Israel’s Final Restoration

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eternally-gratefull

Guest
You are putting ideas, thoughts and words I have never used.........
I am just onterpreting you, Because you refuse to answer specific questions, and leave me no choice, If you would like to correct me, and actually answer my question, Then we can stop this silly back and forth.

You may be willing to do and say anything in order to carry on a dispute, but I do not dispute what has been made clear. God bless you, and may He grand you His wisdom and knowledge.

What? You think I am talking about modern day Isreal. I proved I was not. And you call it a dispute?

The only dispute is you claim something, and when you are questioned about it, (which I rightly did) you get upset, angry, have to try to defend yourself because you think I have an anterior motive, and we have these silly back and forth discussion which lead to nothing.

Again, Unless you are going to show me something different from what I said, Then I am left to believe what was said.

You not saying it word for word does not mean it is not true. The fact is, you have not denied it also.

If the nation of Isreal repents. (not the Israel living in sin still) Will God remember lev 16 or not?


You can still answer, and this whole as you call it argument (I call it a discussion) will be over with.
 

abcdef

Senior Member
Mar 30, 2016
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I am just onterpreting you, Because you refuse to answer specific questions, and leave me no choice, If you would like to correct me, and actually answer my question, Then we can stop this silly back and forth.



What? You think I am talking about modern day Isreal. I proved I was not. And you call it a dispute?

The only dispute is you claim something, and when you are questioned about it, (which I rightly did) you get upset, angry, have to try to defend yourself because you think I have an anterior motive, and we have these silly back and forth discussion which lead to nothing.

Again, Unless you are going to show me something different from what I said, Then I am left to believe what was said.

You not saying it word for word does not mean it is not true. The fact is, you have not denied it also.

If the nation of Isreal repents. (not the Israel living in sin still) Will God remember lev 16 or not?


You can still answer, and this whole as you call it argument (I call it a discussion) will be over with.
Brother EG,

Things are busy around here now.

But I went through every post on this thread.

I was wondering, and maybe you did answer this question somewhere,

what scripture are you using, that Jesus must appear, before the times of the gentiles can end.

Isn't it possible that the ToG's can end without the appearance of Jesus?

Brother John
 

abcdef

Senior Member
Mar 30, 2016
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THE LAST DAYS

By oldhermit

Now I am not going to pretend that I understand all the consequences and implications that are linked to the term “the last days” but, it is certain that it is always associated with both blessing and/or judgment from God. What many have attempted to do is assign a strict and limited definition of time to this term and relegate it solely to a time that is still yet future, but this is not how we generally see it used in scripture. This term is very often used in connection with Israel but does not always represent the same period of time in their history; for example, sometimes it will refer to times related strictly to the OT period as in Daniel 8 which is a partial restating of what Daniel saw in chapter 11 simply cast in different symbols. Here, “the last days” is limited to the time of Antiochus Epiphanes and his destruction of Jerusalem. Other times it refers to the last days of the Jewish economy which was marked by the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD. It also seems to be used in Daniel 12:9 to refer to the end of all time as marked by the resurrection of the dead.

“The Last Days” never seems to have been used by any New Testament writer to refer to the end of the world. The first century Christians were living in the last days of the Jewish economy. It was not the Christian's last days, nor was it the last days of the world, nor of any specified nation other than Israel. It was the last days of the nation of Israel. It represented a time frame of some 37 years that stretched from between 33 AD to 70 AD. This language is used both in connection with the beginning of the reign of Messiah, and the destruction of Jerusalem.

What are “The Last Days” and to whom do they apply? This expression is limited in its application by scripture, not by the reader. It was limited to a specific group of peopleand to a specific time in THEIR history. As it referred to the end of the Jewish economy it defined the destruction of the nation, the killing and scattering of the people, the destruction of the capitol city, the desecration and destruction of the temple, the end of their sacrificial worship, and the destruction of their culture both religiously and politically. This would also end the nation of Israel's association with God. Exclusivity with God would no longer be defined ethnically. As a race, Israel existed only as a type whose appointed function had been fulfilled. Israel was the Bride of Jehovah through whom Messiah would come. All the nations of the earth would be blessed through her. Exclusivity now shifts from the physical to the spiritual. A Jew is now redefined, Romans 2:28-29 – “For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh. But he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that which is of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter; and his praise is not from men, but from God.” After the destruction of the Jewish economy, no generation is recognized by scripture as being in the last days as it is unlikely that any New Testament book was written after 69 AD. We are not now, nor have we ever been in the last days as this term is used in scripture. This period of time has been closed of by historical fulfillment. The following list of New Testament books represents all of the NT books that make use of the phrase “the last days” and the most likely time of their writing.

Acts – AD 62-64, 2Timothy – AD 62-66, Hebrews – AD 63-66, James – before AD 60, 2Peter – AD 66-67, 1John AD 60-65, 2John – AD 66-68, Jude – AD 66-69 (maybe early 70), Revelation – AD 62-68.


What did the prophets say would happen in the last days as this related to Israel?
I. Old Testament focus of the “Last Days”
A. Ezekiel 38:16, “And you will come up against My people Israel like a cloud to cover the land. It shall come about in the last days that I will bring you against My land, so that the nations may know Me when I am sanctified through you before their eyes, O Gog.” This is a prophesy against Israel that deals with the destruction of the nation by the Assyrians in 722 BC. “In the last days” then is endemic to that specific destruction.
B. Daniel 8:17, “So he came near to where I was standing, and when he came I was frightened and fell on my face; but he said to me, 'Son of man, understand that the vision pertains to the time of the end.'” This is a prophesy concerning the destruction of Jerusalem by Antiochus Epiphanes in 169 BC.
C. Daniel 10:14, “Now I have come to give you an understanding of what will happen to your people in the latter days, for the vision pertains to the days yet future.” These days were in the future with respect to the time of Daniel.
D. Daniel 11:35, “Some of those who have insight will fall, in order to refine, purge and make them pure until the end time; because it is still to come at the appointed time.” This has an extraordinary and detailed historic fulfillment from the time of Darius to Antiochus Epiphanes. If you like, I can provide this for you as well.

II. As God Used the Term “Last Days” regarding the nations of Moab and Elam.
A. Jeremiah 48:47, “Yet I will restore the fortunes of Moab in the latter days, declares the LORD. Thus far the judgment on Moab.”
B. Jeremiah 49:39, “But it will come about in the last days that I will restore the fortunes of Elam, declares the LORD.” Although God said he would destroy Moab and Elam he promised that he would restore their fortunes in “the latter days.” This seems to have redemptive aspirations regarding the salvation of the Gentiles in the last days. These are not the first times God uses the term “I will restore the fortunes” in this connection.

III. End of Time Focus
Daniel 12:40, “As for you, go your way till the end. You will rest, and then at the end of the days you will rise to receive your allotted inheritance.” This seems to refer to the full end of human history as it speaks of the resurrection of the dead.

IV. New Testament Focus:
A. Genesis 49:1, Then Jacob summoned his sons and said, “Assemble yourselves that I may tell you what will befall you in the last days.” That this has Messianic focus related to the coming of the Messiah out of the tribe of Judah is clearly seen in Jacob's prophesy concerning the tribe of Judah in verses 8-12.
B. Micah 4:1, And it will come about in the last days that the mountain of the house of the LORD will be established as the chief of the mountains. It will be raised above the hills, and the peoples will stream to it.”
C. Isaiah 2:2, “Now it will come about that in the last days the mountain of the house of the LORD Will be established as the chief of the mountains, and will be raised above the hills; And all the nations will stream to it.”
D.Jeremiah 23:20, “The anger of the LORD will not turn back Until He has performed and carried out the purposes of His heart; In the last days you will clearly understand it.” This entire chapter deals with the coming of their Messiah.

E. Hosea 3:5, “Afterward the sons of Israel will return and seek the LORD their God and David their king; and they will come trembling to the LORD and to His goodness in the last days.”

V. The Last Days as Spoken of by the New Testament
A. Acts 2:17, “And in the last days it shall be, God declares, that I will pour out my Spirit on all flesh, and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams;”
B. 2Timothy 3:1, “But realize this, that in the last days difficult times will come.”
C.Hebrews 1:2, “In these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world.”
D. James 5:3, “Your gold and your silver have rusted; and their rust will be a witness against you and will consume your flesh like fire. It is in the last days that you have stored up your treasure!”
E. 1Peter 1:20, “For He was foreknown before the foundation of the world, but has appeared in these last times for the sake of you.”

F. 2Peter 3:3, Know this first of all, that in the last days mockers will come with their mocking, following after their own lusts.” Peter confirms the presence of these in his time as testimony that they were in the last days on the first century.
G. 1John 2:18, “Children, it is the last hour; and just as you heard that antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have appeared; from this we know that it is the last hour.”
H. Jude 1:18, “That they were saying to you, 'In the last time there will be mockers, following after their own ungodly lusts.'” Like Peter, Jude confirms the presence of these in his time as testimony to the fact that they were in the last days on the first century and that this was the time prophesied by Enoch.
Brother oldhermit,

I have gone through this thread and taken notes on all your posts, what great spiritual food!

I love to set my mind on His Word and think about it.

I don't have much time, but i'm looking at the N.T. scriptures you gave in part V. of "The Last Days".

I have just a quick observation,

The Apostles knew that Jerusalem would be desolated,

What about the 1900 yrs up until now?

Was there no indication of the time that we are in now?

Are we completely blind in knowing the time of Jesus' appearance?

Brother John
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
Brother EG,

Things are busy around here now.

But I went through every post on this thread.

I was wondering, and maybe you did answer this question somewhere,

what scripture are you using, that Jesus must appear, before the times of the gentiles can end.

Isn't it possible that the ToG's can end without the appearance of Jesus?

Brother John
When jesus returns, Gentile dominion in jerusalem ends.. I use many passages, not just one..

There is a pagan temple on top of the temple mount as we speak. The time of the gentile has ot yet been completed..
 

abcdef

Senior Member
Mar 30, 2016
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When jesus returns, Gentile dominion in jerusalem ends.. I use many passages, not just one..



There is a pagan temple on top of the temple mount as we speak. The time of the gentile has ot yet been completed..
If you could give me a couple of scriptures to study linking the end of the ToG's to the appearance of Jesus, it would be appreciated.
==================================================
I'm thinking that the mosque has little to do with control of Jerusalem.

The military of Israel is in complete control of the temple mt.

No other country has any control there.

Brother John
 
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JaumeJ

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Jul 2, 2011
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I¡Part of the prophecies came true when the Jerusalem of this age was taken back by Israel in the 1967 Six Days War. Israel has , for all practical purposes, taken back Jerusalem from the Gentiles. There is yet much more to be accomplished before our Salvation returns, but the
ToG is a fact now. God bless all in Jesus Christ, amen.

ps.........Jerusalem returned to the control of Israel after two thousand years....


Watch!
 
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abcdef

Senior Member
Mar 30, 2016
2,809
111
63
I¡Part of the prophecies came true when the Jerusalem of this age was taken back by Israel in the 1967 Six Days War. Israel has , for all practical purposes, taken back Jerusalem from the Gentiles. There is yet much more to be accomplished before our Salvation returns, but the
ToG is a fact now. God bless all in Jesus Christ, amen.

ps.........Jerusalem returned to the control of Israel after two thousand years....


Watch!
JaumeJ,

What is your opinion of where we are in the statue of Dan 2?

Brother John
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
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If your reference is the idol of Nebuchadnezzar, we have been at the feet of clay and iron for some time.

I am blessed always by the Book, Daniel, and I always try to read Revelation when I read Daniel or vice versa.

Daniel teaches so much. What I believe I understand I generally keep to myself awaiting it to be revealed or for it to come about. As for the stage of the idol, this seems o be self-evident to any who are not bound by nationalisms or flags other than our Banner.

By the way, thank you for the like, but you may want to retrieve it if yo disagree with my editing after you "liked" it. God bless you always...

JaumeJ,

What is your opinion of where we are in the statue of Dan 2?

Brother John
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
If you could give me a couple of scriptures to study linking the end of the ToG's to the appearance of Jesus, it would be appreciated.
==================================================
I'm thinking that the mosque has little to do with control of Jerusalem.

The military of Israel is in complete control of the temple mt.

No other country has any control there.

Brother John
Dan 2. Statue destroyed by rock, Rock = Christ

Dan 7 Final gentile power destroyed by Christ.

Matt 24, Jesus himself will return and put an end to gentile dominion after the abomination of desolation, and week long power of a future prince, who will come from rome.

rev 19, Final "gentile" Beast destroyed by Christ.


as for the dome of the rock having no significants? I disagree, The punishment for Isreal was to have her city and holy place desolate, The temple is desolate because the dome of the rock sits where it belongs. So it has huge ramification accordingg to end time prophesy.
 

abcdef

Senior Member
Mar 30, 2016
2,809
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63
If your reference is the idol of Nebuchadnezzar, we have been at the feet of clay and iron for some time.

I am blessed always by the Book, Daniel, and I always try to read Revelation when I read Daniel or vice versa.

Daniel teaches so much. What I believe I understand I generally keep to myself awaiting it to be revealed or for it to come about. As for the stage of the idol, this seems o be self-evident to any who are not bound by nationalisms or flags other than our Banner.

By the way, thank you for the like, but you may want to retrieve it if yo disagree with my editing after you "liked" it. God bless you always...
Brother JaumeJ,

I agree with you,

But I think that the statue is complete.

I think that the stone is about to strike.

There are a few more things that have to happen.

What do you think?
==============================
Just to say, I don't think that this is a time to be silent about these issues.

We should talk about them.

The time may be shorter than we think, 1yr? 10 yrs? 20 yrs? 6 mos?

Brother John
 

abcdef

Senior Member
Mar 30, 2016
2,809
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Dan 2. Statue destroyed by rock, Rock = Christ

Dan 7 Final gentile power destroyed by Christ.

Matt 24, Jesus himself will return and put an end to gentile dominion after the abomination of desolation, and week long power of a future prince, who will come from rome.

rev 19, Final "gentile" Beast destroyed by Christ.


as for the dome of the rock having no significants? I disagree, The punishment for Isreal was to have her city and holy place desolate, The temple is desolate because the dome of the rock sits where it belongs. So it has huge ramification accordingg to end time prophesy.
Brother EG,

Thanks for the reply,

I'll get back with you, gotta run.

Brother John
 

valiant

Senior Member
Mar 22, 2015
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Matt 24, Jesus himself will return and put an end to gentile dominion after the abomination of desolation, and week long power of a future prince, who will come from rome.

that's funny, Its not in my bible. they must have missed it out. :(
 

JaumeJ

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Jul 2, 2011
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Because that Stone is to destroy and replace, I believe first we must endure that tribulation that is the greatest ever.

During this tribulation the finite number of souls to have been saved will have been attained. This being so, it stands to reason there will be a vast number of souls that are not to be saved, they may even be demonic.

Those with knowledge will be helped according to Daniel, but only with a ver little help, and they will do works to save many during this tribulation.

The holy people will be scattered. I believe they will be working where ever they are.

We always pray God's will be done, and we should keep these events to come in mind when praying these simple, yet profound words. Above all we must pray for the strength and valor that can only be by the Holy Spirit.

God is going to call His children out of the great whore. It is important to understand she is the mother of whores. It is most important, actually, urgent, that people understand what the Bible is saying when referring to what whoredom is, otherwise they will not hear when God calls.

The vast majority of people who claim to be believers in Jesus Christ pay more attention to the teachings of man, no matter the denomination, than to the teachings of Jesus Christ. If they would but learn from Him, and hear Him,they all would b e at peace and much happier about all that is to come, but I am afraid the greatest impetus to the great falling away will be the coming about of these prophecies and the tribulation.

I pray you and I are made strong and filled with valor for this time that is at the doorway.

May you be in God's hands today and forever, amen..............jack


Brother JaumeJ,

I agree with you,

But I think that the statue is complete.

I think that the stone is about to strike.

There are a few more things that have to happen.

What do you think?
==============================
Just to say, I don't think that this is a time to be silent about these issues.

We should talk about them.

The time may be shorter than we think, 1yr? 10 yrs? 20 yrs? 6 mos?

Brother John
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
that's funny, Its not in my bible. they must have missed it out. :(
Oh its in your bible. Whether you can see it or not. Well thats another issue
 

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
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Brother oldhermit,

I have gone through this thread and taken notes on all your posts, what great spiritual food!

I love to set my mind on His Word and think about it.

I don't have much time, but i'm looking at the N.T. scriptures you gave in part V. of "The Last Days".

I have just a quick observation,

The Apostles knew that Jerusalem would be desolated,

What about the 1900 yrs up until now?

Was there no indication of the time that we are in now?

Are we completely blind in knowing the time of Jesus' appearance?

Brother John
As a matter of clarification so that I will know better how to answer your question, what exactly do you mean when you think of Jesus' appearance? What scriptures do you have in mind? This is important because it will also bring up other questions such as what is the new heaven and the new earth and what is the new Jerusalem that comes down out of heaven.
 

valiant

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Mar 22, 2015
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Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull
Matt 24, Jesus himself will return and put an end to gentile dominion after the abomination of desolation, and week long power of a future prince, who will come from rome.

Oh its in your bible. Whether you can see it or not. Well thats another issue
In Matt 24 it doesn't mention putting an end to Gentile dominion, or the week long power of a future coming prince of Rome.

You are fantasising based on an incorrect interpretation of Daniel 9

You have turned the simple into the very complicated (and wrong) by your theories based on heretical beliefs from 19 th century
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
In Matt 24 it doesn't mention putting an end to Gentile dominion, or the week long power of a future coming prince of Rome.

You are fantasising based on an incorrect interpretation of Daniel 9

You have turned the simple into the very complicated (and wrong) by your theories based on heretical beliefs from 19 th century
whatever,

And please stop with your attacks, they are getting old.

I told you I would not respond to childish nonsense anymore..

(your only argument against me is I am fantasizing, And have a theory based on some heretical belief of some 19th century whatever. No actual facts)

Just because you say something does not make it true.

You provide no fact, no reasoning, only childish argument

when you want to start giving proof not opinion. Please come lets talk.. until then, Please leave your comments to yourself. they are helping no one.

 

valiant

Senior Member
Mar 22, 2015
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whatever,

And please stop with your attacks, they are getting old.

I told you I would not respond to childish nonsense anymore..

(your only argument against me is I am fantasizing, And have a theory based on some heretical belief of some 19th century whatever. No actual facts)

Just because you say something does not make it true.

You provide no fact, no reasoning, only childish argument

when you want to start giving proof not opinion. Please come lets talk.. until then, Please leave your comments to yourself. they are helping no one.

it is easy to prove that your interpretation of Daniel 9 is wrong, but the place is not here. I showed that you misinformed about what the Scriptures said by reading in what was not there. You just havent the grace to admit it,
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
it is easy to prove that your interpretation of Daniel 9 is wrong, but the place is not here. I showed that you misinformed about what the Scriptures said by reading in what was not there. You just havent the grace to admit it,
Again with the childish comments. and outright personal attack

Do we need to get mods involved?
 

valiant

Senior Member
Mar 22, 2015
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Originally Posted by valiant
it is easy to prove that your interpretation of Daniel 9 is wrong, but the place is not here. I showed that you misinformed about what the Scriptures said by reading in what was not there. You just havent the grace to admit it,
Again with the childish comments. and outright personal attack

Do we need to get mods involved?
Those comments were factual and true. You pretended that Matt 24 said what it did not say. It was neither childish nor personal. Call the mods if you wish. you are good at doing that,