Lasciviousness...

[blessedjohn80]

Where many stumble on this is think it is out of freedom people sin. It is not. It is slavery that causes men to sin. But the Spirit of Truth sets us free to love. This is our original design.

This is exactly on point. The belief that people will purposely sin because of freedom is just wrong. If God Who has absolute freedom does not sin then so should it be for those who are created in the image of God.

If you think about the word "freedom" and associate it with sin then there's definitely something wrong with how you view God and His people.

 

[disciplemike]

A variety of answers.
It seems many of the early posters were saying that lasciviousness is equal to trying to obey God's law.
I am pretty sure that is not correct, but keep posting. I am reading.

 

[posthuman]

wow amazing how someone posting a text In scripture seems to cause so much hatred makes one wonder.....

there's a subtext. because of the person who posted it, many assume he means to use this verse to condemn people who don't keep the days and foods of the old covenant. which is completely not the application ((in the context)) of this verse.

it is right that whoever forgets that the Lord Christ has accomplished the fulfilling of the old covenant and brought in a new forgets the gospel, and that by adding to His perfect work His perfect work is denied. but that is not what Jude is writing about.

i agree with NarrowRoadDisciple, in his post here

look, Jude then compares such people with the example of unbelief in the wilderness, and with the sin of Sodom and Gomorrah. i think we all know the sin of those cities: unbelief and pride, leading to gluttony, laziness and sexual immorality, for which they became an example not only to us but even to all the Arabs.
there were apparently not only those who would trample the grace of God in order to exchange it for establishing their own righteousness, as the epistles warn of in other places, but also those who went around proclaiming His grace as though it is license to sin. the same thing Paul addresses and rejects when he points out that the law was brought in so sin might increase, and as sin abounded, God's grace abounded even more, and asks what, should we sin all the more so grace should increase all the more too?

may it never be so!!

but Paul does not instruct gentiles to keep the feasts and days and customs of the old covenant any more than he ever teaches anyone to sin.

 

[LaurenTM]

A variety of answers.
It seems many of the early posters were saying that lasciviousness is equal to trying to obey God's law.
I am pretty sure that is not correct, but keep posting. I am reading.

even you don't believe what you wrote

you have now sunk to a new low

you are simply BAITING people here

you're reading? could be, but you are actually disregarding and inserting your own religious bias which is not biblical...it sure is religious however

this is just another case of BAITING

 

[LaurenTM]

wow amazing how someone posting a text In scripture seems to cause so much hatred makes one wonder.....

actually I'm wondering about why you consistently post in defence of threads that are designed to BAIT people into arguing

the op knows very well what people here believe and he also knows how people will respond, so he is posting in a more flamboyantly obvious way...this is nothing short of a deliberate attempt to revive his flagging efforts at convincing everyone he has found true religion

your outrage is ridiculous

 

[miknik5]

It means they went out from us making manifest that though they claimed to be with us they never were. For had they even understood what it meant from the beginning they never would have gone out and never would have suggested or done against the BODY what they suggest and do which is contrary to THE BODY

 

[miknik5]

It's the difference between those who REMAIN IN HIM and those who don't

 

[PeterJens]

People who are trying to convince us to follow the law for salvation.

Now how can anyone seriously think this is a correct assessment of "Lasciviousness"

Only hatred of the proposition about following the law, puts the two concept together.
But this illuminates a common emotional hatred not an actual connection.

Jude is obviously condemning sexual immorality and other traits,

"These people are grumblers and faultfinders; they follow their own evil desires; they boast about themselves and flatter others for their own advantage."
Jude 1:16

Now those who truly follow Christ can spot hatred and emnity anywhere.
I do not approve of legalist who justify themselves by acts of obedience and
not Christ, but equally I do not see lying and connecting opposite concepts
is following the Lord.

Jesus calls us to walk with a pure heart, to speak the truth in love, even against
those we oppose. If you truly want to follow Christ, you need to examine yourself
and check you are not following you emotional hurts of the past and letting love
rule.

But I unfortunately predict most of you will see me also as your enemy, so will
regard these words with emnity as well. But in truth until we can share in love,
we are sharing about our failures and not the Lords work in us.

 

[miknik5]

GOD knows how to discipline HIS CHILDREN just as HE knows how to keep the ungodly for the day of destruction

it is better to be convicted by GOD of hidden sins than to not be convicted of hidden sins

For the alternative to GOD's discipline and rebuke (when one who belongs to HIM sins) is a seared conscience and the storing up of HIS wrath to the day

 

[miknik5]

So who wants to confess their hidden sins of lasciviousness?

 

[FreeNChrist]

We can go all day

I have faith

I have works

Faith and Works = Salvation

I applaud you for at least being open and honest about what you actually believe.

 

[PeterJens]

this is just another case of BAITING

This is just another case of slander.

It is legitimate to ask a question that Jude is asking.
The debate over what is freedom is Christ and what is sin has been going on throughout
church history. However one personally falls in the divide, it is a very important question.

And we are called to walk in the light and discuss all the outcomes as they come to us.
This is the reason for this forum, to pursue such questions.

Now for those who feel they know the answers and only evil people would disagree with
them then this is really frustrating and only the enemy could be doing this, rather than
this is actually an essential question, and a dilemma we all face.

Sabbath observance is a church tradition from the beginning and doing no business on
sunday something our societies have stuck with for centuries. So it is literally blind and
miss-leading to ignore such issues, except if you want to brain wash people into certain
behaviours which is by-itself anti christian.

 

[miknik5]

Until there is evidence that any here are doing these things than it is all just a case of slander

 

[miknik5]

Here's the main issue in those who claim to be of HIS BODY:

we font personally know one another. We do not know each other's lives we do not share with one another our lives so here we are just pointing fingers at one another accusing each other

thw church back then and least had evidence of this before their very eyes

 

[miknik5]

If you see your brother's sin tell it to h

if you don't, don't accuse him

 

[miknik5]

And then of course there are those who were never baptized into THE BODY but speak as if they can direct those who have been baptized by the hand of GOD into THE BODY

Those were the ones who "crept in"

They didn't have the RIGHT WEDDING GARMENT from the beginning! And they didn't even know it

 

[Jimbone]

Trying to explain that GRACE is what changes us .................Is impossible to explain to those who have never tasted it or to those who have quenched it.

Well I understand what you're saying, but I don't think they are saying "you have to keep they law to be saved" like you are accusing them of. Just the same as you are not saying "once we have grace we can then sin all we want" like they accuse you of. Once I was saved His Spirit leads me to WANT to do what pleases Him. Is that hard to understand? I am under the impression that if one is really saved they WILL produce fruit (or works), not in fear ever, but in love and gratitude. I do have to admit at times they way it's worded does seem like they might be suggesting "works" are what keep you saved, but never have I seen 1 person on here suggest that works are what save you. On the other side I have read comments that make doing anything for the Lord seem like a bad thing, like if you do any works you are not trusting God and in turn are not saved. That is just as bad, if not a bit worse in my honest opinion because it leads false converts into a false sense of security. It did me for years. Not to say the other extreme doesn't happen, get too "works based" or legalistic and you can run people off, or scare them away too. I think the truth is in the middle somewhere and I just pray that one day we can come together and find it.

If one is truly saved by the creator of EVERYTHING in the universe they it WILL be evident in their life bottom line, some may change faster, some may take longer, but ALL will be molded to His will. The Spirit leads us all to truth.

 

[PeterJens]

Until there is evidence that any here are doing these things than it is all just a case of slander

I agree with this point. I would suggest very few groups are following Lasciviousness.

One does come to mind the Children of God, who pushed terrible sexual behaviour, and
felt oppressed by society, which I would say for good reason.

So these groups do exist and have existed in the past.

I met one christian who felt marriage was no longer a boundary, and serial relationships
were within Gods way of grace. But I have not heard this preached or taught by any
group.

But again this is why it is important to discuss such ideas and truly pin them down.

 

[miknik5]

I agree with this point. I would suggest very few groups are following Lasciviousness.

One does come to mind the Children of God, who pushed terrible sexual behaviour, and
felt oppressed by society, which I would say for good reason.

So these groups do exist and have existed in the past.

I met one christian who felt marriage was no longer a boundary, and serial relationships
were within Gods way of grace. But I have not heard this preached or taught by any
group.

But again this is why it is important to discuss such ideas and truly pin them down.

can you tell me what supposed "child of GOD" pushed terrible sexual behavior? Do you mean the sons of Eli?

because according to GOD they were
considered sons of belial

 

[PeterJens]

can you tell me what supposed "child of GOD" pushed terrible sexual behavior? Do you mean the sons of Eli?

because according to GOD they were
considered sons of belial

The Family International (TFI) is a new religious movement that started in 1968 in Huntington Beach, California, USA. It was initially called Teens for Christ and later gained fame as The Children of God (COG).