A Scriptural Conclusion

[theStudent]

- or if you will, A Scriptural Challenge.
That what I want to put forth.


Often people visit these Bible Study; Bible Discussion; Bible Board... etc., forums and leave disappointed.
Why? Because, a question seldom ends with a Bible conclusion.
They continue, and continue, with many conclusions that do not mention one scipture. And if a scripture is mentioned, it's sometimes followed by more than 50 words - half of which do not even refer to the scripture given.
Then a person has to dig through a multitude of post only to realize they can't find the topic that was started.

Are we really interested in the word of God, or how long we can debate?
People visit these forums everyday, looking for answers..., and go away with nothing.
Do we realize how many lost souls come looking to you guys for help?
I was on a thread where someone was asking for scripture to back up statements, and you know, that was warming to my heart.
Sometimes, though, sad to say, a person demands a scripture, and when given, they ignore it.
How pleasant it would be to a tired soul, if the Bible spoke more than we did.
I'm sure at the end of the day, more people would go away satisfied - either because they learned something, got something cleared up, taught someone something, or just basically comforted or reasusred someone.
Or are we like those priest that starved the people?


I want to put this challenge out to all who are so into Christ. (He said feed his little sheep.)
I have a number of questions.
Can you use the Bible to answer, and give a brief explanation for using that scripture?
Can you if challenging that explanation, use a scripture, along with a brief explanation, without being un-Christ-like?
Can you if challenged, use a scripture, along with a brief explanation, without being un-Christ-like?


Here is my first question:


What is Hell, and Who created it?

 

[Brainfreeze]

Short answers, have to cut shapes for my son right now

yes, yes, yes, & a place for satan & God made it, on account of lucifer making it for himself (made his own bed) so to speak

 

[Magenta]

What is Hell, and Who created it?

Hell is a translation of four other words in the original languages of Hebrew and Greek: Sheol, Gehenna, Hades, and Tartarus. It essentially means the grave, or stands for death, which came into the world when Adam sinned by disobeying God. (Romans 5:12~ Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all people, because all sinned). It is done away with along with death following the resurrection and judgement of all.

Hell is the grave. It gets thrown into the lake of fire Three different translations:

Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.

Then death and the grave were thrown into the lake of fire. This lake of fire is the second death.

And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

 

[RobbyEarl]

God created hell as He created everything else including satan. Satan was an angel created by God, but full of pride wanted to be God and for that reason hell was created. Here is satan described in the bible

Job 41

“Can you draw out Leviathan[a] with a hook,
Or snare his tongue with a line which you lower?
2 Can you put a reed through his nose,
Or pierce his jaw with a hook?
3 Will he make many supplications to you?
Will he speak softly to you?
4 Will he make a covenant with you?
Will you take him as a servant forever?
5 Will you play with him as with a bird,
Or will you leash him for your maidens?
6 Will your companions make a banquet[b] of him?
Will they apportion him among the merchants?
7 Can you fill his skin with harpoons,
Or his head with fishing spears?
8 Lay your hand on him;
Remember the battle—
Never do it again!
9 Indeed, any hope of overcoming him is false;
Shall one not be overwhelmed at the sight of him?
10 No one is so fierce that he would dare stir him up.
Who then is able to stand against Me?
11 Who has preceded Me, that I should pay him?
Everything under heaven is Mine.

 

[Yonah]

Shalom, for me I choose to go back to the beginning to understand things in the end,,, that's said the rendered hell often, but not always refers to the grave.... sometimes rendered the pit, as well, we all know who created all things... Joh 1:3
All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

 

[RobbyEarl]

And again

12 “I will not conceal[c] his limbs,
His mighty power, or his graceful proportions.
13 Who can remove his outer coat?
Who can approach him with a double bridle?
14 Who can open the doors of his face,
With his terrible teeth all around?
15 His rows of scales are his pride,
Shut up tightly as with a seal;
16 One is so near another
That no air can come between them;
17 They are joined one to another,
They stick together and cannot be parted.
18 His sneezings flash forth light,
And his eyes are like the eyelids of the morning.
19 Out of his mouth go burning lights;
Sparks of fire shoot out.
20 Smoke goes out of his nostrils,
As from a boiling pot and burning rushes.
21 His breath kindles coals,
And a flame goes out of his mouth.
22 Strength dwells in his neck,
And sorrow dances before him.
23 The folds of his flesh are joined together;
They are firm on him and cannot be moved.
24 His heart is as hard as stone,
Even as hard as the lower millstone.
25 When he raises himself up, the mighty are afraid;
Because of his crashings they are beside[d]themselves.
26 Though the sword reaches him, it cannot avail;Nor does spear, dart, or javelin.
27 He regards iron as straw,
And bronze as rotten wood.
28 The arrow cannot make him flee;
Slingstones become like stubble to him.
29 Darts are regarded as straw;
He laughs at the threat of javelins.
30 His undersides are like sharp potsherds;
He spreads pointed marks in the mire.
31 He makes the deep boil like a pot;
He makes the sea like a pot of ointment.
32 He leaves a shining wake behind him;
One would think the deep had white hair.
33 On earth there is nothing like him,
Which is made without fear.
34 He beholds every high thing;
He is king over all the children of pride.”

[h=4]Footnotes:[/h]

 

[RobbyEarl]

I'm logging off now wish I could stay but I have to put the bacon on the table and need sleepy time good night

 

[Willie-T]

Unfortunately, things like this often just end up being Sunday School "Fill in the blanks with the located Scripture" exercises, when the people you spoke of coming here are more than likely looking for where the idea of the "Hell" we don't want to go to came from.

Then we have to get into where there is no real Scripture (the time in Exile) and how the concept of "Hell" never existed previously, but was picked up during those centuries, and incorporated into Jewish religion.

The game of "Find the magic Scripture" is not really a reality.

 

[Brainfreeze]

I'm logging off now wish I could stay but I have to put the bacon on the table and need sleepy time good night

Good night to you Mr. Robby .. God bless

 

[theStudent]

Short answers, have to cut shapes for my son right now

yes, yes, yes, & a place for satan & God made it, on account of lucifer making it for himself (made his own bed) so to speak

Brainfreeze, I am going to be a teenie bit hard, on you, but only because You set the example.
Where's the scripture? You ran into that one, did you?

God created hell as He created everything else including satan.

Thanks for using scripture RobbyEarl, but I see no place in there where it says God created hell, and you and I both know that God did not create sin, nor did he create the atom bomb.

The same goes for you Yonah.

Hell is a translation of four other words in the original languages of Hebrew and Greek: Sheol, Gehenna, Hades, and Tartarus. It essentially means the grave, or stands for death, which came into the world when Adam sinned by disobeying God. (Romans 5:12~ Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all people, because all sinned). It is done away with along with death following the resurrection and judgement of all.

Hell is the grave. It gets thrown into the lake of fire Three different translations:

Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.

Then death and the grave were thrown into the lake of fire. This lake of fire is the second death.

And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

Wonderful! Scripture - that's the key.
So Magenta has used scriptures, and a brief explanation (excellent) to say what hell is.
Anyone wants to challenge her with a scriptures, and a brief explanation?

 

[theStudent]

Unfortunately, things like this often just end up being Sunday School "Fill in the blanks with the located Scripture" exercises, when the people you spoke of coming here are more than likely looking for where the idea of the "Hell" we don't want to go to came from.

Then we have to get into where there is no real Scripture (the time in Exile) and how the concept of "Hell" never existed previously, but was picked up during those centuries, and incorporated into Jewish religion.

The game of "Find the magic Scripture" is not really a reality.

But they will only be looking for where the idea of hell came from, if the challenge the bible or don't really accept it.
Most people believe the scriptures, and with a little explanation, go away satisfied.

Like this one:

Hell is a translation of four other words in the original languages of Hebrew and Greek: Sheol, Gehenna, Hades, and Tartarus.

But if you have a better suggestions as to how we can let the word of God speak, for the sake of those genuine at heart people, you are free to share.

 

[Brainfreeze]

Brainfreeze, I am going to be a teenie bit hard, on you, but only because You set the example.
Where's the scripture? You ran into that one, did you?

?

I was thinking of a scripture but figured that would be related to later (more difficult) questions, that's what I get for assuming

Colossians 1
16For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him

 

[hornetguy]

Matthew 25:41

[SUP]41 [/SUP]“Then the King will turn to those on the left and say, ‘Away with you, you cursed ones, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his demons.[SUP][g][/SUP]

a place prepared for the devil and his angels...

And, Yonah's scripture John 1:3

In the beginning the Word already existed.
The Word was with God,
and the Word was God.
[SUP]2 [/SUP]He existed in the beginning with God.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]God created everything through him,
and nothing was created except through him.

nothing was made that was not made by Him

 

[Willie-T]

But they will only be looking for where the idea of hell came from, if the challenge the bible or don't really accept it.
Most people believe the scriptures, and with a little explanation, go away satisfied.

Like this one:


But if you have a better suggestions as to how we can let the word of God speak, for the sake of those genuine at heart people, you are free to share.

Thanks, but I guess people need to do this. I just got it out of my system years ago, and want more. My wife keeps reminding me that many people still have to do their share of the "Fill in the Blanks", and that it is often a process they need to go through. So, I guess it has its purpose.

 

[theStudent]

Matthew 25:41
a place prepared for the devil and his angels...

Excellent use of scripture.
But Magenta used a scripture to show that hell is cast into the lake of fire.
So is this everlasting fire hell, or the lake of fire?

Actually she didn't quote it, but it's in Revelation 20. I think 13.

 

[PilgrimPassingThru]

Heres a a clip of a few mentioning the same

 

[theStudent]

I was thinking of a scripture but figured that would be related to later (more difficult) questions, that's what I get for assuming

Colossians 1
16For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him

Well God didn't create sin, and the bible calls death an enemy, and says that it got here through Adam.
1 Corinthians 15:
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
Romans 5:
12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:



So God is not responsible for either right?

 

[hornetguy]

I assumed that you were playing the role of a new believer, and most new believers think of Hell as being the place lost people go after the final judgment.

Most new believers don't know about the Hadean world, the place of waiting that Magenta described so well.

 

[theStudent]

Hell is a translation of four other words in the original languages of Hebrew and Greek: Sheol, Gehenna, Hades, and Tartarus. It essentially means the grave, or stands for death, which came into the world when Adam sinned by disobeying God. (Romans 5:12~ Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all people, because all sinned). It is done away with along with death following the resurrection and judgement of all.

Hell is the grave. It gets thrown into the lake of fire Three different translations:

Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.

Then death and the grave were thrown into the lake of fire. This lake of fire is the second death.

And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

If you did research this you would find this to be true.
The original Hebrew and Greek words are translated differently in different translations.

And based on scripture, it is not everlasting.

Revelation 20:
13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

 

[theStudent]

I assumed that you were playing the role of a new believer, and most new believers think of Hell as being the place lost people go after the final judgment.

Most new believers don't know about the Hadean world, the place of waiting that Magenta described so well.

Most old believers haven't a clue.

I know a few students, who aren't even baptized, and know more, than those baptized 30 years their senior. Wasn't Jesus 12 years old, when he was teaching the priest? And weren't his disciples who were considered non-scholars, more knowledgeable?

If a person wants to learn, youn or old, they will.