Bride isn't going to be in the tribulation

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Josh321

Senior Member
Sep 3, 2013
1,286
17
0
#1
The church is going to be gone before anything, it's not our fault that we were made gentiles which are unbelievers but the israel are guilty of killing the messiah so that is why they will go through the tribulation [h=3]Matthew 27:24-25[/h]King James Version (KJV)

24 When Pilate saw that he could prevail nothing, but that rather a tumult was made, he took water, and washed his hands before the multitude, saying, I am innocent of the blood of this just person: see ye to it.
25 Then answered all the people, and said, His blood be on us, and on our children.

after the church age and the fullness of the gentiles come in the bride will be raptured away many people believe that the church will be in the tribulation because of the seals also but look at this




9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.
[h=3]Revelation 6:9-11[/h]King James Version (KJV)

do you see this? a born again believer would NEVER ask for vengence of those that kill them they would ask for forgiveness BECAUSE THEY KNOW THEIR KINGDOM IS NOT OF THIS WORLD and that the unsaved person will be damned for ever look at stephen look at what he did



55 But he, being full of the Holy Ghost, looked up stedfastly into heaven, and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing on the right hand of God,
56 And said, Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of man standing on the right hand of God.
57 Then they cried out with a loud voice, and stopped their ears, and ran upon him with one accord,
58 And cast him out of the city, and stoned him: and the witnesses laid down their clothes at a young man's feet, whose name was Saul.
59 And they stoned Stephen, calling upon God, and saying, Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.
60 And he kneeled down, and cried with a loud voice, Lord, lay not this sin to their charge. And when he had said this, he fell asleep.
[h=3]Acts 7:55-60[/h]King James Version (KJV)


but before all of this happen the bride of christ will be long gone

[h=3]1 Thessalonians 4:16-17[/h]King James Version (KJV)

16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.



the dead in christ, the born again believers that are sleeping will rise first, no not everyone only the TRUE born again believers with christ in them that fell asleep on this earth will rise and we will be caught up in the sky to meet them, we meaning the believers who are still alive and haven't passed away, this event will be unseen to the world
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
#2
1 Corinthians 15:50-54, "Now I say this brothers: that flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of Yahweh; neither does corruption inherit incorruption.Behold, I show you a secret truth: we will not all sleep, but we will all be changed--In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we will be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. So when this corruptible will have put on incorruption, and this mortal will have put on immortality, then will be brought to pass the saying that is written: Death is swallowed up in victory."

Mattithyah 24:29-31, "Immediately, but after the tribulation of those days will the sun be darkened, and the moon will not give her light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. And then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven; and then will all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And He will send His malakim with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will
gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of earth to the other."


The pre-trib doctrine was never preached before around 1830, and is in place to get people to accepth the anti-Messiah, they will be told "meeting Christ in the air is not literal, it's is a higher state of consciousness." The UN has been publishing magazines about thier comin "cosmic christ" for 40 years or something, called "Matreyu." (sp) You need to look into "PROJECT BLUE BEAM," they plan on using hologram technology to fake the second coming, and this is no cracker-jack attempt, it real and it's real serious. Many will fall for it if it happens.

Here are some links

CNN Hologram TV First - YouTube

CNN Will I Am Hologram, First time on TV - YouTube

223 - The New Age Agenda - Amazing Discoveries TV

625 - The Coming Cosmic Christ / Secrets of the Ages - John Triplett - YouTube

Project Blue Beam By Serge Monast (1994)
 

Josh321

Senior Member
Sep 3, 2013
1,286
17
0
#3
1 Corinthians 15:50-54, "Now I say this brothers: that flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of Yahweh; neither does corruption inherit incorruption.Behold, I show you a secret truth: we will not all sleep, but we will all be changed--In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we will be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. So when this corruptible will have put on incorruption, and this mortal will have put on immortality, then will be brought to pass the saying that is written: Death is swallowed up in victory."

Mattithyah 24:29-31, "Immediately, but after the tribulation of those days will the sun be darkened, and the moon will not give her light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. And then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven; and then will all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And He will send His malakim with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will
gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of earth to the other."



The pre-trib doctrine was never preached before around 1830, and is in place to get people to accepth the anti-Messiah, they will be told "meeting Christ in the air is not literal, it's is a higher state of consciousness." The UN has been publishing magazines about thier comin "cosmic christ" for 40 years or something, called "Matreyu." (sp) You need to look into "PROJECT BLUE BEAM," they plan on using hologram technology to fake the second coming, and this is no cracker-jack attempt, it real and it's real serious. Many will fall for it if it happens.

Here are some links

CNN Hologram TV First - YouTube

CNN Will I Am Hologram, First time on TV - YouTube

223 - The New Age Agenda - Amazing Discoveries TV

625 - The Coming Cosmic Christ / Secrets of the Ages - John Triplett - YouTube

Project Blue Beam By Serge Monast (1994)
this is the 144 000 jews.. that will b saved
 

Josh321

Senior Member
Sep 3, 2013
1,286
17
0
#4
1 Corinthians 15:50-54, "Now I say this brothers: that flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of Yahweh; neither does corruption inherit incorruption.Behold, I show you a secret truth: we will not all sleep, but we will all be changed--In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we will be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. So when this corruptible will have put on incorruption, and this mortal will have put on immortality, then will be brought to pass the saying that is written: Death is swallowed up in victory."

Mattithyah 24:29-31, "Immediately, but after the tribulation of those days will the sun be darkened, and the moon will not give her light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. And then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven; and then will all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And He will send His malakim with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will
gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of earth to the other."


The pre-trib doctrine was never preached before around 1830, and is in place to get people to accepth the anti-Messiah, they will be told "meeting Christ in the air is not literal, it's is a higher state of consciousness." The UN has been publishing magazines about thier comin "cosmic christ" for 40 years or something, called "Matreyu." (sp) You need to look into "PROJECT BLUE BEAM," they plan on using hologram technology to fake the second coming, and this is no cracker-jack attempt, it real and it's real serious. Many will fall for it if it happens.

Here are some links

CNN Hologram TV First - YouTube

CNN Will I Am Hologram, First time on TV - YouTube

223 - The New Age Agenda - Amazing Discoveries TV

625 - The Coming Cosmic Christ / Secrets of the Ages - John Triplett - YouTube

Project Blue Beam By Serge Monast (1994)
and i don't care what man has to say i'm sticking to the word of God they can do whatever they want but i'm sticking to the word of God and the rapture won't be look how the movies show it, it will be invisible to the world, incorruptible is eternal the corruptible( flesh ) cannot see that because everything that is eternal is unseen
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
#5
this is the 144 000 jews.. that will b saved
i dont know where you got that...

Mattithyah 24:40-42, "Then two will be in the field; one will be taken, and the other left. Two women will be grinding at the mill; one will be taken, and the other left. Therefore watch! For you do not know what hour your Ruler will come,"

this is not pre-trib, there are still going to be humans in flesh on earth after Yahshua's return: (1000 yr regin)

Isayah 66:20-24, "And I will also take of them for priests and for Levites, says Yahweh. For as the inew heavens and the new earth which I will make will remain before Me, says Yahweh: so will your seed and your name remain. And it will come to pass that from one New Moon to another, and from one Sabbath to another, all flesh will come to worship before Me, says Yahweh. And they will go forth and look upon the carcasses of the men who have transgressed against Me; for their worm will not die, nor will their fire be quenched; and they will be an abhorrence to all flesh."
 

Josh321

Senior Member
Sep 3, 2013
1,286
17
0
#6
you didn't even read the thread did you, you just came into the thread with a mindset that said i was wrong and just wrote something else
 

Josh321

Senior Member
Sep 3, 2013
1,286
17
0
#7
i dont know where you got that...

Mattithyah 24:40-42, "Then two will be in the field; one will be taken, and the other left. Two women will be grinding at the mill; one will be taken, and the other left. Therefore watch! For you do not know what hour your Ruler will come,"

this is not pre-trib, there are still going to be humans in flesh on earth after Yahshua's return: (1000 yr regin)

Isayah 66:20-24, "And I will also take of them for priests and for Levites, says Yahweh. For as the inew heavens and the new earth which I will make will remain before Me, says Yahweh: so will your seed and your name remain. And it will come to pass that from one New Moon to another, and from one Sabbath to another, all flesh will come to worship before Me, says Yahweh. And they will go forth and look upon the carcasses of the men who have transgressed against Me; for their worm will not die, nor will their fire be quenched; and they will be an abhorrence to all flesh."
and i got that from the bible
 
O

overcomer2

Guest
#8
Here is where pre trib started:
In 1767, a Chilean-born Catholic Priest, Manuel de Lacunza y Diaz came to Imola, Italy, when the Jesuits were expelled from Spain because of their brutality. There he claimed to be a converted Jew named Rabbi Juan Jushafat Ben-Ezra. Under that alias, he wrote a 900 page book titled, The Coming of Messiah in Glory and Majesty. Lacunza theorized that the Church would be taken to be with the Lord to escape the reign of Antichrist in the last 3-1/2 years of the age, some 45 days before Jesus’ final return to Earth. During that 45 days (while the Church was in heaven), God would pour out His wrath upon the wicked remaining on Earth.
In 1828, "Glory and Majesty" was translated into English by a radical cultist London preacher named Edward Irving. Lacunza’s views could have died there, for most in England saw Irving as a heretic.
At the
same time Margaret MacDonald from Port Glasgow, Scotland, claimed she received divine revelations from God about a rapture. According to MacPherson, Miss Margaret had occultic ties, including a friendship with a girl who was into psychic powers and automatic writing. She sent her vision in a letter to Irving and, shortly thereafter, her revelation showed up in print. In September, 1830, The Morning Watch, a periodical put out by Irving’s church, published, "Commentary on the Epistles to the Seven Churches in the Apocalypse."(1)
According to James Whisler (2), the MacDonald clan was intimately associated with the Knights Templar - Margaret’s hometown being in one of the main areas that the Templars sailed to and settled in when they left France. He added, these "Satanic bloodlines" often chose the Christian religion as a cover to hide their origins and their true religion.
About the same time as Margaret Macdonald’s vision, John Nelson Darby was playing with the dispensationalist idea of dividing history into ages or "dispensations." Many prophecy teachers of today credit John Darby with the origin of these teachings because he was a well-educated man who authored many books. In fact, Darby went to see Margaret and her family shortly after she gained notoriety for her vision, and in later years, claimed them as his own.
With financial backing, the "vision" spread
Darby then headed out, promoting, improvising and adding to his new doctrine. He came to America several times and traveled all across the country to preach dispensation. As "luck" would have it, there always seemed to be wealthy benefactors nearby. This included men like eccentric banker Henry Drummond, who was involved from the beginning, making his resources available to Irving’s church in London and continuing to support the movement. Researcher Robert L. Pierce noted "…Darby’s unusual mobility, for his day and time and his seeming lack of financial problems."

Even Scofield after getting out of prison helped promote this lie from the Catholic Jesuits.

 
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zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
#9
The church is going to be gone before anything, it's not our fault that we were made gentiles which are unbelievers but the israel are guilty of killing the messiah so that is why they will go through the tribulation
document? maybe you do....i'll wade through this thread.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
#10
and i don't care what man has to say i'm sticking to the word of God they can do whatever they want but i'm sticking to the word of God and the rapture won't be look how the movies show it, it will be invisible to the world, incorruptible is eternal the corruptible( flesh ) cannot see that because everything that is eternal is unseen
where is there anything in the bible about people saying "WHAT? MY FAMILY VANISHED!"
planes; trains and automobiles crashing....clothes lying around?
empty churches?

WHERE?
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
#12
Revelation 20:4, "And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them. And I saw the souls of those who were beheaded for their witness of Yahshua and for the word of Yahweh and who had not worshiped the beast, nor his likeness, neither had received his mark in their foreheads nor upon their hands; and they lived and reigned with the Messiah a thousand years--"

beheaded for their witness of Yahshua

who had not worshiped the beast...neither had received his mark in their foreheads

post tribulation, resurrection at Yahshua's return.

1 Corinthians 15:50-54, "Now I say this brothers: that flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of Yahweh; neither does corruption inherit incorruption.Behold, I show you a secret truth: we will not all sleep, but we will all be changed--In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we will be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. So when this corruptible will have put on incorruption, and this mortal will have put on immortality, then will be brought to pass the saying that is written: Death is swallowed up in victory."

Mattithyah 24:29-31, "Immediately, but after the tribulation of those days will the sun be darkened, and the moon will not give her light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. And then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven; and then will all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And He will send His malakim with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will
gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of earth to the other."
 

breno785au

Senior Member
Jul 23, 2013
6,002
764
113
39
Australia
#14
where is there anything in the bible about people saying "WHAT? MY FAMILY VANISHED!"
planes; trains and automobiles crashing....clothes lying around?
empty churches?

WHERE?
I dont usually involve myself in discussions about these topics, but thats darn funny! lol
 

Josh321

Senior Member
Sep 3, 2013
1,286
17
0
#16
Forget it, I choose to not get involved. Sorry about that, keep studying and praying, you will get it.
lol there is nothing to study, the holy spirit reveals the mystery of the entire bible, maybe you need to pray and ask for spiritual understanding
 
Oct 22, 2011
628
7
18
#17
lol there is nothing to study, the holy spirit reveals the mystery of the entire bible, maybe you need to pray and ask for spiritual understanding
Wrong answer brother. For even God's Word tells us to study.
2Ti 2:15
Study to show thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.




 

Josh321

Senior Member
Sep 3, 2013
1,286
17
0
#18
Wrong answer brother. For even God's Word tells us to study.
2Ti 2:15
Study to show thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.



i didn't meant it in that way, he was telling me to study the bible, i simply was trying to say studying the bible won't help because without the holy spirit you will never understand it, even the
 
Feb 17, 2010
3,620
27
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#19
Josh my man.... Just to turn from sin to God is ALREADYT a great tribulation.... The FLESH FIGHTS HARD...

But let me show you one Scripture... For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be.
Mar 13:20 And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved:
but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.


Actually God shortened the days of the tribulation, FOR THE SAKE OF THE ELECT THAT ARE STILL HERE IN THE TRIBULATION...

Sorry to do it here on the forum, but maybe you and I can help more brothers to STAY STRONG IN FAITH... the TRIBULATION SHALL NOT BE ABOVE OUR LORD'S GRACE!!!!
 
D

doulos

Guest
#20
The church is going to be gone before anything, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

but before all of this happen the bride of christ will be long gone

1 Thessalonians 4:16-17

King James Version (KJV)

16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.



the dead in christ, the born again believers that are sleeping will rise first, no not everyone only the TRUE born again believers with christ in them that fell asleep on this earth will rise and we will be caught up in the sky to meet them, we meaning the believers who are still alive and haven't passed away, this event will be unseen to the world
How is it that the church missed this doctrine, over the 1800 years prior to it leaving the pen of John Nelson Darby, in the mid-19th century?

WHAT DOES SCRIPTURE SAY ABOUT THE GATHERING OF THE ELECT?
Here is a link to a good article demonstrating that tribulation has been going on since the first century. click> GREAT TRIBULATION

Are Christians supposed to be looking for our blessed Savior's return, or our own personal exit? Isn't it our job to be here?
John 17:15 I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.

I will be humbly honored to remain my brother John's fellow partaker in THE tribulation and in THE kingdom (of God) and endurance of Jesus Christ:
Revelation 1:9 I, John, your brother and fellow partaker in the tribulation and kingdom and perseverance {which are} in Jesus, was on the island called Patmos because of the word of God and the testimony of Jesus. NASB

(Greek/English Interlinear (tr) NT) Revelation 1:9 | egw <1473> {I} iwannhV <2491> {JOHN,} o <3588> {WHO} kai <2532> {ALSO} adelfoV <80> {BROTHER} umwn <5216> {YOUR} kai <2532> {AND} sugkoinwnoV <4791> {FELLOW PARTAKER} en <1722> {IN} th <3588> {THE} qliyei <2347> {TRIBULATION} kai <2532> {AND} en <1722> {IN} th <3588> {THE} basileia <932> {KINGDOM} kai <2532> {AND} upomonh <5281> {ENDURANCE} ihsou <2424> {OF JESUS} cristou <5547> {CHRIST,}....

1 Corinthians 15:51-52 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

At the last trump. Not a few trumps before the last but at the last trump, and if there is any THEY group I am pretty confident I would not want to be in it.

1 Thessalonians 4:16-17 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive [and] remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

"Note the WE (again). Paul was speaking to the Church of which he was part and we have every scriptural reason to believe that we also includes us. You and I and the rest of the church are the WE."

And the Olivet Discourse again demonstrates the order:

Matthew 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time.
Matthew 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days ... the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
Matthew 24:30 they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds
Matthew 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet [a great trumpet, NASB], and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

(1) Great tribulation.
(2) After the tribulation.
(3) Son of man coming
(3) Great trumpet
(5) Gather together elect

Seems the book of Matthew would have to be rewritten to support more than one gathering of the elect.

Look at 1 Thess 4:16 again: "...the Lord shall descend from heaven..."

How many second comings are we to expect?

Matthew 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

1 Thessalonians 4:16 "...with the voice of the archangel..."

Revelation 10:7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.
Revelation 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become [the kingdoms] of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
Rev 16:17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.

1 Thessalonians 4:16 "... trump of God..."

1 Thessalonians 4:16 "For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout,..."

Matthew 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet [a great trumpet, NASB], and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

The Olivet Discourse appears to be organized as:

Verses 1-14 describe the events of 70 AD and the historical realities we are witness to, and close in verse 14 with "and then shall the end come".
Verses 15-31 describe this "end" through events leading up to the Second Coming, and close with the coming of the Son of man and the gathering of the elect.
Verses 32-37 describe how we are to know it is the time of the end and close with the coming of the Son of man.
Verses 38-41 describe what the times will be like when this event takes place, and close with the coming of the Son of man and the gathering of the elect.
Verses 42-51 describe how we should prepare ourselves for this event, and close with the Second Coming and God's wrath on those left behind in verse 41
 
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