Joel Osteen book "Your Best Life Now"

Stunnedbygrace · Feb 23, 2018

What bothers me is that she thinks we do something wrong, so she sets out to show us what she thinks we do wrong with subterfuge and manipulation. She begins a thread titled Joel Osteen your best life now. Then she asks that we read a review on the book by a certain man. Then she says the thread was not about what she led us to believe it was about but that instead it was some sort of net for our feet, to catch us in our wrongdoing ( she thinks). As near as I can grasp, our wrongdoing is that we won't listen to the WOF guy about a book review (which as it turns out isn't really a book review but she just wanted us to BELIEVE it was). And if we won't listen to it because we are convinced it will just be another pamphlet, then that apparently proves that we have never read or listened to Osteen, which I personally have, so it didn't prove what she wanted to prove, at least in my case.

Its the manipulation and subterfuge that annoys me. I want to be spoken plainly to and not be manipulated and all of you should expect the same of me. She caught her feet in the net she intended for ours.

Stunnedbygrace · Feb 23, 2018

I will gladly be called an aggressor if I can snatch back the foot of one person who is ready to be snatched away by the leaven of men. It calls for a certain amount of aggression when we know how difficult leaven is to remove and the damage it does to our growth and wholeness and soundness of mind.

eternally-gratefull · Feb 23, 2018

JGIG said:

Hey sis.

I am just sick of it,, That is my point, people can only do so much, when you have to throw your hands up.

The Bible tells us to work out our salvation for fear and trembling, because we are lights in a fallen world and not to put ourselves in a position where we will be blameless and harmless people without fault to a wicked generation (not sinless. But above reproach)

I think mr Olsteen has failed in that area. If he did not, we would not be having this conversation.

here is the way I see it,

If Joaniemarie believes something, Say it, in your own words. You do not have to post all these books. These pamphlets, these saying from people who will cause contention based on the fact of who they are alone (ie, joseph prince, Joel olsteen, Drt Ellis) just tell us in your own words. Let’s discuss that,. I said the same thing to Grace777, in fact begged him to stop posting videos from people with questionable integrity or teachings, even if you agreed with the them on the actual topic he was posting. The Hyper grace war started SOLELY on the fact of videos posted by Jospeh prince. Did those ideas have to be posted to make his point? No. And the message was missed because he used a source which many people can not stand.

I stood up for Joaniemarie and Grace777 and Ben and Willy because the lies against the gospel they were preaching (saved by grace through faith) was refuted, they kept claiming that the people were preaching things which were not true,

Many of the things Grace777 and Joanie posted I may have agreed with. (Many I did not. But we could not even discuss that meaningfully because of the war against hypergrace and WOF) yet like I told G777 over and over again, we could have actually discussed those things if they put them in their own words. But since they were works of people who others can not stand because of their WOF doctrines, or other doctrines, or what they deem as easy greasy grace or whatever, No one can have any meaningful discussion.

THAT is what I am sick of.. And THAT is why I said I can no longer stand by while Joanie keeps on doing this stuff and defend her.

Is this not a bible discussion forum? Why can’t we discuss the Bibl?

Why does their always seem to be wars over what charismatics, or what word of faith people or what chatholics believe? I am not just sick of word of faith, I am sick of them all.. We all should be.. If you ant to discuss how you think God blesses people. Lets discuss that, Lets not discuss word of faith. Lets discuss blessing s and what they are. Biblically speaking, not what some plaster says.

eternally-gratefull · Feb 23, 2018

eternally-gratefull said:

Hey sis.

I am just sick of it,, That is my point, people can only do so much, when you have to throw your hands up.

The Bible tells us to work out our salvation for fear and trembling, because we are lights in a fallen world and not to put ourselves in a position where we will be blameless and harmless people without fault to a wicked generation (not sinless. But above reproach)

I think mr Olsteen has failed in that area. If he did not, we would not be having this conversation.

here is the way I see it,

If Joaniemarie believes something, Say it, in your own words. You do not have to post all these books. These pamphlets, these saying from people who will cause contention based on the fact of who they are alone (ie, joseph prince, Joel olsteen, Drt Ellis) just tell us in your own words. Let’s discuss that,. I said the same thing to Grace777, in fact begged him to stop posting videos from people with questionable integrity or teachings, even if you agreed with the them on the actual topic he was posting. The Hyper grace war started SOLELY on the fact of videos posted by Jospeh prince. Did those ideas have to be posted to make his point? No. And the message was missed because he used a source which many people can not stand.

I stood up for Joaniemarie and Grace777 and Ben and Willy because the lies against the gospel they were preaching (saved by grace through faith) was refuted, they kept claiming that the people were preaching things which were not true,

Many of the things Grace777 and Joanie posted I may have agreed with. (Many I did not. But we could not even discuss that meaningfully because of the war against hypergrace and WOF) yet like I told G777 over and over again, we could have actually discussed those things if they put them in their own words. But since they were works of people who others can not stand because of their WOF doctrines, or other doctrines, or what they deem as easy greasy grace or whatever, No one can have any meaningful discussion.

THAT is what I am sick of.. And THAT is why I said I can no longer stand by while Joanie keeps on doing this stuff and defend her.

Is this not a bible discussion forum? Why can’t we discuss the Bibl?

Why does their always seem to be wars over what charismatics, or what word of faith people or what chatholics believe? I am not just sick of word of faith, I am sick of them all.. We all should be.. If you ant to discuss how you think God blesses people. Lets discuss that, Lets not discuss word of faith. Lets discuss blessing s and what they are. Biblically speaking, not what some plaster says.

5 minutes got me, That last line should say pastor not plaster..lol And I would add, minister or televangelist says also.

Stunnedbygrace · Feb 23, 2018

eternally-gratefull said:

Well...that was quite funny...a plasterer of pamphlets...

JGIG · Feb 23, 2018

p_rehbein said:

So Christians are not allowed to be wealthy?

If you invent a very useful contraption, that sells like hotcakes and makes you gobs of money, say, $10 million per year, and you give half (or some other large percentage) of it away each year, are you not allowed to keep what you've earned? Buy a nice house? Upgrade your vehicle or buy your dream tractor (if you have land to maintain with your nice house, lol)? Because you are a Christian? Where is that mandated in New Covenant Scripture?

Vows of poverty are extra-biblical, and really, most believers don't honestly consider what a true vow of poverty would entail.

Let me reiterate: I'm not a Joel Osteen fan. His preaching is a bit floofy for me, though I recognize that encouraging the Body of Christ is what he's been called to do, and that's what he does. He does not preach health and wealth for the sake of being well and rich, but to be able to minister to others out of ability and surplus. If you're sick all the time, your capacity to work in the harvest is hampered. So take care of yourself - improve your outlook on life, and see how God walks with you - no matter what. We've walked through serious childhood cancer with one of our seven children (stage 4 metastatic brain and spine cancer), so I'm not speaking without knowing something about this.

Do you walk through such a thing with a woe-is-me attitude, wondering if God - at worst - is judging you or your family or at best, 'trying to teach you something' (not uncommon teaching in many segments of the Body), or do you recognize that we live in a fallen world which will touch our lives in hard ways sometimes and choose to trust that God is a Good Shepherd through it all no matter the outcome, and no matter your doubts and fears along the way?

When there is financial lack, again, do you walk through with a woe-is-me attitude, begrudging those who have plenty, or do you choose to trust in God's provision, however meager it may seem at the time, find something to do about your situation, and take joy in whatever opportunities you find? Or do you humbly accept help when it's provided, also receiving that provision with joy? When finances improve, is there guilt, or thankfulness?

The older I get, the more I see that so many in the Body are just plain crabby and discontent with who and/or where they are in life. And much of that is self-inflicted, rooted in attitude. Paul has some things to say about that - and not in a condemning way, but in a redemptive way.

To condemn Joel Osteen for trying to get folks to look at life with optimism and choosing to trust God through whatever-life-throws-at-them is, well, it just isn't right.

On the essentials of the Christian faith, Osteen is sound. The rest - you and everyone else has the right to take him or leave him without excoriating him. In my opinion, the Body of Christ needs more encouraging and building up rather than the beat-downs that they often get from much preaching today.

Please don't misunderstand - much of this post isn't directed at you, in particular, just some thoughts that have come to mind in the course of the discussion

.

-JGIG

Stunnedbygrace · Feb 23, 2018

You are missing a lot JGIG. Her posts about Job and sickness for one.

Her very own teaching and the teachings of others she posts say that your child , or you, did not have the faith to be healed. So what you have said I can agree with - what you said about both wealth and health. But she teaches something different. You have missed it. You have missed the why of the harshness she is treated with.

Nice to see you again, BTW.

eternally-gratefull · Feb 23, 2018

JGIG said:

So Christians are not allowed to be wealthy?

If you invent a very useful contraption, that sells like hotcakes and makes you gobs of money, say, $10 million per year, and you give half (or some other large percentage) of it away each year, are you not allowed to keep what you've earned? Buy a nice house? Upgrade your vehicle or buy your dream tractor (if you have land to maintain with your nice house, lol)? Because you are a Christian? Where is that mandated in New Covenant Scripture?

Vows of poverty are extra-biblical, and really, most believers don't honestly consider what a true vow of poverty would entail.

Let me reiterate: I'm not a Joel Osteen fan. His preaching is a bit floofy for me, though I recognize that encouraging the Body of Christ is what he's been called to do, and that's what he does. He does not preach health and wealth for the sake of being well and rich, but to be able to minister to others out of ability and surplus. If you're sick all the time, your capacity to work in the harvest is hampered. So take care of yourself - improve your outlook on life, and see how God walks with you - no matter what. We've walked through serious childhood cancer with one of our seven children (stage 4 metastatic brain and spine cancer), so I'm not speaking without knowing something about this.

Do you walk through such a thing with a woe-is-me attitude, wondering if God - at worst - is judging you or your family or at best, 'trying to teach you something' (not uncommon teaching in many segments of the Body), or do you recognize that we live in a fallen world which will touch our lives in hard ways sometimes and choose to trust that God is a Good Shepherd through it all no matter the outcome, and no matter your doubts and fears along the way?

When there is financial lack, again, do you walk through with a woe-is-me attitude, begrudging those who have plenty, or do you choose to trust in God's provision, however meager it may seem at the time, find something to do about your situation, and take joy in whatever opportunities you find? Or do you humbly accept help when it's provided, also receiving that provision with joy? When finances improve, is there guilt, or thankfulness?

The older I get, the more I see that so many in the Body are just plain crabby and discontent with who and/or where they are in life. And much of that is self-inflicted, rooted in attitude. Paul has some things to say about that - and not in a condemning way, but in a redemptive way.

To condemn Joel Osteen for trying to get folks to look at life with optimism and choosing to trust God through whatever-life-throws-at-them is, well, it just isn't right.

On the essentials of the Christian faith, Osteen is sound. The rest - you and everyone else has the right to take him or leave him without excoriating him. In my opinion, the Body of Christ needs more encouraging and building up rather than the beat-downs that they often get from much preaching today.

Please don't misunderstand - much of this post isn't directed at you, in particular, just some thoughts that have come to mind in the course of the discussion

.

-JGIG

once again sis, This is not about an argument about people being blessed By God with money, or even healing, everyone here i am sure has witnessed God healing anothe person in a way you can nto deny it was him,

It is about gods will for ALL people to be bless or healed. (Physically or financially vs spiritually I may add)

PennEd · Feb 23, 2018

JGIG said:

There is nothing inherently wrong with wealth. After all, wealth is a relative term. Virtually EVERYONE in the developed west are in the top 5% of wealthiest people on Earth, and most are in the top 1%.

I don't know what Joel, Joyce Meyer, or some of the other incredibly wealthy Christians do to help the poor. And I WILL NOT judge them by simply their wealth.

The issue is SEEKING wealth, and the idea that God's desire and plan is for us to be wealthy in THIS life, and also to have perfect health. Some even preach against persecutions!

THIS should be the mindset of every Christian:

Philipians:4[FONT=&quot]10 But I rejoiced in the Lord greatly that now at last your care for me has flourished again; though you surely did care, but you lacked opportunity. [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT][FONT=&quot]11 Not that I speak in regard to need, for I have learned in whatever state I am, to be CONTENT: [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT][FONT=&quot]12 I know how to be abased, and I know how to abound. Everywhere and in all things I have learned both to be full and to be hungry, both to abound and to suffer need. [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT][FONT=&quot]13 I can do all things through Christ[b] who strengthens me.

[/FONT]BTW, it IS nice to see you back. I consider myself a "hypergracer"! Just cannot get onboard with the health and wealth prosperity doctrine, and I don't think it's because the Holy Spirit hasn't opened my eyes to it yet. I think He is mercifully keeping them shut!

wolfwint · Feb 23, 2018

JGIG said:

From, "Are There Wealthy People in the Bible?"

Dr. Glenn Sunshine and Dr. Jay Richards both point to the Old Testament examples of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob – these patriarchs of the faith were wealthy men. Job was also wealthy. Sunshine points out that these examples remind us that:

Although Scripture has some very harsh things to say about the wealthy, this does not mean that all of them are evil or under divine judgment. Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and Job were rich and yet were also approved by God. Just as poverty doesn’t guarantee virtue, wealth does not guarantee vice.

In his discussion of Acts 2-5, Art Lindsley lists several examples from the New Testament of wealthy believers who gave generously to those in need. Among these Christians are:

Joseph, called Barnabas (Acts 4:36-37)
Dorcas (Acts 9:36)
Cornelius (Acts 10:1)
Sergius Paulus (Acts 13:6-12)
Lydia (Acts 16:14-15)
Jason (Acts 17:5-9)
Aquila and Priscilla (Acts 18:2-3)
Mnason of Cyprus (Acts 21:16)
Philemon (Philemon 1)

These believers lived faithful Christian lives in addition to enjoying wealth. It’s important to take note of the example they set. Art makes a point of saying these people “were wealthy and gave generously.” Their actions illustrate the responsibilities placed upon the wealthy because of how they have been blessed.

In an earlier post, Glenn Sunshine digs deeper into the obligations of the rich, saying,

Scripture is very clear that the wealthy have obligations to the poor that God takes very seriously.

Among the obligations Sunshine lists are:

Treating the poor with fairness.
Not using the courts to defraud the poor.
Not taking advantage of another’s misfortune.
Preserving the dignity of the poor by providing opportunities for work.

We encourage you to read more of Dr. Sunshine’s series to learn more about this topic.
Again, God’s real concern, Sunshine writes, is not necessarily with wealth or poverty, but with righteousness and justice.
_______________________________________________________________________________

Some good food for thought.

-JGIG

I see a different to be wealthy and to get wealth trough selling the gospel. The last one i find questionable. I suppose in bible you find no christian who became rich trough telling the gospel

Depleted · Feb 23, 2018

NoobSaibot said:

Do you know why shepherds have staffs? Not for the sheep. Sheep are easily managed, so never need a staff.

Sometimes staffs are for walking over tough terrain. Sometimes they're used to fight against bears and wolves.

What she is doing isn't Christian. And the response to it ought to be the tough end of the staff. The one often used by the Lord in his word.

Act 13:41 "'Look, you scoffers, be astounded and perish; for I am doing a work in your days, a work that you will not believe, even if one tells it to you.'"

Depleted · Feb 23, 2018

BenFTW said:

I see you've really thought it over after I called you passive-aggressive. Too bad you never considered it's not a good thing, so you should stop being it.

And, I dare you to call me passive-aggressive. I've got no passive in me!

As for confirming the OP? What about it? That she is once again pamphleting this forum and we're not falling for it? Or, "wow, what a great review of an awful book?"

Because let's be real, have you watched the 1984 guide to promoting "the gospel of positive thinking" yourself? No, you came on here to defend the heretics of the positive thinking gospel's pampheleter... passive-aggressively. Show me the love in your passive-aggressive sermon?

Speaking of ungodly behavior!

Depleted · Feb 23, 2018

BenFTW said:

Clue: The powers of positive thinking/WoF is not Christ!

7seasrekeyed · Feb 23, 2018

this thread is nonsensical

really and truly just plain silly

do book reviews even belong in the BDF?

nope. they would actually work in miscellaneous but in this case, conspiracy forum might be a better fit

7seasrekeyed · Feb 23, 2018

ma'am...I would suggest that YOU are the one disassembling the word of God and blaming your mishandling of it on those who wish you no harm, but are rather, and understandably so, irritated at your posturing and attempt at appearing to be some innocent that has fallen on a group of people who just do not understand how wonderful your posts are

The word “healed” as translated from both Hebrew and Greek, can mean either spiritual or physical healing. However, the contexts of Isaiah 53 and 1 Peter 2 make it clear that they are referring to spiritual healing, not physical. “He himself bore our sins in his body on the tree, so that we might die to sins and live for righteousness; by his wounds you have been healed” (1 Peter 2:24). The verse is referring to sin and righteousness, not sickness and disease. Therefore, being “healed” in both these verses is speaking of being forgiven and saved, not being physically healed.

we need to understand the Bible in context

while there certainly are people who are healed there are also, most certainly those who are not healed and in fact the latter would be the majority

the fact that anyone prays at all for healing, is PROOF that people believe God can and does heal

as Jesus said faith even as small as a mustard seed was sufficient, it is nonsensical to say someone does not have enough faith to be healed

as Jesus had to die for our sins to be forgiven, yet He healed many before his death and resurrection, it is not truthful to say He healing is in the atonement when it is OBVIOUS God healed before Jesus even came to the earth

the confusion lies in inserting one's teachings or personal beliefs INTO a passage that does not fit the ideas being entertained and then saying 'here is proof'

1. God heals today

2. God does not heal everybody...in fact the majority are not healed

3. Faith is indicated in ANY prayer...God hears prayer. The Bible says so

4. God does NOT need truckloads of faith to heal someone. God does not derive extra power to heal from the faith of a human being

5. God is merciful and does not taunt people nor offer promises and then not keep them. The entire fault lies at the feet of those who say that God's will is for everyone to be healed and Isaiah 53 proves it.

as indicated above, that is NOT what Jesus died for. He died to restore God's creation to Himself.

Speak2Me · Feb 23, 2018

Amos 3:3 Can two walk together, except they be agreed?

7seasrekeyed · Feb 23, 2018

you know, I really don't care because people are going to watch and believe whatever they want and they are free to do that and that is between them and God

however, the Bible being distorted and misapplied, is what I do care about

Speak2Me · Feb 23, 2018

Amos 3:3 Can two walk together, except they be agreed?

Speak2Me · Feb 23, 2018

Amos 3:3 Can two walk together, except they be agreed?

Speak2Me · Feb 23, 2018

Amos 3:3 Can two walk together, except they be agreed?

Can you walk with TBN, & not be agreed?

Joel Osteen book "Your Best Life Now"

Senior Member

Senior Member

eternally-gratefull

Guest

eternally-gratefull

Guest

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

eternally-gratefull

Guest

Senior Member

Senior Member

Depleted

Guest

Depleted

Guest

Depleted

Guest

7seasrekeyed

Guest

7seasrekeyed

Guest

Banned

7seasrekeyed

Guest

Banned

Banned

Banned