Genesis 2:23 -pa`am (Strongs H6471)

Bookends · Jul 22, 2013

#6471 פַּעַם pa`am {pah'-am} or (fem.) פַּעַמָה pa`amah {pah-am-aw'} from H6470; TWOT - 1793a; n f
[h=4]—Hebrew Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)[/h]
1) stroke, beat, foot, step, anvil, occurrence 1a) foot, hoof-beat, footfall, footstep 1b) anvil 1c) occurrence, time, stroke, beat 1c1) one time, once, twice, thrice, as time on time, at this repetition, this once, now at length, now...now, at one time...at another
[h=3]Genesis 2:23[/h]Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)

[SUP]23 [/SUP]And the man said:

This one, at last, is bone of my bone
and flesh of my flesh;
this one will be called “woman,”
for she was taken from man.

Literal Translation= "At Last"
Youngs Literal Translation = "This is the proper step"
ESV = "This at Last"
Common English Bible = "This one Finally is"
ISV = "At Last"
Complete Jewish Translation = "At Last!"
Knox Bible = "Here, at Last"...

Now why would Adam say this if Eve was made within a 24 hour period of Adam? This word/phrase could imply that considerable time went by. Adam became lonely, after naming all the animals and see their pairs, male and female. I know most you won't even consider this Earth is older then 6-10 thousand years old because this is what you always been taught, and to seriously investigate this matter would cause ripples in your doctrines, Christian friends and denominations...Too bad...I'm glad I'm not bound to common and popular consensus and having the liberty to explore and seek truth...

.

Bookends · Jul 22, 2013

Be challenged!!!!!

[video=youtube;GaiAomEVpKY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GaiAomEVpKY[/video]

RachelBibleStudent · Jul 23, 2013

probably adam said 'at last' because he had gone through literally thousands of animals...naming them and searching for a helper...

a few thousand 'interviews' later...he -finally- found the woman for the job...

oldhermit · Jul 23, 2013

RachelBibleStudent said:

That is precisely the point.
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Man was in need of a helper that was compatible and suitable to man. [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]The presentation and naming of the animals was “to see what he would call them.” After the animals were named (presumably according to species), there is the realization in Adam that there was none among them suited to satisfy man's physiological, or psychological, or emotional needs. This is about more than Adam simply assigning names to the animals. In his naming of the animals, Adam calls none of them helper. This was not information that God needed to know. God already knew this to be true. This exercise was so that Adam would know and understand that none of these were for him. None of them would be allowed to fulfill man's need for a mate. Adam finds [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]no compatibility between any of them and himself. [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif] Woman was then formed and brought to Adam and he immediately assigns to her both name and relationship. She is woman because she is taken out of man. She is wife because she is one flesh with him. She s[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]atisfied all of the compatibility issues - physiologically, or psychologically, and emotionally. Unlike anything from among the animals, she is[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif] suitable as a helper for man.[/FONT]

HeRoseFromTheDead · Jul 23, 2013

I think at last is a selective interpretation. The word can also mean at one time, or once.

And the man said: This one was at one time bone of my bone...

Makes far more sense...

Bookends · Jul 23, 2013

RachelBibleStudent said:

I'd like to see you go through thousands of animals in a 12 hours or to be gracious to you, 24 hours (it's possible he didn't get sleepy

)

Bookends · Jul 23, 2013

oldhermit said:

That is precisely the point.
Man was in need of a helper that was compatible and suitable to man. The presentation and naming of the animals was “to see what he would call them.” After the animals were named (presumably according to species), there is the realization in Adam that there was none among them suited to satisfy man's physiological, or psychological, or emotional needs. This is about more than Adam simply assigning names to the animals. In his naming of the animals, Adam calls none of them helper. This was not information that God needed to know. God already knew this to be true. This exercise was so that Adam would know and understand that none of these were for him. None of them would be allowed to fulfill man's need for a mate. Adam finds no compatibility between any of them and himself. Woman was then formed and brought to Adam and he immediately assigns to her both name and relationship. She is woman because she is taken out of man. She is wife because she is one flesh with him. She satisfied all of the compatibility issues - physiologically, or psychologically, and emotionally. Unlike anything from among the animals, she is suitable as a helper for man.

And you are assuming that Adam did all this, and got lonely within a 24 hour day. Ok...Thanks for making your point seem illogical and not rational. I'm not trying to deny the supernatural, I believe in it, but God also gave us reality.

oldhermit · Jul 23, 2013

Bookends said:

All I am telling you is what the text shows us. It is up to you as to whether or not you will believe it.

Bookends · Jul 23, 2013

HeRoseFromTheDead said:

Yes, thanks for your comment. But "Yom", the word for day, does not always pertain to a 24 hour day either, and in Genesis 1 evening to morning is only half a day. And in Genesis 2 the word "Yom" is interpreted a period of time by even most Young Earthers. And the 7th day doesn't even have this phrase "evening and morning" associated with it, so it makes more logical sense to me, that we are still experience God's rest, the 7th day "time period." And God is very concerned about us entering into that rest even today. All Hebrew Scholars agree there are 3 or 4 definitions to day "yom". And taking all the biblical accounts of creation, and all valid scientific evidences, it make more sense to me that we live on an old Earth and in an old universe.

oldhermit · Jul 23, 2013

Bookends said:

Yes, thanks for your comment. But "Yom", the word for day, does not always pertain to a 24 hour day either, and in Genesis 1 evening to morning is only half a day. And in Genesis 2 the word "Yom" is interpreted a period of time by even most Young Earthers. And the 7th day doesn't even have this phrase "evening and morning" associated with it, so it makes more logical sense to me, that we are still experience God's rest, the 7th day "time period." And God is very concerned about us entering into that rest even today. All Hebrew Scholars agree there are 3 or 4 definitions to day "yom". And taking all the biblical accounts of creation, and all valid scientific evidences, it make more sense to me that we live on an old Earth and in an old universe.

From the first day to the sixth day, a day is always defined according to the same standard of measurement - the evening and the morning.

Bookends · Jul 23, 2013

oldhermit said:

I believe you are assuming that "evening and morning" is being used as a standard of measurement. It could also be interpreted as a beginning and a closing of each creation event or step.

KohenMatt · Jul 23, 2013

Bookends said:

RachelBibleStudent said:

To expand on this point, it makes all the sense in the world to be looking for a helper/partner/wife, and when seeing only animals, and lots of them to be disappointed. So when something comes along not animal life, Adam was probably crying tears of joy.

Matt

john832 · Jul 23, 2013

KohenMatt said:

Who was this done for? Did God know what the suitable partner for Adam was? Of course. Did Adam? This is why Adam had to see the animals and name them. Hmmm, none of these are like me and don't have intelect on my level. Wonder Why?

Gen 1:21 And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good.

Gen 1:25 And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good.

Now what kind was Adam made after?

Gen 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
Gen 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

Adam was made after the God kind and he had to come to that realization.

oldhermit · Jul 23, 2013

Bookends said:

There is no possible way one can get that out of the language of the text. This is something one pushes into the text because for one reason or the other, they want the text to mean something other than what it says. There is absolutely no justifiable reason to assume that the text means anything other than what the language reveals.

Bookends · Jul 23, 2013

oldhermit said:

I disagree. We need recognize the genre in which the Genesis account is written in, and interpret scripture with that in mind, if you don't then you'll come with all kinds erroneous interpretations leading us all in different directions. Just because Genesis portrays Satan as a snake doesn't mean he looks like one, or when the text says that God walked in the garden we shouldn't assume He has hands and feet.

john832 · Jul 23, 2013

Call it a space shuttle if you want, but I am convinced the Genesis account is of 7 literal, 24 hour, days.

oldhermit · Jul 23, 2013

Bookends said:

Friend, this is exactly the textual approach that has brought you to this "erroneous interpretation" of Gen. chapter 1. Truth is not in the genre. Truth does not lie within the historical or the cultural context. Truth lies exclusively within the framework of the grammatical structure of the text, PERIOD. Scripture is equidistant to both time and culture and is not contingent on either time or culture. The further away you get from the grammar, the further away you get from the truth. If you want to learn to understand scripture, you MUST learn to depend on the language of scripture. If you want to KNOW the Bible then study the Bible and not books written about the Bible.

oldhermit · Jul 23, 2013

john832 said:

Amen! Perhaps you may find this interesting.

By Glen Rogers
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]The Creation of Light, 3-5 - “Let there be...” This is the command pattern for every stage of creation.[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]A. Light is spoken into existence. What kind of light is under consideration? It is not that which represents the glory of God such as we find in the dedication of the Temple. This is light that is comprised of matter. It is created light that is not produced by celestial sources. These are not yet created.
[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]B. Light is separated from the darkness. This is an interesting phenomenon. Light and darkness do not naturally separate. It required an act of God to separate the two. What does this say about the theory of natural determinacy – the influence of natural law? It did not yet exist. Heaven and earth are matter, light is energy. These are the two basic elements of physics. At this point in creation, there are no "natural laws" in place to influence their behavior. Light is separated from the darkness by an act of God. Matter and energy are being organized into a more complex life sustaining system.
[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]C. Light is assigned to function – To measure time, 5. God gives the definition of what constitutes a day. God's definition stands as:[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1. Light = day + morning.
[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]2. Darkness = night + evening.[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]The combination of these two represent a 24 hour period of time. This same standard of measurement is used in every stage of creation. From the first day before the sun, moon, and stars were created until after these were
placed in the heavens as the standard measurement of evening and morning representing one day. This standard of measurement does not change even after the formation of the sun, moon, and stars.[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]The creation of celestial bodies, 14-19 - On the fourth day, light is coalesced into stars. How much matter was created as light in verse three? Apparently enough to form all of the stars and other celestial objects. Now, light is not only separated from the darkness, it is organized into the celestial bodies of the heavens.[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]A. Sun and moon – Purpose – To regulate time and to give light upon the earth. [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1. To separate day from night. This maintains the same standard of time measurement that has already been put in place from the first day.[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif] 2. To establish a pattern for seasons. [/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]B. The laws of physics are now put in place. This will be represented in at least four ways. [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1. The measuring of months and years will be regulated and measured according to rotational patterns. [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]2. Earths rotation is set. This places light on one hemisphere and darkness on the other. [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]3. The evening and morning effect are now the result of the rotation of the earth on its axis. This means that earths magnetic fields are now in place which is formed by the flow of the earths liquid iron core. The magnetic field is necessary to protect the earth against solar radiation. [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]4. Gravitational forces are now operational. Earth now begins it revolution around the sun which creates the changing of seasons.[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]
C. The Expansion of the Universe, 16-19, the stars.[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1. This is strategic placement, Jeremiah 10:12. “The Lord stretched out the heavens.” This is the organized placement of galaxies, No stars or other heavenly bodies including gaseous clouds have yet been observed to exist outside of galaxies. [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]2. Scope of the universe – Using the speed of light as the standard of measurement – 186,000 mps.[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]a. Our solar system is:[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]* Three seconds to the moon. [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]* Eight minutes to the sun.[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]* Five and ½ hrs to Pluto[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]* Four years and four months to Alpha Centauri, the nearest star outside our solar system.
[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]b. The Milky Way galaxy is average in size. [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]* An estimated 200 to 400 billion stars. [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]* It boasts between six and eight arms. Our solar system is in the Corona arm of the galaxy about 30,000 light years from its center.[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]* It is about 100,000 light years across. [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]* It rotates at a rate in excess of 9,000 mph requiring about 25,000 years for the galaxy to complete one rotation. Creation is not even old enough for our galaxy to have ever competed a single rotation. Estimating creation at 6,000 years this would mean that our galaxy has only competed ¼ of a rotation.[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]* The Milky Way galaxy is part of a cluster of some 30 galaxies which we refer to as the 'Local Group'. Our nearest neighbor in this group is some 5 million light years away.[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]* The Local Group is itself part of a larger cluster of galaxies known as the Virgo super cluster which contains about 200 separate galaxy groups. The nearest of which to our group is about 50 million light years away. This
super cluster contains some 2,500 large galaxies and 50,000 dwarf galaxies. The Virgo super cluster is only one of approximately 10 million super clusters. “And God stretched out the heavens.” Indeed![/FONT]

Bookends · Jul 23, 2013

oldhermit said:

Now here is something we can agree on. But I would also add that Scripture is equidistant to the book of nature and His creation. And as for scripture not contingent on time or culture, but also nature and creation in which many Young Earth advocates violate in respect to all the different variations of species within a kind. Young Earth hypothesis does not allow enough time for Lion to become a cat, or a horse to become a zebra, or a Great Dane to become a Shih Tzu (through natural processes, not human intervention). Thus YE is more supportive of micro evolution and it's processes happening in a short period of time, as where I believe God actually created many of the species with a kind from the get go, that has biblical support. We just have to disagree here bub! All I'm trying to do is open this up for evaluation, I'm trying to destroy your faith. The fact is that everything that God made has a design and purpose, and when we study what He made not only points to Him and that we are privileged people and planet, but that our planet and universe wasn't made 10,000 yrs ago. There is definitely the appearance of age to our world and Our God can not lie or deceive, and that puts the YE supports in predicament. I'm only trying to show that God's word does not contradict an older earth and universe. Peace bro.

oldhermit · Jul 23, 2013

Bookends said:

Now here is something we can agree on. But I would also add that Scripture is equidistant to the book of nature and His creation. And as for scripture not contingent on time or culture, but also nature and creation in which many Young Earth advocates violate in respect to all the different variations of species within a kind. Young Earth hypothesis does not allow enough time for Lion to become a cat, or a horse to become a zebra, or a Great Dane to become a Shih Tzu (through natural processes, not human intervention). Thus YE is more supportive of micro evolution and it's processes happening in a short period of time, as where I believe God actually created many of the species with a kind from the get go, that has biblical support. We just have to disagree here bub! All I'm trying to do is open this up for evaluation, I'm trying to destroy your faith. The fact is that everything that God made has a design and purpose, and when we study what He made not only points to Him and that we are privileged people and planet, but that our planet and universe wasn't made 10,000 yrs ago. There is definitely the appearance of age to our world and Our God can not lie or deceive, and that puts the YE supports in predicament. I'm only trying to show that God's word does not contradict an older earth and universe. Peace bro.

You are attempting to extract truth from the scientific community rather that from scripture. If scientific evaluation of natural "evidence" and natural processes conflict with the language of the text, which do you regard as truth?

Genesis 2:23 -pa`am (Strongs H6471)

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