Fallacies of the Present Day Church

Skinski7 · Nov 22, 2012

What you quoted does not change the meaning. Jesus suffered in the flesh and did not yield to the lusts of men (1Pet 4:1) and we are to put on the same mind and do the same.

Whether we "cease from sin" or are "done with sin" it is exactly the same meaning. Sin is in the PAST (it has ceased, it is done with) for a true born again Christian. A Christian has ESCAPE the corruption that is in the world through lust. If they are still in bondage to yielding to lust and sinning then they are, be definition, NOT SAVED.

You are explaining it away to support your contention that the sin does not cease in a Christian. ie In your view a Christian still yields to the passions and desires of the flesh and disobeys God.

No they don't! Christian's stop sinning because they have crucified the lusts which draw a sinner into sinning. Those who yield to those sins have not crucified those lusts.

It is very simple.

Skinski7 · Nov 22, 2012

Abiding said:

One single act of rebellion towards God will spiritually kill you.

Is that clear enough? I have alluded to that fact all through my writings.

You simply cannot be reconciled to God whilst still in rebellion. You cannot remain reconciled to God if you spit in His face and rebel again.

If a sinner forsakes their rebellion and yields to God, if they are then cleansed of all their past transgression by the blood, so that they are then clean and pure before God, and they then go and rebel again they are instantly condemned.

It took one sin for Adam and Eve and it takes one sin for anyone else.

Rebellion is deadly and it is even deadlier if you have been reconciled because you have then trodden the blood with which you were sanctified and treated it common like that of an animal. Peter taught the second state of corruption is worse than the first state of corruption. A sinner who has never come to a knowledge of the truth is in a much better situation than that of an individual who came to a knowledge of the truth and turned from it and went back to wallowing in the mire.

The early church understood this and this is why willful sin after salvation was such a serious thing. Willful sin after salvation is dangerous beyond belief because it is being done from a state of full understanding.

Most who profess Jesus Christ today have not done this because they never truly repented in the first place. Thus this concept if completely alien to that of the average professing Christian. The Bible has very strong warnings about this sort of sin which should strike the fear of God into people.

I don't say there is no hope for someone who does such a thing but I will not tell them repentance is guaranteed. They need to get on their face before God and find that godly sorrow that will purge that rebellion out of their soul that they may repent.

Hebrews 12 uses Esau as an example of being unable to find repentance. He sold his birthright and while he could not repent and get it back (in the natural) the lesson has a much more serious spiritual connotation regarding true repentance.

Few today understand these things because few understand genuine repentance. I recommend you did deep into the Scriptures and do a study on repentance and what it actually means.

Abiding · Nov 22, 2012

Skinski7 said:

One single act of rebellion towards God will spiritually kill you.

Is that clear enough? I have alluded to that fact all through my writings.

You simply cannot be reconciled to God whilst still in rebellion. You cannot remain reconciled to God if you spit in His face and rebel again.

If a sinner forsakes their rebellion and yields to God, if they are then cleansed of all their past transgression by the blood, so that they are then clean and pure before God, and they then go and rebel again they are instantly condemned.

It took one sin for Adam and Eve and it takes one sin for anyone else.

Rebellion is deadly and it is even deadlier if you have been reconciled because you have then trodden the blood with which you were sanctified and treated it common like that of an animal. Peter taught the second state of corruption is worse than the first state of corruption. A sinner who has never come to a knowledge of the truth is in a much better situation than that of an individual who came to a knowledge of the truth and turned from it and went back to wallowing in the mire.

The early church understood this and this is why willful sin after salvation was such a serious thing. Willful sin after salvation is dangerous beyond belief because it is being done from a state of full understanding.

Most who profess Jesus Christ today have not done this because they never truly repented in the first place. Thus this concept if completely alien to that of the average professing Christian. The Bible has very strong warnings about this sort of sin which should strike the fear of God into people.

I don't say there is no hope for someone who does such a thing but I will not tell them repentance is guaranteed. They need to get on their face before God and find that godly sorrow that will purge that rebellion out of their soul that they may repent.

Hebrews 12 uses Esau as an example of being unable to find repentance. He sold his birthright and while he could not repent and get it back (in the natural) the lesson has a much more serious spiritual connotation regarding true repentance.

Few today understand these things because few understand genuine repentance. I recommend you did deep into the Scriptures and do a study on repentance and what it actually means.[/QUOTE
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If someone didnt repent in the first place then they were never converted...So of coarse there in deep weeds
they still have the wrath of God on them.

You didnt answer the Galations question because it was about a Christian who had fallen in sin
which threw down your declaration. Making your teaching a false teaching.

Now you play the go study the bible ploy. Nice skinski.

You claim you cant say whether or not a sinning Christian has hope if he were to
repent...wow. Thats just amazing. I see you dont understand the Esau context at all.
And Galatians 6:1 was a command to restore the believer which again you avoided
because that proves he can be restored or it wouldnt have been written and commanded.

.....

Abiding · Nov 22, 2012

Your either for Him or against Him
Gathering or scattering.

And your not sure. Hmmm

Skinski7 · Nov 22, 2012

Abiding said:

No that is not what I said at all. Please read my words more carefully.

I said that a Christian who willfully rebels and trods underfoot the blood of Jesus Christ by which they were sanctified is not guaranteed to be able to find repentance.

If they do repent then they can be reconciled, if they do not repent then they will not be reconciled.

Heb 12:15 Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled;
Heb 12:16 Lest there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright.
Heb 12:17 For ye know how that afterward, when he would have inherited the blessing, he was rejected: for he found no place of repentance, though he sought it carefully with tears.

Willful sin AFTER salvation has a defiling effect on the soul much worse than willful sin before salvation for it is done from a state of full knowledge.

Hence Paul taught...

2Pe 2:20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
2Pe 2:21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.
2Pe 2:22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

Hebrews 6 warns of an "impossibility" in the context of "falling away."

Heb 6:4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
Heb 6:5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
Heb 6:6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

Red33 · Nov 22, 2012

Skinski7 said:

One single act of rebellion towards God will spiritually kill you.

Is that clear enough? I have alluded to that fact all through my writings.

You simply cannot be reconciled to God whilst still in rebellion. You cannot remain reconciled to God if you spit in His face and rebel again.

If a sinner forsakes their rebellion and yields to God, if they are then cleansed of all their past transgression by the blood, so that they are then clean and pure before God, and they then go and rebel again they are instantly condemned.

It took one sin for Adam and Eve and it takes one sin for anyone else.

Rebellion is deadly and it is even deadlier if you have been reconciled because you have then trodden the blood with which you were sanctified and treated it common like that of an animal. Peter taught the second state of corruption is worse than the first state of corruption. A sinner who has never come to a knowledge of the truth is in a much better situation than that of an individual who came to a knowledge of the truth and turned from it and went back to wallowing in the mire.

The early church understood this and this is why willful sin after salvation was such a serious thing. Willful sin after salvation is dangerous beyond belief because it is being done from a state of full understanding.

Most who profess Jesus Christ today have not done this because they never truly repented in the first place. Thus this concept if completely alien to that of the average professing Christian. The Bible has very strong warnings about this sort of sin which should strike the fear of God into people.

I don't say there is no hope for someone who does such a thing but I will not tell them repentance is guaranteed. They need to get on their face before God and find that godly sorrow that will purge that rebellion out of their soul that they may repent.

Hebrews 12 uses Esau as an example of being unable to find repentance. He sold his birthright and while he could not repent and get it back (in the natural) the lesson has a much more serious spiritual connotation regarding true repentance.

Few today understand these things because few understand genuine repentance. I recommend you did deep into the Scriptures and do a study on repentance and what it actually means.

You have never even studied rebellion, perhaps a few verses here and there but the doctrine of rebellion presented in the whole counsel of God you simply are adrift. Go away and put a bridle over your mouth before your tongue gets condemned.

Skinski7 · Nov 22, 2012

Also Gal 6:1 is not necessarily in the context of willful sin.

Gal 6:1 Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness; considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted.

Fault- G3900
paraptōma
par-ap'-to-mah
From G3895; a side slip (lapse or deviation), that is, (unintentional) error or (wilful) transgression: - fall, fault, offence, sin, trespass.

I would say that Peter when he withdrew from the Gentiles in fear of the Jews would be in the context of Gal 6:1. Paul rebuked Peter and Peter obviously repented of his sin.

Yet Peter was not out fornicating or committing adultery. He was not doing what Heb 10:26 is speaking about, he had been drawn into error through his fear of men. Paul brought him back into the truth and thus onto the correct path. Peter was indeed on dangerous ground but not in the same context of Heb 10:26-29 or 2Pet 2:20-22. That is my understanding.

It is pure foolishness to use scriptures like Gal 6:1 and imply that Heb 10:26-29 or 2Pet 2:20-22 do not mean what they plainly state. Also anyone who has indeed been through a true repentance and has escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust and has gone from darkness to light by the power of God knows full well they cannot go out and willfully sin and then just say sorry and all is ok. No way. We know that to do such a thing is deadly for it is rooted in iniquity which would be deep within the soul.

BarlyGurl · Nov 22, 2012

Skinski7 said:

One single act of rebellion towards God will spiritually kill you.

Is that clear enough? I have alluded to that fact all through my writings.

You simply cannot be reconciled to God whilst still in rebellion. You cannot remain reconciled to God if you spit in His face and rebel again.

If a sinner forsakes their rebellion and yields to God, if they are then cleansed of all their past transgression by the blood, so that they are then clean and pure before God, and they then go and rebel again they are instantly condemned.

It took one sin for Adam and Eve and it takes one sin for anyone else.

Rebellion is deadly and it is even deadlier if you have been reconciled because you have then trodden the blood with which you were sanctified and treated it common like that of an animal. Peter taught the second state of corruption is worse than the first state of corruption. A sinner who has never come to a knowledge of the truth is in a much better situation than that of an individual who came to a knowledge of the truth and turned from it and went back to wallowing in the mire.

The early church understood this and this is why willful sin after salvation was such a serious thing. Willful sin after salvation is dangerous beyond belief because it is being done from a state of full understanding.

Most who profess Jesus Christ today have not done this because they never truly repented in the first place. Thus this concept if completely alien to that of the average professing Christian. The Bible has very strong warnings about this sort of sin which should strike the fear of God into people.

I don't say there is no hope for someone who does such a thing but I will not tell them repentance is guaranteed. They need to get on their face before God and find that godly sorrow that will purge that rebellion out of their soul that they may repent.

Hebrews 12 uses Esau as an example of being unable to find repentance. He sold his birthright and while he could not repent and get it back (in the natural) the lesson has a much more serious spiritual connotation regarding true repentance.

Few today understand these things because few understand genuine repentance. I recommend you did deep into the Scriptures and do a study on repentance and what it actually means.

Skinski... I think you are failing to consider that people have a an array of different reasoning/intellectual powers, varying from Autistic to brainiac and biological age can have marginal influence. YOU are making broad sweeping statements about sin and rebellion which seem to entirely exclude the tender compassion of God and his gentle mercy toward His children... who despite their sequential age... can have the reasoning power of a very young child.

psychomom · Nov 22, 2012

It does sound simple, the way you say it.
But when I think of "sin", I think of falling short, in deed, in word, in thought.

If I drop a gallon of apple juice on my freshly washed kitchen floor (an example I chose because I have done it)
what happens if my first thought isn't charitable? (and it wasn't)
Does the Lord then reject me, for thinking something I would never say...but definitely thought?

I wonder if the reason it sounds simple when you say it is because we have different definitions of that it is to fall short?
Either that or you are a much, much better person than I. (sad...for me)
I can train myself to do and to say what is honoring to the Lord (and even then, not all the time)...but what about my thoughts?
Can I not belong to Jesus until I have complete mastery over them?
And if I can't, how shall I ever have mastery over them?

It's a very bleak prospect, this idea of not having the Holy Spirit within to empower me to walk in His ways.
-ellie

psychomom · Nov 22, 2012

psychomom said:

beeteedubs...I should never say never.
I never should have said that.

Abiding · Nov 22, 2012

Skinski7 said:

Also Gal 6:1 is not necessarily in the context of willful sin.

Gal 6:1 Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness; considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted.

Fault- G3900
paraptōma
par-ap'-to-mah
From G3895; a side slip (lapse or deviation), that is, (unintentional) error or (wilful) transgression: - fall, fault, offence, sin, trespass.

I would say that Peter when he withdrew from the Gentiles in fear of the Jews would be in the context of Gal 6:1. Paul rebuked Peter and Peter obviously repented of his sin.

Yet Peter was not out fornicating or committing adultery. He was not doing what Heb 10:26 is speaking about, he had been drawn into error through his fear of men. Paul brought him back into the truth and thus onto the correct path. Peter was indeed on dangerous ground but not in the same context of Heb 10:26-29 or 2Pet 2:20-22. That is my understanding.

It is pure foolishness to use scriptures like Gal 6:1 and imply that Heb 10:26-29 or 2Pet 2:20-22 do not mean what they plainly state. Also anyone who has indeed been through a true repentance and has escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust and has gone from darkness to light by the power of God knows full well they cannot go out and willfully sin and then just say sorry and all is ok. No way. We know that to do such a thing is deadly for it is rooted in iniquity which would be deep within the soul.

Ok then im sure someone who IS spiritual will restore the overtaken brother
surely not you.....youd sit there all day wondering about all the clauses that are not in that context
and all your other misunderstood verses and leave him in the ditch and cross the road...i see.

Red33 · Nov 22, 2012

Red33 said:

..before your tongue gets you in more trouble than you can handle or find a way of escape.

BarlyGurl · Nov 22, 2012

Red33 said:

lol... he started a new thread!

Skinski7 · Nov 22, 2012

psychomom said:

This is why it is so important to understand what sin actually is.

While the Greek definition literally means "missing the mark" and indeed we all miss the mark. The sin that leads to death is willful rebellion to God NOT temptation.

Carefully read how James describes the sin that leads to death.

Jas 1:14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
Jas 1:15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

Temptation wrought by the lusts of the flesh is yielded to willfully in the mind and it is this combining of the will with the temptation which gives birth to sin which in turn brings forth death.

Look at what happened to Eve in the garden for it is the same description.

Gen 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.

Eve was overcome by her temptation, she was drawn away by her lusts and she thus chose to sin. It was the act of YIELDING to sin which wrought spiritual death.

Look at what God said to Cain...

Gen 4:6 And the LORD said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen?
Gen 4:7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.

God was telling Cain that sin lay at the door but that he should rule over it. The initial anger Cain had was temptation, God does not charge it as sin here. For sure anger can be sin but in this case God said that sin "lies at the door."

Cain needed to do this...

1Co 10:13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

Temptation is common to man but when tempted we have to take the way of escape. This is the "denying ourselves" and "picking up our cross" and "following Jesus." We deny the lusts of the flesh.

So you drop some water in the kitchen and have an uncharitable thought? Is that a sin unto death? Not necessarily, what do you do with that uncharitable thought? You crucify it and yield to the Spirit. This is the Christian walk.

Those that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the passions and desires. So if we truly live in the Spirit we must walk (what we do) in it.

Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
Gal 5:25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.

Jesus was tempted in ALL POINTS as we are.

Heb_4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

Jesus was our example and through abiding with Him we are to walk as He walked which is after the Spirit.

Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

psychomom said:

Again temptation is common to man. Also another aspect is that a life of sin "hard-wires" us to sin. We were discussing this at fellowship last Sunday actually. This is why the scriptures teaches that we are to "renew our minds" and the Bible also teaches that God "quickens our mortal bodies."

When we forsake our "rebellion" in repentance we are then in a state whereby we can yield to God and walk after the Spirit. This is a time of growing in the grace and knowledge of Jesus Christ. It does not mean we are perfect but we are not rebels anymore. Thus the known sins of the flesh have ceased but we may still be doing things wrong we do not realise and have ungodly impulses. This is why Peter taught we are to "add to our faith."
2Pe 1:3 According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
2Pe 1:4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
2Pe 1:5 And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;
2Pe 1:6 And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;
2Pe 1:7 And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.
2Pe 1:8 For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
2Pe 1:9 But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.
2Pe 1:10 Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:
2Pe 1:11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Notice in the above passage we first "escape the corruption that is in the world through lust," this is a reference to repentance where the flesh is crucified with the passions and desires. This is where the outright rebellion to God ceases, we no longer walk our own way but turn and submit willingly to God.

It is when we are in this state of submission that we can then become partakers of the divine nature. This does not happen instantly and this is why Peter teaches that we are to add to our faith. This is the "work of faith" referred to in 1Th 1:3 and this "work of faith" is the context of faith in Eph 2:8-9.

The grace of God which brings salvation teaches us...

Tit 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
Tit 2:12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;

We, having forsaken our rebellion in repentance, then yield and apply what we learn to our lives by faith hence...

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

Thus Peter was describing this "through faith" when he spoke of "adding to our faith to make our calling and election sure so we may be granted abundant entrance into the kingdom."

This process after the rebellion has ceased it the "perfecting of the saints."

Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
Eph 4:14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
Eph 4:15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:

So while you may have a spontaneous impure thought upon dropping the water it is not necessarily an act of rebellion. There are "faults" that we confess one to another, also we we sin (unwittingly) we have an advocate (1Joh 2:1).

There are different sorts of sin. There is sin unto death and sin not unto death. There is willful sin and non-willful sin. Willful sin involved yielding knowingly and committing wrong doing hence sin is transgression (1Joh 3:4) and violating one's conscience (Jam 4:17). Those who sin in that way are of the devil. Christian's do not commit that sort of sin EVER. If they do they need to repent and do their first works to remove that seed of iniquity that lies within the soul.
[/quote]

The Holy Spirit is given to all those who obey God. If you are not in rebellion and are yielding to God by a faith that works by love then have confidence that God will complete the work he has started in you.

My warnings are for those in willful rebellion who have never repented. I also refute those who preach the false Gospel which teaches that the rebellion does not cease.

Abiding · Nov 22, 2012

The New International Skinski version
! Peter 3:18 For Christ died for sins once for allmost all, the righteous for the (-(un)righteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body but made alive by the Spirit,

Skinski7 · Nov 22, 2012

Was Eve sinning when she was looking at the fruit thinking, "ooohhh yeah, that looks good, I would like to be wise."

No. That was the temptation. She sinned when she decided in her mind to yield to that temptation and do it. Thus the actual transgression would have occurred in the mind before she actually ate it because her heart was already set on rebellion.

This is why Jesus would say that one only has to look at a women with lust to commit adultery. The outward action is a manifestation of inward iniquity (another reason that the works of the law cannot justify).

When a man sees a beautiful women and is tempted by his natural passions it is not sin. If that man is a Christian he must put that desire to death in His mind and bring his thoughts into subjection of the Spirit. If he does not do so and starts to roll with lustful thoughts he has sinned.

It is for this reason that the way to life is say narrow. Very few people will submit themselves to the Spirit and deny their flesh. Most who profess Christianity will yield in some way to their passions in the full knowledge it is wrong. The motivation to stop this kind of activity is found in the brokenness of repentance.

2Co 7:10 For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.
2Co 7:11 For behold this selfsame thing, that ye sorrowed after a godly sort, what carefulness it wrought in you, yea, what clearing of yourselves, yea, what indignation, yea, what fear, yea, what vehement desire, yea, what zeal, yea, what revenge! In all things ye have approved yourselves to be clear in this matter.

Thus when we totally submit to Jesus Christ we are then empowered by God to walk in Spirit. It is not of ourselves but a work of God but it does involve us freely choosing to yield instead of rebelling.

Red33 · Nov 22, 2012

Jm 4:17 is addressing the sin of omission that every believer had been guilty of at some time in their walk with God. It is part of growing and being crucified so that we take on the new man and put on Christ and learn to put off the old man. Don't try to condemn the believer with a form of rebellion when you are as guilty (if not more) in not doing the things that you should as well as not knowing the things you ought to know.

Eve was not drawn away with her own lust because she had no lust within to be drawn away with. She was supernaturally deceived by the serpent through words. The mistake she made before taking any fruit from that tree was to give audience to the words of the serpent. This is what corrupted her and made her perceive the fruit to be something that would make her wise. The mistake that we make as believers is doing the same when we listen to a stranger's voice, who have never come in through the door and have found some other way, like many on this site that parade their error like an ice cream man who drives around various neighborhoods piping his music to draw bystanders and allure them with his sweet goodies and tasty morsels and when the bystander takes a bite, they sell out their birthright and latch onto the ice cream man's deception of goodies and later learn that there is no place of repentance for them because they listened to a stranger's voice and got sucked into poneros evil.

Mediate · Nov 23, 2012

Eve was drawn away out of the deception of the serpent, there's nothing supernatural about it.

'Hey, I know God told you that you would die if you eat this, but seriously, you won't'

It is the creation of a duality in her mind. 'But wait, God told me I will, yet now I'm being told I won't, I want to try it and see who is right'.

It's a form of testing God. And a form of disobeying God.

It's the seed that's sewn in every person's mind at some point in life; 'Maybe there's more to life than God'.

Mediate · Nov 23, 2012

And when we go through every angle and 'try out' things, and sin, and do things we shouldn't, and explore, that's when it all comes back round (at least for me), 'well actually, God was pretty right, and I'm dumb for thinking any different'.

Mediate · Nov 23, 2012

Sin was always part of the plan. If it wasn't, the tester never would have been in the garden. It takes us to see what we had when it's gone.

Fallacies of the Present Day Church

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