Earth is Flat and Stationary
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All I said was, if The Bible was as specific as to provide a map of the universe, we would not be so open for deception.
Anyhow, what The Bible does say about the universe through scripture, is more in line with a flat earth than a globe earth. The immovable foundations, 4 corners of the earth, ends of earth, circle of the earth, stars crashing into the earth.
So my ideas are founded in The Bible. When I was an atheist I dismissed The Bible in part because the authors thought the earth was flat, when I realized it was flat, my rejection of The Bible for this reason was one of the first guilty thoughts I had.
Anyhow, what The Bible does say about the universe through scripture, is more in line with a flat earth than a globe earth. The immovable foundations, 4 corners of the earth, ends of earth, circle of the earth, stars crashing into the earth.
So my ideas are founded in The Bible. When I was an atheist I dismissed The Bible in part because the authors thought the earth was flat, when I realized it was flat, my rejection of The Bible for this reason was one of the first guilty thoughts I had.
No, your ideas are not founded in the Bible.
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4 corners - does not fit with your model too, flat earth is not a square
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immovable foundations - what does this mean in your model? You need some movement for gravity, so FE people came with idea that the FE is always accelerating somewhere? If you mean just the surface, any earthquake is a proof that something is moving under our feet.
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ends of earth - or ends of a (dry) land
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falling stars - its just a shift in language, what we call meteorites, they called falling stars. Their vocabulary is not inspired. Like if I say "my heart is breaking",it is not scientific description what is happening inside of me. Beware of such uses. It is just a subjective description of what one is seeing/feeling.
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circle of the earth - the same word is used there:
"he goes about in the vaulted heavens" (Job 22:14, NIV)
"sits above the circle of the earth" (Is 40:22, NIV)
"he marked out the horizon on the face of the deep" (Prov 8:27, NIV)
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Not so conclusive now, right?
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4 corners - does not fit with your model too, flat earth is not a square
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immovable foundations - what does this mean in your model? You need some movement for gravity, so FE people came with idea that the FE is always accelerating somewhere? If you mean just the surface, any earthquake is a proof that something is moving under our feet.
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ends of earth - or ends of a (dry) land
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falling stars - its just a shift in language, what we call meteorites, they called falling stars. Their vocabulary is not inspired. Like if I say "my heart is breaking",it is not scientific description what is happening inside of me. Beware of such uses. It is just a subjective description of what one is seeing/feeling.
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circle of the earth - the same word is used there:
"he goes about in the vaulted heavens" (Job 22:14, NIV)
"sits above the circle of the earth" (Is 40:22, NIV)
"he marked out the horizon on the face of the deep" (Prov 8:27, NIV)
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Not so conclusive now, right?
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pckts - I would like to address a personal issue with you. What happens to you if you realise
the world is a globe?
Observational bias causes massive problems if our view is not a view on a subject of interest
but our whole lives and outlook are founded upon it.
Now for me to accept your view, I would have to believe a conspiracy of vast complexity and
engenuity which does not exist in life, even in the most complex of projects, which normally
fail for that reason. Now it would not change my life, but I would need to investigate further
and understand the world around me better.
What I am saying is people are basically dumb and stumble into things. Small facts or events,
can be hidden, and everything bumble on, but a massive issue, that everyone knows and distorts,
not possible. Deception in terms of disbelief or reinterpretation, yes, all the time.
So you are saying I am a liar, evil and part of the conspiracy. And at this point I know you are
wrong. Why? Because I know what I am, I cannot lie to myself without knowing it. So here we
have the problem. You have a self invested bias, a belief the world is different than it is, and
a theory everyone is in on this conspiracy. Now this is what defines a delusion, a conspiracy
theory and fills the world of mental illness with unwell people who cannot cope.
So my friend I have serious concerns for you and your health, but wish you well, and hope you
make a good recovery. God bless.
the world is a globe?
Observational bias causes massive problems if our view is not a view on a subject of interest
but our whole lives and outlook are founded upon it.
Now for me to accept your view, I would have to believe a conspiracy of vast complexity and
engenuity which does not exist in life, even in the most complex of projects, which normally
fail for that reason. Now it would not change my life, but I would need to investigate further
and understand the world around me better.
What I am saying is people are basically dumb and stumble into things. Small facts or events,
can be hidden, and everything bumble on, but a massive issue, that everyone knows and distorts,
not possible. Deception in terms of disbelief or reinterpretation, yes, all the time.
So you are saying I am a liar, evil and part of the conspiracy. And at this point I know you are
wrong. Why? Because I know what I am, I cannot lie to myself without knowing it. So here we
have the problem. You have a self invested bias, a belief the world is different than it is, and
a theory everyone is in on this conspiracy. Now this is what defines a delusion, a conspiracy
theory and fills the world of mental illness with unwell people who cannot cope.
So my friend I have serious concerns for you and your health, but wish you well, and hope you
make a good recovery. God bless.
Exactly.
You were given photos from Russian satellite, live stream from the International Space Station but still you will repeat how NASA has this or that logo and how evil it is because of it.
Also, you have no proof of flat earth at all. You are just trying to respond to our proofs of a globe, but your isolated answers do not return any working whole.
You were given photos from Russian satellite, live stream from the International Space Station but still you will repeat how NASA has this or that logo and how evil it is because of it.
Also, you have no proof of flat earth at all. You are just trying to respond to our proofs of a globe, but your isolated answers do not return any working whole.
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Why do you trust pictures of astronauts (and want us to accept them too) but do not trust pictures from satellites?
Also, you did not respond to why also Russians and other nations are working as evil NASA wants them to work.
Also, can you explain to me, why young earth astronomers, who have no problem going against science and to teach that Universe is 6000 years old or that evolution did not happen are lying to us too, regarding the universe?
Also, you did not respond to why also Russians and other nations are working as evil NASA wants them to work.
Also, can you explain to me, why young earth astronomers, who have no problem going against science and to teach that Universe is 6000 years old or that evolution did not happen are lying to us too, regarding the universe?
Genesis 1:
[SUP][SUP]1 [/SUP][/SUP]In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
[SUP]15 [/SUP]And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth,
[SUP]18 [/SUP]And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.
Heliocentric / big bang model (atheist world view):
A huge explosion for no reason
After billions of years, all the gas separated itself to form stars
The rest all clumped together to form planets which orbit stars (even though they spin contrary to the laws of physics in this model)
Stars are balls of burning gas
All light comes from stars
Either you believe God's Word, or you think it's a metaphor and think the author was just ignorant and made the mistake of clearly writing that light and days came before the sun and stars.
The heliocentric model is not compatible with scripture.
[SUP][SUP]1 [/SUP][/SUP]In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
[SUP]15 [/SUP]And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth,
[SUP]18 [/SUP]And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.
Heliocentric / big bang model (atheist world view):
A huge explosion for no reason
After billions of years, all the gas separated itself to form stars
The rest all clumped together to form planets which orbit stars (even though they spin contrary to the laws of physics in this model)
Stars are balls of burning gas
All light comes from stars
Either you believe God's Word, or you think it's a metaphor and think the author was just ignorant and made the mistake of clearly writing that light and days came before the sun and stars.
The heliocentric model is not compatible with scripture.
Genesis 1:
[SUP][SUP]1 [/SUP][/SUP]In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
[SUP]15 [/SUP]And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth,
[SUP]18 [/SUP]And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.
Heliocentric / big bang model (atheist world view):
A huge explosion for no reason
After billions of years, all the gas separated itself to form stars
The rest all clumped together to form planets which orbit stars (even though they spin contrary to the laws of physics in this model)
Stars are balls of burning gas
All light comes from stars
Either you believe God's Word, or you think it's a metaphor and think the author was just ignorant and made the mistake of clearly writing that light and days came before the sun and stars.
The heliocentric model is not compatible with scripture.
[SUP][SUP]1 [/SUP][/SUP]In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
[SUP]15 [/SUP]And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth,
[SUP]18 [/SUP]And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.
Heliocentric / big bang model (atheist world view):
A huge explosion for no reason
After billions of years, all the gas separated itself to form stars
The rest all clumped together to form planets which orbit stars (even though they spin contrary to the laws of physics in this model)
Stars are balls of burning gas
All light comes from stars
Either you believe God's Word, or you think it's a metaphor and think the author was just ignorant and made the mistake of clearly writing that light and days came before the sun and stars.
The heliocentric model is not compatible with scripture.
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You believe the earth is older than 6000 years?
Funny how historical evidence stops at ~6000 years isn't it, how the oldest civilizations are dated in that period. The liars try to add things like statues, Easter island, stonehenge, or even ice ages because they add tens of thousands of years too. The funniest one is trying to explain why the sphinx is water-eroded, they claim that it's so old because the planet shifted and it used to be a rain forest but now it's a desert, when actually 40 days of rain and a year in the great flood would have done it.
Who do you think is in control of Earth? Who influences Hollywood? Who controls the media? Who runs the governments? Who authorizes text books?
Maybe the confusion comes from you believing that Satan isn't trying to send people to hell or lying to people.
Funny how historical evidence stops at ~6000 years isn't it, how the oldest civilizations are dated in that period. The liars try to add things like statues, Easter island, stonehenge, or even ice ages because they add tens of thousands of years too. The funniest one is trying to explain why the sphinx is water-eroded, they claim that it's so old because the planet shifted and it used to be a rain forest but now it's a desert, when actually 40 days of rain and a year in the great flood would have done it.
Who do you think is in control of Earth? Who influences Hollywood? Who controls the media? Who runs the governments? Who authorizes text books?
Maybe the confusion comes from you believing that Satan isn't trying to send people to hell or lying to people.
No, you're clearly delusional.
God's own scripture states that:
1) The earth existed before the sun or stars.
2) Light existed before the sun or stars.
3) Time and days existed before the sun or stars.
The heliocentric / Big Bang model is not compatible with scripture.
Here is some bonus scripture
The earth does not move
Psalm 93:1
The Lord reigneth, he is clothed with majesty; the Lord is clothed with strength, wherewith he hath girded himself: the world also is stablished, that it cannot be moved.
The earth has foundations
Proverbs 8:29
When he gave to the sea his decree, that the waters should not pass his commandment: when he appointed the foundations of the earth:
The sun does not act according to the behavior of stars according to scientists:
Matthew 24:29
Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken
Time will cease to exist:
Revelation 10:6
And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:
The heliocentric / Big Bang model is not compatible with scripture.
Do you even believe in heaven? Are you expecting to go in to space? Which planet will you live on?
God's own scripture states that:
1) The earth existed before the sun or stars.
2) Light existed before the sun or stars.
3) Time and days existed before the sun or stars.
The heliocentric / Big Bang model is not compatible with scripture.
Here is some bonus scripture
The earth does not move
Psalm 93:1
The Lord reigneth, he is clothed with majesty; the Lord is clothed with strength, wherewith he hath girded himself: the world also is stablished, that it cannot be moved.
The earth has foundations
Proverbs 8:29
When he gave to the sea his decree, that the waters should not pass his commandment: when he appointed the foundations of the earth:
The sun does not act according to the behavior of stars according to scientists:
Matthew 24:29
Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken
Time will cease to exist:
Revelation 10:6
And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:
The heliocentric / Big Bang model is not compatible with scripture.
Do you even believe in heaven? Are you expecting to go in to space? Which planet will you live on?
You believe the earth is older than 6000 years?
Funny how historical evidence stops at ~6000 years isn't it, how the oldest civilizations are dated in that period. The liars try to add things like statues, Easter island, stonehenge, or even ice ages because they add tens of thousands of years too. The funniest one is trying to explain why the sphinx is water-eroded, they claim that it's so old because the planet shifted and it used to be a rain forest but now it's a desert, when actually 40 days of rain and a year in the great flood would have done it.
Who do you think is in control of Earth? Who influences Hollywood? Who controls the media? Who runs the governments? Who authorizes text books?
Maybe the confusion comes from you believing that Satan isn't trying to send people to hell or lying to people.
Funny how historical evidence stops at ~6000 years isn't it, how the oldest civilizations are dated in that period. The liars try to add things like statues, Easter island, stonehenge, or even ice ages because they add tens of thousands of years too. The funniest one is trying to explain why the sphinx is water-eroded, they claim that it's so old because the planet shifted and it used to be a rain forest but now it's a desert, when actually 40 days of rain and a year in the great flood would have done it.
Who do you think is in control of Earth? Who influences Hollywood? Who controls the media? Who runs the governments? Who authorizes text books?
Maybe the confusion comes from you believing that Satan isn't trying to send people to hell or lying to people.
Also, you did not respond to why also Russians and other nations are working as evil NASA wants them to work.
Satan is authorizing text books? How exactly does this work?
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It means the earth doesn't move and sits on pillars. The only one's that need gravity are globe earthers.
So you throw and or in and that means your interpretation is valid?
It's just a "shift in language", and that is for you to determine? The shift occurred along with the globe earth. ors and shifts in language to fit a false model.
No, circle is a circle.
I'm still conclusive it's flat,you change the verse to fit your belief rather than interpret and believe the verse.
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When happens to you if you realize it's flat? I already stated in my big post, I already believed what you believe and every piece of that puzzle is an clear and obvious lie to me, there is no going back.
It exists, and thank you for describing honestly what would happen if you discovered it.
What I am saying is people are basically dumb and stumble into things. Small facts or events,
can be hidden, and everything bumble on, but a massive issue, that everyone knows and distorts,
not possible. Deception in terms of disbelief or reinterpretation, yes, all the time.
It's possible, you have not discovered it yet, because you do not think it is possible.
I'm not saying you are a intentional malicious evil liar, I always say you are deceived by the intentional malicious evil liars.
You know what you are and you cannot lie to yourself without knowing it? You are a man, and we are all capable of liying to ourselves without knowing it, sorry but you have to humble yourself and accept this.
I wish you well and hope you will come around to the truth someday, you seem to have potential, just have to slowly work you up with small conspiracies until you realize bigger ones are possible and in place.
It exists, and thank you for describing honestly what would happen if you discovered it.
What I am saying is people are basically dumb and stumble into things. Small facts or events,
can be hidden, and everything bumble on, but a massive issue, that everyone knows and distorts,
not possible. Deception in terms of disbelief or reinterpretation, yes, all the time.
It's possible, you have not discovered it yet, because you do not think it is possible.
I'm not saying you are a intentional malicious evil liar, I always say you are deceived by the intentional malicious evil liars.
You know what you are and you cannot lie to yourself without knowing it? You are a man, and we are all capable of liying to ourselves without knowing it, sorry but you have to humble yourself and accept this.
I wish you well and hope you will come around to the truth someday, you seem to have potential, just have to slowly work you up with small conspiracies until you realize bigger ones are possible and in place.
Yeah, nice... when you draw a square around your flat earth, you will get 4 corners. What a genius idea.
Sure. Literal pillars. And God has His literal legs on our literal firmanent.
Good work with the Bible.
Possible translations are possible translations. That you put word "earth" meaning the whole planet somewhere where it is much probably land or continent, is not proof of anything.
Thats why "or" means my interpretation is valid, yes.
Languages change. And are also descriptive. When I say my heart is breaking or that moon will not give his light or that I saw a star falling, it is a descriptive languages - what a person can see or feel.
It is not a technical language - what is scientifically happening.
I have proved to you that it is not translated as circle always. Thats why your whole life depends on one specific translation choice. Which is never a good idea.
Have you ever learned another languge than English? If you did, you should know how any translation works. Its a translator who decides which meaning from many he will use.
Every reader and even more every translator puts his ideas, style of thinking and personality into the text he reads or translates.
Sure. Literal pillars. And God has His literal legs on our literal firmanent.
Good work with the Bible.
Possible translations are possible translations. That you put word "earth" meaning the whole planet somewhere where it is much probably land or continent, is not proof of anything.
Thats why "or" means my interpretation is valid, yes.
Languages change. And are also descriptive. When I say my heart is breaking or that moon will not give his light or that I saw a star falling, it is a descriptive languages - what a person can see or feel.
It is not a technical language - what is scientifically happening.
I have proved to you that it is not translated as circle always. Thats why your whole life depends on one specific translation choice. Which is never a good idea.
Have you ever learned another languge than English? If you did, you should know how any translation works. Its a translator who decides which meaning from many he will use.
Every reader and even more every translator puts his ideas, style of thinking and personality into the text he reads or translates.
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You have little faith in God or the Holy Spirit to provide The Word. That is the basis of your globe arguments for scripture.
Tell me all day you do not believe the verses are literal and your reasoning, I will still believe they are literal, because I'm not trying to make them fit the globe or anything else, I make my cosmological beliefs fit the scripture.
Tell me all day you do not believe the verses are literal and your reasoning, I will still believe they are literal, because I'm not trying to make them fit the globe or anything else, I make my cosmological beliefs fit the scripture.