2 God's

[OtherWay210]

This comes to mind, that how well do we know our own family ?
Growing up I thought i "knew" ; my family until i converted,
then realized the world is a different place then i was lead to believe.
That takes time, and the right information or experience good or bad ;
to form a better map of the world our family and ourselves.
We're not always seeing the world or self, or others as they actually are.

People change and we change .
But when it comes to God He wont change.
Hes the same yesterday today and forever.

That being true : then the only answer left is ;we do not really know God ;
if it appear as if He is changing.


Prophecy tells something before it happens.
What happens in the NT, was taught before the fact in the OT.
Time meaning very little to God ( 2 Peter 3:8 ) .

 

[stonesoffire]

I don't know if this has been said, only reading from beginning. But, could the view of God be misconstrued, not having anyone who expressed the true nature of God before Jesus?

Misconstrued in the OT I mean. Well, actually is still this way until Jesus is known.

 

[Deade]

He is the same. The Bible is an integrated whole.

Hi Lucy-Pevensie,

You got that right. It was always the pre-incarnate Jesus dealing with all the patriarchs of old. No human has seen God the Father, in any form: John 6:46: “Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father.”

Jesus is the creator, lawgiver and leader of ancient Israel:

1 Corinthians 10:1-4: “Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea; and were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea; and 1 did all eat the same spiritual meat; and did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.”

John 8:58: “Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.”

John 1:1-3: “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.”

To behold the face of the Father (now also Christ) in His glorified state, we would automatically serve him. We would be so overwhelmed we would feel His power. Like when He comes back and they call for the rocks to fall upon them to escape His felt power. It wouldn’t take faith to serve Him, and He insists on faith (Heb. 11:6).

Yours,

Deade

 

[stonesoffire]

I'm not going to argue the point, but there is evidence in the Bible that the "God of the Old Testament" is actually Jesus, not the Father. John declares that Isaiah saw Jesus, not the Father, on the throne.

I think that the idea of two different entities results from speculations rather than scholarship. The idea of Jesus throwing down fire and sulfur on Sodom doesn't square with "gentle Jesus, meek and mild". It's more comfortable to put the wrathful god at a distance, equate him with "the Father" Whom we cannot see, and embrace Jesus Who did not do such things while on earth. What is overlooked in such a view is that "He who has seen Me has seen the Father" and "I do what I see My Father doing". In other words, the two are one in character, will, and action.

A side note, with a grammar nazi trigger warning: the plural of god is gods, not god's. The possessive of god is god's, and the plural possessive is gods'.

I think it's in Exodus where Moses went to the mountaintop to be with Father, only not known thatvwaybyet, but the men with Moses met with the God of Israel somewhere on the way up, and they all ate together. Moses had sprinkled them with blood before going up.

 

[7777pinacled]

I think it's in Exodus where Moses went to the mountaintop to be with Father, only not known thatvwaybyet, but the men with Moses met with the God of Israel somewhere on the way up, and they all ate together. Moses had sprinkled them with blood before going up.

Yes the very mountain where our Lord spoke to moshe of the Holy Ground. A humble man seeking peace.

The very place that a mans humble heart and ears lead him to see the divine shekinah.
The same place that in his pain and suffering a sacrificial love was well placed in the hands of another.

A man who has spoken with the gentle passerby, rightly shielded his eyes.

 

[7777pinacled]

I think it's in Exodus where Moses went to the mountaintop to be with Father, only not known thatvwaybyet, but the men with Moses met with the God of Israel somewhere on the way up, and they all ate together. Moses had sprinkled them with blood before going up.

Yes, generations
the very mountain where our Lord spoke to moshe of the Holy Ground. A humble man seeking peace.

The very place that a mans humble heart and ears lead him to see the divine shekinah.
The same place that in his pain and suffering a sacrificial love was well placed in the hands of another.

A man who has spoken with the gentle passerby, rightly shielded his eyes.

 

[FlyingDove]

OT Jehovah is Jesus (Theophany). Jesus/Jehovah is the Son

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word (Jesus/Jehovah), and the Word (Jesus/Jehovah), was with God (Jehovah the Father), and the Word (Jesus/Jehovah) was God.

The Father/Jehovah dwells in him (Jn 14:10 & 20) & in Jehovah/Son dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily (Col 2:9). And because of this the Son can either pardon or punish.

Matthew 28:18 Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

Before the creation of our universe. The pre-existing determinate counsel (Acts 2:23). God the Father-Son-Holy Spirit, crafted & executed the plan for our universe.

Luke 1:68 Blessed be the Lord God of Israel; for he hath visited and redeemed his people,

John 6:38 "Jesus said; I have come down from heaven"

Jn 8:23 Jesus said, You are from below; I am from above. You are of this world, this earthly order; I am not of this world

Jn 16:28 Jesus said; I came out from the Father & have come into the world; again, I am leaving the world & going to the Father

Jn 17:5 Father, glorify Me along with Yourself & "restore Me to such majesty & honor in Your presence as I had with You before the world existed

God the Son Jehovah/Jesus is the agent by whom Jehovah God the Father works in our universe.

God the Son = Jehovah/Jesus is PREEMINENT (Col 1:18) in ALL things within our realm:

Creation: Jn 1:3 & 10, Col 1:16, 1 Cor 8:6

Redemption: Gal 3:13, Rev 5:9, Col 1:14, Rom3:24

Resurrection: Jn 11:25, Acts 4:33, 1Pet 1:3 & 3:21

Mediation: 1 Tim 2:5, Heb 8:6, 9:15, 12:24

Jugdment: Jn 5:22, Rom 2:16, 2 Tim 4:1

After creation; Gen 1: Jehovah, God the Son rested from his work.

After Jesus/Jehovah = God the Son finished the work of redemption. He go's to Heaven and sits down next at the right hand of Jehovah God the Father (Acts 7:55-56, Eph 1:20, Col 3:1, Heb 8:1)

This is my perspective/opinion only. Maranatha FD

 

[stonesoffire]

Imrah or Memra is the manifested Word of the Lord in Hebrew. Is what the Jews called Him, and knew of Him by this.

I love to find these gems.

 

[posthuman]

God has not stopped being angry with mankind in the NT:

But God shows his anger from heaven against all sinful, wicked people who suppress the truth by their wickedness.
Romans 1:18 NLT
https://bible.com/bible/116/rom.1.18.NLT

​

Yes

God is angry with the wicked every day.
If he turn not, He will whet His sword;
He hath bent his bow, and made it ready.
(Psalm 7:11-12)
​

He does not change.
Eternal Father, Eternal Son
God is one.

 

[posthuman]

Surely the cross has Him looking at mankind in a different way some, dont you think.

the same way He looked when He shed blood to make clothing and cover the shame of the man and the woman in Genesis 3, don't you think?

 

[posthuman]

I believe that God Himself is learning from His different experiences...from before being a Father to after begetting a son....because He seems to soften somewhat.
I think we humans also do and get this from God...so much understanding can be gained from our own experiences who are made in the likeness of God.

if God can "learn" then there is a time when He is ignorant. then He is not God; He is not omniscient and every verse that says "Lord you know all things" is a lie.

God does not change.

He is not a man, that He should lie, or change His mind. Numbers 23:19.

 

[Magenta]

if God can "learn" then there is a time when He is ignorant. then He is not God; He is not omniscient and every verse that says "Lord you know all things" is a lie.

God does not change.

He is not a man, that He should lie, or change His mind. Numbers 23:19.

Jesus grew in wisdom and stature, and in favor with God and man. Luke 2:52

 

[posthuman]

Jesus grew in wisdom and stature, and in favor with God and man. Luke 2:52

Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.
(Hebrews 13:8) ​

 

[posthuman]

Jesus grew in wisdom and stature, and in favor with God and man. Luke 2:52

Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.
(Hebrews 13:8) ​

did we break the Bible?

no, we found a place where something amazing is hidden

we should buy the whole field, then dig it out! (("on the lookout for choice pearls"))

 

[joefizz]

What do you see as the difference between the Old testament creator God, and the New Testament Father God.
Just a thought provoking question, I'm just looking for your understanding you dont have to be a scholar to answer.
What I see is that God was a Father before creation but in the Old Testament he had no one he could be Father too.
There was no cross, there was no born again, there were no bona fide offspring birthed of God the Father.
He had in Him all his Fatherly attributes but none to express them too.
So what we have is an angry (with mankind) OT God with Fatherly attributes he cannot express.

So when Jesus came and begin to call God His Father it was a strange phenomenon to people.
Ultimately that is what cost Jesus His life, He called God his Father.

So I have already done one message today, this is just a short story I have had rolling around in me.
Any thoughts good, bad, or indifferent.

noone to be father to?
exactly how many angels were with him in heaven again?

 

[Magenta]

Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.
(Hebrews 13:8) ​

I wonder what it was like for Him to be a baby

 

[posthuman]

I wonder what it was like for Him to be a baby

and an apprentice carpenter

 

[loveme1]

I see Heavenly Father throughout the Old and New Testament.. what changes is us inwardly through what came to pass when the Lord was crucified and Resurrected by our Gracious, Powerful and Loving GOD.

 

[OneFaith]

God is the same today, yesterday, and tomorrow. He seems different because He did things physically in the Old Testament that He now does spiritually in the New Testament- which seems tamer to us.

God was His people’s Father long before the cross. If you look up genealogy in the Bible, it says “...and Seth the son of Adam, and Adam the son of God.” We are made in His image- a child shares the image of their father. His people from under the old covenant (the 144,000) are just as much His children as Christians are.

 

[beta]

if God can "learn" then there is a time when He is ignorant. then He is not God; He is not omniscient and every verse that says "Lord you know all things" is a lie.

God does not change.

He is not a man, that He should lie, or change His mind. Numbers 23:19.

I think you misunderstand...God does KNOW everything ! He has all knowledge IN SPIRIT/in Mind/given in stone/ on paper, whichever way He can communicate with man...but He could have no 'fleshly personal experience until He had a Son in the flesh. Jesus having the Mind/Spirit of His Father could then relay the human experience to God His Father....who until then KNEW EVRYthing only through Mind/Spirit which has not the feelings of the flesh.
GOD lacking KNOWledge is never in question !!! He knows everything to the finest detail but could not FEEL it as acutely till He had a SON.
Please PH, this is just as I see it today...tomorrow I might be corrected and know better, we grow and learn every day ...it's not a doctrine.