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I hold a doctorate of divinity and WAS a diehard dispensationalist. Then the dcotors gave me a few weeks to live because my heart was enlarged enough to be near bursting. God miraculously healed me through the love and gifts operating in and through Nora Lam. Ultrasound evidenced that this was and could have only been a miracle. It was then I lost all passion for expounding the doctrines I had held with such unrelenting intensity. I preach Christ and Him crucified, I preach His love and I Corinthians 13. His love for us and our love for others, because of Him, outweighs all arguments of doctrines, I previously held so dear.
T
I presently have only 15% of heart function, so I've been there and done that. <smile> I'm a lecturer, author, sometime pastor, and though I am now 85, the Lord has never allowed me to lose the zeal for the ministry to which he called me over 35 years ago. Our ministries may differ, but so what? We both serve the same Master and just do what He says.
T
Both. Our history is recorded in solar years so to be generally understood, all conclusions had to eventually be expressed in solar years. Revelation was written under the Roman government in 95-105 A.D., so we used the calendar John knew in those calculations: the solar calender of 365.24 days. Daniel was raised under the complex 19-year cyclical Jewish calendar, with a year of 360 days. Babylon's calendar also had 360 days, so it is reasonable to conclude that calculations of Daniel's prophecies should be made using the calendars with which Daniel was familiar.
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P
You are right there is no 7 year great tribulation
It’s a 7 year agreement or covenant, and in the middle of the 7 years then shall be great tribulation
Which = 3 ½ years or 1260 days or 42 months or time, times, and half time.
Its 3 ½ years of Great tribulation not 7 years.
Jesus said
Matt24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand
21 For then shall be great tribulation,
Now go to Daniel and see what Jesus was talking about.
Daniel 9:27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
A week is seven years
In the middle of that 7 year covenant or agreement thats when the great tribulation will begin
Gen29:28And Jacob did so, and fulfilled her week: and he gave him Rachel his daughter to wife also.
29And Laban gave to Rachel his daughter Bilhah his handmaid to be her maid.
30And he went in also unto Rachel, and he loved also Rachel more than Leah, and served with him yet seven other years.
All this is conformed in the book of revelation, as it all talks about a 3 ½ time line or 1260 days or 42 months or time, times, and half time
It’s a 7 year agreement or covenant, and in the middle of the 7 years then shall be great tribulation
Which = 3 ½ years or 1260 days or 42 months or time, times, and half time.
Its 3 ½ years of Great tribulation not 7 years.
Jesus said
Matt24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand
21 For then shall be great tribulation,
Now go to Daniel and see what Jesus was talking about.
Daniel 9:27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
A week is seven years
In the middle of that 7 year covenant or agreement thats when the great tribulation will begin
Gen29:28And Jacob did so, and fulfilled her week: and he gave him Rachel his daughter to wife also.
29And Laban gave to Rachel his daughter Bilhah his handmaid to be her maid.
30And he went in also unto Rachel, and he loved also Rachel more than Leah, and served with him yet seven other years.
All this is conformed in the book of revelation, as it all talks about a 3 ½ time line or 1260 days or 42 months or time, times, and half time
T
I don't wish to be offensive and I'm not going to argue about it, but you have made assumptions that have now been proven wrong biblically and historically.
1. The 1290 days of Dan 12:11, fulfilled in 688AD by the construction of the Islamic Dome of the Rock.
2 The 42 months of Rev 11:2, fulfilled in 1967AD by the freeing of Jerusalem from Gentile control.
3. The 1260 Days of Rev 11:3, fulfilled in 1948AD by the Jewish people returning to their homeland.
4. The 1260 days of Rev 12:5, fulfilled in 1948AD by the establishment of the new nation of Israel.
5. The Time, Times and Half Time of Dan 7:25, fulfilled in 1948AD by the new nation of Israel.
6. The Time, Times and Half Time of Dan 12:7, fulfilled in 1967AD by the freeing of Jerusalem.
7. The Season and Time of Dan 7:12, fulfilled in 1948AD when Gentiles lost control of the Holy Land.
Seven prophecies fulfilled to the year. It is a statistical impossibility for the above seven prophecies to exactly fit Scripture and history to the year, as they do, unless those are the correct interpretations. And my, what doors of understanding those prophecies open for us. Looking back at the rest of the Bible, we now know that Gentile control of the Holy Land is over. We can also identify the Two Witnesses so we now know God has never forgotten the Jews. We further know that the Abomination of Desolation is not an antichrist in our future, but a building that’s been on Mount Moriah for over 1300 years.
Seven prophecies fulfilled to the year. It is a statistical impossibility for the above seven prophecies to exactly fit Scripture and history to the year, as they do, unless those are the correct interpretations. And my, what doors of understanding those prophecies open for us. Looking back at the rest of the Bible, we now know that Gentile control of the Holy Land is over. We can also identify the Two Witnesses so we now know God has never forgotten the Jews. We further know that the Abomination of Desolation is not an antichrist in our future, but a building that’s been on Mount Moriah for over 1300 years.
And because of those fulfilled prophecies, it appears that most of Revelation is not about events still in our future, but about things that have taken place in our era. These fulfillments of prophecy are real, whether we want to believe them or not, and they strongly impact our traditional ideas of what is yet to come. Prophecies thought to be about a future Seven-Year Tribulation were actually about something else entirely, events that have happened during the Christian era.
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T
The book of Rev was written for the 144,000, and among those 144,000 is not a single Gentile.
Its clearly spelled out. Rev 1:1 written so the servants of God will know what will shortly come to pass.
Rev 7, there are your servants. Last part of Rev 7, there is the church.
This isn't my opinion and I never came up with this. The Holy Spirit gave me this. And when I say
gave, I really mean shoved into my mind in a split second. I used to have trouble making all the pieces
fit. It seems very simple now. So simple in fact, I'm amazed that no one else sees it. This isn't
an opinion or belief that I feel strongly about. If you ever had the Holy Spirit act upon you like it
did me, you would know its right. People make it complicated, but its really simple. Your first post
about the trumpets, its just a way of trying to make it complicated.
Its clearly spelled out. Rev 1:1 written so the servants of God will know what will shortly come to pass.
Rev 7, there are your servants. Last part of Rev 7, there is the church.
This isn't my opinion and I never came up with this. The Holy Spirit gave me this. And when I say
gave, I really mean shoved into my mind in a split second. I used to have trouble making all the pieces
fit. It seems very simple now. So simple in fact, I'm amazed that no one else sees it. This isn't
an opinion or belief that I feel strongly about. If you ever had the Holy Spirit act upon you like it
did me, you would know its right. People make it complicated, but its really simple. Your first post
about the trumpets, its just a way of trying to make it complicated.
T
The book of Revelation was actually written for Jesus slaves, and Jesus slaves are the Gentilew church. God the Father says so in the very first verse . . .
Rev 1:1 "The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants (servants in Greek is doulos, definition slaves) things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John."
Rev 1:1 "The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants (servants in Greek is doulos, definition slaves) things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John."
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P
It’s not written to just for the 14000. But to him that hath an ear let him hear
And there is no Jew or Greek or Gentile in Christ Jesus.
No the Holy Spirit did not gave you this, remember the devil comes as an angel of light and his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness.
14And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
15Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.
If you are looking for the church after Rv3 or Rv7 look for where two or three are gathered together in his name and there is plenty of church
And there is no Jew or Greek or Gentile in Christ Jesus.
No the Holy Spirit did not gave you this, remember the devil comes as an angel of light and his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness.
14And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
15Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.
If you are looking for the church after Rv3 or Rv7 look for where two or three are gathered together in his name and there is plenty of church
P
Its not my view, there is no Jew or Greek or Gentile in Christ Jesus.
28There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus
20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.
And that be the church
..
28There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus
20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.
And that be the church
..
God does not give us a lot of the details about how He will work prophecy out, and men have always tried to fill in the blanks.
That is what the rabbi’s did with the prophecy of the Messiah. When it happened it was ignored because Christ did not fit what the rabbis said the prophecy meant.
We must learn the bible and discern what is clearly bible and what is from man’s ideas. Sometimes man even gets it wrong when they determine what a bible verse means.
That is what the rabbi’s did with the prophecy of the Messiah. When it happened it was ignored because Christ did not fit what the rabbis said the prophecy meant.
We must learn the bible and discern what is clearly bible and what is from man’s ideas. Sometimes man even gets it wrong when they determine what a bible verse means.
T
It sounds like this spirit you are listening to is going against the written Word of God. The true Holy Spirit will not go against His own written word and I trust His written word more than I do your spirit. I'll quote the verse again . . .
Rev 1:1 "The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John."
Jesus' servants are the believers in Him, the Gentile church.
Rev 1:1 "The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John."
Jesus' servants are the believers in Him, the Gentile church.
W
I see some truths in what everyone is saying. The 144000 are Jews, verified by Scripture. However, we are all God's children ,Jew & gentile after Christ now as Peter T pointed out. Red tent is right,man sometimes gets it wrong & we have to keep discerning.Always keep an open mind on unfulfilled prophecy, backed up by Scripture. I don't know how Therapon got to certain dates, numerology is beyond me.
However I do know that the 2 witnesses are not spiritual. The spiritual part of the 2 witnesses is the candlestick & olive trees as to what they represent. So I do believe the 144,000 are Messianic/Christian Jews, otherwise they couldn't be going to heaven.However the 2 witnesses are also men.
Therapon, if there is no trib or antichist then maybe you will say next, that none of Rev will happen. I think you should take your own advice & remain open. You might ask yourself, what is satan's purpose? Has anyone since 1967 gone into the temple claiming he was Jesus/Messiah & sacrified animals? Who has been the world leader since 1967 & what is our universal currency? Our currency is not based on gold.
However I do know that the 2 witnesses are not spiritual. The spiritual part of the 2 witnesses is the candlestick & olive trees as to what they represent. So I do believe the 144,000 are Messianic/Christian Jews, otherwise they couldn't be going to heaven.However the 2 witnesses are also men.
Therapon, if there is no trib or antichist then maybe you will say next, that none of Rev will happen. I think you should take your own advice & remain open. You might ask yourself, what is satan's purpose? Has anyone since 1967 gone into the temple claiming he was Jesus/Messiah & sacrified animals? Who has been the world leader since 1967 & what is our universal currency? Our currency is not based on gold.