Any Chance Jesus Imputes Righteousness to a Person in This Wretched Condition?
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He is not speaking of them who offer dead works coming from a dead faith .(Hebrews 6:1) Natural man . But those who have tasted and seen that God is good as the kind of God who will never leave us or forfake His elect.
Philippians 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:
He is speaking of a believer who has eternal life .The better thing that accompanies salvation (OSAS)
2Corinthians 2:16 To the one we are the savour of death unto death; and to the other the savour of life unto life. And who is sufficient for these things?
Philippians 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:
He is speaking of a believer who has eternal life .The better thing that accompanies salvation (OSAS)
2Corinthians 2:16 To the one we are the savour of death unto death; and to the other the savour of life unto life. And who is sufficient for these things?
You should learn the nuances of language......the use of may does not mean might be....MAY is erroneously translated from the following word which DOES NOT INDICATE what you are saying...and for once in your life accept the truth and open your eyes....you can chunk the word MAY.....it is not even found within the definition of the word used.......
sózó: to save
Original Word: σῴζωPart of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: sózó
Phonetic Spelling: (sode'-zo)
Short Definition: I save, heal
Definition: I save, heal, preserve, rescue.
Nestle GNT 1904
παραδοῦναι τὸν τοιοῦτον τῷ Σατανᾷ εἰς ὄλεθρον τῆς σαρκός, ἵνα τὸ πνεῦμα σωθῇ ἐν τῇ ἡμέρᾳ τοῦ Κυρίου.
Westcott and Hort 1881
παραδοῦναι τὸν τοιοῦτον τῷ Σατανᾷ εἰς ὄλεθρον τῆς σαρκός, ἵνα τὸ πνεῦμα σωθῇ ἐν τῇ ἡμέρᾳ τοῦ κυρίου.
Westcott and Hort / [NA27 variants]
παραδοῦναι τὸν τοιοῦτον τῷ Σατανᾷ εἰς ὄλεθρον τῆς σαρκός, ἵνα τὸ πνεῦμα σωθῇ ἐν τῇ ἡμέρᾳ τοῦ κυρίου.
RP Byzantine Majority Text 2005
παραδοῦναι τὸν τοιοῦτον τῷ Σατανᾷ εἰς ὄλεθρον τῆς σαρκός, ἵνα τὸ πνεῦμα σωθῇ ἐν τῇ ἡμέρᾳ τοῦ κυρίου Ἰησοῦ.
Greek Orthodox Church 1904
παραδοῦναι τὸν τοιοῦτον τῷ Σατανᾷ εἰς ὄλεθρον τῆς σαρκός, ἵνα τὸ πνεῦμα σωθῇ ἐν τῇ ἡμέρᾳ τοῦ Κυρίου Ἰησοῦ.
Tischendorf 8th Edition
παραδοῦναι τὸν τοιοῦτον τῷ σατανᾷ εἰς ὄλεθρον τῆς σαρκός, ἵνα τὸ πνεῦμα σωθῇ ἐν τῇ ἡμέρᾳ τοῦ κυρίου Ἰησοῦ.
Scrivener's Textus Receptus 1894
παραδοῦναι τὸν τοιοῦτον τῷ Σατανᾷ εἰς ὄλεθρον τῆς σαρκός, ἵνα τὸ πνεῦμα σωθῇ ἐν τῇ ἡμέρᾳ τοῦ Κυρίου Ἰησοῦ.Stephanus Textus Receptus 1550
παραδοῦναι τὸν τοιοῦτον τῷ Σατανᾷ εἰς ὄλεθρον τῆς σαρκός ἵνα τὸ πνεῦμα σωθῇ ἐν τῇ ἡμέρᾳ τοῦ κυρίου Ἰησοῦ
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Preaching Once Dead in a persons trespasses and sin Always Dead in their trespasses and sin (ODAD) is not the kind of gospel that accompanies salvation. (OSAS)
We are not to sit in judgment of His Spirit of Grace that comes from His work of faith that works in us to both will and do his good pleasure. But get under the authority of it. Its hyper grace.. It rises above judgment those who think they can see into the hearts of others and accuse them of using it as a licence for sin. and not a get out of hell free, form of forgiveness. .
1John 3:14 We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.
2Corinthians 2:16 To the one we are the savour of death unto death; and to the other the savour of life unto life. And who is sufficient for these things?
Man is a three part being; body, soul, and spirit.
When a man's spirit leaves his body, the body dies. The soul of a man will continue on either in heaven or hell. The spirit of man always returns to the Lord, the giver of life. The body is put in the grave.
God's not against taking a Christian out of this world if the he continues to live a carnal life, ruining his testimony.
When a man's spirit leaves his body, the body dies. The soul of a man will continue on either in heaven or hell. The spirit of man always returns to the Lord, the giver of life. The body is put in the grave.
God's not against taking a Christian out of this world if the he continues to live a carnal life, ruining his testimony.
If you have been fully illumined, and meet all the other criteria in the verses you posted, then as the versus state, it is impossible to be reconciled.
But I have a question for you. With everyone on this and all other Christian forums disagreeing on so many points in scriptures; ...just how many do you then think have been fully illumined and tasted all the good from the Lord?
The simple obvious answer is that today we do not meet the criteria. I therefore believe Hebrews 6:4-6 was addressing some in the first century AD who had been fully illumined and tasted of all the good from the Lord. Those certain individuals would then constitute those scriptures writes about as a dog who returns to its vomit, or a sow returning to wallow in the mire. Hebrews 6:4-6 does, however, provide us warning, that if and when we are fully illumined, not to return to our previous status, or it will be far worse than at the first time we were there.
But I have a question for you. With everyone on this and all other Christian forums disagreeing on so many points in scriptures; ...just how many do you then think have been fully illumined and tasted all the good from the Lord?
The simple obvious answer is that today we do not meet the criteria. I therefore believe Hebrews 6:4-6 was addressing some in the first century AD who had been fully illumined and tasted of all the good from the Lord. Those certain individuals would then constitute those scriptures writes about as a dog who returns to its vomit, or a sow returning to wallow in the mire. Hebrews 6:4-6 does, however, provide us warning, that if and when we are fully illumined, not to return to our previous status, or it will be far worse than at the first time we were there.
Dont forget every thread is the not of works thread.
The bible only got like 3 verses in it. John 3:16, Ephesians 2:8-9, Romans 10:9 and maybe 1 corinthians 15:1-4 but the last one is questionable, it says you can believe in vain and ya gotta keep in memory what Paul preached and we know that aint true, since its not of works and keeping something in memory is a work. If ya do that you're damned for sure! Dont be tryna save yourself
The bible only got like 3 verses in it. John 3:16, Ephesians 2:8-9, Romans 10:9 and maybe 1 corinthians 15:1-4 but the last one is questionable, it says you can believe in vain and ya gotta keep in memory what Paul preached and we know that aint true, since its not of works and keeping something in memory is a work. If ya do that you're damned for sure! Dont be tryna save yourself
1 John 5:3-5:
For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments. And his commandments are not burdensome. For everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world— our faith. Who is it that overcomes the world except the one who believes that Jesus is the Son of God?
Matthew 22:36-40:
“Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?” And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the great and first commandment. And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets.”
John 6:39-40:
And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day. For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.”
If one can lose their salvation, at what point does he/she lose their salvation? How can anyone who believes in Jesus then know they are not among the cursed to hell?
For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments. And his commandments are not burdensome. For everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world— our faith. Who is it that overcomes the world except the one who believes that Jesus is the Son of God?
Matthew 22:36-40:
“Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?” And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the great and first commandment. And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets.”
John 6:39-40:
And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day. For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.”
If one can lose their salvation, at what point does he/she lose their salvation? How can anyone who believes in Jesus then know they are not among the cursed to hell?
P
I am fully aware that 'may' is not in the passage. But the 'may' doesn't change the fact that this individual had to be turned over to satan that he be saved on the day of Christ. Paul turned him over so he could be saved. But you people keep ignoring this plain fact right in the passage and turning it into a chastisement for the sake of his personal testimony.
P
It's interesting how you people decide plain passages of scripture say what you want them to say. The passage itself says the things that accompany salvation are works. But so many are sure they are saved despite the fact that they do not have that which the author of Hebrews says accompanies salvation and are instead barren fields. Barren fields which he says are in danger of being burned in the end.
P
"and believes in him"
Only the person who is presently believing has the promise. If you stop believing the above passage no longer applies to you. It is addressed to presently believing people, not those who have stopped believing and have gone back to the world in a willful, contemptuous unbelief.
They lose it when they stop trusting in the blood of Christ to forgive their sin and they refuse all attempts by God to bring them back to trust in Christ and he turns them over to it. At which point he will not allow them to come back to repentance so that Christ is not openly shamed.
Only the person who is presently believing has the promise. If you stop believing the above passage no longer applies to you. It is addressed to presently believing people, not those who have stopped believing and have gone back to the world in a willful, contemptuous unbelief.
They lose it when they stop trusting in the blood of Christ to forgive their sin and they refuse all attempts by God to bring them back to trust in Christ and he turns them over to it. At which point he will not allow them to come back to repentance so that Christ is not openly shamed.