Is once saved always saved true? Or is it only giving false security?

[Hornet689]

[h=2]Is once saved always saved true? Or is it only giving false security?[/h]

Is once saved always saved true?
Or is it only giving false security?

This subject is one that I believe the devil has done much damage. If a person is saved and tormented by guilt and shame, then the devil will accuse them of not being saved. This is used by the enemy to bring much fear, torment and condemnation into a person's life. There is no need to fear losing your salvation, if you know how much that God loves you, how merciful of a God we serve, and how we are not saved by works but by grace. Are we living a worldly lifestyle? Are we holding unforgiveness in our hearts? Now that's another story.

I strongly encourage you to consider the whole gospel of salvation, as it is VERY much filled with hope and the love of God, and not to simply look at this teaching and feel condemned. It is my hope that this teaching motivates you to get serious about your relationship with God and forgive those whom have wronged you. That is what Jesus is asking of us! To love Him with our whole heart, and to love one another as He has forgiven us. Is that asking too much, after all that He has done for us? Not at all.

Those who need to hold tightly to the once-saved theory, are those who's minds are bound in dead religion. They do not grasp the concept of God's love, grace, and mercy towards us, and therefore need to feel secure, because they do not feel worthy as they are attempting to be saved by works. They feel that one mistake, and God is angry with them. This is not true, but to somebody who has religious strongholds and spirits (demons), this is too big of a reality to overlook. If this is you, then I encourage you to read my teachings on Exposing Dead Religion and The Jesus of the Bible. If you cling tightly to the once-saved theory, then you have some serious bondages to religion and should resolved those through spiritual warfare and deliverance and establish your intimate relationship with God.

It is my heart's desire with this teaching to do two things: (a) break up the nonsense of once-saved theology which is costing the body of Christ numerous number of souls every year, and (b) provide comfort and truth to those who are tormented constantly over fear of losing their salvation. If you think that you're going to lose your salvation every time you slip up, then you are not living in grace but legalism, and do not understand your relationship with God, and as a result, you will constantly fear loss of your salvation and fall into condemnation.

Why is it so important to preach against once-saved? Because millions of souls are in hell because the church has not done it's job educating the body. While we are out evangelizing the sinners, there are people in our own congregations that are on their way to hell. Why? One good reason is unforgiveness. The Bible is crystal clear that if we don't forgive those who wrong us, then we are not going to receive forgiveness for our own sins, and as a result, we abide in spiritual death.

For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

Matthew 6:14-15

We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death. Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.

1 John 3:14-15

What does love have to do with forgiving others? Everything! We are commanded to love and forgive others as Christ has forgiven us. The Bible tells us that love covers (forgives) sin that others have done against us.

And above all things have fervent charity among yourselves: for charity [love] shall cover the multitude of sins.

1 Peter 4:8

Hatred stirreth up strifes: but love covereth all sins.

Proverbs 10:12

If I am right, and I have every reason to believe that I am, then there are millions of Christians who are on their way to hell right now because there are unresolved issues of unforgiveness in their hearts towards at least one person who has wronged them.

John Bevere wrote an anointed book entitled The Bait of Satan. This book contains the most anointed, scriptural, and motivating message on unforgiveness that I have ever heard. It is not written in a condemnation manner at all, but rather conviction to get us serious about our forgiving others. It is a must-read for any believer in Christ!

The OSAS arguments considered

There are several passages in the Bible which are used in an attempt to prove that we cannot lose our salvation. I want to take a closer look at some of the most common theories in this teaching.

"Nobody can pluck us from the Father's hand" (John 10:28-29)

If you back up one more verse, you'll find some missing information about this passage; in verse 27, we find that true sheep will follow Christ:

My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
​

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[rachelsedge]

I don't know if it's so much that it's not once-saved-always-saved, but rather more like the parable of the seeds. Many of the seeds do land somewhere and grow, but it's not for long. Some don't have deep roots, some are choked by the world, and yet others don't even make it to the dirt.

I'm a bit confused which side you're arguing for. You are against once-saved-always-saved, but then you say this:

...(I want to) provide comfort and truth to those who are tormented constantly over fear of losing their salvation. If you think that you're going to lose your salvation every time you slip up, then you are not living in grace but legalism, and do not understand your relationship with God, and as a result, you will constantly fear loss of your salvation and fall into condemnation.

If you think that you can lose your salvation, then wouldn't that fear be rational?

For those souls who we are "losing in church every year", I would say that they were never had in the first place; much like the seeds in the parable.

 

[CDavid]

I don't know if it's so much that it's not once-saved-always-saved, but rather more like the parable of the seeds. Many of the seeds do land somewhere and grow, but it's not for long. Some don't have deep roots, some are choked by the world, and yet others don't even make it to the dirt.

I'm a bit confused which side you're arguing for. You are against once-saved-always-saved, but then you say this:



If you think that you can lose your salvation, then wouldn't that fear be rational?

For those souls who we are "losing in church every year", I would say that they were never had in the first place; much like the seeds in the parable.

The "Once saved always saved" is just a feel good philosophy, as is the per-trib rapture. Take it from one who spent 48 years believing both. Then, I began to read the Bible for myself. Both are dangerous doctrines.

 

[Ritter]

Dangerous in terms of real effects on the salvation of the soul?

I'll have to part ways there.

Dangerous in terms of glossing over doctrinal truth and giving an uneasy feeling of license to Christians?

Yes.

Dipping a bit farther into soteriology, the text available is pretty clear that one cannot "lose" their salvation. Backslide? Yes. Get a taste then ultimately commit the unpardonable sin? Yes. But to be fully immersed and be made a new creation? To have one's sins be forgotten? To rely on the Sovereignty and Lordship of Christ to solidify the process rather than our own fickle and fallible selves? No.

Loss of salvation does not contextually work.

 

[Cobus]

The Bible gives the answer. Was a person ever saved that keeps on sinning. That is the question..... I do not care what Satan says to whom, NOT AT ALL. But I do care LOTS what God says to us.... And HE SAYS.....
1 John 3:9, That whosoever is born of God CANNOT SIN. What? CANNOT SIN? Yes cannot sin.
I see salvation as to be BORN OF GOD, and that person CANNOT sin, because he is BORN OF GOD! And the SEED of God REMAINITH IN HIM. So if a person that is Born of God CAN SIN, then God is a lier. And we know HE IS NOT! BUT!!!!! That person may ask God that God would put HIM BACK IN HIS FLESH, but then there is NO MORE SALVATION for this person.

You see rebirth, means to be BORN OF GOD, and that GOD'S Holy Spirit is now the Spirit in the flesh, your spirit has gone to be IN GOD, and hidden there untill Jesus returns. But there is a way BACK to the OLD YOU... all you have to do is ASK GOD TO PUT YOU BACK IN YOUR FLESH.... Then you will sin again, and God removed HIS SEED from your flesh, and HE WILL NEVER put it back again.

So there you are, that is why people are confused. If Christ Jesus lives in our flesh, HE CANNOT SIN. But if we return to remove him from the flesh and take it all over again, we will sin again, and then there is no salvation for us. I do not know af ANY person in life or the Bible that did this stupid act to replace Jesus in their old flesh. Some fall away on the WAY to life, but the ones that completed the WAY (Jesus is the Way) are as perfect as He is perfect, because that is what God's salvation does. Makes even the flesh do God's will and produce GOOD WORKS only!

 

[Hungry]

The "Once saved always saved" is just a feel good philosophy, as is the per-trib rapture. Take it from one who spent 48 years believing both. Then, I began to read the Bible for myself. Both are dangerous doctrines.

I think most of the confusion comes with, are you saved in the first place? We are to be the Bride of Christ but I think some people just want to date for a while. I think they moved in but didn't necessarily tie the knot then moved on. Jesus said we can tell a tree by its fruit. There should be tell tale evidence that someone is a Christian other than a fish on their car. If they have no problem sinning, and cursing then I'd suggest they may be in danger. But, if they are God's children He will continually rebuke them, so although you might catch them in a lie or something they will be more opt to apologize and forgive. As for the pre-trib rapture Revelations states the Restrainer must come out of the world before the worst happens. Most consider this to be the Holy Spirit. So if God will never forsake us, I think its a strong argument that we are going too.

 

[PS]

1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will depart from the faith by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons,

1 Timothy 1:19 Holding faith and a good conscience. By rejecting this, some have made shipwreck of their faith,

2 Peter 2:15 Forsaking the right way, they have gone astray. They have followed the way of Balaam,

2 Peter 2:20 If they have escaped the corruption of the world by knowing our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ and are again entangled in it and overcome, they are worse off at the end than they were at the beginning.

2 Peter 2:21 It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than to have known it and then to turn their backs on the sacred command that was passed on to them.

2 Timothy 4:3-4 For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions, and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander off into myths.

Ezekiel 33:18 “If a righteous man turns from his righteousness and does evil, he will die for it.”

Galations 5:4-7 You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace. For through the Spirit, by faith, we ourselves eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness. For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything, but only faith working through love. You were running well. Who hindered you from obeying the truth?

Hebrews 6:4 “It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, if they fall away, to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.”

Hebrews 10:26-29 For if we go on sinning deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a fearful expectation of judgment, and a fury of fire that will consume the adversaries. Anyone who has set aside the law of Moses dies without mercy on the evidence of two or three witnesses. How much worse punishment, do you think, will be deserved by the one who has spurned the Son of God, and has profaned the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has outraged the Spirit of grace?

Hebrews 12:15-17 See to it that no one fails to obtain the grace of God; that no “root of bitterness” springs up and causes trouble, and by it many become defiled; that no one is sexually immoral or unholy like Esau, who sold his birthright for a single meal. For you know that afterward, when he desired to inherit the blessing, he was rejected, for he found no chance to repent, though he sought it with tears.

Hebrews 3:12-14,18 Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called “today,” that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. For we have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original confidence firm to the end....And to whom did he swear that they would not enter his rest, but to those who were disobedient?

Luke 9:62 Jesus said to him, “No one who puts his hand to the plow and looks back is fit for the kingdom of God.”

Proverbs 21:16 “A man who strays from the path of understanding comes to rest in the company of the dead.”

Revelation 2:4 But I have this against you, that you have abandoned the love you had at first.

Revelation 2:5 Remember therefore from where you have fallen; repent, and do the works you did at first. If not, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place, unless you repent.

Romans 11:21-22 For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God’s kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off.

 

[Cobus]

Ps do ypu know of any person that tasted all of those POWERS OF THE COMING AGE, and BEING PART OF HOLY SPIRIT, and all that? That gave up all this to be sinner again?

 

[Bookends]

Where is scripture does it say one can be un-born, once born-again? The question is, have you been born-again and tasted the heavenly gift?

Try this as an experiment, try walking away from the faith...If you have truly repented and believed, and accepted Jesus Christ as your Lord and savior, and slip, backslide, turn away, God will chastise you bring you back again. Hebrews 12 states this clearly. If you never were born again, which mean God never adopted you as His son. Hebrews 12:8 states, [SUP]8 [/SUP]But if you are without chastening, of which all have become partakers, then you are illegitimate and not sons.

 

[Bookends]

The Bible gives the answer. Was a person ever saved that keeps on sinning. That is the question..... I do not care what Satan says to whom, NOT AT ALL. But I do care LOTS what God says to us.... And HE SAYS.....
1 John 3:9, That whosoever is born of God CANNOT SIN. What? CANNOT SIN? Yes cannot sin.
I see salvation as to be BORN OF GOD, and that person CANNOT sin, because he is BORN OF GOD! And the SEED of God REMAINITH IN HIM. So if a person that is Born of God CAN SIN, then God is a lier. And we know HE IS NOT! BUT!!!!! That person may ask God that God would put HIM BACK IN HIS FLESH, but then there is NO MORE SALVATION for this person.

You see rebirth, means to be BORN OF GOD, and that GOD'S Holy Spirit is now the Spirit in the flesh, your spirit has gone to be IN GOD, and hidden there untill Jesus returns. But there is a way BACK to the OLD YOU... all you have to do is ASK GOD TO PUT YOU BACK IN YOUR FLESH.... Then you will sin again, and God removed HIS SEED from your flesh, and HE WILL NEVER put it back again.

So there you are, that is why people are confused. If Christ Jesus lives in our flesh, HE CANNOT SIN. But if we return to remove him from the flesh and take it all over again, we will sin again, and then there is no salvation for us. I do not know af ANY person in life or the Bible that did this stupid act to replace Jesus in their old flesh. Some fall away on the WAY to life, but the ones that completed the WAY (Jesus is the Way) are as perfect as He is perfect, because that is what God's salvation does. Makes even the flesh do God's will and produce GOOD WORKS only!

You now Cobus, every time I read your stuff I have to pray for myself for you make my blood boil. According to Cobus here, if he dies now he'd goto hell, because he had admitted to us that he himself has not reached this sin perfect state in his flesh. Nobody in the bible has ever claim to have achieved this, thus everyone mentioned in the bible must not be saved. If this was true, don't you think that Jesus and Paul would have place much more emphases on a sinless perfection as a requisite for entering the eternal state, having complete salvation?

I not only pray for myself and how I react to you Cobus, but I pray to God for God to open your eyes to see that in true repentance, belief, and in real faith that Christ Paid it ALL for you.

 

[PS]

Ps do ypu know of any person that tasted all of those POWERS OF THE COMING AGE, and BEING PART OF HOLY SPIRIT, and all that? That gave up all this to be sinner again?

Yes. And as the Bible warns against it I am not prepared to discuss it.

 

[mark54]

Yes. And as the Bible warns against it I am not prepared to discuss it.

PS

D'ya think Desp might have made his way here incoginito?

 

[mark54]

Ps do ypu know of any person that tasted all of those POWERS OF THE COMING AGE, and BEING PART OF HOLY SPIRIT, and all that? That gave up all this to be sinner again?

When did you stop being a sinner?

Sin is transgression of the law 1John3:4

 

[PS]

PS

D'ya think Desp might have made his way here incoginito?

It wouldn't surprise me.

 

[Skinski7]

1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will depart from the faith by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons,

1 Timothy 1:19 Holding faith and a good conscience. By rejecting this, some have made shipwreck of their faith,

2 Peter 2:15 Forsaking the right way, they have gone astray. They have followed the way of Balaam,

2 Peter 2:20 If they have escaped the corruption of the world by knowing our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ and are again entangled in it and overcome, they are worse off at the end than they were at the beginning.

2 Peter 2:21 It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than to have known it and then to turn their backs on the sacred command that was passed on to them.

2 Timothy 4:3-4 For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions, and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander off into myths.

Ezekiel 33:18 “If a righteous man turns from his righteousness and does evil, he will die for it.”

Galations 5:4-7 You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace. For through the Spirit, by faith, we ourselves eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness. For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything, but only faith working through love. You were running well. Who hindered you from obeying the truth?

Hebrews 6:4 “It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, if they fall away, to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.”

Hebrews 10:26-29 For if we go on sinning deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a fearful expectation of judgment, and a fury of fire that will consume the adversaries. Anyone who has set aside the law of Moses dies without mercy on the evidence of two or three witnesses. How much worse punishment, do you think, will be deserved by the one who has spurned the Son of God, and has profaned the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has outraged the Spirit of grace?

Hebrews 12:15-17 See to it that no one fails to obtain the grace of God; that no “root of bitterness” springs up and causes trouble, and by it many become defiled; that no one is sexually immoral or unholy like Esau, who sold his birthright for a single meal. For you know that afterward, when he desired to inherit the blessing, he was rejected, for he found no chance to repent, though he sought it with tears.

Hebrews 3:12-14,18 Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called “today,” that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. For we have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original confidence firm to the end....And to whom did he swear that they would not enter his rest, but to those who were disobedient?

Luke 9:62 Jesus said to him, “No one who puts his hand to the plow and looks back is fit for the kingdom of God.”

Proverbs 21:16 “A man who strays from the path of understanding comes to rest in the company of the dead.”

Revelation 2:4 But I have this against you, that you have abandoned the love you had at first.

Revelation 2:5 Remember therefore from where you have fallen; repent, and do the works you did at first. If not, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place, unless you repent.

Romans 11:21-22 For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God’s kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off.

Very sobering scriptures of warning that every individual ought to heed.

It amazes me how the human mind can simply blot out such warnings and rip the following passage out of context...

Joh 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
Joh 10:28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
Joh 10:29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

Nowhere did Jesus say you could not leave His hand. He said that no man can pluck you out. Those who follow Him are the one's who will not perish those who refuse to follow will most certainly perish.

Salvation is not some judicial ticket. Salvation is a practical state of existence whereby one has been reconciled to God through repentance and faith. A saved person has escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust and they have had their consciences purged of all previous rebellion. They are adding diligently to their faith as God brings them to the full measure of holiness.

No rebel to God is going to enter the kingdom. Only doers of the will of God. Those who cling to a few select and isolated passages and use them to give themselves an assurance that there is nothing they can do that would disqualify them are caught in the same error of the Pharisees who sought their eternal security in the bloodline of Israel.

Don't be deceived. All those Scriptures PS listed are in the Bible and they are WARNINGS for the Christian.


Jesus plainly taught that if you CONTINUE in His word then you are indeed His disciple. He then said that if you sin you are the slave of sin but that He came to set people free from being a slave to sin. The Pharisees believed they were not slaves because they were blood descendents of Abraham. Jesus warned them that WHAT YOU DO reflects who you actually belong too which is exactly the sentiment Paul shares in Rom 6:16 and John shares in 1Joh 3:6-10.

Yet Jesus said of the Pharisees that they "couldn't hear His words." There are so many, so very many today who simply CANNOT HEAR the truth because their hearts are set against it. Just like the Pharisees of old they view salvation in a false light. They view salvation as some judicial ticket they have received (because they believe that Jesus judicially swapped places with them) which has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with their MANIFEST CONDUCT and thus they erroneously believe that their DEEDS are disconnected from SALVATION. This is exactly the same error of the Pharisees but dressed up in a form of Christian clothing.

Joh 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
Joh 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
Joh 8:33 They answered him, We be Abraham's seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how sayest thou, Ye shall be made free?
Joh 8:34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.
Joh 8:35 And the servant abideth not in the house for ever: but the Son abideth ever.
Joh 8:36 If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.
Joh 8:37 I know that ye are Abraham's seed; but ye seek to kill me, because my word hath no place in you.
Joh 8:38 I speak that which I have seen with my Father: and ye do that which ye have seen with your father.
Joh 8:39 They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham.
Joh 8:40 But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham.
Joh 8:41 Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.
Joh 8:42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
Joh 8:43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
Joh 8:45 And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.
Joh 8:46 Which of you convinceth me of sin? And if I say the truth, why do ye not believe me?
Joh 8:47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

While many who are deceived by this error will profess that outward conduct is an illustration if they are "truly saved or not" by disconnecting "deeds" from the "state of the soul" they make an allowance for "temporary rebellion" whereby they teach that the individual is STILL SAVED.

If that "temporary rebellion" is in fact "permanent rebellion" then they will claim that the person was "never saved to begin with."

What Satan has done is in effect NEUTRALISE all the warnings in the Bible about falling away which in effect neutralises ANY FEAR OF JUDGMENT. Thus it breeds a complacent attitude in the churches which are under this delusion and sin is thus tolerated because, in their mind, sin has nothing to do with whether one is saved or not. These people truly believe that Jesus swapped places with them and that He PAID THEIR PENALTY in a judicial sense and thus God will not pour out His wrath on them if they are disobedient otherwise the same sins would be being punished twice.

They then twist the Scriptures about chastisement as applying to a sanctification WHICH HAS BEEN COMPLETELY DISCONNECTED from justification. Thus they teach that the willful rebellion of someone who is saved has consequences on this earth and that they may also lose rewards in heaven but NEVER HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH THEIR SALVATION.

Hence the pastors will preach "moral lessons" in a context that "obedience gets you the blessings" but HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH SALVATION because they misunderstand and have redefined FAITH. They view faith a a mere TRUST or MENTAL ASSENT which is totally separated from ANY DOING because in their mind ANY DOING = WORKS. Yet they do not understand that when Paul states that salvation is "not of works" he is speaking of the "works of the law" AND NOT the "works of faith." Due to this obedience is thrown out the window as a requirement for salvation and is made simply a FRUIT of salvation which MAY OR MAY NOT happen some time down the road.

They believe in a JUSTIFICATION which covers REBELLION because to them SANCTIFICATION = REBELLING LESS AND LESS. Thus when a professing Christian IS IN TRANSGRESSION they see that "God has not finished with them yet" because everyone is on the "rebelling less and less" road of sanctification. Therefore a Christian IN SIN is just at a different place on that road and "WHO ARE YOU TO JUDGE" many will say.

The fallacy here is that they do not understand that the rebellion in a true born again believer has ceased. When God counts a Christian as righteous (justification) it is based on that individual yielding completely to God from their heart (TRUE FAITH) and not on an outward manifestation of perfection. The false theology makes an allowance for rebellion in faith when the Bible does not!

THERE IS NO REBELLION TO GOD IN FAITH.

So while a truly born again Christian may not be perfect outwardly their HEARTS ARE PURE TOWARDS GOD. Sanctification after justification is simply the Saint being perfected as God teachers them more about righteousness and holiness and as they learn they submit. Sanctification has absolutely NOTHING to do with rebelling less and less. Rebellion is iniquity and those who are in rebellion are WORKERS OF INIQUITY. Christian's are to DEPART FROM ALL INIQUITY otherwise they are mere TARES in the body of Christ who will in the end be burned.

Paul knew this and this is why he constantly preached holiness in his letters to the churches and warned them over and over again in regards to iniquity and disobedience.

Today we have a church system which is just as apostate as the religious system of Israel in the time of Jesus. VERY FEW see it and God is calling His people out of the System of Error.

God's people are the salt of the earth and if the salt loses its flavour then it is good for nothing! A light is not to be covered up but is to be a light to the world.

God's people are HOLY. They are not WRETCHED SINNERS which so many teach today. God's people WERE sinners, they WERE rebellious, they WERE self-willled, they WERE disobedient, they WERE children of wrath. NOT ANY MORE!

It is so important to make the distinction between WILLFUL REBELLION which is simply walking your own way after your own lusts and that of YIELDING TO GOD FROM THE HEART. The latter is the walk of faith where the heart is CLEAN towards God. The latter may err in judgment and do wrong but not in the sense of self-willed rebellion (ie. they are not walking after the lusts of the flesh). The rebellion HAS CEASED. If the rebellion has not ceased then there WAS NO TRUE REPENTANCE experience which means there was no rebirth.

Don't be deceived!

Salvation IS NOT a judicial abstract provision.

Salvation is a STATE OF EXISTENCE whereby you are in communion with God having been washed of all your past transgression and you walk with a pure heart towards God and thus YIELD to His teaching.


2Co 13:5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?
2Co 13:6 But I trust that ye shall know that we are not reprobates.
2Co 13:7 Now I pray to God that ye do no evil; not that we should appear approved, but that ye should do that which is honest, though we be as reprobates.
2Co 13:8 For we can do nothing against the truth, but for the truth.
2Co 13:9 For we are glad, when we are weak, and ye are strong: and this also we wish, even your perfection.

 

[CDavid]

The "Once saved always saved" is just a feel good philosophy, as is the per-trib rapture. Take it from one who spent 48 years believing both. Then, I began to read the Bible for myself. Both are dangerous doctrines.

Once saved always saved believers use scripture to support their belief. They use the story of the prodigal son to illustrate that, no matter how far the son fell from grace, he never stopped being his fathers son. But, read that story with an objective mind, and you will see that the moral to the story is, a child of God who does get lost can repent; For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found . Another passage of scripture used to promote the deception is John 10:27-28; [SUP]27[/SUP] My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: [SUP]28[/SUP] And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. Reading this passage with emphasis on the words in bold print, as do those who preach this private interpretation, it does seem to support the doctrine. But let's read this again, putting the emphasis in another place. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: [SUP]28[/SUP] And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. Reading the same passage in this manor, we get a condition placed on believers.

Many verses of scripture, when taken selectively from the text, do establish a "once saved always saved" doctrine. But, when verses are selectively taken from the text, it is easy to take them out of context. Surrounding verses must be included in order to get the real message. Sometimes the entire chapter must be read to develop the correct understanding.

To keep this post short, I'll stop for now, and allow for replies, which I will in turn reply.

May God Bless In Every Way

 

[Enow]

Is once saved always saved true? Or is it only giving false security?

http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/56294-war-principality-eternal-security.html

OSAS is true, but God will judge His House of Whom we have to do.

Hebrews 10:[SUP]29 [/SUP]Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace? [SUP]30 [/SUP]For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people. [SUP]31 [/SUP]It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

 

[Skinski7]

Once saved always saved believers use scripture to support their belief. They use the story of the prodigal son to illustrate that, no matter how far the son fell from grace, he never stopped being his fathers son. But, read that story with an objective mind, and you will see that the moral to the story is, a child of God who does get lost can repent; For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found . Another passage of scripture used to promote the deception is John 10:27-28; [SUP]27[/SUP] My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: [SUP]28[/SUP] And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. Reading this passage with emphasis on the words in bold print, as do those who preach this private interpretation, it does seem to support the doctrine. But let's read this again, putting the emphasis in another place. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: [SUP]28[/SUP] And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. Reading the same passage in this manor, we get a condition placed on believers.

Many verses of scripture, when taken selectively from the text, do establish a "once saved always saved" doctrine. But, when verses are selectively taken from the text, it is easy to take them out of context. Surrounding verses must be included in order to get the real message. Sometimes the entire chapter must be read to develop the correct understanding.

To keep this post short, I'll stop for now, and allow for replies, which I will in turn reply.

May God Bless In Every Way

They MISUSE isolated texts of scripture and IGNORE VAST AMOUNTS of Scripture which contradicts their reasoning.

The Prodigal Son was not reconciled to his father until AFTER he left the pig pen and humbled himself before his dad. This parable teaches a CONDITIONAL reconciliation. Yes he COULD repent and HE DID repent and forsook going his own way.

The parable of the prodigal son does in no way support OSAS except through RHETORIC when people say "once a son always a son" which is found nowhere in the Bible. The people who do this are misapplying the NATURAL FLESH and FORCING IT to teach a SPIRITUAL LESSON.

The Bible says this...

Hos_4:6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children.

Adam is also an example of a son who was cast out.

Luk 3:38 Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.

God does cut off those who don't remain steadfast in the faith.

Rom 11:20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:
Rom 11:21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
Rom 11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

Why do they ignore the warnings in the Bible and cling to rhetoric? The Bible means what it says!

When Jesus said no-one can pluck you out of His hand He didn't say YOU CANNOT LEAVE. If you follow Christ and remain steadfast in the faith then you will surely inherit the kingdom. If you turn away and go back to your own way then you are like a pig going back to the mire.

 

[Stephen63]

1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will depart from the faith by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons,

1 Timothy 1:19 Holding faith and a good conscience. By rejecting this, some have made shipwreck of their faith,

2 Peter 2:15 Forsaking the right way, they have gone astray. They have followed the way of Balaam,

2 Peter 2:20 If they have escaped the corruption of the world by knowing our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ and are again entangled in it and overcome, they are worse off at the end than they were at the beginning.

2 Peter 2:21 It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than to have known it and then to turn their backs on the sacred command that was passed on to them.

2 Timothy 4:3-4 For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions, and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander off into myths.

Ezekiel 33:18

 

[starfield]

OSAS is a dangerous doctrine designed by Satan to give people false sense of security.

1 Timothy 4:1- Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils.