Inspiration of Scriptures
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If you are an unbeliever, that's all it is. But if you are a believer, then it is the Word of God.
Naturally. But they did have the written Scriptures, and that's all that matters. We now have the written Scriptures in almost every language. So what's your point?
Looks to me like you are having some serious difficulties in believing that the Bible is indeed the Word of God.
Naturally. But they did have the written Scriptures, and that's all that matters. We now have the written Scriptures in almost every language. So what's your point?
Looks to me like you are having some serious difficulties in believing that the Bible is indeed the Word of God.
Unlike the other NT writers Luke was not with Jesus during His earthly ministry.
why did Luke had to search things out before he could write them down?
Some of Luke's information was undoubtedly transmitted by people; but I believe that divine inspiration largely determined what was written.
Or why are there slight differences in synoptic gospels, where many quotations of Jesus are different?
When several people witness an event like a traffic accident, there will be as many versions of what happened as there are witnesses. But nobody will necessarily be lying. Things like recollection, point of view and perspective influence what is said. These minor differences attest more to authenticity than against it.
If every word is given by God, why are styles of Paul and of John different?
Some may believe every word is inspired. I don't believe that! I believe that God's point of view and his desires are never compromised; but the personality and experience of the writer finds their way into the text.
why did Luke had to search things out before he could write them down?
Some of Luke's information was undoubtedly transmitted by people; but I believe that divine inspiration largely determined what was written.
Or why are there slight differences in synoptic gospels, where many quotations of Jesus are different?
When several people witness an event like a traffic accident, there will be as many versions of what happened as there are witnesses. But nobody will necessarily be lying. Things like recollection, point of view and perspective influence what is said. These minor differences attest more to authenticity than against it.
If every word is given by God, why are styles of Paul and of John different?
Some may believe every word is inspired. I don't believe that! I believe that God's point of view and his desires are never compromised; but the personality and experience of the writer finds their way into the text.
Jesus is God manifest in flesh,God with us.
Adam was made in the image of God.Adam was made in the figure of Him to come,Christ.The image of God is the image of Christ.
God calls things that have not happened yet,as though they happened,which the Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world,and the prophets blood shed from the foundation of the world,and all the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
God had the plan to come in the future in flesh,and created Adam in that image,an innocent nature in flesh.
In the beginning was the Word,and the Word was with God,and the Word was God.
All things were made by Him,and without Him was not anything made that was made.
In the beginning was the plan of God to come in flesh,and that plan was with God before He laid down the foundation of the world,and that plan was God manifest in flesh.
All things were made with the plan of God to come in the flesh,and without that plan God would of not created anything He created,for Jesus is the reason creation is successful,forgiveness of sins,and eternal life.
Jesus is the first plan that God had before He created anything,so He is the firstborn among creatures,and the beginning of the creation of God,although He was not born until 4000 years later,because God calls things that have not happened yet,as though they already happened.
And the Word became flesh,and dwelt among us.No person has ever seen God,for He is an invisible Spirit,the only begotten Son has declared Him,a visible image of God.
The word of God,the Bible,is God revealing Himself by words written down.
The Word of God is God revealing Himself by a visible manifestation of Himself,and the visible relationship to the saints for eternity,for there is one throne in heaven,and one who sits in that throne,which is the throne of God and the Lamb,God in the glorified body of the man Christ Jesus.
Jesus at the right hand of God symbolizes exercising the throne of power,a temporary role,until His enemies are conquered,then the Son shall submit to the Father,that God may be all in all.
The only person we will see in heaven is Jesus,the only visible relationship of God to the saints,and Jesus told Philip,if you have seen Me you have seen the Father,and He is the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
Adam was made in the image of God.Adam was made in the figure of Him to come,Christ.The image of God is the image of Christ.
God calls things that have not happened yet,as though they happened,which the Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world,and the prophets blood shed from the foundation of the world,and all the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
God had the plan to come in the future in flesh,and created Adam in that image,an innocent nature in flesh.
In the beginning was the Word,and the Word was with God,and the Word was God.
All things were made by Him,and without Him was not anything made that was made.
In the beginning was the plan of God to come in flesh,and that plan was with God before He laid down the foundation of the world,and that plan was God manifest in flesh.
All things were made with the plan of God to come in the flesh,and without that plan God would of not created anything He created,for Jesus is the reason creation is successful,forgiveness of sins,and eternal life.
Jesus is the first plan that God had before He created anything,so He is the firstborn among creatures,and the beginning of the creation of God,although He was not born until 4000 years later,because God calls things that have not happened yet,as though they already happened.
And the Word became flesh,and dwelt among us.No person has ever seen God,for He is an invisible Spirit,the only begotten Son has declared Him,a visible image of God.
The word of God,the Bible,is God revealing Himself by words written down.
The Word of God is God revealing Himself by a visible manifestation of Himself,and the visible relationship to the saints for eternity,for there is one throne in heaven,and one who sits in that throne,which is the throne of God and the Lamb,God in the glorified body of the man Christ Jesus.
Jesus at the right hand of God symbolizes exercising the throne of power,a temporary role,until His enemies are conquered,then the Son shall submit to the Father,that God may be all in all.
The only person we will see in heaven is Jesus,the only visible relationship of God to the saints,and Jesus told Philip,if you have seen Me you have seen the Father,and He is the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
Why? Peter did not use your Bible, they had different versions. So believer or unbeliever in what exactly?
Show me that Bible is the word of God. If it is not said anywhere, of course I have difficulties to believe it.
Bible is a library translated from compilation of manuscripts. Word of God is a direct saying of God or Christ.
And my question is what view of inspiration can be applied to it.
Show me that Bible is the word of God. If it is not said anywhere, of course I have difficulties to believe it.
Bible is a library translated from compilation of manuscripts. Word of God is a direct saying of God or Christ.
And my question is what view of inspiration can be applied to it.
Verbal dictation theory:
The dictation theory claims that God dictated the books of the Bible word by word, suggesting the authors were no more than tools used to communicate God's precisely intended message.
Verbal plenary inspiration:
This view gives a greater role to the human writers of the Bible while maintaining a belief that God preserved the integrity of the words of the Bible. The effect of inspiration was to move the authors so as to produce the words God wanted.
In this view the human writers' "individual backgrounds, personal traits, and literary styles were authentically theirs, but had been providentially prepared by God for use as his instrument in producing Scripture."
Intuition theory:
The authors of the Scriptures were merely wise men, so the Bible is inspired by advanced human insight.
Partial inspiration:
the Bible is infallible in matters of faith and practice/morals, yet it could have errors in history or science (e.g. the Big Bang could be true, and the Genesis creation account is more allegorical than historical).
Dynamic inspiration:
The thoughts contained in the Bible are inspired, but the words used were left to the individual writers.
This suggests the underlying message of the Scriptures are inspired, while the exact wording is dynamic.
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It seems to me, that most of you are for Verbal plenary inspiration, few of you are for Verbal dictation theory, but when I ask questions about it, you go to Verbal plenary inspiration as the majority.
So far, nobody (I think) believes in the next three. Maybe I can make a poll for this.
I, personally, think that Dynamic inspiration is what best describes my actual feelings, but I am still in a process of searching.
The dictation theory claims that God dictated the books of the Bible word by word, suggesting the authors were no more than tools used to communicate God's precisely intended message.
Verbal plenary inspiration:
This view gives a greater role to the human writers of the Bible while maintaining a belief that God preserved the integrity of the words of the Bible. The effect of inspiration was to move the authors so as to produce the words God wanted.
In this view the human writers' "individual backgrounds, personal traits, and literary styles were authentically theirs, but had been providentially prepared by God for use as his instrument in producing Scripture."
Intuition theory:
The authors of the Scriptures were merely wise men, so the Bible is inspired by advanced human insight.
Partial inspiration:
the Bible is infallible in matters of faith and practice/morals, yet it could have errors in history or science (e.g. the Big Bang could be true, and the Genesis creation account is more allegorical than historical).
Dynamic inspiration:
The thoughts contained in the Bible are inspired, but the words used were left to the individual writers.
This suggests the underlying message of the Scriptures are inspired, while the exact wording is dynamic.
------
It seems to me, that most of you are for Verbal plenary inspiration, few of you are for Verbal dictation theory, but when I ask questions about it, you go to Verbal plenary inspiration as the majority.
So far, nobody (I think) believes in the next three. Maybe I can make a poll for this.
I, personally, think that Dynamic inspiration is what best describes my actual feelings, but I am still in a process of searching.
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Propositions vs Words
Some issues to consider regarding the epistemology of propositional entities:
1. If we start with a thoughtful epistemology, we might find that propositions in scripture are, by necessity, tied very closely to precision in wording.
2 Although a proposition and the words used to convey that proposition are not the same, and they can EXIST independently, that does not necessarily mean we can DISCOVER them independently.
3. It is possible, and common, in matters of complexity, that precision in UNDERSTANDING of a proposition can not be arrived at without precision in the WORDING of the proposition.
4. So although the proposition and the words ARE independent entities, we cannot necessarily work our way backward to the correct proposition without the correct words.
5. If God created the universe, and all the complexities of math and science within it, then God is a God of great precision and complexity - therefore it would be consistent with his character, and consistent with his very nature, to give us propositions that contain complexity, and which would thereby, quite often, require precision of words in order to convey the precision and complexity of meaning.
6. There is no reason to believe the thoughts which God places within words should be any less complex or precise than the thoughts God places within nature and science... and if these thoughts placed into words are complex and precise, then they would REQUIRE precise language to convey them.
7. Therefore, words are important.
8. Precise words are important.
9. It would seem that if our epistemology begins with the nature of God, then we must eventually arrive at some precision of language by necessity, when concerning God's special revelation.
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Trofimus,
It is becoming more and more evident that you are looking for problems where none exist.
What if both statements are true, therefore both are allowed to stand as divinely inspired? No matter what you may think, it is God the Holy Spirit who inspired both writers to put down what they wrote. On one hand Matthew is indicating that God was speaking to confirm that Jesus was His beloved Son, while Mark and Luke recorded the exact words spoken -- "This is my beloved Son". But in the Gospel of John we have John the Baptizer saying "And I saw, and bare record that this is the Son of God". John the Baptist heard the very same words but he also indicated and gave a witness ("bare record") that Jesus is the Son of God -- a confirmation. So we have various statements about the same incident expressed in different ways.
In a court of law, the testimony of every witness will not be an exact replica of that of every other witness, but they will all confirm that they witnessed something and their testimony will agree. So it is in Scripture. You will also find that what the Holy Spirit stated in the Old Testament is sometimes stated a little differently in the New Testament, but both witnesses are true.
It is becoming more and more evident that you are looking for problems where none exist.
What if both statements are true, therefore both are allowed to stand as divinely inspired? No matter what you may think, it is God the Holy Spirit who inspired both writers to put down what they wrote. On one hand Matthew is indicating that God was speaking to confirm that Jesus was His beloved Son, while Mark and Luke recorded the exact words spoken -- "This is my beloved Son". But in the Gospel of John we have John the Baptizer saying "And I saw, and bare record that this is the Son of God". John the Baptist heard the very same words but he also indicated and gave a witness ("bare record") that Jesus is the Son of God -- a confirmation. So we have various statements about the same incident expressed in different ways.
In a court of law, the testimony of every witness will not be an exact replica of that of every other witness, but they will all confirm that they witnessed something and their testimony will agree. So it is in Scripture. You will also find that what the Holy Spirit stated in the Old Testament is sometimes stated a little differently in the New Testament, but both witnesses are true.