Animals/Pets in Heaven

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atwhatcost

Guest
Animals have no need of redemption because they are without sin. I am sure that God is capable of bringing the pets back to life. If what you believe is actually true than God doesn't care squat about animals. Probably even less about insects.
I wouldn't mind if he really did care less for mosquitoes and roaches. (The former just gave me itchy welts on my legs, and the latter dared to skedaddled from under a bunch of weeds I was pulling and gave me a new record for backing up in a hurry. lol) Unfortunately, I hear they have a good purpose, so I'm glad God doesn't "fix that" for me. lol

Outside of that, thanks for saying that about redemption. Bowman won't hear, but that's what I was really thinking.
 
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atwhatcost

Guest
Well animals don't have souls so I don't see how they WOULD be in heaven. On the new earth tho I see no reason why. The new earth is perfected earth so it would make sense that animals would be there.
Same question. How do you know if they do or don't have souls? And, even then, what do souls have to do with it? Do our souls save us or does God?

(And since many people keep thinking I'm coming off mean lately. I'm really not. I'm sincerely asking.)
 
Nov 19, 2012
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I know lame, sir. And you are lame! Slice-and-dice-to-fit-my-mood theology just doesn't work on me. Enough. I don't have time for people who think they alone know all. Play in your own sandbox.

Show your position with scripture.

If not....then you have nothing but your unreferenced opinion...
 

RickyZ

Senior Member
Sep 20, 2012
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Ecclesiastes 3:19: "After all, the same fate awaits human beings and animals alike. One dies just like the other. They are the same kind of creature. A human being is no better off than an animal, because life has no meaning for either."
Eccl 3:20: "They are both going to the same place---the dust. They both came from it; they will both go back to it."
Eccl 3:21: "How can anyone be sure that the human spirit goes upward while an animal's spirit goes down into the ground?"
Followed by Eccl 3:21a: Thou shalt ask EdisonTrent for he alone knoweth

Hey I wasn't going to post that but somebody here said I had to be snipish!
 

JGIG

Senior Member
Aug 2, 2013
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Ecclesiastes 3:19: "After all, the same fate awaits human beings and animals alike. One dies just like the other. They are the same kind of creature. A human being is no better off than an animal, because life has no meaning for either."
Eccl 3:20: "They are both going to the same place---the dust. They both came from it; they will both go back to it."
Eccl 3:21: "How can anyone be sure that the human spirit goes upward while an animal's spirit goes down into the ground?"
I wrote most of the following on another similar recent thread. I'll edit and expand it somewhat for this thread:

Do I believe we will see our pets again in eternity?

Yes I do.

I don't believe that God, Who places such value on life, just ends innocent life. Animals (yes, bugs, too) were affected by the Fall, but bear no fault for it. The more I learn of God's character, the personalities that He's put not only in pets, but in wild animals too (who hasn't seen on YouTube deer and dogs playing, the relationships that elephants and other animals have with each other - one of the fish in our aquarium and one of our cats play 'cat and mouse' on a regular basis, etc.), and the undeniable bond that He's allowed to exist between people and animals who come under their care - it just doesn't make sense that He would just erase them from His creation and from our minds and hearts.

God is all about redemption, restoration, and LIFE.

The Ecclesiastes passage? It comes under the category of 'wisdom and poetic literature' in the Bible. Like those in the Psalms and Proverbs, the writer asks questions, ponders, and makes observations about mankind, the world we live in, and God Almighty. Does Psalm 10 tell us that God stands far away and hides in times of trouble? No - the psalmist is asking the question.

Other declarative Scriptures reveal to us the character of God - Truths in which we can rest when the questions come.

I don't know the details of how eternity will be, but I do trust God and His love for me, His creation, and His love for life. And based on Who He is, I trust that our loved ones who are in Christ, as well as our pets who have passed on, are safe in His Hand and that we will be with them again.

What that will look like or how our existences will be lived out in eternity, I don't know. There will be a new heaven and a new earth, and I believe that eternity will in part be spent exploring and enjoying what God has created!

I don't think there will be 'ownership' of our pets, but fellowship. I think they will have independence and exist in a way that God intended when He created animals. That said, I think (and this is opinion/conjecture) that God will absolutely honor our relationships with our pets. Mankind and animals, and even animals amongst themselves, have undeniable relational bonds that are very strong. I believe God will honor those sweet, very real bonds.

Grace, peace, and comfort to you in Christ,
-JGIG
 

know1

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2012
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My pastor and another that I heard speak about it, said that animals do not have redeemable souls, and they are unable to accept Christ as their saviour, so as a result, there won't be animals there. I personally think that they will be there because before The Fall there were animals made perfect by God. I also wonder about people who are severely mentally disabled (not to say and mentally disabled person is akin to an animal in any way), if they are not able to comprehend the concept of salvation, you could easily say that they will not go to Heaven. But God says that all of His creations that are under the age of comprehension will be accepted into His kingdom without question. So to me, this sounds like those who cannot mentally comprehend the idea of salvation, and are therefore unable to accept Christ because of their lack of understanding, will be accepted into Heaven, and I feel like that includes animals. Animals are also His creation.
As for animals not having souls, they who would say such a thing, don't know what the soul is. I will simply say for now that animals do indeed have a soul.
I change my mind, I'm going to say a little more about animals having a soul.
Rev 16:3 And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea.
The above verse is referring to fish having a soul.
Though you will get many interpretations concerning the soul, it is basically your consciousness. Look up the word soul and see how the soul goes through everything the body goes through when alive and it can die with the body, yet when the body is dead, the soul experiences what is happening to its spiritual body.
Your heart is what you use to understand with, which is not to be confused with the mind. They are distinct one from another.
Another thought to consider is the following.
I have told this story many times in the past, but not to you, so please listen.
I will make this true story short.
Years ago I was listening to a man who said he went to heaven, and while he was there, he said he saw many children. Then he said, "all those aborted babies are in heaven". Then I said within myself, "that man is lying, for the word of God says that except a person be born again, he cannot go to heaven".
Is that really what the word of God says?
No, it doesn't.
Keep in mind, I never said that out loud but thought it only.
Immediately, I heard a man's voice screaming at me in great anger. After that He said, "My word says except a MAN (and He stressed the word, man) be born again, he cannot see into the kingdom of God".
Then He said, "babies are not men".
What does this have to do with animals, you ask?

Rom 7:8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.
Rom 7:9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
Rom 7:10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
Rom 7:11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.

Like babies, animals don't live in sin, for they don't have the law nor do they have the capacity to understand God's law. They do however know some of the things you like and dislike by your response to them.
All I was getting at, is that animals don't need a savior to save them from their sins because they don't commit sin, just like babies don't sin. And if God doesn't hold our children accountable for their foolish actions, neither would He hold an animal accountable for doing things they don't understand.
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
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The Bible mentions that the whole of Creation was cursed by sin, that includes animals.
Does that mean that Gabriel & Michael the archangel have been cursed by sin?
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
4,995
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As for animals not having souls, they who would say such a thing, don't know what the soul is. I will simply say for now that animals do indeed have a soul.
I change my mind, I'm going to say a little more about animals having a soul.
Rev 16:3 And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea.
The above verse is referring to fish having a soul.
Now think again. Where does the word HAVE appear in your scripture? Is it the that the living being as an complete entity, died?

I think that nephesh & psyche are not metaphysical terms at all, like some part of man or some part of being. I think that all the references can be understood as referring to life, living being, or person. (5 souls were on the ship.) I have marked every reference in my Bibles, even made note cards for individual occurrences including the original language.

If you have some proof that a soul has a spiritual body, I would like to see it. Also, proof that heart & mind are as you say distinguishable on your basis.


After that He said, "My word says except a MAN (and He stressed the word, man) be born again, he cannot see into the kingdom of God".
Then He said, "babies are not men".
ASV
John 3:3
"Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except one be born anew, he cannot see the kingdomof God."

The word is one or someone (tis in Greek) -- it is not "man."


What does this have to do with animals, you ask?

Rom 7:8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.
Rom 7:9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
Rom 7:10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
Rom 7:11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.
Your baby theology is not sustained by your scripture. Romans 7 is not about babies either. I was alive apart from the law, can only refer to a person who trusted Christ as Savior & was regenerated receiving new life. The I of Romans 7 was derailed in the Christian life WHEN THE COMMANDMENT CAME. Sin which was dormant in the flesh which was crucified with Christ, lived AGAIN. REvived. And the Christian became in the carnal state. (I am carnal, sold under sin.)
 
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Tintin

Guest
No sin in heaven, therefore the very concept of "what can I do now" will be gone. At that time there is only one thing to do -- love God completely with all of our new-body being. And that we'll do perfectly. So, I strongly suspect we'll be worshiping God forever, not hanging out with the new toys. lol
Toys? Worshipping God can take many different forms. We can create, build, hike, invent, swim, mountain-climb etc. in worship of God. Worship isn't relegated to prayer and singing.
 
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Tintin

Guest
Also, we will work for our King on the New Heavens and the New Earth, but it will be easy and pleasurable.
 
Dec 12, 2013
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Which verses state that animals will be in heaven....just simply post 2 to 3 verses which state that the animals in heaven rejoiced, sang, played harps, have immortal spirits, are born again, get resurrected etc.......
 

Budman

Senior Member
Mar 9, 2014
4,153
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Does that mean that Gabriel & Michael the archangel have been cursed by sin?
The specific curse that Tintin is speaking about is the one on physical creation - man's dwelling place, the earth and the universe. It doesn't include heaven and the spiritual beings there.
 

know1

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2012
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Now think again. Where does the word HAVE appear in your scripture? Is it the that the living being as an complete entity, died?

I think that nephesh & psyche are not metaphysical terms at all, like some part of man or some part of being. I think that all the references can be understood as referring to life, living being, or person. (5 souls were on the ship.) I have marked every reference in my Bibles, even made note cards for individual occurrences including the original language.

If you have some proof that a soul has a spiritual body, I would like to see it. Also, proof that heart & mind are as you say distinguishable on your basis.



ASV
John 3:3
"Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except one be born anew, he cannot see the kingdomof God."

The word is one or someone (tis in Greek) -- it is not "man."


What does this have to do with animals, you ask?



Your baby theology is not sustained by your scripture. Romans 7 is not about babies either. I was alive apart from the law, can only refer to a person who trusted Christ as Savior & was regenerated receiving new life. The I of Romans 7 was derailed in the Christian life WHEN THE COMMANDMENT CAME. Sin which was dormant in the flesh which was crucified with Christ, lived AGAIN. REvived. And the Christian became in the carnal state. (I am carnal, sold under sin.)
I'm not ready yet, as I have to do a little more digging, but I will answer most of your questions.
 
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Marian29

Guest
"Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie." Revelation 22:14, 15
 
Dec 1, 2014
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Still looking for the words (animals IN HEAVEN).......the word creature is not necessarily indicative of animals!
You're right, bro, but what I happily share though is that there is no Scripture that directly states animals will not be in Heaven. Combine that with God's love and that is where we place our hope for animals.