In Christ, or in Sin
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This is where I disagree with a lot of folks. The new nature is what we are supposed to be, not 2 natures in one (both old and new) Jesus came to destroy the old man nature in us, or body of sin, and if our old man nature truly died with Christ on the cross, and we are truly raised up a new man in Christ, then those old sinful ways were put to death as well.
2 Corinthians 5:17Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
So if you raise up again that which the Lord came to destroy, then you will be found to be a transgressor.
2 Corinthians 5:17Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
So if you raise up again that which the Lord came to destroy, then you will be found to be a transgressor.
K
This is absolutely correct, as what Paul was really saying is that he showed the difficulties that he had while he was still young/new in the faith. He had not fully matured at that time yet.
This is what the Holy Spirit was sent here for, as our helper to guide us into perfection and make us mature in the faith so that we can not get caught up in willful sin again, keeping ourselves pure. As Apostle Paul told Apostle Timothy to not let sin make him impure again.
Romans 6:6
Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Romans 6:19I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.
Paul did say he spake a certain way to them as they needed to put things into reverse and into the correct practice.
Paul did say he spake a certain way to them as they needed to put things into reverse and into the correct practice.
K
You have to take all scripture into consideration in order to get the full picture. Someone with one verse might say, "It's blue." While someone with another scripture might say, "It's yellow." When actually it's green- a combination of both. There's a difference between visiting sin and living in it. If someone is completely never going to sin after baptism, then they were born full grown. What baby, spiritual or physical, is born with no growing to do?
The bible talks about growing in Christ, doesn't that imply changing your ways over time? You're right, and the bible is right, someone in Christ WILL quit sinning. I used to smoke for years, now I do not. I grew in Christ. But what if, while I was still trying to quit, someone judged me as not being a Christian? How can I grow in Christ to the point of not smoking if I wasn't in Christ? Do I still have more growing to do? Yes, and I'm trying- and that is the difference- I'm not living in sin, I'm living with the struggle to get out of sin. Meanwhile, where I fail grace succeeds.
Do some people take advantage of God's grace and think of it as a license to sin? Sure they do, the bible says so. But they are deceiving themselves, they are then living to sin. But God knows the thoughts and intentions of the heart. Not that you are judge, but you can't see growth in a person since yesterday, but if you see no growth after a decade, it would appear that they are living for sin instead of fr God, but still, only God knows for sure. Paul was killing Christians, and it probably appeared to them that he would not go to heaven.
And even after baptism he said, "The good I want to do I do not do, but the bad I do not want to do, that is what I keep doing." Someone could have judged him when he sinned after baptism. But take a close look at his intentions in what he said. He said he WANTS to do good but fails sometimes. That implies trying, which brings forth growth, he is still in Christ and covered under grace. But we know that whatever doesn't grow dies.
One of the fruits of the Spirit is patience. Why would God be patient with sinners before baptism, and not be patient with His children after baptism, and then tell us to be good to others, ESPECIALLY to those who belong to the household of faith? We are not to take advantage of grace, but what purpose is grace if completely unneeded or unused?
The bible talks about growing in Christ, doesn't that imply changing your ways over time? You're right, and the bible is right, someone in Christ WILL quit sinning. I used to smoke for years, now I do not. I grew in Christ. But what if, while I was still trying to quit, someone judged me as not being a Christian? How can I grow in Christ to the point of not smoking if I wasn't in Christ? Do I still have more growing to do? Yes, and I'm trying- and that is the difference- I'm not living in sin, I'm living with the struggle to get out of sin. Meanwhile, where I fail grace succeeds.
Do some people take advantage of God's grace and think of it as a license to sin? Sure they do, the bible says so. But they are deceiving themselves, they are then living to sin. But God knows the thoughts and intentions of the heart. Not that you are judge, but you can't see growth in a person since yesterday, but if you see no growth after a decade, it would appear that they are living for sin instead of fr God, but still, only God knows for sure. Paul was killing Christians, and it probably appeared to them that he would not go to heaven.
And even after baptism he said, "The good I want to do I do not do, but the bad I do not want to do, that is what I keep doing." Someone could have judged him when he sinned after baptism. But take a close look at his intentions in what he said. He said he WANTS to do good but fails sometimes. That implies trying, which brings forth growth, he is still in Christ and covered under grace. But we know that whatever doesn't grow dies.
One of the fruits of the Spirit is patience. Why would God be patient with sinners before baptism, and not be patient with His children after baptism, and then tell us to be good to others, ESPECIALLY to those who belong to the household of faith? We are not to take advantage of grace, but what purpose is grace if completely unneeded or unused?
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Amen! Through the Spirit
Roman 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
Romans 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
So he says,
IF we through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body we shall live
He says therefore,
Col 3:5 Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:
Mortify these, as he continues,
Col 3:6 For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:
Col 3:7 In the which ye also walked some time, when ye lived in them.
he says ye also used to walk in for some time when you lived in them but we dont anymore, we are made new creatures in Christ, better start walking like one.
Amen
Roman 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
Romans 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
So he says,
IF we through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body we shall live
He says therefore,
Col 3:5 Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:
Mortify these, as he continues,
Col 3:6 For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:
Col 3:7 In the which ye also walked some time, when ye lived in them.
he says ye also used to walk in for some time when you lived in them but we dont anymore, we are made new creatures in Christ, better start walking like one.
Amen
Actually Paul litigates this in Romans 7 and it seems that even he was not victorious all the time. You see it's a sliding scale where the more you walk with Christ the more there is to rid of your life. No matter how much you accomplish there is always much more to do. The closer you draw to the brightness of Christ's presence the more illumination of your imperfections.
Until we are free of this vile body of flesh we will need to cope with our imperfection.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
Until we are free of this vile body of flesh we will need to cope with our imperfection.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
Yes, used to walk, meaning past tense,notice here in 1 Corinthians 6:9-11 "Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,[SUP]10 [/SUP]Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.[SUP]11 [/SUP]And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God."
Again "were" meaning past tense
Again "were" meaning past tense
A
Too bad Paul didn't have it in Romans 6. lol
In the 8 verses of Romans 6:15-23 ...
Paul warned these believers: (habitual) sin results in eternal death.
For everyone.
But, that's okay ... even BACs today don't see his dire warning.
BACs today think he was only telling them: they no longer had to be slaves of sin!
In the 8 verses of Romans 6:15-23 ...
Paul warned these believers: (habitual) sin results in eternal death.
For everyone.
But, that's okay ... even BACs today don't see his dire warning.
BACs today think he was only telling them: they no longer had to be slaves of sin!
Exactly, he said in the which ye ALSO walked (past tense, for some time) WHEN ye actually lived in them (those particular things). However, it was not by themselves, but THROUGH the Spirit they were to mortify what he just told them about.
And so indeed as they walked (in times past) in those things when they lived in them so also he says, Gal 5:25 If we live in the Spirit, (now) let us also walk in the Spirit. Because as he said earlier Gal 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
So they walked in and lived in those other things which should not be walked in or lived in, but rather we are to walk by the Spirit we live in now (through which) we will not fulfil the lusts of the flesh but mortify them.
But its still through the Spirit one does. As we are to obey through the Spirit, and through the Spirit mortify those things.
Otherwise why mention doing anything through Him at all? I see it as waxing stronger in the Spirit by exercising oneself unto godliness (in that way).
And so indeed as they walked (in times past) in those things when they lived in them so also he says, Gal 5:25 If we live in the Spirit, (now) let us also walk in the Spirit. Because as he said earlier Gal 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
So they walked in and lived in those other things which should not be walked in or lived in, but rather we are to walk by the Spirit we live in now (through which) we will not fulfil the lusts of the flesh but mortify them.
But its still through the Spirit one does. As we are to obey through the Spirit, and through the Spirit mortify those things.
Otherwise why mention doing anything through Him at all? I see it as waxing stronger in the Spirit by exercising oneself unto godliness (in that way).
Our true identity when born again is a unique and one of a kind measure of God which no other will have identical to that specific measure. If we do that which we dont want to do then it is not us/a measure of God doing it, but the sin in our flesh which has been motivated from our birth through us having motivated free-will. Paul said that how to perform what is good I find not (but he approves of good). Most can find a measure of how to perform what is good when they surrender all to God and continue to hate sin. If a person does not hate sin...even that might be something God knows the real them does not approve of in time. I believe if we hate sin, then we do not sin. I believe if we do not hate sin, then it is still possible for that person to hate sin eventually, which is why I am approved to judge the sin in the flesh, but not the person/spirit of man, maybe just the spkrit a person is being motivated by at the time.
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