Scripture is absolutely essential for you walk. And anything you think you hear from G-d should be checked against Scripture. Always.

 

[Brackenzee]

Does that mean Jesus' admonishments to mercy were not from God? They contradicted the scriptures that advocated the death penalty for various offenses, IE adultery. If Jesus is truly the son of God, then he must be the prism through which we view all of scripture. If scripture goes against the spirit of Christ, I choose to side with Christ.

 

[Nuhen]

They contradicted the scriptures that advocated the death penalty for various offenses, IE adultery.

That's actually a common misconception.

 

[VW]

First off, it's actually very easy to seperate the book and the words. Things like the whole swearing on the Bible in court, that would be people idolising the book and ignoring it's words. See?

I'm afraid I don't understand your point. No, a study of Scripture does not replace a relationship with G-d, HOWEVER, G-d will never give you a 'revelation' that contradicts Scripture. A good grounding in Scripture is absolutely essential for you walk. And anything you think you hear from G-d should be checked against Scripture. Always.

In the case of the bible, you cannot separate it from its words, not as a believer. (I am with you about swearing on the bible, if a person is honest, this is unnecessary, and if they are a liar, it will not make any difference. But does swearing on the bible make it an idol? I don't think so.)

Paul made an interesting statement about where his doctrine came from. He said that it was based upon the revelation of the Spirit and the prophets. Many times I have thought that I understood what I was to believe, having been taught out of the scriptures, only to find that what I thought was true was false. The reason this happens is that we have a natural mind, which is able to understand the bible, but is not able to understand God. For the natural mind cannot perceive God, it is not able to understand Him and the things about Him. This, believe it or not, is according to scripture. Fortunately, we have been given a new and spiritual mind, which is not like the natural mind, as it is a gift from God in His Spirit. We have the mind of Christ.

If we trust the understanding of the scripture, rather than the revelation of the Spirit, which is the mind of Christ, we may have already placed our trust in something not from or of God. (And this is the real meaning of an idol, what we trust in. The children were lead by God out of Egypt, lead by the cloud during the day, and by the fire at night, but when they got to the mountain of God, and heard His voice, they were afraid and did not trust in Him, but rather drew away and hid. And when Moses had gone up on the mountain and was gone for a while, they got Arron to build them an idol to worship. We worship what we love, and we trust what we worship.)

Some will think that I am writing against the bible, but I am not. I am questioning even, in my own heart, what I trust and love and worship, always and every day, that in me be found no thing which would interfere with my walk with my God in truth and love. It is so much easier to trust in something I can hold in my hand, and in something I can read and understand with my mind, because I have not been trained in trusting in the Spirit. As I pray to our Father, I ask that in me be no truth which is not revealed in me by His Spirit.

 

[Brackenzee]

A good attitude to have, VW. The problem isn't with the Bible itself, but with people who are so certain that their own interpretations of it are correct that they rage against all wisdom and all behavior that contradicts that interpretation.

It's the reason that people like Pat Roberson can excoriate children's fantasy novels while simultaneously saying horribly insensitive things regarding earthquake victims in Haiti.

 

[charisenexcelcis]

The scripture provides an objective measure. I have to go with number two. It's not that the subjective isn't vital, but given the choice, I will go with the Bible, not with revelation.

 

[Nuhen]

Okay, no matter how many times I read this thread, I still need to ask for clarification.

It SEEMS like you are trying to say that the bible has become an idol, and because of that we should stop using it and rely on personal revelations from G-d, or use it but interpret it through personal revelations from G-d.

I ask because if that's the case, if that's what you believe, then this is VERY, EXTREMELY dangerous theology.

 

[Ma-maa]

The scripture provides an objective measure. I have to go with number two. It's not that the subjective isn't vital, but given the choice, I will go with the Bible, not with revelation.

[+1]

See, the funny thing about spiritual leading without Scriptural backup, is that you're left wide, wide open to deception. Not to say the Spirit doesn't lead you, but the Ruach HaKodesh isn't the only spirit out there. Every revelation you have from G-d should be checked against the Bible. G-d does not lie or change his mind (Numbers 23:19, 1 Samuel 15:29), so any revelation that is truly from him should line up with what he's already said.

 

[songster]

It is kinda hard to separate the book from the words contained in it. I guess the question is: what does the bible represent to us? The possibility is that we can hold the scripture as being God to us. Because we have this gift from Him, so easily obtained and read, that we might learn to lean upon and rely upon the scripture in place of the Lord. I am afraid that this is much more of a problem than we realize. I believe that Paul understood this danger, and took pains in his walk to make sure that it did not cause him trouble. He went so far as to tell those he was writing that when we came among them, he had determined to know nothing but Jesus Christ, and Him crucified. He was schooled in the scriptures before his conversion, being in training as a Pharisee, and after meeting Jesus he counted all of his training as waste.

Lets see what the word of God has to say about His Word. John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. This would indicate that the Word is significantly more than a literary work or chronology of events, but the Word is God. In John 1:14 ... The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us .., once again depicting Jesus as being tantamount to the word of God. Finally, we have Jesus declaring that His Word provides sustaining power, Matthew 4:4 ... 'Man does not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.' , and we know, of course, that all scripture was inspired by God, and therefore, even with bad translation, still originally came from the mouth of God.

The average believer does not know the contents of the bible without first reading or hearing it. It is inscribed on our hearts once we have heard it, believed it, and understood it. Without understanding, it is stolen from us or becomes useless intellectual information. Matthew 13:19 ... When anyone hears the message about the kingdom and does not understand it, the evil one comes and snatches away what was sown in his heart.

Even those who receive a message from an angel or a prophet do not receive an immediate inscription of the word of God upon their hearts. Faith itself is dependent on the Word of God, Romans 10:17 ... So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Paul did not abandon his knowledge of the Law, nor did he consider it waste. He did, however, consider all 'things' as loss. Whatever he had gained in this world he counted them as nothing compared to the richness of the knowledge of Christ. Philippians 3:7 ... But whatever was to my profit I now consider loss for the sake of Christ. What is more, I consider everything a loss compared to the surpassing greatness of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whose sake I have lost all things. Paul's knowledge of the Law was a strength to him in the days following his conversion. He did not use the law unlawfully, but rather as a way of defining sin. Romans 7:7 ... I would not have known what sin was except through the law. For I would not have known what coveting really was if the law had not said, "Do not covet."

Paul's training equipped him to conduct a clear comparison between the Old and New Testaments, giving him an extraordinary ability to reveal to his people, how Christ Jesus was the long anticipated Messiah through his remembrance of the writings of the prophets.

Had you said that reading the word for a set period of time each day at exactly the same time each day could become religious obligation, I might have agreed, but I sincerely believe that it is a near impossibility for scripture to become an idol. It is more likely to become a decorative piece or something used for an outward show in place of witnessing ones faith, but never an idol.

Psalm 138:2

I will worship toward your holy temple, and praise your name for your loving kindness and for your truth: for you have magnified your word above all your name.

 

[jesus_be4_religion]

The bible can definitely become an idol when it is not pointed towards Jesus Christ(Immanuel) and his death and resurrection for our sins. That is really the whole good news there need be no more. Yet we often make a big deal about everything that doesn't matter, even to the point of saying you are not saved if you believe that. This is when part of the bible becomes an idol.

 

[songster]

The bible can definitely become an idol when it is not pointed towards Jesus Christ(Immanuel) and his death and resurrection for our sins. That is really the whole good news there need be no more. Yet we often make a big deal about everything that doesn't matter, even to the point of saying you are not saved if you believe that. This is when part of the bible becomes an idol.

The word is what it is, the Word of God, and when used properly it is good for instruction in every circumstance of life, but when used devisively or without understanding it can quickly become the letter of the law. I believe that when this occurs it's the result of legalism, judging, religious mindsets, doctrines and rules of men, denominationalism and self righteousness, having little to do with the scriptures themselves.

 

[VW]

Okay, no matter how many times I read this thread, I still need to ask for clarification.

It SEEMS like you are trying to say that the bible has become an idol, and because of that we should stop using it and rely on personal revelations from G-d, or use it but interpret it through personal revelations from G-d.

I ask because if that's the case, if that's what you believe, then this is VERY, EXTREMELY dangerous theology.

No, I do not say to stop using the bible. I have one open before me now, at this very minute, and every time I sit down to write in this group.

You see, I do not believe that the Spirit will ever lead us to a place that is not scriptural, ever. I do not believe in checking revelation from God against the scripture, because I might not understand the scripture as well as God does. Ha, Ha!! I will never understand that scripture as He does, so how can I check what He tells me against it?

I believe that we have taken a dangerous road, one in which we have placed limits upon God, telling Him in essence, "Okay, you gave us the bible, and maybe it is to be used by Your Spirit to teach us, but we are only going to believe what we can see out of your bible, and if You try to teach us something that is different from what we understand from the bible, then we are going to disregard it and consider it deception." If we did this to our God, our Savior, then the bible has become an idol.

 

[VW]

[+1]

See, the funny thing about spiritual leading without Scriptural backup, is that you're left wide, wide open to deception. Not to say the Spirit doesn't lead you, but the Ruach HaKodesh isn't the only spirit out there. Every revelation you have from G-d should be checked against the Bible. G-d does not lie or change his mind (Numbers 23:19, 1 Samuel 15:29), so any revelation that is truly from him should line up with what he's already said.

And that is the problem, for what He has written down is subject to our understanding. So in essence we have told God, do not tell us anything we do not understand. I for one will not do that. I am glad that the apostles did not do that.

What part do I have with other spirits. God, who is in us is greater than them all. And when the devil came to tempt Jesus in the wilderness, did he not use the scriptures to tempt Him? And Jesus spoke the scriptures to answer the devil, but in and with the power and the understanding of the Holy Spirit, just as we can today.