He became sin...???

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
M

Mitspa

Guest
#1
This was just brought up on another thread but thought it would be interesting to discuss...

"He became sin" who did no sin...would that not suggest that "sin" is a spiritual force?
 
Feb 7, 2015
22,418
413
0
#2
Was there ever another view?
 
Sep 4, 2012
14,424
689
113
#3
This was just brought up on another thread but thought it would be interesting to discuss...

"He became sin" who did no sin...would that not suggest that "sin" is a spiritual force?
I believe the correct translation of that word is sin offering. I'll do some digging...
 
S

shotgunner

Guest
#4
He was made to be sin, who knew no sin, so that we could be made righteous, who knew no righteousness.
 
Sep 4, 2012
14,424
689
113
#5
I believe the correct translation of that word is sin offering. I'll do some digging...
The word translated sin both times in 2 Corinthians 5:21 is the exact same Greek word.

He made the one who did not know sin to be sin on our behalf, in order that we could become the righteousness of God in him. 2 Corinthians 5:21

It would make no sense to say "He made the one who knew no sin offering to be a sin offering".

However, this same word is translated sin offering in the Septuagint in 94 places in Exodus, Leviticus, and Numbers. So it does appear that this word can take on different shades of meaning depending on context. So based on that, I think in this case sin offering is probably the correct translation.

He made the one who did not know sin to be a sin offering on our behalf, in order that we could become the righteousness of God in him. 2 Corinthians 5:21
 
Sep 4, 2012
14,424
689
113
#6
Adam Clarke's Commentary on the Bible: 2 Corinthians 5:21

For he hath made him to be sin for us - Τον μη γνοντα ἁμαρτιαν, ὑπερ ἡμων ἁμαρτιαν εποιησεν· He made him who knew no sin, (who was innocent), a sin-offering for us. The word ἁμαρτια occurs here twice: in the first place it means sin, i.e. transgression and guilt; and of Christ it is said, He knew no sin, i.e. was innocent; for not to know sin is the same as to be conscious of innocence; so, nil conscire sibi, to be conscious of nothing against one’s self, is the same as nulla pallescere culpa, to be unimpeachable.

In the second place, it signifies a sin-offering, or sacrifice for sin, and answers to the חטאה chattaah and חטאת chattath of the Hebrew text; which signifies both sin and sin-offering in a great variety of places in the Pentateuch. The Septuagint translate the Hebrew word by ἁμαρτια in ninety-four places in Exodus, Leviticus, and Numbers, where a sin-offering is meant; and where our version translates the word not sin, but an offering for sin. Had our translators attended to their own method of translating the word in other places where it means the same as here, they would not have given this false view of a passage which has been made the foundation of a most blasphemous doctrine; viz. that our sins were imputed to Christ, and that he was a proper object of the indignation of Divine justice, because he was blackened with imputed sin; and some have proceeded so far in this blasphemous career as to say, that Christ may be considered as the greatest of sinners, because all the sins of mankind, or of the elect, as they say, were imputed to him, and reckoned as his own. One of these writers translates the passage thus: Deus Christum pro maximo peccatore habuit, ut nos essemus maxime justi, God accounted Christ the greatest of sinners, that we might be supremely righteous. Thus they have confounded sin with the punishment due to sin. Christ suffered in our stead; died for us; bore our sins, (the punishment due to them), in his own body upon the tree, for the Lord laid upon him the iniquities of us all; that is, the punishment due to them; explained by making his soul - his life, an offering for sin; and healing us by his stripes.

But that it may be plainly seen that sin-offering, not sin, is the meaning of the word in this verse, I shall set down the places from the Septuagint where the word occurs; and where it answers to the Hebrew words already quoted; and where our translators have rendered correctly what they render here incorrectly. In Exodus, Exo 29:14, Exo 29:36 : Leviticus, Lev 4:3, Lev 4:8, Lev 4:20, Lev 4:21, Lev 4:24, Lev 4:25, Lev 4:29, Lev 4:32-34; Lev 5:6, Lev 5:7, Lev 5:8, Lev 5:9, Lev 5:11, Lev 5:12; Lev 6:17, Lev 6:25, Lev 6:30; Lev 7:7, Lev 7:37; Lev 8:2, Lev 8:14; Lev 9:2, Lev 9:3, Lev 9:7, Lev 9:8, Lev 9:10, Lev 9:15, Lev 9:22; Lev 10:16, Lev 10:17, Lev 10:19; Lev 12:6, Lev 12:8; Lev 14:13, Lev 14:19, Lev 14:22, Lev 14:31; Lev 15:15, Lev 15:30; Lev 16:3, Lev 16:5, Lev 16:6, Lev 16:9, Lev 16:11, Lev 16:15, Lev 16:25, Lev 16:27; Lev 23:19 : Numbers, Num 6:11, Num 6:14, Num 6:16; Num 7:16, Num 7:22, Num 7:28, Num 7:34, Num 7:40, Num 7:46, Num 7:52, Num 7:58, Num 7:70, Num 7:76, Num 7:82, Num 7:87; Num 8:8, Num 8:12; Num 15:24, Num 15:25, Num 15:27; Num 18:9; Num 28:15, Num 28:22; Num 29:5, Num 29:11, Num 29:16, Num 29:22, Num 29:25, Num 29:28, Num 29:31, Num 29:34, Num 29:38.

Besides the above places, it occurs in the same signification, and is properly translated in our version, in the following places: -

2 Chronicles, 2Ch 29:21, 2Ch 29:23, 2Ch 29:24 : Ezra, Ezr 6:17; Ezr 8:35 : Nehemiah, Neh 10:33 : Job, Job 1:5 : Ezekiel, Eze 43:19, Eze 43:22, Eze 43:25; Eze 44:27, Eze 44:29; Eze 45:17, Eze 45:19, Eze 45:22, Eze 45:23, Eze 45:25. In all, one hundred and eight places, which, in the course of my own reading in the Septuagint, I have marked.
 
Feb 7, 2015
22,418
413
0
#7
Only trouble with that is that there had been "sin offerings" for hundreds of years, and they did not really directly affect sin.... simply purified humans from past sins, up to that point in time.

However, if Christ actually did become sin, then when He died, sin would also have to die right along with Him..... something sin had never done before. Sin would be left in the grave when Christ arose with a new body.
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#10
Adam Clarke's Commentary on the Bible: 2 Corinthians 5:21

For he hath made him to be sin for us - Τον μη γνοντα ἁμαρτιαν, ὑπερ ἡμων ἁμαρτιαν εποιησεν· He made him who knew no sin, (who was innocent), a sin-offering for us. The word ἁμαρτια occurs here twice: in the first place it means sin, i.e. transgression and guilt; and of Christ it is said, He knew no sin, i.e. was innocent; for not to know sin is the same as to be conscious of innocence; so, nil conscire sibi, to be conscious of nothing against one’s self, is the same as nulla pallescere culpa, to be unimpeachable.

In the second place, it signifies a sin-offering, or sacrifice for sin, and answers to the חטאה chattaah and חטאת chattath of the Hebrew text; which signifies both sin and sin-offering in a great variety of places in the Pentateuch. The Septuagint translate the Hebrew word by ἁμαρτια in ninety-four places in Exodus, Leviticus, and Numbers, where a sin-offering is meant; and where our version translates the word not sin, but an offering for sin. Had our translators attended to their own method of translating the word in other places where it means the same as here, they would not have given this false view of a passage which has been made the foundation of a most blasphemous doctrine; viz. that our sins were imputed to Christ, and that he was a proper object of the indignation of Divine justice, because he was blackened with imputed sin; and some have proceeded so far in this blasphemous career as to say, that Christ may be considered as the greatest of sinners, because all the sins of mankind, or of the elect, as they say, were imputed to him, and reckoned as his own. One of these writers translates the passage thus: Deus Christum pro maximo peccatore habuit, ut nos essemus maxime justi, God accounted Christ the greatest of sinners, that we might be supremely righteous. Thus they have confounded sin with the punishment due to sin. Christ suffered in our stead; died for us; bore our sins, (the punishment due to them), in his own body upon the tree, for the Lord laid upon him the iniquities of us all; that is, the punishment due to them; explained by making his soul - his life, an offering for sin; and healing us by his stripes.

But that it may be plainly seen that sin-offering, not sin, is the meaning of the word in this verse, I shall set down the places from the Septuagint where the word occurs; and where it answers to the Hebrew words already quoted; and where our translators have rendered correctly what they render here incorrectly. In Exodus, Exo 29:14, Exo 29:36 : Leviticus, Lev 4:3, Lev 4:8, Lev 4:20, Lev 4:21, Lev 4:24, Lev 4:25, Lev 4:29, Lev 4:32-34; Lev 5:6, Lev 5:7, Lev 5:8, Lev 5:9, Lev 5:11, Lev 5:12; Lev 6:17, Lev 6:25, Lev 6:30; Lev 7:7, Lev 7:37; Lev 8:2, Lev 8:14; Lev 9:2, Lev 9:3, Lev 9:7, Lev 9:8, Lev 9:10, Lev 9:15, Lev 9:22; Lev 10:16, Lev 10:17, Lev 10:19; Lev 12:6, Lev 12:8; Lev 14:13, Lev 14:19, Lev 14:22, Lev 14:31; Lev 15:15, Lev 15:30; Lev 16:3, Lev 16:5, Lev 16:6, Lev 16:9, Lev 16:11, Lev 16:15, Lev 16:25, Lev 16:27; Lev 23:19 : Numbers, Num 6:11, Num 6:14, Num 6:16; Num 7:16, Num 7:22, Num 7:28, Num 7:34, Num 7:40, Num 7:46, Num 7:52, Num 7:58, Num 7:70, Num 7:76, Num 7:82, Num 7:87; Num 8:8, Num 8:12; Num 15:24, Num 15:25, Num 15:27; Num 18:9; Num 28:15, Num 28:22; Num 29:5, Num 29:11, Num 29:16, Num 29:22, Num 29:25, Num 29:28, Num 29:31, Num 29:34, Num 29:38.

Besides the above places, it occurs in the same signification, and is properly translated in our version, in the following places: -

2 Chronicles, 2Ch 29:21, 2Ch 29:23, 2Ch 29:24 : Ezra, Ezr 6:17; Ezr 8:35 : Nehemiah, Neh 10:33 : Job, Job 1:5 : Ezekiel, Eze 43:19, Eze 43:22, Eze 43:25; Eze 44:27, Eze 44:29; Eze 45:17, Eze 45:19, Eze 45:22, Eze 45:23, Eze 45:25. In all, one hundred and eight places, which, in the course of my own reading in the Septuagint, I have marked.
I like Adam Clark ..but I think he is trying to make the scriptures read to his own understanding...I believe its clear our sin was "imputed" unto Christ ..just as the Old Testament sacrifice received the sin of the people.
 
Dec 9, 2011
13,744
1,728
113
#11
This was just brought up on another thread but thought it would be interesting to discuss...

"He became sin" who did no sin...would that not suggest that "sin" is a spiritual force?
We can't see a sin but we can see a sin being committed.We can't see the devil but we know the devil exist.IMO It is a spiritual force and affects the flesh and man could not do anything to stop sin and death only GOD could clean the inside.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#12
He knew no sin.

He took our sin on his body

That is all it means..

Why do people want to make things so hard.
 
4

49

Guest
#13
We can't see a sin but we can see a sin being committed.We can't see the devil but we know the devil exist.IMO It is a spiritual force and affects the flesh and man could not do anything to stop sin and death only GOD could clean the inside.
You hit that spot on. Going through a lot in my life right now, and am battling the enemy who is trying to keep me from growing in my Lord and Savior. It is a battle, and myself have lost quite a few, but my God is going to win the war. Not being self-centered here, but can use some prayers. Thank you for the post.
 
S

shotgunner

Guest
#15
Jesus became sin, was made to be sin.

The parallel is Moses lifting up the brass serpent in the wilderness. This is a type of Jesus being lifted up on the cross. The serpent wasn't lifted as an offering, but as a representation of Jesus having become sin.
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#16
Jesus became sin, was made to be sin.

The parallel is Moses lifting up the brass serpent in the wilderness. This is a type of Jesus being lifted up on the cross. The serpent wasn't lifted as an offering, but as a representation of Jesus having become sin.
Very good!...the snake representing sin...bronze represents judgment having been made ... when we see our sin judged in His Body...we are healed..just as they was :)
 
K

Kaycie

Guest
#17
If sin were mud, and everyone's mud was piled on Him, He would be a big blob. But even though He became a big blob, at the very core He is still a soul without mud. Our sin was on Him (spiritually), not in Him (spiritually). The soul of who He is never became sinful.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,707
3,650
113
#18
The Atonement is multi faceted. It is easy to lift up one facet and declare "This is it!".
 
Sep 4, 2012
14,424
689
113
#19
The word "offering" is clearly not in the Greek...
That's true. Neither is it in any of the 94+ verses in the OT that I listed, yet that is the clear meaning. You make the call.

And they shall carry forth the calf whole without the camp, and they shall burn the calf as they burnt the former calf: it is the sin-offering of the congregation. Leviticus 4:21

Καὶ ἐξοίσουσι τὸν μόσχον ὅλον ἔξω τῆς παρεμβολῆς, καὶ κατακαύσουσι τὸν μόσχον, ὃν τρόπον κατέκαυσαν τὸν μόσχον τὸν πρότερον. ἁμαρτία συναγωγῆς ἐστιν. ​ Leviticus 4:21