Cherubim
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N
okay you say they are machines, now they are cherubs, please post the scripture so the scripture is speaking here.
your assuming that Ezekiel 28 is taking about the one with the fiery burning sword in Genesis 3:24. Think:: why why would God put some one who is being sentenced to death in Ezekiel 28, but lets them protect the garden in Genesis 3:24. There is no info given you; to make that assumption., But, there is plenty of information given in Ezekiel 28 that shows it is taking about Satan. it flows. but what your inserting in there doesn't fit.
I never said that... what ? stick to one verse at a time.
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no the wheels and the living creatures are two separate things, there is one wheel for each cherubim. lol the wheels are colored amber stone color. lol
odd how the bible says that the snake is a beast of the field. how do you explain this?
The cherub from Ezekiel was the cherub in Genesis 3:24 because its the only cherub that Genesis alluded to being in the Garden of Eden. lol If the cherub was satan, then he was not the snake in the tree... RIGHT? instead he was possibly the cherub in Ezekiel 28, but even then it doesn't say that that cherub is even satan. RIGHT?
odd how the bible says that the snake is a beast of the field. how do you explain this?
The cherub from Ezekiel was the cherub in Genesis 3:24 because its the only cherub that Genesis alluded to being in the Garden of Eden. lol If the cherub was satan, then he was not the snake in the tree... RIGHT? instead he was possibly the cherub in Ezekiel 28, but even then it doesn't say that that cherub is even satan. RIGHT?
Cherubim are physical Beings like you and me, being that they have hands and faces and use machines to move from point a to point b.
As according to the Bible Ezekiel ch 1 and 2.
also notice that the throne of God is over their heads, and GOD is on the throne!!!!!!! JAH creator of heaven and earth.
PRAISE BE TO GOD, JAH, our HEAVENLY FATHER. May his will be done on earth as it is in Heaven.
As according to the Bible Ezekiel ch 1 and 2.
also notice that the throne of God is over their heads, and GOD is on the throne!!!!!!! JAH creator of heaven and earth.
PRAISE BE TO GOD, JAH, our HEAVENLY FATHER. May his will be done on earth as it is in Heaven.
N
nooo ugh, 
your not allowing yourself to grasp the figure of speech that is used there. its a figure. thats why it reads like it does. its a teaching method a tool. By calling him Serpent its showing you hes not there to do good, the teaching is giving you more information with the symbols without needed to use alot of words. plus. it protects people who are not meant to understand certain teachings God's word. it seems like from what I see, it works very very well.
Mark 4:12
your not allowing yourself to grasp the figure of speech that is used there. its a figure. thats why it reads like it does. its a teaching method a tool. By calling him Serpent its showing you hes not there to do good, the teaching is giving you more information with the symbols without needed to use alot of words. plus. it protects people who are not meant to understand certain teachings God's word. it seems like from what I see, it works very very well.Mark 4:12
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actually I find that if you don't try to treat it all as metaphor like you say, it makes more sense. lol
but you know, think what you want the fact is that satan has yet to be cast out of Heaven. When he is cast out he is cast down to the earth by the arch angel Michael. along with all of his army. They are on earth for a while after this before Satan is eventually bound by another angel with a chain.
Think about it, if satan was cast out of heaven. WHEN DID IT HAPPEN? in the bible I mean? Because satan still has the power to travel between the heaven and earth. For instance, IN JOB, and in the dessert with Jesus. THE DEVIL IS NOT IN HELL YET!!!!! he is still in the heavens talked about in Genesis 1:1
REVELATION 12:7 is the only instance of the war recorded in the Bible.
but you know, think what you want the fact is that satan has yet to be cast out of Heaven. When he is cast out he is cast down to the earth by the arch angel Michael. along with all of his army. They are on earth for a while after this before Satan is eventually bound by another angel with a chain.
Think about it, if satan was cast out of heaven. WHEN DID IT HAPPEN? in the bible I mean? Because satan still has the power to travel between the heaven and earth. For instance, IN JOB, and in the dessert with Jesus. THE DEVIL IS NOT IN HELL YET!!!!! he is still in the heavens talked about in Genesis 1:1
REVELATION 12:7 is the only instance of the war recorded in the Bible.
actually I find that if you don't try to treat it all as metaphor like you say, it makes more sense. lol
but you know, think what you want the fact is that satan has yet to be cast out of Heaven. When he is cast out he is cast down to the earth by the arch angel Michael. along with all of his army. They are on earth for a while after this before Satan is eventually bound by another angel with a chain.
Think about it, if satan was cast out of heaven. WHEN DID IT HAPPEN? in the bible I mean? Because satan still has the power to travel between the heaven and earth. For instance, IN JOB, and in the dessert with Jesus. THE DEVIL IS NOT IN HELL YET!!!!! he is still in the heavens talked about in Genesis 1:1
REVELATION 12:7 is the only instance of the war recorded in the Bible.
I can go into what the wheels are ?..
I won't say they are the Gospels , because that is not written ,because Ezekiel is being too detailed in Ezekiel 1: .
but lets not Get off subject, I want you to explain the wheels to me..... since you said you could. THEY ARN"T THE GOSPELS, cause that is a crazy theory that I'm aware of, and its easy to disprove. the four gospels of Mat mark luke john were all written after Jesus ascended into heaven. THEY DIDN"T EXIST TO EZEKIEL. nor would he ever talk about those particular gospels, moving angels from place to place.
but you know, think what you want the fact is that satan has yet to be cast out of Heaven. When he is cast out he is cast down to the earth by the arch angel Michael. along with all of his army. They are on earth for a while after this before Satan is eventually bound by another angel with a chain.
Think about it, if satan was cast out of heaven. WHEN DID IT HAPPEN? in the bible I mean? Because satan still has the power to travel between the heaven and earth. For instance, IN JOB, and in the dessert with Jesus. THE DEVIL IS NOT IN HELL YET!!!!! he is still in the heavens talked about in Genesis 1:1
REVELATION 12:7 is the only instance of the war recorded in the Bible.
I can go into what the wheels are ?..
I won't say they are the Gospels , because that is not written ,because Ezekiel is being too detailed in Ezekiel 1: .
but lets not Get off subject, I want you to explain the wheels to me..... since you said you could. THEY ARN"T THE GOSPELS, cause that is a crazy theory that I'm aware of, and its easy to disprove. the four gospels of Mat mark luke john were all written after Jesus ascended into heaven. THEY DIDN"T EXIST TO EZEKIEL. nor would he ever talk about those particular gospels, moving angels from place to place.
I presume you all know the Hebrews worshiped the pagan gods of other neighboring nations?
SERAPHIM, the imaginary supernatural guardians of the threshold of Yahweh's sanctuary, only mentioned in Isa. vi. (Isaiah's vision). Their form is not described, but they have not only six wings (verse 2), but hands (verse 6) and feet (verse 2). They are of colossal height, for they overtop Him who is seated on the high throne; and with a voice that shakes the thresholds they proclaim the Trisagion, like the four "living creatures" (cf. Cherubim) in Rev. iv. 6-8. Probably in the lost Hebrew text of Enoch xx. 7 "seraphim" stood where the Ethiopic and the Greek give "the serpents" or "the dragons"; Paradise, serpents and cherubim are here made subject to Gabriel. In late Jewish writings, more recognized than "Enoch," they are classed among the celestials with the cherubim and the 'ophannim ("wheels," cf. Ezek. i.). Now as to their origin and significance. They may originally have had a serpent form, for it is difficult not to regard "seraphim" as originally (as in Num. xxi. 8) = "serpents"; cf. also the flying serpents of Israelitish folklore in Isa. xiv. 29. If so, Isaiah has transformed and ennobled these supernatural guardians of sacred things and persons. The "Nehushtan" broken in pieces under Hezekiah (2 Kings xviii. 4) may have given an impulse to the prophet's imagination. Was it not a greater thing to ennoble them than to destroy their artistic representation ? There is no precise Babylonian or Egyptian equivalent, though attempts have been made to produce points of contact with Babylonian or Egyptian beliefs.
See further Enc. Bib. " Seraphim," and cf. Duhm's Jesaia, ed. 2.1902), on Isa. vi. (T. K. C.)
Seraphim
CHERUBIM, the Hebrew plural of "cherub" (kerub), imaginary winged animal figures of a sacred character, referred to in the description of Solomon's temple (1 Kings vi. 23-35, vii. 29, viii. 6, 7), and also in that of the ark of the tabernacle (Ex. xxv. 18-22, xxvi. 1, 31, xxxvii. 7-9). The cherub-images, where such occur, represent to the imagination the supernatural bearers of Yahweh's throne or chariot, or the guardians of His abode; the cherub-carvings at least symbolize His presence, and communicate some degree of His sanctity. In Gen. iii. 24 the cherubim are the guards of Paradise; Ezek. xxviii. 14, 16 cannot be mentioned here, the text being corrupt. We also find (1 Sam. iv. 4; 2 Sam. vi. 2) as a divine title "that sitteth upon the cherubim"; here it is doubted whether the cherubim are the material ones in the temple, or those which faith assumes and the artist tries to represent - the supernatural steeds upon which Yahweh issues forth to interfere in human affairs. In a poetic theophany (Ps. xviii. 10) we find "upon a cherub" parallel to "upon the wings of the wind" (cp. Isa. xix. 1; Ps. civ. 3). One naturally infers from this that the "cherub" was sometimes viewed as a bird. For the clouds, mythologically, are birds. "The Algonkins say that birds always make the winds, that they create the waterspouts, and that the clouds are the spreading and agitation of their wings." "The Sioux say that the thunder is the sound of the cloud-bird flapping his wings." If so, Ps. xviii. 10 is a solitary trace of the archaic view of the cherub. The bird, however, was probably a mythic, extra-natural bird. At any rate the cherub was suggested by and represents the stormcloud, just as the sword in Gen. iii. 24 corresponds to the lightning. In Ezek. i. the four visionary creatures are expressly connected with a storm-wind, and a bright cloud (ver. 4). Elsewhere (xli. 18) the cherub has two faces (a man's and a bird's), but in i. 10 and x. 14 each cherub has four faces, a view tastefully simplified in the Johannine Apocalypse (Rev. iv. 7). It is best, however, to separate Ezekiel from other writers, since he belongs to what may be called a great mythological revival. Probably his cherubim are a modification of older ones, which may well have been of a more sober type. His own accounts, as we have seen, vary. Probably the cherub has passed through several phases. There was a mythic bird-cherub, and then perhaps a winged animal-form, analogous to the winged figures of bulls and lions with human faces which guarded Babylonian and Assyrian temples and palaces. Another analogy is furnished by the winged genii represented as fertilizing the sacred tree - the date-palm (Tylor); here the body is human, though the face is sometimes that of an eagle. It is perhaps even more noteworthy that figures thought to be cherubs have been found at Zenjirli, within the ancient North Syrian kingdom of Ya'di (see Jeremias, Das Alte Testament im Lichte des Alten Orients, pp. 350 f.); we may combine this with the fact that one of the great gods of this kingdom was called Rakab'el or Rekub'el (also perhaps Rakab or Rekub). A Sabaean (S. Arabian) name Karab'el also exists. The kerubim might perhaps be symbolic representatives of the god Rakab'el or Rekub'el, probably equivalent to Hadad, whose sacred animal was the bull. That the figures symbolic of Rakab or Hadad were compounded or amalgamated by the Israelites with those symbolic of Nergal (the lion-god) and Ninib (the eagle-god), is not surprising.
Cherubim
SERAPHIM, the imaginary supernatural guardians of the threshold of Yahweh's sanctuary, only mentioned in Isa. vi. (Isaiah's vision). Their form is not described, but they have not only six wings (verse 2), but hands (verse 6) and feet (verse 2). They are of colossal height, for they overtop Him who is seated on the high throne; and with a voice that shakes the thresholds they proclaim the Trisagion, like the four "living creatures" (cf. Cherubim) in Rev. iv. 6-8. Probably in the lost Hebrew text of Enoch xx. 7 "seraphim" stood where the Ethiopic and the Greek give "the serpents" or "the dragons"; Paradise, serpents and cherubim are here made subject to Gabriel. In late Jewish writings, more recognized than "Enoch," they are classed among the celestials with the cherubim and the 'ophannim ("wheels," cf. Ezek. i.). Now as to their origin and significance. They may originally have had a serpent form, for it is difficult not to regard "seraphim" as originally (as in Num. xxi. 8) = "serpents"; cf. also the flying serpents of Israelitish folklore in Isa. xiv. 29. If so, Isaiah has transformed and ennobled these supernatural guardians of sacred things and persons. The "Nehushtan" broken in pieces under Hezekiah (2 Kings xviii. 4) may have given an impulse to the prophet's imagination. Was it not a greater thing to ennoble them than to destroy their artistic representation ? There is no precise Babylonian or Egyptian equivalent, though attempts have been made to produce points of contact with Babylonian or Egyptian beliefs.
See further Enc. Bib. " Seraphim," and cf. Duhm's Jesaia, ed. 2.1902), on Isa. vi. (T. K. C.)
Seraphim
CHERUBIM, the Hebrew plural of "cherub" (kerub), imaginary winged animal figures of a sacred character, referred to in the description of Solomon's temple (1 Kings vi. 23-35, vii. 29, viii. 6, 7), and also in that of the ark of the tabernacle (Ex. xxv. 18-22, xxvi. 1, 31, xxxvii. 7-9). The cherub-images, where such occur, represent to the imagination the supernatural bearers of Yahweh's throne or chariot, or the guardians of His abode; the cherub-carvings at least symbolize His presence, and communicate some degree of His sanctity. In Gen. iii. 24 the cherubim are the guards of Paradise; Ezek. xxviii. 14, 16 cannot be mentioned here, the text being corrupt. We also find (1 Sam. iv. 4; 2 Sam. vi. 2) as a divine title "that sitteth upon the cherubim"; here it is doubted whether the cherubim are the material ones in the temple, or those which faith assumes and the artist tries to represent - the supernatural steeds upon which Yahweh issues forth to interfere in human affairs. In a poetic theophany (Ps. xviii. 10) we find "upon a cherub" parallel to "upon the wings of the wind" (cp. Isa. xix. 1; Ps. civ. 3). One naturally infers from this that the "cherub" was sometimes viewed as a bird. For the clouds, mythologically, are birds. "The Algonkins say that birds always make the winds, that they create the waterspouts, and that the clouds are the spreading and agitation of their wings." "The Sioux say that the thunder is the sound of the cloud-bird flapping his wings." If so, Ps. xviii. 10 is a solitary trace of the archaic view of the cherub. The bird, however, was probably a mythic, extra-natural bird. At any rate the cherub was suggested by and represents the stormcloud, just as the sword in Gen. iii. 24 corresponds to the lightning. In Ezek. i. the four visionary creatures are expressly connected with a storm-wind, and a bright cloud (ver. 4). Elsewhere (xli. 18) the cherub has two faces (a man's and a bird's), but in i. 10 and x. 14 each cherub has four faces, a view tastefully simplified in the Johannine Apocalypse (Rev. iv. 7). It is best, however, to separate Ezekiel from other writers, since he belongs to what may be called a great mythological revival. Probably his cherubim are a modification of older ones, which may well have been of a more sober type. His own accounts, as we have seen, vary. Probably the cherub has passed through several phases. There was a mythic bird-cherub, and then perhaps a winged animal-form, analogous to the winged figures of bulls and lions with human faces which guarded Babylonian and Assyrian temples and palaces. Another analogy is furnished by the winged genii represented as fertilizing the sacred tree - the date-palm (Tylor); here the body is human, though the face is sometimes that of an eagle. It is perhaps even more noteworthy that figures thought to be cherubs have been found at Zenjirli, within the ancient North Syrian kingdom of Ya'di (see Jeremias, Das Alte Testament im Lichte des Alten Orients, pp. 350 f.); we may combine this with the fact that one of the great gods of this kingdom was called Rakab'el or Rekub'el (also perhaps Rakab or Rekub). A Sabaean (S. Arabian) name Karab'el also exists. The kerubim might perhaps be symbolic representatives of the god Rakab'el or Rekub'el, probably equivalent to Hadad, whose sacred animal was the bull. That the figures symbolic of Rakab or Hadad were compounded or amalgamated by the Israelites with those symbolic of Nergal (the lion-god) and Ninib (the eagle-god), is not surprising.
Cherubim
K
PS did good. A cherub (cherubim is the Hebrew plural) is a figure composed of parts of ox, eagle, lion and man (occasionally minor variations on the exact four animals. It is the national emblem of Babylon, and was copied in the redesign of the sphinx by the 12th dynasty (I think) Egyptians. Because Ezekiel's chariot (the merkabah) had these four creatures, it is also a cherubim. It is way more. Symbolically, it a root vision shared by many people of the glory of God in revival.
The Jews would not teach on the merkabah in open congregation because of the confusion that results, as is happening here. "Wings" means wings of a building, not of a bird. "Wheels" means both drive wheels of a chariot, but also the gear wheels similar to a watch mechanism or (look it up) astrolabe.
The Jews would not teach on the merkabah in open congregation because of the confusion that results, as is happening here. "Wings" means wings of a building, not of a bird. "Wheels" means both drive wheels of a chariot, but also the gear wheels similar to a watch mechanism or (look it up) astrolabe.
P
You're question is " what are the wheels"
I will share as god answered this question for me ..
He showed me the wheel in parts..
HUB - God , everyone is to be attached to him.. All being done for his glory
SPOKES-- we are the spokes .. Our heads attached to god (the hub) Wich attaches is to him.. We then as a "body" .. Bring together our gifts and talents to glorify what's being done and make it about him and his kingdom and what "He" is doing..
Not the worlds kingdom us and what it is doing.. ..
The bottom part of the spokes " becomes" the rubber part of this wheel .. Every talent by each spoke pours into this area.. Wich become feet( tread) on the wheel..
TREAD- when each persons talent going into anything comes
Together and done in agreement for the glory and kingdom of god .. "then" the wheel will begin moving forward..
gods chariot wheel is on a "huge" grand scale ..
What's it going to take to get that huge wheel on gods chariot?
all churches are going to have to come together , put down their doctrines and paperwork and start "walking out" the gospel..
The churches are the spokes on the" huge" wheel up above folks!
can you imagine if every church closed it's mouth and instead "came together" with all those gifts and talents inside them and said " together " we can do this? of everyone kept their mouth shut , we wouldn't know who was what!! But I guarantee you .. "Ye shall surely know them by the fruits of their labor"
we want gods kingdom to come? Are we "real sure" about that? cause all i see is a bunch of quarreling about paperwork.. put the paperwork(doctrines) down and start joining a movement to get gods wheel on!
That's going to take mouths closed and let's do!!
I will share as god answered this question for me ..
He showed me the wheel in parts..
HUB - God , everyone is to be attached to him.. All being done for his glory
SPOKES-- we are the spokes .. Our heads attached to god (the hub) Wich attaches is to him.. We then as a "body" .. Bring together our gifts and talents to glorify what's being done and make it about him and his kingdom and what "He" is doing..
Not the worlds kingdom us and what it is doing.. ..
The bottom part of the spokes " becomes" the rubber part of this wheel .. Every talent by each spoke pours into this area.. Wich become feet( tread) on the wheel..
TREAD- when each persons talent going into anything comes
Together and done in agreement for the glory and kingdom of god .. "then" the wheel will begin moving forward..
gods chariot wheel is on a "huge" grand scale ..
What's it going to take to get that huge wheel on gods chariot?
all churches are going to have to come together , put down their doctrines and paperwork and start "walking out" the gospel..
The churches are the spokes on the" huge" wheel up above folks!
can you imagine if every church closed it's mouth and instead "came together" with all those gifts and talents inside them and said " together " we can do this? of everyone kept their mouth shut , we wouldn't know who was what!! But I guarantee you .. "Ye shall surely know them by the fruits of their labor"
we want gods kingdom to come? Are we "real sure" about that? cause all i see is a bunch of quarreling about paperwork.. put the paperwork(doctrines) down and start joining a movement to get gods wheel on!
That's going to take mouths closed and let's do!!
P
It's a wheel problem allright .. And the body is still standing around wondering what's wrong ..well folks .. We are the problem .. I'm a spoke trying to fit into gods hub and I can't find a church that wants to do it. Find me a church (cause I've looked at millions) that wants to gran arms with another church (forget about denominations) and im in!!!
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see all these metaphor people hanging around, spokes and wheels. too bad the Bible never mentioned spokes in the wheels, just that they are two wheels one turning inside of another. Their work and colour is like amber colour.
as for :In late Jewish writings, more recognized than "Enoch," they are classed among the celestials with the cherubim and the 'ophannim ("wheels," cf. Ezek. i.). Now as to their origin and significance.
Yeah, there is no such thing as an ophanim. THEY ARE NOT IN THE BIBLE. they only exist in the ancient Jewish Merkabah bologna.
see here to see the lies
Merkabah mysticism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
see there are the lies, that were weaved about the wheels. So, nobody that researched them could ever come to truth.
truth is, the wheels are vehicles, because the angels use them when they ascend and descend on the son of man.
Ophanim - is not real
the wheels are called GELGEL that is what they are called in ch 10 of Ezekiel. SO, there are no ophanim.
the only angels that are in the Bible are Cherubim and Seraphim, same with the Book of Enoch.
Arch angels Great angels and Dragon angels.
But Metaphor is nice, I mean that just says you can pretend it means anything you want it too. which is probably meaning the point of the wheels is alluding the majority of you.
as for :In late Jewish writings, more recognized than "Enoch," they are classed among the celestials with the cherubim and the 'ophannim ("wheels," cf. Ezek. i.). Now as to their origin and significance.
Yeah, there is no such thing as an ophanim. THEY ARE NOT IN THE BIBLE. they only exist in the ancient Jewish Merkabah bologna.
see here to see the lies
Merkabah mysticism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
see there are the lies, that were weaved about the wheels. So, nobody that researched them could ever come to truth.
truth is, the wheels are vehicles, because the angels use them when they ascend and descend on the son of man.
Ophanim - is not real
the wheels are called GELGEL that is what they are called in ch 10 of Ezekiel. SO, there are no ophanim.
the only angels that are in the Bible are Cherubim and Seraphim, same with the Book of Enoch.
Arch angels Great angels and Dragon angels.
But Metaphor is nice, I mean that just says you can pretend it means anything you want it too. which is probably meaning the point of the wheels is alluding the majority of you.
K
If a thing is purposefully hidden, how can Wikipedia or anyone know which are the lies about it? The widipedia omits Maimonides' helpful clue that the wings are connected.
Ezek. 10:12-13 states specifically the merkabah had wheels (ophanim) which were called wheels (gilgal).
Ophanim are not angels, neither are cherubim or seraphim. Some angels are human beings, like in Gen.32:3.
Ezek. 10:12-13 states specifically the merkabah had wheels (ophanim) which were called wheels (gilgal).
Ophanim are not angels, neither are cherubim or seraphim. Some angels are human beings, like in Gen.32:3.
cherubim and seraphim are angels.
wikipedia didn't say it was a lie, wikipedia treats it as biblical doctrine, when its not in the BIBLE!
so just check out their in the bible section under the word cherubim or angel.
Cherub - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Angel - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
see i'm trying to point out when people lie about the Bible.
this is where and why. they are treating merkabah mysticism as truth when it was a group of priests that got together to lie about the truth in the Bible.
wikipedia didn't say it was a lie, wikipedia treats it as biblical doctrine, when its not in the BIBLE!
so just check out their in the bible section under the word cherubim or angel.
Cherub - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Angel - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
see i'm trying to point out when people lie about the Bible.
this is where and why. they are treating merkabah mysticism as truth when it was a group of priests that got together to lie about the truth in the Bible.