God cannot abide in sin. It was sin that originally separated us from God. Is it so strange to you that if I choose to do that which I know God loathes, especially while I know God is with me that I could lose my guidance from God? that I could be blinded by my sin? Where does the wide path take me Enochson? where does it lead? why are their paths?
CONFINED ARGUMENT THREAD
- Thread starter Deadtosin
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E
I wasn't trying to trip you up.
I was trying to make sure what you meant before continuing.
I don't think you understand the great Love wherewith He has loved us and saved us for the sake of His Dear Son.
We are clothed in the Righteousness of the Lord Jesus Who gave Himself for us.
I get the hatred of sin. I hate it too.
That's why I fight it and hate it when I fall into it.
And when I hurt real bad as I go to Him.
That's why it seems to happen less and less. I get convicted and it hurts. So I watch and avoid it.
Even though I know more and more as time goes by how unworthy I really am.
But I thought you were saying God casts you off when you stumble. That's just wrong.
I was trying to make sure what you meant before continuing.
I don't think you understand the great Love wherewith He has loved us and saved us for the sake of His Dear Son.
We are clothed in the Righteousness of the Lord Jesus Who gave Himself for us.
I get the hatred of sin. I hate it too.
That's why I fight it and hate it when I fall into it.
And when I hurt real bad as I go to Him.
That's why it seems to happen less and less. I get convicted and it hurts. So I watch and avoid it.
Even though I know more and more as time goes by how unworthy I really am.
But I thought you were saying God casts you off when you stumble. That's just wrong.
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F
No you go back and look. My whole post concerning Hebrew's 10 was that we must repent. If fact I stated it over and over. All you had to do was read it.
Of course you did, you just tried proving to me that if I choose to sin, we don't have to repent.
Then you ended contradicting yourself, and chose to believe we must repent, but never said you were wrong.
Many on here do that, as if no one notices. I can go back and paste my first post concerning Heb 10 and prove it was all about repentance. SO you knew that from the first.
You just didn't get repentance at that time, now you do, cuz you cant get our fo the corner you backed yourself into with the homosexual, and "true Christian" statements you made.
Yea I have your tactics nailed dude.
Second, Hebrews 10 is about "sinning willfully", I know that because that is what it says.
So why do you want so badly it to only apply to the Law, even when the wording is clear and plain???
Why is it you constantly keep limiting the saying "if we sin willfully" to only apply to returning to the law, but not any other sins, when he used "sin" in a general sense???? WHY WHY WHY
Why are you trying to prove to me we are born sinners? Lets say your right, what does that prove concerning anything about repentance, or Hebrews 10?
WHY DID EVE SIN? WAS IT BY CHOICE OR HER NATURE?
I have asked this over and over you refuse to answer. So? Why? She and Adam knew it would lead to death, they knew God said dont do it - so why did they do it?
Were they created sinful?
or did they not have freewill?
Or did they choose to give in to the temptation by freewill?
F
See Ed, you knew this was about repentance ALL ALONG, and in your first repsonse to me here is what you said when I made it clear we were discussing repentace:
Page 12 Post #238
Quote:
AND HERE IS YOUR RESPONSE:
ignored the fact that I was speaking of repentance, and went straight into your little "do you sin?" thing that never ended.
So dont tell me it was not about repentance, it was. You have now switched your view.
So how can it be as you say:
I posted the above before I ever answered if I fail from time to time.
Your now just lying because you failed in your argument and you know it. That is the reason for the sneaky attempt to change your view.
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E
why do you think like this SIN, SIN,SIN, FAILURE,FAILURE,FAILURE, I'M A SCHUM BAG. That set's well with the God who gave His Son for you! hold on let be get my bat and beat myself agian with defeat. WHAT EVER HAPPEAN TO YOU ARE MORE THEN VICTOR IN CHRIST. I'M NOT THE ONE INSULTING GOD'S VICTROY HERE. This separated thing what a bunch of bull not in the book.
E
Perhaps we would do well to identify exactly what "sin" is, in plain and simple English?
Is it an action? Is it violation of the Mosaic law? Of NT law? If it isn't a heart condition (disease), what is it?
Hope this is helpful, and not just adding fuel to the fire.
~ellie
Is it an action? Is it violation of the Mosaic law? Of NT law? If it isn't a heart condition (disease), what is it?
Hope this is helpful, and not just adding fuel to the fire.
~ellie
thanks for that, and you are right, I chose the wrong words for sure. He doesn't cast me off. I suppose one could say that if I choose to sin I choose to walk away from God. Praise God it does get harder and harder to sin it is almost unimaginable to think I could willingly do something against God in any way. God bless you brother I love how the Spirit gets stronger and stronger within us. Such an amazing God we have for sure
it is almost unimaginable to think I could willingly do something against God in any way. God bless you brother I love how the Spirit gets stronger and stronger within us. Such an amazing God we have for sure being lost in sin is in the book. The book also states God will have nothing to do with unrighteousness. The book also states that when we are born of God we sin no more, it is absolutely my experience when I willingly sin against God I don't feel as close to him, like I turned my back, and it gets harder to pray and harder to understand all that with the Spirit comes so easily
5 I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not.
6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.
Jude.
6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.
Jude.
P
Okay, a brother in the Lord posted an excellent treatise on sin, repentance, and the blood of Christ on another thread. Can one of you technically minded help me to copy it here? :/
I, the elderly, have trouble with these things, at times.
I am beginning to wonder, original sin aside, if perhaps terminology might be misunderstood, and just think some clarity from the Holy Spirit would be good. (duh! lol)
~ellie
I, the elderly, have trouble with these things, at times.
I am beginning to wonder, original sin aside, if perhaps terminology might be misunderstood, and just think some clarity from the Holy Spirit would be good. (duh! lol)
~ellie
E
I hope you provide the evidence where I said anything remotely like if we "choose to sin, we don't have to repent".
Hopefully you prove all this.
UH. OK. Hopefully you"nail my tactics" at some point in the following posts, i.e: show me saying what you claim instead of just ranting.
I didn't say it was only about The Law.
But....aren't you the one who spends so much time defining sin as Transgression of the Law?
I said it was about Hebrews at the edge of the New Covenant who turn away, rejecting the only means God has provided for forgiveness of sins. They reject so great a salvation.
Yes, the warning applies to any who do the same (reject the Once For All Sacrifice for sins, Christ Jesus).
But if you follow the logical conclusion of your misuse of Heb 10:26 - You, the pure freewill man who willfully sins (from time to time) has no more sacrifice for sins. You have neglected so great a salvation, trod the Son of God underfoot and subjected Him to an open shame. So: do you need to get saved again (rebaptized, etc?)
I've not one time said sinning willfully only applies to returning to the Law. Please show me saying that.
What I am actually saying is that most sin involves the use of the ill, and is willful sin (with the exception of unconscious or accidental breaking of the Law or sinning).
Now everything you are about MUST agree with that, since you're all about using your (pure) free will to sin - your choice to sin. Willful sin.
What I have been saying is that there is far more to sin than you write about ("the homo", etc). And that virtually all sin is willful. You will also see I have posted we must confess our sin to receive forgiveness and cleansing. But because this is your obsession, you jump on the AHA! but you must have REPENTANCE with confession. I didn't think that needed to be explained. I see that you need everything carefully spelled out, and repeated often - I can do that.
No. And that was my point to you as well.
The big deal is your pure free will.
Well, since they were completely innocent; without fear or shame; they had personal communion with the Lord, is it safe to say they were created and remained clean and innocent.... until the fall? Of course that's what it says.
She was deceived, yet being deceived was still in the transgression.
Adam was not deceived, so sinned willfully.
Because Eve was the first to fall into sin through deception, she was now placed under subjection to her husband.
Adam became the federal head, and we are told he was not deceived, but sinned willfully. Paul places Adam as the pointman in the fall, SIN entering in through him, and death as a result of sin.
Romans 5:12
12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
ALL MEN FELL IN ADAM. How clear do you need it to be?
You playing games with what this clearly says to avoid acknowledging that YOU are sinful by nature and continue to willfully sin because you are a sinner is bordering on Idolatry, so I'm not discussing it with you any longer. You clearly don't have a grasp on how systemic sin really is, and why this passage is so important to understand"
1 John 1:8
If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us.
You can either study this passage or not.
Its not the one about saying we have not sinned (past), this one is talking about having sin.
answered.
No.
Yes they did.
But why can't you just admit BEFORE they fell there was no sin, no curse, no death, no separation from God?
So after the fall, are they able to undo the sin; curse and death any more than you are today?
Presumably, knowing what you know, and having a pure will that only fails from time to time, you really should be able to keep those kids of yours from ever falling into sin: whatever it takes, man. It would be worth it, wouldn't it?
I'd get on that asap.
Rather tired of your child-like use of 'freewill'.
Do you think you are debating a Calvinist? lol.
Hopefully you prove all this.
UH. OK. Hopefully you"nail my tactics" at some point in the following posts, i.e: show me saying what you claim instead of just ranting.
I didn't say it was only about The Law.
But....aren't you the one who spends so much time defining sin as Transgression of the Law?
I said it was about Hebrews at the edge of the New Covenant who turn away, rejecting the only means God has provided for forgiveness of sins. They reject so great a salvation.
Yes, the warning applies to any who do the same (reject the Once For All Sacrifice for sins, Christ Jesus).
But if you follow the logical conclusion of your misuse of Heb 10:26 - You, the pure freewill man who willfully sins (from time to time) has no more sacrifice for sins. You have neglected so great a salvation, trod the Son of God underfoot and subjected Him to an open shame. So: do you need to get saved again (rebaptized, etc?)
I've not one time said sinning willfully only applies to returning to the Law. Please show me saying that.
What I am actually saying is that most sin involves the use of the ill, and is willful sin (with the exception of unconscious or accidental breaking of the Law or sinning).
Now everything you are about MUST agree with that, since you're all about using your (pure) free will to sin - your choice to sin. Willful sin.
What I have been saying is that there is far more to sin than you write about ("the homo", etc). And that virtually all sin is willful. You will also see I have posted we must confess our sin to receive forgiveness and cleansing. But because this is your obsession, you jump on the AHA! but you must have REPENTANCE with confession. I didn't think that needed to be explained. I see that you need everything carefully spelled out, and repeated often - I can do that.
No. And that was my point to you as well.
The big deal is your pure free will.
Well, since they were completely innocent; without fear or shame; they had personal communion with the Lord, is it safe to say they were created and remained clean and innocent.... until the fall? Of course that's what it says.
She was deceived, yet being deceived was still in the transgression.
Adam was not deceived, so sinned willfully.
Because Eve was the first to fall into sin through deception, she was now placed under subjection to her husband.
Adam became the federal head, and we are told he was not deceived, but sinned willfully. Paul places Adam as the pointman in the fall, SIN entering in through him, and death as a result of sin.
Romans 5:12
12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
ALL MEN FELL IN ADAM. How clear do you need it to be?
You playing games with what this clearly says to avoid acknowledging that YOU are sinful by nature and continue to willfully sin because you are a sinner is bordering on Idolatry, so I'm not discussing it with you any longer. You clearly don't have a grasp on how systemic sin really is, and why this passage is so important to understand"
1 John 1:8
If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us.
You can either study this passage or not.
Its not the one about saying we have not sinned (past), this one is talking about having sin.
answered.
No.
Yes they did.
But why can't you just admit BEFORE they fell there was no sin, no curse, no death, no separation from God?
So after the fall, are they able to undo the sin; curse and death any more than you are today?
Presumably, knowing what you know, and having a pure will that only fails from time to time, you really should be able to keep those kids of yours from ever falling into sin: whatever it takes, man. It would be worth it, wouldn't it?
I'd get on that asap.
Rather tired of your child-like use of 'freewill'.
Do you think you are debating a Calvinist? lol.
E
See Ed, you knew this was about repentance ALL ALONG, and in your first repsonse to me here is what you said when I made it clear we were discussing repentace:
Page 12 Post #238
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by feedm3
God gave us the ability to repent of all sin, saying I sin because I am a sinner is saying you have not repented - I Cor 7, II Pet 3:10, Luke 13:3, and Acts 2:38.
AND HERE IS YOUR RESPONSE:
Quote:
How long since your last confession (repentance)?
Feedm3, I see now that your black and white view of things is an issue. And your total denial that you are a sinner. That's okay, there are lots of people like that out there today.
THIS is what the whole thing started over: Take a good look and see what you were really saying (and continued to say).
Originally Posted by feedm3
God gave us the ability to repent of all sin, saying I sin because I am a sinner is saying you have not repented - I Cor 7, II Pet 3:10, Luke 13:3, and Acts 2:38.
You wanted to to claim/suggest you had repented of all sin, and were no longer a sinner.
I asked you....Oh really? how long have you been sinless (how long since your last confession)?
Yes I know.
Because guys like you would continually focus on The Law actually end up obsessed with sin.
I haven't had any change of view whatsoever.
Nothing you have said has convinced me that all men didn't fall in Adam inheriting the same spiritual condition he had after falling. That includes you.
No sneakiness on my part.
I just wanted to see how often you (The Law man) willfully sinned despite The Spirit of Grace, and why you would use your pure and good free will to choose to sin against the Lord?
You don't have an answer. Well, you do, but your answer is idolatrous.
E
Please use the quote feature properly. I can not use this mess to refute your accusations that I'm lying.
Notice with your poor use of the quote feature, I can only respond to what you have quoted. See how it works?
You didn't show anything.
Don't worry yourself about that.
I'm fine.
Yes feedm3. You got me.
All this time, and I had no idea what repentance is.
I'm sure glad I came across your sound doctrine.
Are you going to be ok?
Why do you keep saying I'm mad?
I'm amused.
No, your position that you have a pure free will is idolatrous.
Your twisting of the clear meaning of Scripture is idolatrous.
The same way Ephesians is wrestled into separating Grace from faith as both gifts of God - This has to happen with the denial of all men having inherited Adam's spiritual condition. Its that B&W approach to "freewill".
OK. We'll see if you keep your vow. I'm good with that.
What corner?
My position is clear and has not changed.
OK. Bye then.
I've never once said we don't need to repent of sin. Not one time.
I'm not mad at all. Not in the slightest.
You're projecting.
It's something you may want to pay attention to - it crosses over into alot lot of things - like swinging a sin hammer all day long at others...focus on the Gospel at least as much as you focus on The Law.
And, full circle back to the "making excuses for your sin" default position.
Don't we all make excuses before we fail from time to time?
Bye then.
Notice with your poor use of the quote feature, I can only respond to what you have quoted. See how it works?
You didn't show anything.
Don't worry yourself about that.
I'm fine.
Yes feedm3. You got me.
All this time, and I had no idea what repentance is.
I'm sure glad I came across your sound doctrine.
Are you going to be ok?
Why do you keep saying I'm mad?
I'm amused.
No, your position that you have a pure free will is idolatrous.
Your twisting of the clear meaning of Scripture is idolatrous.
The same way Ephesians is wrestled into separating Grace from faith as both gifts of God - This has to happen with the denial of all men having inherited Adam's spiritual condition. Its that B&W approach to "freewill".
OK. We'll see if you keep your vow. I'm good with that.
What corner?
My position is clear and has not changed.
OK. Bye then.
I've never once said we don't need to repent of sin. Not one time.
I'm not mad at all. Not in the slightest.
You're projecting.
It's something you may want to pay attention to - it crosses over into alot lot of things - like swinging a sin hammer all day long at others...focus on the Gospel at least as much as you focus on The Law.
And, full circle back to the "making excuses for your sin" default position.
Don't we all make excuses before we fail from time to time?
Bye then.
F
From Now on Ed, this is all I am going to post in response to you, unless you say something that needs attention. But I am tired of answering all your questions, and mine being ignored. So "this corner"
Questions ED wont answer:
1. Was Adam and Eve created sinful?
2. Why did Adam and Eve sin?
3. Was their sin committed by freewill?
4. Why does a homosexual has to repent to go to heaven, do you?
5. What is repentance?
6. Do you repent of your sins?
7.. If a "true Christian does not continue in sin", Do you still continue in sin?
8. Does Hebrews 10:26 say "if we return to the law" or "if we sin willfully"?
9. If "we return to the law", then can you show where it says this? If "we sin willfully" then does that apply to all sin?
10. How can one "walk away from Jesus Christ" as you said, if he has no freewill?
Questions ED cant answer
guess I broke my "vow", lol your desperate for anything.
Questions ED wont answer:
1. Was Adam and Eve created sinful?
2. Why did Adam and Eve sin?
3. Was their sin committed by freewill?
4. Why does a homosexual has to repent to go to heaven, do you?
5. What is repentance?
6. Do you repent of your sins?
7.. If a "true Christian does not continue in sin", Do you still continue in sin?
8. Does Hebrews 10:26 say "if we return to the law" or "if we sin willfully"?
9. If "we return to the law", then can you show where it says this? If "we sin willfully" then does that apply to all sin?
10. How can one "walk away from Jesus Christ" as you said, if he has no freewill?
Questions ED cant answer
guess I broke my "vow", lol your desperate for anything.
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E
Oh feedm3.
Save your breath.
I answered all those questions.
You have some idolatrous notions about what the Bible says, and about your own condition. Just repent, that's covered by The Blood.
Your 'freewill' issue is your own conundrum, not mine. See, I've never said man doesn't have freewill. My position is that it is warped, in a spiritually corrupt condition, inclinded to SIN.
The New Birth changes that, we are now inclined to fight against sin. we are at war with it, whereas before, it was our CHOICE. always.
You contend men are born pure.
We disagree. One of us is wrong.
You can make it me if you feel better, okay?
Save your breath.
I answered all those questions.
You have some idolatrous notions about what the Bible says, and about your own condition. Just repent, that's covered by The Blood.
Your 'freewill' issue is your own conundrum, not mine. See, I've never said man doesn't have freewill. My position is that it is warped, in a spiritually corrupt condition, inclinded to SIN.
The New Birth changes that, we are now inclined to fight against sin. we are at war with it, whereas before, it was our CHOICE. always.
You contend men are born pure.
We disagree. One of us is wrong.
You can make it me if you feel better, okay?
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