Baptism symbol only ?

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IAm3rd

Guest
#42
Matthew 3:16) And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him: 17 .) And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased..............[WITNESS]


Mark 1:4) John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.5 .) And there went out unto him all the land of Judaea, and they of Jerusalem, and were all baptized of him in the river of Jordan, confessing their sins…….. 7) And preached, saying, There cometh one mightier than I after me, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to stoop down and unloose.8.) I indeed have baptized you with water: but he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost.9 .) And it came to pass in those days, that Jesus came from Nazareth of Galilee, and was baptized of John in Jordan.10 .) And straightway coming up out of the water, he saw the heavens opened, and the Spirit like a dove descending upon him: 11 .) And there came a voice from heaven, saying, Thou art my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.[WITNESS]

Luke 3:16) John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire:…….21) Now when all the people were baptized, it came to pass, that Jesus also being baptized, and praying, the heaven was opened,
22 .) And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.[WITNESS]

Acts 1:4) And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.
5 .) For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence……22) Beginning from the baptism of John, unto that same day that he was taken up from us, must one be ordained to be a witness with us of his resurrection.

10:34) Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:
35 .) But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.
36 .) The word which God sent unto the children of Israel, preaching peace by Jesus Christ: (he is Lord of all:)
37 .) That word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judaea, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached;………..44) While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
45 .) And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
46 .) For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,
So is your point that water baptism no longer applies, and it is only baptism in the spirit that applies to us ?
 
I

IAm3rd

Guest
#44
OK so think about this...the person who receives Christ on their deathbed but was never baptized or had communion? Are they saved?
That's up to God... I do not limit His grace. We are bound to obey God.But God does as He pleases
 
D

der

Guest
#46
No where in the Bible does it say water baptism is just a symbol, but rather Jesus himself said, He that believes AND IS BAPTIZED WILL BE SAVED. Many people not understanding why baptism saves ignores this verse in Mark 16.16. But the Bible shows how baptism saves. 1Peter1.21 says, Baptism does now also save us...BY THE RESSURECTION OF JESUS CHRIST. This is because as Romans 6.3 says, So many of us as were baptized INTO Jesus Christ were baptized into his death. Paul was told in Acts22.16, Arise, and be baptized, and wash away your sins. It doesn't say it's a symbol
 

sacraig67

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2014
455
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#48
That's up to God... I do not limit His grace. We are bound to obey God.But God does as He pleases
OK so why should we HAVE to be baptized if justification relies on us accepting Jesus without being baptized?
 
I

IAm3rd

Guest
#49
OK so why should we HAVE to be baptized if justification relies on us accepting Jesus without being baptized?
Again, where does the bible say justification relies upon us "accepting Jesus without being baptized " ?
 

sacraig67

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2014
455
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#50
That's up to God... I do not limit His grace. We are bound to obey God.But God does as He pleases
No explain how this works for someone on a deathbed but not for anyone else first. You want me to prove something but you are unwilling to to explain your own contradiction.
 
D

der

Guest
#51
I'm sorry, but to obey is to be saved. The apostle Paul said in Philippians 2.12, As you have always OBEYED... WORK OUT YOUR OWN SALVATION, WITH FEAR AND TREMBLING. Revelation 22.14 says, Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right TO THE TREE OF LIFE. In Luke 10.16 Jesus told his apostles, He that hears you, hears me. And in Acts 10.48 it says Peter commanded them who just received the Holy Ghost, speaking in tongues, to be baptized in the name of the Lord. In other words to obey the commandment to be baptized, is to obey the Lord. And baptism must be done in Jesus' name, Lord or Christ added, because Jesus said He that believes AND IS BAPTIZED WILL BE SAVED. And Peter said in Acts 4.12 There is no salvation in any other besides Jesus Christ, because there is NONE OTHER NAME under heaven, given among men, WHEREBY WE MUST BE SAVED. That's why it says in Acts.19.5 When they heard that they should believe on Christ Jesus(vs.4), they were baptized IN THE NAME OF THE LORD JESUS. Jesus said in John 12.50 I know that God's commandment is life everlasting. And in 1John3.23 it says, This is God's commandment, that we should believe ON(not just IN)the name of his son Jesus Christ. And we see that to believe on Jesus, is to be baptized in his name according to Acts19.4,5. So baptism is more than a symbol according to the scriptures. May God bless you. Amen.
 
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I

IAm3rd

Guest
#52
No explain how this works for someone on a deathbed but not for anyone else first. You want me to prove something but you are unwilling to to explain your own contradiction.
What contradiction ? I didnt say it worked or didnt work. I said thats up to God, and I do not limit His grace. But we are bound to obey Him are we not ?
 
I

IAm3rd

Guest
#53
I'm sorry, but to obey is to be saved. The apostle Paul said in Philippians 2.12, As you have always OBEYED... WORK OUT YOUR OWN SALVATION, WITH FEAR AND TREMBLING. Revelation 22.14 says, Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right TO THE TREE OF LIFE. In Luke 10.16 Jesus told his apostles, He that hears you, hears me. And in Acts 10.48 it says Peter commanded them who just received the Holy Ghost, speaking in tongues, to be baptized in the name of the Lord. In other words to obey the commandment to be baptized, is to obey the Lord. And baptism must be done in the name of Jesus' name, Lord or Christ added, because Jesus said He that believes AND IS BAPTIZED WILL BE SAVED. And Peter said in Acts 4.12 There is no salvation in any other besides Jesus Christ, because there is NONE OTHER NAME under heaven, given among men, WHEREBY WE MUST BE SAVED. That's why it says in Acts.19.5 When they heard that they should believe on Christ Jesus(vs.4), they were baptized IN THE NAME OF THE LORD JESUS. Jesus said in John 12.50 I know that God's commandment is life everlasting. And in 1John3.23 it says, This is God's commandment, that we should believe ON(not just IN)the name of his son Jesus Christ. And we see that to believe on Jesus, is to be baptized in his name according to Acts19.4,5. So baptism is more than a symbol according to the scriptures. May God bless you. Amen.
Amen... exactly right. Jesus said those who do the will of the Father will enter the Kingdom... and Why do you call me Lord and do not what I say ?
 
Sep 10, 2013
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#54
No explain how this works for someone on a deathbed but not for anyone else first. You want me to prove something but you are unwilling to to explain your own contradiction.
It works because he is getting baptized with the baptism of tears. Tears of repentance coming from a broken heart of the one who realizes what a wasted life he lived without God.
In most cases, people repent on their deathbeds out of fear from hell (hell that they have created to themselves, not God) and not out of love for God.

There are also people who may not be baptized in the church but sacrifices their lives for others. They also are being baptized with the baptism of their own blood and they meet God because their behavior has been Christlike. They have put others higher than their selfish, egocentric desires.
 

sacraig67

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2014
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#55
John 14:6 " I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the father except through me."
 
I

IAm3rd

Guest
#56
John 14:6 " I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the father except through me."
really ? I mean, I dont even know what to say here....

Seriously, if this is the answer to my original question, please... PLEASE take a look at your theology and ask yourself why you are believing it.
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
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#57
"not must" ? Jesus commands that all believers be baptized, and your telling me it's NOT a must ?
Why do you call me Lord and do not what I say ? ~ Jesus
Ephesians 4:5
one Lord, one faith, one baptism;

There is only one Baptism, so which is it, water or the Spirit of God?

Acts 1:5New King James Version (NKJV)[SUP]5 [/SUP]for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.”



Matthew 3:11
I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.

Mark 1:8
I indeed baptized you with water, but He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit.”

Luke 3:16
John answered, saying to all, “I indeed baptize you with water; but One mightier than I is coming, whose sandal strap I am not worthy to loose. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.

John 1:33
I did not know Him, but He who sent me to baptize with water said to me, ‘Upon whom you see the Spirit descending, and remaining on Him, this is He who baptizes with the Holy Spirit.’

Acts 10:47
“Can anyone forbid water, that these should not be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have?

Acts 11:16
Then I remembered the word of the Lord, how He said, ‘John indeed baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’


So no command to; just a ? who can forbid water after they received the Holy Spirit of truth over the Spirit of error

Man has mixed the two Baptisms together the same a they mix Law literal law and grace together. And new wine, can't remain in old wineskins
Water Baptism does not save, Holy Spirit Baptism does

May not say Symbol literal, yet it was done in public for the first time, by John to announce the Messiah has arrived when John saw the Dove, land on Yeshua, and heard the voice from Father
oh then said after this announcement that he must decrease and Yeshua must increase






John 3:30
He must increase, but I must decrease.

Enough scripture?
 

sacraig67

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2014
455
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#58
Well did Jesus say through me and baptism or just through me? What did Jesus say?
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
15,045
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#59
Again, I am looking for a scripture reference that says baptism is only a symbol that doesnt need to be done... not a conclusion you come to by reading various verses... Does the Bible actually say it ? Anywhere ? in any form or fashion ?
So what is it you are after?
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
15,045
110
63
#60
really ? I mean, I dont even know what to say here....

Seriously, if this is the answer to my original question, please... PLEASE take a look at your theology and ask yourself why you are believing it.
Please, tell us what is it that you believe to be saved? What is the formula?