The unpardonable sin

[Samual]

In the book of Mathew, Mark, and I think John, Jesus says that all blasphemy against men will be forgiven, but the blasphemy against the holy spirit will not be forgiven. I have seen articles all over the place discussing it. They say that the blasphemy against the spirit is often misinterpreted. That the blasphemy is to reject Jesus, to go your whole life without accepting Jesus. Without accepting that he died on the cross. They all say that the Pharasies accused Jesus of being the devil, that if you refuse Jesus's forgiveness in the face of irrefutable proof, that's the unforgivable sin. All of these articles agree on that, they also agree and all say that if you're worried that you may have committed the sin, then that shows you still care and, therefore have not committed the sin. Because if you had committed the unpardonable sin, you wouldn't care weather you had or not. Because your heart would be so hardened against God, you wouldn't care if you had committed the unforgivable sin. The one thing they cannot agree on, however, is weather or not the sin can still be committed today, and who it can be committed by. Some say it cannot be committed today, others say it can but not by a christian, then some say that it can be committed today even by a christian. But then they always come back and say that if you're worried you may have committed it, then you couldn't have committed it because if you had then you wouldn't care because your heart would be so hardened. Is this true? What does the unpardonable sin mean to you? I have struggled with this for a little while now, and I just can't seem to find a solid answer. Because even though they're all the same answer, they all have a different element to them, and leave big gaps in their explanations.

 

[kennethcadwell]

To me blasphemy of the Holy Spirit runs deeper then just unbelief, as the bible shows that disobedience to the gospel is also unbelief. Denying the Holy Spirit comes by denying His power, gifts, and not obeying to walk in the fruits thereof.
Apostle Paul gives insights to this in his epistle to Titus when he said there will be those who confess to know God but in works they will deny Him. They continue to walk an unclean/sinful lifestyle which means they are denying the guidance of the Holy Spirit working in their lives.
Apostle Paul clears these answers up for us by saying do not grieve the Holy Spirit, which means we can still deny Him by how we choose to walk. If one chooses to continue to walk in the flesh (give into sinful lusts) without repentance they have grieved the Holy Spirit and committed blasphemy against Him. If a person walks in the Spirit they are walking by His guidance and His fruits with love being the greatest, and Paul says there is no condemnation for those who walk this way.

 

[Samual]

To me blasphemy of the Holy Spirit runs deeper then just unbelief, as the bible shows that disobedience to the gospel is also unbelief. Denying the Holy Spirit comes by denying His power, gifts, and not obeying to walk in the fruits thereof.
Apostle Paul gives insights to this in his epistle to Titus when he said there will be those who confess to know God but in works they will deny Him. They continue to walk an unclean/sinful lifestyle which means they are denying the guidance of the Holy Spirit working in their lives.
Apostle Paul clears these answers up for us by saying do not grieve the Holy Spirit, which means we can still deny Him by how we choose to walk. If one chooses to continue to walk in the flesh (give into sinful lusts) without repentance they have grieved the Holy Spirit and committed blasphemy against Him. If a person walks in the Spirit they are walking by His guidance and His fruits with love being the greatest, and Paul says there is no condemnation for those who walk this way.

So what you're saying is the unforgivable sin is the sin of unrepentance. By refusing to repent our sins before God and allow Jesus into our hearts, we are blaspheming the holy spirit?

 

[Zmouth]

If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your Father which is in heaven give good things to them that ask him?
Matt 7:11

If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?
Luke 11:13

-------------------------------------
"If ye being evil know how to give good gifts to your children.."

So the evil bring give good gifts?

A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good;
and an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is evil:
for of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaketh. Luke 6:45

---------------------------------------
"...how much more shall your Father which is in heaven..."
"...how much more shall your heavenly Father"

So how is your heavenly Father?

In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:2 Thess 1:8
And Jesus answering saith unto them, Have faith in God. Mark 11:22

-----------------------------------------
"....give good things to them that ask him?"
"... give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?"

So if being evil what will God give them?

Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. Galatians 6:7

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"Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ....." John 8:42

 

[shoki]

[h=3]Luke 12:10 And everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but the one who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven.[/h]A person who Associates partners with God Almighty and dies in the same state (without repenting before death) will not receive Gods pardon.

 

[MarcR]

Blasphemy against the Holy Spirit consists of two things and ONLY those two things:

1) Giving Satan credit for the work of the Holy Spirit.

2) Giving the Holy Spirit blame for the works of Satan.

 

[DesiredHaven]

Blaspheme against equals words against

1. to speak reproachfully, rail at, revile, calumniate, blaspheme
2. to be evil spoken of, reviled, railed at

When you compare between them they seem consistent in the same

Mat 12:31 Wherefore I say unto you,
All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men:
but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.

Mat 12:32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him:
but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him,
neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

Luke 12:10 And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him:
but unto him that blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgiven.

Mark 3:28-30 Verily I say unto you, All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme:
But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness,
but is in danger of eternal damnation:

Reason Jesus gave...

Because they *said*, He hath an unclean spirit.

It was what they said, and shows its the manner of speaking under the definition of blaspheme (in the above) also.

 

[atwhatcost]

I don't think it's a mere speak. It's a solid belief. Either God isn't or God lies. Something believed to death, literally.

I've been angry with God. Well, angry is the polite word. Furious doesn't cover it, but as angry as I was and as much as I wanted to give up on him, I couldn't deny he is. When we deny God right down to our bones, and never repent, that's blaspheming.

We've all blasphemed for a while, but some of us repented. (Before you were born again, you blasphemed.)

Can Christians do it? Yes and no. Yes, that some seeds fell on rocky soil, grew, and then died. Yes, in that the counterfeits live among the real crop. No, in that those that grow in God just can't go there.

The problem is on our side, not God's side. He knows who belongs to him forever and who will not. We can only see the present, and even there we can't see into a person's being. I agree. If you're worried about blaspheming, you're not blaspheming.

When my mother died, my brother said that's when he gave up on God. No God would ever let his mother died. Seems kind of childish, but it was the words of a 18 year old boy in pain. His problem is he never outgrew those words and still thinks he's right. If he dies before believing the truth, he has blasphemed. If he comes to Christ, it's a previous temper tantrum nailed to that cross.

 

[mailmandan]

The concept of "blasphemy against the Spirit" is mentioned in Mark 3:22-30 and Matthew 12:22-32. The term blasphemy may be generally defined as "defiant irreverence." This case of blasphemy is a specific one, called "the blasphemy against the Holy Spirit" in Matthew 12:31. In Matthew 12:31-32, the Pharisees, having witnessed irrefutable proof that Jesus was working miracles in the power of the Holy Spirit, claimed instead that the Lord was possessed by the demon "Beelzebub" (Matthew 12:24). Now notice that in Mark 3:30 Jesus is very specific about what they did to commit "blasphemy against the Holy Spirit."

Jesus Christ is not on earth—He is seated at the right hand of God. No one can witness Jesus Christ performing a miracle and then attribute that power to Satan instead of the Spirit. The sin that is unpardonable for us is the state of continued unbelief.

 

[Samual]

So here is what I gather from all of you: The fact that I am concerned that I've committed the unpardonable sin means I haven't committed it? It is refusal to come to God, refusal to repent for your sins, that is blaspheming the holy spirit?

 

[atwhatcost]

So here is what I gather from all of you: The fact that I am concerned that I've committed the unpardonable sin means I haven't committed it? It is refusal to come to God, refusal to repent for your sins, that is blaspheming the holy spirit?

Unsure. (My answer, not your question. lol) We may have (probably have) done it, but it's like all our lies, cheats, gossiping, and other sins. Once we are redeemed, it is as if we didn't do it. Jesus took our punishment to that cross, so we look clean and sparkly to God.

Since we are already pardoned, it cannot be the unpardonable, right? (And that's what I'm unsure about, but it seems right.) We are counted as righteous through Christ, but only if we endure with him to the end.

(I believe in once saved always saved, but have had enough friends who I truly thought were saved that walked away to question if I'm truly save. I think so, but won't know until the moment after this body gives up the ghost.)

 

[seed_time_harvest]

In the book of Mathew, Mark, and I think John, Jesus says that all blasphemy against men will be forgiven, but the blasphemy against the holy spirit will not be forgiven. I have seen articles all over the place discussing it. They say that the blasphemy against the spirit is often misinterpreted. That the blasphemy is to reject Jesus, to go your whole life without accepting Jesus. Without accepting that he died on the cross. They all say that the Pharasies accused Jesus of being the devil, that if you refuse Jesus's forgiveness in the face of irrefutable proof, that's the unforgivable sin. All of these articles agree on that, they also agree and all say that if you're worried that you may have committed the sin, then that shows you still care and, therefore have not committed the sin. Because if you had committed the unpardonable sin, you wouldn't care weather you had or not. Because your heart would be so hardened against God, you wouldn't care if you had committed the unforgivable sin. The one thing they cannot agree on, however, is weather or not the sin can still be committed today, and who it can be committed by. Some say it cannot be committed today, others say it can but not by a christian, then some say that it can be committed today even by a christian. But then they always come back and say that if you're worried you may have committed it, then you couldn't have committed it because if you had then you wouldn't care because your heart would be so hardened. Is this true? What does the unpardonable sin mean to you? I have struggled with this for a little while now, and I just can't seem to find a solid answer. Because even though they're all the same answer, they all have a different element to them, and leave big gaps in their explanations.

Blasphemy cannot be done in ignorance,Paul was forgiven of blasphemy because he did it in ignorance but a person who is reprobate is no longer convicted by the HOLY SPIRIT and they know the difference between right and wrong it just they really really don't care .So when you blaspheme the HOLY SPIRIT it is because that is really the way you are and its not that GOD walked away from you but you walked away.

 

[Samual]

Blasphemy cannot be done in ignorance,Paul was forgiven of blasphemy because he did it in ignorance but a person who is reprobate is no longer convicted by the HOLY SPIRIT and they know the difference between right and wrong it just they really really don't care .So when you blaspheme the HOLY SPIRIT it is because that is really the way you are and its not that GOD walked away from you but you walked away.

So you're saying that God knows if you truly mean what you say? If you cursed him in a moment of anger or even just randomly and stupidly, he would forgive you because you didn't mean it. You can't blaspheme God without being fully aware that you are doing it. And the sin is to refuse the forgiveness he offers.

 

[atwhatcost]

Blasphemy cannot be done in ignorance,Paul was forgiven of blasphemy because he did it in ignorance but a person who is reprobate is no longer convicted by the HOLY SPIRIT and they know the difference between right and wrong it just they really really don't care .So when you blaspheme the HOLY SPIRIT it is because that is really the way you are and its not that GOD walked away from you but you walked away.

Wait. So you're saying Paul didn't know what he was doing when he joined a mob to kill Steven? If that's true why was he traveling to another town to do the same thing to someone else? Some sins we do out of ignorance. All sins we do out of believing we come first.

 

[JesusIsAll]

Blaspheme against equals words against

1. to speak reproachfully, rail at, revile, calumniate, blaspheme
2. to be evil spoken of, reviled, railed at

When you compare between them they seem consistent in the same

Mat 12:31 Wherefore I say unto you,
All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men:
but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.

Mat 12:32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him:
but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him,
neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

Luke 12:10 And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him:
but unto him that blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgiven.

Mark 3:28-30 Verily I say unto you, All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme:
But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness,
but is in danger of eternal damnation:

Reason Jesus gave...

Because they *said*, He hath an unclean spirit.

It was what they said, and shows its the manner of speaking under the definition of blaspheme (in the above) also.

Yes, the entire context calling good evil, which goes beyond a personal insult, rather goes to a state of mind of being in agreement with Satan that the things of God are not good. Also, all God's Spirit has to do is stop convicting one of sin for that person to fall into perdition, for a person's heart to harden, because sinful man must be drawn of God. I've always seen Christ's warning as being along the lines, "You had really better watch your mouths, because you may just get what you profess to believe," that is, the things of Satan, who does not appreciate the things of God. Saying good is evil, that light is darkness, is a serious, serious evil state of heart and mind, like proclaiming allegiance to the devil,

Isaiah 5:20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

 

[MarcR]

Blaspheme against equals words against

1. to speak reproachfully, rail at, revile, calumniate, blaspheme
2. to be evil spoken of, reviled, railed at

When you compare between them they seem consistent in the same

Mat 12:31 Wherefore I say unto you,
All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men:
but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.

Mat 12:32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him:
but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him,
neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

Luke 12:10 And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him:
but unto him that blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgiven.

Mark 3:28-30 Verily I say unto you, All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme:
But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness,
but is in danger of eternal damnation:

Reason Jesus gave...

Because they *said*, He hath an unclean spirit.

It was what they said, and shows its the manner of speaking under the definition of blaspheme (in the above) also.

You are correct; but idiom occurs when words are used in ways that don't precisely conform to their connotation.

a hot dog is not a domestic animal on a warm day.

If I ask the Lord 'make me a blessing' I am asking Him to cause me to be one.

If I ask my wife to' make me a sandwich', I am NOT asking her to cause me to be one.

 

[Viligant_Warrior]

Blasphemy cannot be done in ignorance,Paul was forgiven of blasphemy because he did it in ignorance but a person who is reprobate is no longer convicted by the HOLY SPIRIT and they know the difference between right and wrong it just they really really don't care .So when you blaspheme the HOLY SPIRIT it is because that is really the way you are and its not that GOD walked away from you but you walked away.

You're been reprimanded on the count of misdefining blasphemy. I will reprimand you about "walking away." It does not happen. No one can "lose" their salvation, or shed it because of their sin. This is a statement of someone who does not understand the Gospel of grace.

 

[DesiredHaven]

You are correct; but idiom occurs when words are used in ways that don't precisely conform to their connotation.

a hot dog is not a domestic animal on a warm day.

If I ask the Lord 'make me a blessing' I am asking Him to cause me to be one.

If I ask my wife to' make me a sandwich', I am NOT asking her to cause me to be one.

MarcR what portion of the post was this idiom thing you are speaking of?

Im not catching what the but is for? Can you highlight the idiom part for me?

 

[DesiredHaven]

Yes, the entire context calling good evil, which goes beyond a personal insult, rather goes to a state of mind of being in agreement with Satan that the things of God are not good. Also, all God's Spirit has to do is stop convicting one of sin for that person to fall into perdition, for a person's heart to harden, because sinful man must be drawn of God. I've always seen Christ's warning as being along the lines, "You had really better watch your mouths, because you may just get what you profess to believe," that is, the things of Satan, who does not appreciate the things of God. Saying good is evil, that light is darkness, is a serious, serious evil state of heart and mind, like proclaiming allegiance to the devil,

Isaiah 5:20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

Would seem so, I wouldnt want to do that, since there is no forgiveness for it, its not something to be taken lightly, people seem to come real close to this daily.

 

[maxwel]

Matthew 12:31
Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.

This is a REAL verse, and it's fine to look at the context, and see what it's about...
but I think there's a bigger problem


Currently I think this verse is being used by EXTREME Charismatic charlatans to manipulate their congregation, and prevent any investigation into what they say or do.

Example:
"Don't question the Holy Spirit's work through me. Don't doubt it, don't examine it, don't compare it with scripture... or you're damned."

Whereas the bible actually teaches us to "test" all things, and compare the words of ministers with scripture.