Do we decide to be saved?

[followjesus]

That is NOT what Scripture tells us:

For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. (1 Tim 2:3,4)

But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things... But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him. (1 Jn 2:20, 27)

When people follow the teachings of false teachers, then they cannot see the whole counsel of God.

" My People perish because there is No shepherd to feed them, they perish for Lack of Knowledge of the Lord, they speak but visions of thier Heart and deciet of thier dreams. therefore I will feed the Wormwood and send a famine of Hearing the word of the Lord..... But I will raise up for them My Shepherd, and He will feed them and fill them, from the throne of david, He will shepherd My People. I will put My spirit in them and cause them to Walk in My ways, cause them to Hear and to see.....He will bring forth Judgement into truth, and the isles shall wait for His Law.....son of Man say to these dead Bones Live and they shall Live


" I am the good shepherd, My sheep Know My voice and they will Not follow a stranger"

 

[John146]

From what I have read in the Bible so far, I am currently inclined toward election but it also "seems to me" that we make a decision to be saved. I can't reconcile these two positions, other than to suggest that PERHAPS God elects us to salvation but we decide when to take Him up on it.

I am not aware of any significant distinction between election and predestination.

Predestination is a beautiful doctrine that is aimed at one who is already saved. It never refers to being chosen for salvation. Predestination teaches the believer that the adoption, the redemption of the body, is the future hope of those who have trusted in Christ as Savior. It is our destination even though it has not occurred yet.

 

[EarnestQ]

Once you understand how God's foreknowledge enters into this, it will affect your understanding. Those who are elected are "elect according to the foreknowledge of God".

So you are saying there is no decision we make that affects if or when we are saved?

 

[EarnestQ]

Simple enough, the elect are/were predestined. Then there is everyone else, the dead.

View attachment 180907

See above.

 

[John146]

So you are saying there is no decision we make that affects if or when we are saved?

God's election is simply God's choosing. It is not referring to being chosen for salvation. Jesus Christ is God's elect, Isaiah 42. Did Jesus Christ need salvation? Jesus Christ is the way God elected to bring about His salvation plan. We see in Scripture, God always puts aside the first and elects the second.

Cain - Abel
Ishmael - Isaac
Esau - Jacob
Saul - David
Law - grace
OT - NT

The first represents the flesh, with the second representing the spiritual.

 

[JaumeJ]

Many people have fallen into a trap of thinking because it iswritten we are "foreknown" by our Father that there is no choice in being saved.

What they do not think of is that this is the age of darkness where when we come to the Father through the Blood of His Blessed Lamb, we then become "foreknown" before the Kingdom comes.

When I came to The One Who Is, He led me to Jesus Christ by the Holy Spirit.......In so doing He has foreknown me before teh Kingdom to come.

So it is with all who are given to turn to Jesus Christ.........This should be enough to understand what I understand, but elaboration is there if you want it.

 

[EarnestQ]

A rather abstract thought I have had regarding this issue of predestination vs free will is how I see the difference between us experiencing time and God being outside of time.

I have likened it to a mural painted on a wall. The wall is time. God has painted upon it the very beginning of time through the very end of time. Our life is painted as a very short segment on that wall.

To God, the entire wall, the entire stream of time, is but one instant in "now". This explains to me how God can answer a prayer before we pray it and how God can prophesy (a verb, as opposed to the noun prophecy) about the future.

It "might" also be that since all time is the same instant before God that our free will decision and God's predestination are the same thing to God. But I admit that this is just my speculation on how God can reconcile predestination and free will.

I expect that, in spite of all of our presumptions about how right we are, we really won't understand it until we are in eternity and we understand how God has worked in time better.

Perhaps, at that "time", we will not really care about it at all.

 

[JaumeJ]

This is funny in a good way.

I have used that same "mural analogy" for fifty years.

The Father knw me when my heart was broken and a gave it to Him........He led me to Jesus Christ, but it took a broken heart and my own desiree to be led to Him.......All blessings in our most wonderous Lord...j

A rather abstract thought I have had regarding this issue of predestination vs free will is how I see the difference between us experiencing time and God being outside of time.

I have likened it to a mural painted on a wall. The wall is time. God has painted upon it the very beginning of time through the very end of time. Our life is painted as a very short segment on that wall.

To God, the entire wall, the entire stream of time, is but one instant in "now". This explains to me how God can answer a prayer before we pray it and how God can prophesy (a verb, as opposed to the noun prophecy) about the future.

It "might" also be that since all time is the same instant before God that our free will decision and God's predestination are the same thing to God. But I admit that this is just my speculation on how God can reconcile predestination and free will.

I expect that, in spite of all of our presumptions about how right we are, we really won't understand it until we are in eternity and we understand how God has worked in time better.

Perhaps, at that "time", we will not really care about it at all.

 

[John146]

A rather abstract thought I have had regarding this issue of predestination vs free will is how I see the difference between us experiencing time and God being outside of time.

I have likened it to a mural painted on a wall. The wall is time. God has painted upon it the very beginning of time through the very end of time. Our life is painted as a very short segment on that wall.

To God, the entire wall, the entire stream of time, is but one instant in "now". This explains to me how God can answer a prayer before we pray it and how God can prophesy (a verb, as opposed to the noun prophecy) about the future.

It "might" also be that since all time is the same instant before God that our free will decision and God's predestination are the same thing to God. But I admit that this is just my speculation on how God can reconcile predestination and free will.

I expect that, in spite of all of our presumptions about how right we are, we really won't understand it until we are in eternity and we understand how God has worked in time better.

Perhaps, at that "time", we will not really care about it at all.

Predestination and free will go hand in hand. Man has the free will to believe upon the Lord Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins that brings salvation. The saved man now has been predestined unto the future adoption, which is the redemption of the body. Predestination has nothing to do about God determining who gets saved, rather, it is God choosing those who receive His Son to adopt them in the future, giving them a glorified body.

 

[carl11]

Predestination and free will go hand in hand. Man has the free will to believe upon the Lord Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins that brings salvation. The saved man now has been predestined unto the future adoption, which is the redemption of the body. Predestination has nothing to do about God determining who gets saved, rather, it is God choosing those who receive His Son to adopt them in the future, giving them a glorified body.

sure man had free will and yet they can say I chose Christ but the problem with that statement is that it goes contrary to what the scriptures have to say. In other words any action that we take to get ourselves saved would be a work and we know without a shadow of a doubt that the Bible says one cannot be come saved because of a work. Predestination has everything to do with salvation, now just because one has been predestined and is one of God’s elect does not mean they have become automatically saved before they were born albeit it could be possible but there still are requirements that God has to do in order that a person may become saved.

 

[John146]

In other words any action that we take to get ourselves saved would be a work and we know without a shadow of a doubt that the Bible says one cannot be come saved because of a work. Predestination has everything to do with salvation, now just because one has been predestined and is one of God’s elect does not mean they have become automatically saved before they were born albeit it could be possible but there still are requirements that God has to do in order that a person may become saved.

Let's go to Scripture.

16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?

You cannot equate believing with a work of the law. Over and over Scripture states that believing the gospel of Jesus Christ brings about salvation. Jesus has accomplished all the work. All we must do is believe.

 

[John146]

Ephesians 1:5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

Paul is addressing already saved believers. The "us" is saved believers. What is the adoption?Romans 8:23And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

What's the believer's destination that we are waiting for? The adoption, the redemption of our bodies. The adoption has not happened yet, it is a future thing promised to believers. The seal of the Holy Spirit guarantees the adoption will take place.

 

[carl11]

Let's go to Scripture.

16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?

You cannot equate believing with a work of the law. Over and over Scripture states that believing the gospel of Jesus Christ brings about salvation. Jesus has accomplished all the work. All we must do is believe.

Right the Bible declares to believe, have faith, confess, endure to the end, become baptize and yet everyone one of these statements is a work. I need not tell you that Eph. 2 declares we all are dead in sins and trespasses, likewise Rom. 3 declares no one is good. Titus 3:5 says not by works of righteous will save us. In the end it is 100% the work of Christ and not 99.9% and then .1% of us.

 

[Magenta]

So you are saying there is no decision we make that affects if or when we are saved?

No, I do not believe that is what Nehemiah is saying at all, for if I understand his position correctly (and I believe I do ), he stands staunchly against Calvinism

 

[John146]

Right the Bible declares to believe, have faith, confess, endure to the end, become baptize and yet everyone one of these statements is a work. I need not tell you that Eph. 2 declares we all are dead in sins and trespasses, likewise Rom. 3 declares no one is good. Titus 3:5 says not by works of righteous will save us. In the end it is 100% the work of Christ and not 99.9% and then .1% of us.

Acts 16:
30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

 

[carl11]

Acts 16:
30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

Jn. 6:29

 

[joaniemarie]

That is NOT what Scripture tells us:

For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. (1 Tim 2:3,4)

But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things... But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him. (1 Jn 2:20, 27)

When people follow the teachings of false teachers, then they cannot see the whole counsel of God.

Wow Nehemiah., So you believe you know the whole council of God? I certainly don't believe that.

Below is a re post of what I said that you responded to just to be clear. IN CONTEXT I don't believe it is possible for us here on earth to know the whole counsel of God. I don't even think when we get to heaven and get our new bodies we will know the whole counsel of God.

But I do know for sure that we know (in part) and we can and should be growing daily in the grace and knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ .......but we will NOT know it ALL. But if you believe you know it.... pardon me if I don't hang on your every word because I don't believe that is a possibility. We know only in part.


(previous post)






[h=2]

Re: Do we decide to be saved?[/h]

Originally Posted by seed_time_harvest

Everyone deep down knows there Is a GOD so then there Is no excuse,say yes.Choose to believe and where we are weak,HE Is strong.



I've been reading some of the posts here and they bring up so many good points and verses. I was thinking about how people are "blinded" How satan has blinded the minds of those who believe not so that the light of the glorious gospel should shine unto them....... There is so much to this yet when it all is said and done., we can totally count on the love and grace of God in Jesus to accomplish what He starts doing.

Understanding the whole counsel of God is not for us to do... but understanding that He so loved the world and us individually., He gave His only begotten Son that WHOSOEVER believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life...

We can be confident in that Love and grace and lean on it hard. ​

 

[joaniemarie]

Joaniemarie, I guess I owe you an apology. I was speaking against some of the things you were putting forth pertaining to healing. God has let me keep so many ailments I almost forgot the times He has healed me. Covering the notes for my books, I came across notes pertaining to healing that I preached on 30 years ago.

I often said I would pray with anyone about healing. Perhaps I should pray less and believe more. At least believe what the Holy Spirit gave me all those years ago. I am sorry I spoke ill of you admonishes, and I thank you for waking my spirit back up.

View attachment 180913

Thank you for sharing that Deade. I've not remembered any of your posts to be rude or mean at all. But I so appreciate your kind words here and am very thankful that these discussions brought some good blessings to your mind about what the Lord has done in your life.

I didn't know you were a preacher! PRAISE THE LORD!!!! I hope you will share your experiences on the subject. God bless you brother!

 

[Nehemiah6]

Wow Nehemiah., So you believe you know the whole council of God? I certainly don't believe that.

Unfortunately there is a lot of Bible truth you don't believe, and there are a lot of unbiblical things which you do believe.

So what I will do is post excerpts from what Got Questions has to say about this, and you will discover that WHEN CHRISTIANS OPEN THEIR BIBLES they see the whole counsel of God.

Question: "What is the whole counsel of God?"

Answer: The phrase the whole counsel of God is found in Acts 20:27. In his farewell speech to the elders of the Ephesian church, Paul says, “Therefore I testify to you this day that I am innocent of the blood of all, for I did not shrink from declaring to you the whole counsel of God” (Acts 20:26–27, ESV). Declaring the whole counsel of God is what made Paul “innocent” of anyone’s choice to turn away from the truth. Paul had fulfilled his ministry among the Ephesians....

Paul shared “the whole counsel of God” (ESV) or “the whole will of God” (NIV) or “the whole purpose of God” (NASB) in that he spoke the complete gospel. He had given them the whole truth about God’s salvation. He also revealed to them the “mystery” of God (Ephesians 3:9), which in the context ofEphesians 3 is God’s extending His plan of salvation to Gentiles as well as Jews.

Despite the opposition Paul faced in Ephesus, he continued to share the good news in its entirety. He did not shrink back from his duty but proclaimed the whole counsel of God. He tells the Ephesian elders, “I served the Lord with great humility and with tears and in the midst of severe testing by the plots of my Jewish opponents. You know that I have not hesitated to preach anything that would be helpful to you but have taught you publicly and from house to house. I have declared to both Jews and Greeks that they must turn to God in repentance and have faith in our Lord Jesus” (Acts 20:19–21). Paul shared everything that God had revealed with everyone who would listen—and even some who wouldn’t...

Paul emphasizes “the whole counsel of God” as a way to affirm the completion of his duties toward the Ephesians and to remind them of the truth. Paul warns, “I know that after I leave, savage wolves will come in among you and will not spare the flock. Even from your own number men will arise and distort the truth in order to draw away disciples after them. So be on your guard!” (Acts 20:29–31).

The whole counsel of God includes some things that are difficult to hear—the fact that we are dead in sin and deserving of God’s wrath (Ephesians 2:1–3) and the fact that we cannot save ourselves through works (Ephesians 2:8–9). The gospel is a call to repentance and faith. Believers will face persecution (John 16:33) and likely be considered foolish. But none of these things can dissuade us.

We should follow Paul’s example and also preach the whole counsel of God. All Scripture is inspired, and all of it is profitable (2 Timothy 3:16). We must preach it in its entirety and allow the Holy Spirit to use His sword as He sees fit (Ephesians 6:17). Paul did not share half-truths or only parts of the gospel; rather, he shared all of what God has revealed. We must do the same.

You can read the full article here: https://www.gotquestions.org/whole-counsel-of-God.html

 

[joaniemarie]

Unfortunately there is a lot of Bible truth you don't believe, and there are a lot of unbiblical things which you do believe.

So what I will do is post excerpts from what Got Questions has to say about this, and you will discover that WHEN CHRISTIANS OPEN THEIR BIBLES they see the whole counsel of God.




You can read the full article here: https://www.gotquestions.org/whole-counsel-of-God.html

Based on all of your previous posts to me., I have no interest or desire in hearing your advice or teaching links. My only interaction with you is re posting my posts IN CONTEXT since you continually try to take what I post out of context. Since you do that with me 99% of the time I can only imagine what you do with other information you handle.