Antichrist is NOT a person!

[Ahwatukee]

Greetings MaggieMye,

If you read the texts of scripture below, you will come to the correct conclusion that the 'antichrist' is not a person, but rather a "anti-Jesus" way of thinking or of religion...such as the gnostics referred to in Scripture...not by the Name of "gnostic" but by their beliefs. The Antichrist is a SPIRIT...and nowhere in scripture does is say that it will embody a human being.

Other scriptures would disagree with this, as they identify the beast/antichrist as a person, an individual. As an example please consider the following:

"But the beast was captured, and with him the false prophet who had performed the signs on his behalf. With these signs he had deluded those who had received the mark of the beast and worshiped his image. The two of them were thrown alive into the fiery lake of burning sulfur." - Rev.19:20

The reference to "the two of them" and they being captured, demonstrates that both the beast and the false prophet as being two individuals and not a system. In fact, right in the scripture that you provided, the antichrist is mentioned as an actual person "you heard that antichrist is coming," as well as those who were types of the antichrist, having the same spirit. In addition, the mention of both the beast and the false prophet being thrown "alive" into the lake of fire would also demonstrate that they are individual beings.

 

[PennEd]

This is no longer an esoteric, science fiction debate, that coincides with Scripture. People are ACTUALLY doing this. The technology exists right now. Isn't even possible you are wrong?

 

[MaggieMye]

I suggest that your conclusion does not follow from the Scriptures you've quoted. I deleted the commentary for clarity.

Nothing in 1 John 2:18, 2:22, or 2 John 1:7 demands that the antichrist is a spirit. 1 John 4:3 says "spirit of antichrist" which states that there is such a thing as an 'antichrist spirit'. That does not demand that all entities called "antichrist" are spirits.

Consider the context of the verses:

1 John 2:19 says, "They went out from us, but they were not really of us; for if they had been of us, they would have remained with us." I submit that this is clearly talking about people, not spirits.

1 John 2:23 says, "Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father; the one who confesses the Son has the Father also."
Again, this is talking about people, not spirits.

2 John 9 says, "Anyone who goes to far and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God...". Once again, the context is people rather than spirits.

As to whether the antichrist is a spirit or a person really hasn't been established either way by your argument.[/QUOTE[
Then you need to read more carefully. While it IS people that do the disbelieving and UNabiding, it is due to the antichrist spirit/mentality/belief...that being AGAINST Christ Jesus as having come in the flesh.

 

[PennEd]

BTW. I'm not the slightest worried about it. I love when prophecy comes to life in unmistakable ways. I'm genuinely confused as to why we can't take the Bible for what it says.

 

[Ahwatukee]

People who truly read the Bible already know this. The rest will refuse to give up hoping for a coming Boogie-man anyway. ☺

We refuse to give in to the false teachings because we who study this information pay attention to the details Willie! The fact that both the beast/antichrist and the false prophet are both captured and thrown alive into the lake of fire demonstrates that, not only is the beast a kingdom, but represents the individual ruler who will be over that kingdom.

And yes, there is a boogie man who is coming and who will be proclaiming himself to be God, whom most of the world at that time will worship. Pay attention to the details!

"He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God’s temple, proclaiming himself to be God."

Does the above sound like a system or an idea? Or is it conveying an actual person to come?

 

[Locutus]

John stated he was living in the last hour:

1 John 2:18 Children, it is the last hour; and just as you heard that antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have appeared; from this we know that it is the last hour.

Last "hour" does not "last" for 1900 years and counting after he wrote.

 

[Jackson123]

2 Thessalonians

2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

1. Man of sin. > look like a person

2. Son of prediction, > look like a person

3.exalted himself. > look like a person

4. Sit in the temple. > look like a person.

 

[Willie-T]

So you're not going to have ANY issue receiving a microchip in your hand to use as a debit card Willie?

How is it possible for Scripture to be THIS precise about the method of buying and selling, and yet you dismiss it?

No, it is NOT precise since it says the very same thing about the mark God's followers are going to get.

Forehead = beliefs
Hand = actions

BTW, many of you "seem" old enough to remember that currency was one of the first marks of the Beast... then it was our SS#... then it was bar codes... then credit cards... now the chips in our cards... and don't forget iris scanners and fingerprints. I swear, we sometimes border right on the edge of fanatical insanity with all the purely maniacal imaginings we conjure up.

 

[Locutus]

2 Thessalonians

2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

1. Man of sin. > look like a person

2. Son of prediction, > look like a person

3.exalted himself. > look like a person

4. Sit in the temple. > look like a person.

The son of perdition was a man was who was alive and being restrained when Paul wrote this - this "son of perdition" is not alive today - he's gone dead and buried.

 

[Dino246]

Then you need to read more carefully. While it IS people that do the disbelieving and UNabiding, it is due to the antichrist spirit/mentality/belief...that being AGAINST Christ Jesus as having come in the flesh.

Perhaps you could re-read my post a little more carefully. My point is not that 'antichrist' is not a spirit, but that your argument is support of your assertion does not hold water.

Please understand, I'm not attacking you personally, nor am I challenging your conclusion, but I am challenging the substance of your argument because, as you have presented it, it's not a good one. It's logically flawed and ignores the context of the verses you cited.

Further, a "mentality" or a "belief" is not a spirit. Conflating them doesn't help your argument either.

 

[PennEd]

No, it is NOT precise since it says the very same thing about the mark God's followers are going to get.

Forehead = beliefs
Hand = actions

BTW, many of you "seem" old enough to remember that currency was one of the first marks of the Beast... then it was our SS#... then it was bar codes... then credit cards... now the chips in our cards... and don't forget iris scanners and fingerprints. I swear, we sometimes border right on the edge of fanatical insanity with all the purely maniacal imaginings we conjure up.

C'mon Willie. Don't lump me in with what others believe.

Will you get the microchip, and rid yourself of cash, credit cards, various IDs, house key, computer pass codes, etc...?

 

[dcontroversal]

I have never conclusively believed it would be a chip, tattoo or a lazed bar code.....but the four things I will not dismiss....

a. The personal pronouns applied unto the beast
b. The definite article "the" applied unto the man of sin
c. The effectual power from Satan that empowers the beast
d. The fact that he CAUSES all, young and old to receive a mark to buy and sell

Regardless of the means, the arguments, the spiritualization of who, what, when and where.....a-d cannot be chunked and or just swept under the rug in order to believe or push a particular line of thought that one holds to. The word is either inspired and means what it says or it is all a bunch of poppy cock and let's party because it holds no power or position of absolute truth.

Having said the above, it is obvious that whoever receives it will be serving Satan with both hands and mind......

Just saying...

 

[dcontroversal]

The son of perdition was a man was who was alive and being restrained when Paul wrote this - this "son of perdition" is not alive today - he's gone dead and buried.

HAHAHHAHA more comedy hour, you have some good jokes...I bet you lead the comedy hour or the entertainment hour on 5th Sundays hey.....except for the fact that verse 1 sets the context....the PAROUSIA of JESUS, that is to say our gathering together unto him....

a. Written after the resurrection
b. Written after the ascension
c. Written before the body presence of Christ and our gathering together unto him

More fluff of some Roman emperor I suppose.....more spiritualization of the facts into a fantasy land box......

 

[Willie-T]

Anyone here aware that several of the Caesar's required a mark be put on people before they were allowed into the major Roman-controlled market places to either buy or sell? I believe it was only ashes, but they still could not engage in commerce there without it.

But I doubt that was what John meant at all. I think he meant selling out to the power of enterprise rather than trust in God.

 

[Dino246]

Anyone here aware that several of the Caesar's required a mark be put on people before they were allowed into the major Roman-controlled market places to either buy or sell? I believe it was only ashes, but they still could not engage in commerce there without it.

Out with the preterist!

Just kidding; I had heard that somewhere.

 

[loveme1]

I believe there is one that is stout compared to....but a few twists and turns along the way for sure... though there is a anti christ system at work.. if you read Daniel they tried to enforce idol worship by means of a statue then too..

There is an evil rebellion attempting to live forever as gods. I consider they believe they triumph if they deceive all. Those who will not submit will need to be killed. One agenda where all religions and people unite except the Children of GOD who will not be beguiled.

Much destruction will come to pass for one to come and take by peace...
in GOD we Trust.

 

[Nehemiah6]

If you read the texts of scripture below, you will come to the correct conclusion that the 'antichrist' is not a person, but rather a "anti-Jesus" way of thinking or of religion...

My. my, Maggie, kindly do not limit yourself to just these verses. Start with Revelation 13 and work your way backward to the book of Daniel. And pray tell, why can't a certain kind of spirit be embodied in a person? The Antichrist is the Arch-Blasphemer of God. Please note (Rev 20:10):

And [1] the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where [2] the beast and [3] the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

We are here presented with the UNHOLY TRINITY: (1) the Devil or Satan, (2) the Beast or the Antichrist (also called the Man of Sin, the Son of Perdition), and (3) the False Prophet. All these are personal beings (the Devil a spirit being) and therefore all these can be -- and will be -- tormented eternally in the Lake of Fire and Brimstone (also known as eternal Hell).

A WARNING TO THOSE WHO PRESENT FALSE DOCTRINE: Kindly do your homework before misleading those who may be new to the faith or not familiar with Bible truth. And do not follow the doctrines of men, which are in fact the doctrines of devils.

 

[dcontroversal]

Anyone here aware that several of the Caesar's required a mark be put on people before they were allowed into the major Roman-controlled market places to either buy or sell? I believe it was only ashes, but they still could not engage in commerce there without it.

Yep....and you have to have a Sam's card to shop at Sam's

The only problem is it will be global and I am fairly confident that Rome did not conquer the entire world and even now we see the Petro Dollar which was the world's reserve currency beginning to fail and the extreme possibility of a world wide system coming online to replace it all....

I ain't arguing with you Willy...I just don't buy the 70 A.D. Rome Caesar deal based upon the repeat of history....From Egypt to Assyria to Babylon to Persia to Greece to Rome and what Rome devolves into we can see a continuing attempt by Satan to bring out this world wide system....continually hindered by God and suppressed because it was not yet time.....In my view humanity must be conditioned to a certain point (apostasy) before they will receive a super natural Satanic inspired man who can work all kinds of lying wonder and signs as God........

 

[garee]

The reference to "the two of them" and they being captured, demonstrates that both the beast and the false prophet as being two individuals and not a system. In fact, right in the scripture that you provided, the antichrist is mentioned as an actual person "you heard that antichrist is coming," as well as those who were types of the antichrist, having the same spirit. In addition, the mention of both the beast and the false prophet being thrown "alive" into the lake of fire would also demonstrate that they are individual beings.

It’s a system for usurping the teaching ministry of the Holy Spirit the ideology of the antichrist (singular Satan, the lying spirit ) . Satan the lying spirit has no form he is not considered a beast of the field formed from the lifeless spiritless dust.

Throw in one you have the other.

The system is shown doing its work of deceiving below. Peter used as a false prophet and one of the many antichrists (plural) . Just as was the another beast of the field a serpent doing his first work of a lying spirit savouring not the things that be of God not seen, but those that be of the creature as that seen..


Then Peter took him, and began to rebuke him, saying, Be it far from thee, Lord: this shall not be unto thee.But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savouring not the things that be of God, but those that be of the men .

Gen 3:4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:

As always...first things first

2Co 4:18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

 

[Locutus]

Paul states that the man of sin/perdition was alive and being restrained in his day:

2 Thess 2:6 And you know what restrains him now, so that in his time he will be revealed.

How can someone be restrained "now" in Paul's day when Paul wrote the above if he wasn't alive then?

I don't make this stuff up like the dispensationalists.