I'm Treading Works Salvation...lolzzzzzzz

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preacher4truth

preacher4truth

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#1
Dec 28, 2016
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Recently I made this post in a thread (I edited out the persons name I addressed which said "Hello ________ !):

preacher4truth said:
All the elect pre-conversion were as the rest of mankind, Ephesians 2:3. Note in Ephesians 1 He already spoke to them about their being predestined and chosen to salvation before the foundation of the world.

Also, take a look at Paul's words in 2 Timothy 2:8-10 where the thing that motivated him to preach was because the elect are out there. He learned this personally in Acts 18 concerning Corinth. It's a beautiful and hope-filled truth, we are not preaching in vain, God has His elect out there that He will save in time. :)
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A person then stated in response to the above "you are now starting to tread the works based salvation waters." I then asked for proof of this from my statement and later, this same person stated that the part that is bold above is "treading works based salvation." That is, because God has His elect out there, and I believe this biblical truth, then I am treading works based salvation waters. LOL! Oh, well.

Frankly that is a misguided and unfounded assertion so I wanted to allow others to chime in:

Some of you can really distort what others have said, so you'll find some way to spin my statement out of disdain for election, for me &c so I wanted to capture several more asinine takes on what I said and see exactly how others will twist what I've said in diablos fashion.

Others of you will find the false accusation as bizarre and unfounded as I have, and rightly so since there is nothing even remotely true about the false accusation.
 
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Willie-T

Willie-T

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Feb 7, 2015
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Boy! He really got to you, didn't he?
 
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kaylagrl

Guest
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Willie-T said:
Boy! He really got to you, didn't he?
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It seems so. But Ive never seen a more touchy bunch then the crowd over on that thread. Almost in hysterics if you disagree and point out Scripture against what they believe.smh
 
Rockrz

Rockrz

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Dec 3, 2016
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Well, everyone has scripture they think is more true than your scriptures...

It's kinda like kids in grade school saying their dad can beat up your dad... but here it's "my scriptures are more true than your scriptures"

The only way to answer all that is to say - one thing is for certain and that is... we be some gonna find out one day!
 
Angela_grace

Angela_grace

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Jan 3, 2016
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I think lots of things go out of proportion on the forums. Once someone disagrees with one on one thing it's like they must disagree on everything. And that the other person is always wrong. I think we even just skim what the other posted and read what may not even be there but what we believe someone who disagrees with me on "everything" would say. I also don't think it helps that one can never really know the tone of voice one is using. Prob more often then not we assume a not so pleasing tone but it could very much be a gentle, pleasant tone as well.

My thoughts on why arguable forums blow up as they do.
 
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Cerwin

Guest
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Angela_grace said:
I think lots of things go out of proportion on the forums. Once someone disagrees with one on one thing it's like they must disagree on everything. And that the other person is always wrong. I think we even just skim what the other posted and read what may not even be there but what we believe someone who disagrees with me on "everything" would say. I also don't think it helps that one can never really know the tone of voice one is using. Prob more often then not we assume a not so pleasing tone but it could very much be a gentle, pleasant tone as well.

My thoughts on why arguable forums blow up as they do.
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You mean like you might say something and another person disagrees, and so everyone just joins in and disagrees too without even looking at the original post ? Your definitely right about learning how to "express" yourself in a way that doesn't sound demanding and opinionated. Took me a long time to learn a better way of posting so I could communicate myself better.
 
SovereignGrace

SovereignGrace

Senior Member
#7
Dec 28, 2016
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preacher4truth said:
Recently I made this post in a thread (I edited out the persons name I addressed which said "Hello ________ !):



A person then stated in response to the above "you are now starting to tread the works based salvation waters." I then asked for proof of this from my statement and later, this same person stated that the part that is bold above is "treading works based salvation." That is, because God has His elect out there, and I believe this biblical truth, then I am treading works based salvation waters. LOL! Oh, well.

Frankly that is a misguided and unfounded assertion so I wanted to allow others to chime in:

Some of you can really distort what others have said, so you'll find some way to spin my statement out of disdain for election, for me &c so I wanted to capture several more asinine takes on what I said and see exactly how others will twist what I've said in diablos fashion.

Others of you will find the false accusation as bizarre and unfounded as I have, and rightly so since there is nothing even remotely true about the false accusation.
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Sooooo...being chosen from before the creation of the world is treading upon works salvation? Then sign me up, too. Lullz...
 
preacher4truth

preacher4truth

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#9
Dec 28, 2016
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kaylagrl said:
It seems so. But Ive never seen a more touchy bunch then the crowd over on that thread. Almost in hysterics if you disagree and point out Scripture against what they believe.smh
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I agree, the anti-calvinists can't stand the doctrine of election and hate when Scripture reproves them and then they get bent. Unreal. Maybe they should make their own Bible?
 
preacher4truth

preacher4truth

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#10
Dec 28, 2016
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SovereignGrace said:
Sooooo...being chosen from before the creation of the world is treading upon works salvation? Then sign me up, too. Lullz...
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Exactly. Not one anti Cal will have the honesty or guts to agree that nothing in my statement says a thing about works salvation because I'm what they call a calvinist. It's too easy to just be filled with malice and hate instead. The hate and ugliness from that group is over the top, and it is actually grounded in hatred for God's Sovereign electing grace.
 
ForthAngel

ForthAngel

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#11
Aug 31, 2012
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kaylagrl said:
It seems so. But Ive never seen a more touchy bunch then the crowd over on that thread. Almost in hysterics if you disagree and point out Scripture against what they believe.smh
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Anyone who reads the thread honestly can see that the Arminian side of the debate are the ones who have either A. problems with reading comprehension, or B. just flat out liars and hostile toward everyone who doesn't agree. The level of misrepresentation from the side of the Arminians is unreal.
 
preacher4truth

preacher4truth

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#12
Dec 28, 2016
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ForthAngel said:
Anyone who reads the thread honestly can see that the Arminian side of the debate are the ones who have either A. problems with reading comprehension, or B. just flat out liars and hostile toward everyone who doesn't agree. The level of misrepresentation from the side of the Arminians is unreal.
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Yep, lot's of anger definitely on the anti-cal side. It is mixed with a denial of Scripture, lies about what cals say, and yet not one of the anti-cals has the fortitude to stand up against those lies -- such as the lie propagated against my statement in the OP. Honesty and standing up for what is right would be nice, but that would be something Christians would do, so obviously it's asking too much. That's why I posted the OP, to see who could actually be honest. No one dares to step up to the plate.

BTW, not one Calvinist has a problem with the multitudes if passages presented that state "whosoever will." Of course, we believe that, and God makes the person willing. But the verses are used as if they pit themselves against God's electing grace like a "Nu-uh, that's not true! Whosoever can come, so there!" response. That is because it is exactly what is meant by using those Scriptures, they are used in attempt to deny the fact of election. It is callow and lacking in honesty and Biblical acumen.

Then there are the "all" verses. Not one of them wants to take an honest look at the context of the word "all" in any given passage and so they won't. Their's is a miserable failure to properly exegete and follow 2 Timothy 2:15.

I get it, they're scared of election and way more comfortable that they elected themselves to salvation. It is way easier to believe they did something instead of trusting God and what He has done, and that is a sad fact. But some will simply have none of this truth, they will fight God's Word and His people perpetually.
 
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preacher4truth

preacher4truth

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#13
Dec 28, 2016
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#13
ForthAngel said:
Anyone who reads the thread honestly can see that the Arminian side of the debate are the ones who have either A. problems with reading comprehension, or B. just flat out liars and hostile toward everyone who doesn't agree. The level of misrepresentation from the side of the Arminians is unreal.
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Maybe you could explain to me how in the OP my statement is treading a works based salvation water. I'm not seeing it at all. Seems just another unfounded fabricated lie. When will these believer's actually be honest? I've been waiting to see this, but it is just not happening.
 
ForthAngel

ForthAngel

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#14
Aug 31, 2012
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preacher4truth said:
Maybe you could explain to me how in the OP my statement is treading a works based salvation water. I'm not seeing it at all. Seems just another unfounded fabricated lie. When will these believer's actually be honest? I've been waiting to see this, but it is just not happening.
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It's just one of the common lies told about Calvinists. What it stems from is the fact that reformed believers commit to striving to be obedient to Christ. This is something a lot of haters don't get and automatically call us workers for. If you notice, those who are part of this whole ecumenical movement and "compromise for the sake of unity" will deny scriptures where we have clear commands and rules to follow as Christians. Someone is blaspheming? That's okay, they are our brother. Someone promoting heretical teachers? That's okay, they believe in Jesus and are our brothers. We are free from the condemnation of the law in Christ, but by no means lawless. They don't understand this.
 
ForthAngel

ForthAngel

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Aug 31, 2012
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#15
ForthAngel said:
It's just one of the common lies told about Calvinists. What it stems from is the fact that reformed believers commit to striving to be obedient to Christ. This is something a lot of haters don't get and automatically call us workers for. If you notice, those who are part of this whole ecumenical movement and "compromise for the sake of unity" will deny scriptures where we have clear commands and rules to follow as Christians. Someone is blaspheming? That's okay, they are our brother. Someone promoting heretical teachers? That's okay, they believe in Jesus and are our brothers. We are free from the condemnation of the law in Christ, but by no means lawless. They don't understand this.
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I should define what I mean by ecumenical movement since it has a lot of meanings. I mean those who think everyone who identifies as a Christian yet defies scripture are still to be considered part of the body and embraced. Saw an example of this in regards to open theism just yesterday.

And as far as your comment is concerned, I dunno how they got that out of it. I was misrepresented around every turn on that thread as you know. Pretty frustrating, not to mention deceptive and evil.
 
preacher4truth

preacher4truth

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#16
Dec 28, 2016
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#16
ForthAngel said:
It's just one of the common lies told about Calvinists. What it stems from is the fact that reformed believers commit to striving to be obedient to Christ. This is something a lot of haters don't get and automatically call us workers for. If you notice, those who are part of this whole ecumenical movement and "compromise for the sake of unity" will deny scriptures where we have clear commands and rules to follow as Christians. Someone is blaspheming? That's okay, they are our brother. Someone promoting heretical teachers? That's okay, they believe in Jesus and are our brothers. We are free from the condemnation of the law in Christ, but by no means lawless. They don't understand this.
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Right. So twisting this statement "God has His elect out there that He will save in time." into saying it means I am treading works based salvation is par for the course even when it is completely absurd and unfounded? Yes, that is their protocol.

The dishonesty of many in that group is astounding. I suppose it is OK to lie and misrepresent continually because you're "saved." So, being obedient to Christ, and putting off the flesh would make them to be as one working their way to heaven. So sin, sin, sin. It's all good because being lawless is the way into the Kingdom!:D
 
preacher4truth

preacher4truth

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Dec 28, 2016
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ForthAngel said:
I should define what I mean by ecumenical movement since it has a lot of meanings. I mean those who think everyone who identifies as a Christian yet defies scripture are still to be considered part of the body and embraced. Saw an example of this in regards to open theism just yesterday.

And as far as your comment is concerned, I dunno how they got that out of it. I was misrepresented around every turn on that thread as you know. Pretty frustrating, not to mention deceptive and evil.
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Yep. It is anything goes for several of these. Any "gospel" especially if they smile alot and write humanistic books and call them "Christian". Prosperity, WoF, even in light of Scripture that condemns them in judgment who preach these lies, they stand up for the wolves in the sheepfold. Being covetous (which is idolatry) while proclaiming to be Christian? That's the gospel to them, and it's OK! Pay no mind to those passages that teach that the covetous won't be in Heaven, written to warn those in the church who believe that lying gospel.

Ironically it is those who expose these false teachers that are attacked. To them: Wolves? Yes! Sheep who follow the Word against them? NO!!! They won't tolerate that! Talk about people being self-deceived...
 
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CeileDe

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#18
God loves all of you. Jesus is the way, not believing in Calvinism and not believing in Arminianism, only Jesus
 
ForthAngel

ForthAngel

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Aug 31, 2012
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CeileDe said:
God loves all of you. Jesus is the way, not believing in Calvinism and not believing in Arminianism, only Jesus
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I agree. The issue really isn't the isms. It's who confines themselves to the word of God and properly understands it and who doesn't. I don't think anyone believes in Calvinism or Arminianism. These are just ways of categorizing different understandings. The question is really, who is consistent and honest in their handling of scripture, and who isn't?
 
A

Ariel82

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#20
Hmmm...never seen a Calvinist accused of works salvation. Most people go the opposite extreme and accuse them of teaching a licentious doctrine.

Not that your OP teaches either.

Last time I checked on that thread, it was alright.

Must have missed the drama.

Are you still calling others Universalist?
 
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