lets nut this Sabbath thing out one point at a time. Point 2

[Hamster]

God rested on the seventh day from all his work Genesis 2:3 But there was no mention of the sabbath being unto the Lord until it was mention in the law of Moses, Exodus 16:23. The Sabbath was given to those under the law, Exodus 16:23-30. The seven day was the Sabbath, Exodus 16:26. When Christ died the first day of the week was given to remember the Lord with breaking of bread, Acts 20:7.

I hope this will help!

 

[john832]

You just have no clue what grace is. Or faith for that matter. Grace and law are mutually exclusive. I know that's a stumbling stone to you and other law-cultists, but that's the way it was designed to exclude from the kingdom those who glory in laws (that they don't even keep), but don't have faith.

So, you would teach the following?

Grace = Anarchy

Do as you please?

Jdg 21:25 In those days there was no king in Israel: every man did that which was right in his own eyes.

 

[Brother_Don]

The serenity prayer is a nice prayer. God grant me the serenity to accept the things i can not change, the courage to change the things i can, and the wisdom to know the difference,written by Francis of Assisi.

 

[john832]

God rested on the seventh day from all his work Genesis 2:3 But there was no mention of the sabbath being unto the Lord until it was mention in the law of Moses, Exodus 16:23.

Gen 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
Gen 2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Exo 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

You left the part out about sanctifying and hallowingh the very first Sabbath, the seventh day of creation week. It has been in effect ever since.

The Sabbath was given to those under the law, Exodus 16:23-30. The seven day was the Sabbath, Exodus 16:26.

Interesting you should bring up Ex 16:26 without quoting verses 17 and 18...

Exo 16:26 Six days ye shall gather it; but on the seventh day, which is the sabbath, in it there shall be none.
Exo 16:27 And it came to pass, that there went out some of the people on the seventh day for to gather, and they found none.
Exo 16:28 And the LORD said unto Moses, How long refuse ye to keep my commandments and my laws?

Now this was stated prior to the "giving of the Law" on Mt. Sinai. God asked how long they would refuse to keep His Commandments and His Laws. Laws and Commandments that were already in force.

When Christ died the first day of the week was given to remember the Lord with breaking of bread, Acts 20:7.

I hope this will help!

It doesn't hlep when you leave out important imformation...

First of all, Christ did NOT die on the first day of the week. The Passover He died on occured on Wedesday, April 25, 31AD (by today's calendar). He was buried at sunset and was in the tomb three days and three nights. He arose at/about sunset on Sabbath afternoon.

The three days and three nights should not really be discussed in this thread, it needs a thread of it's own.

Acts 20:7 from the Diaglott...

Act 20:7 In and the first of the sabbaths, having been assembled of us to break bread, the Paul discoursed to them, being about to depart on the morrow; continued and the discourse till midnight.

Dr. Bullinger sheds some light on what the first of the Sabbaths is...

"first, &c. = first day of the sabbaths, i.e. the first day for reckoning the seven sabbaths to Pentecost. It depended upon the harvest (Deu_16:9), and was always from the morrow after the weekly sabbath when the wave sheaf was presented (Lev_23:15)."

Again, that is outside the one point of this thread and needs a separate thread to address it.

Suffice it to say, Acts 20:7 is not speaking to church service on the first day of the week.

 

[john832]

Paul already addressed that. Grace and faith are not lawless.

Lemme see, Grace and Faith are not Lawlessness?

Mat 7:23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

word for lawlessness is...

G458
ἀνομία
anomia
an-om-ee'-ah
From G459; illegality, that is, violation of law or (generally) wickedness: - iniquity, X transgress (-ion of) the law, unrighteousness.

from Thayer...

G458
ἀνομία
anomia
Thayer Definition:
1) the condition of without law
1a) because ignorant of it
1b) because of violating it
2) contempt and violation of law, iniquity, wickedness
Part of Speech: noun feminine
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: from G459
Citing in TDNT: 4:1085, 646

And in the another post you assure us that...

You just have no clue what grace is. Or faith for that matter. Grace and law are mutually exclusive. I know that's a stumbling stone to you and other law-cultists, but that's the way it was designed to exclude from the kingdom those who glory in laws (that they don't even keep), but don't have faith.

For grace to exclude Law, then there is no Law. Presto, LAWLESSNESS!

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Lemme see, Grace and Faith are not Lawlessness?

Mat 7:23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

word for lawlessness is...

G458
ἀνομία
anomia
an-om-ee'-ah
From G459; illegality, that is, violation of law or (generally) wickedness: - iniquity, X transgress (-ion of) the law, unrighteousness.

from Thayer...

G458
ἀνομία
anomia
Thayer Definition:
1) the condition of without law
1a) because ignorant of it
1b) because of violating it
2) contempt and violation of law, iniquity, wickedness
Part of Speech: noun feminine
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: from G459
Citing in TDNT: 4:1085, 646

And in the another post you assure us that...

For grace to exclude Law, then there is no Law. Presto, LAWLESSNESS!

You obviously are an unbeliever.

And this is [GOD's] commandment: that we believe in the name of his Son Jesus Christ and love one another, just as he commanded us. 1 John 3:23

Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God: that you believe into the one whom that one sent.” John 6:29​

 

[john832]

You obviously are an unbeliever.

And this is [GOD's] commandment: that we believe in the name of his Son Jesus Christ and love one another, just as he commanded us. 1 John 3:23

Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God: that you believe into the one whom that one sent.” John 6:29​

Well, I don't believe what you teach, if that is what you mean. I do believe what I find written in the Bible...

2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

Mat 19:16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
Mat 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

1Jn 5:2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
1Jn 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

Difference is I believe ALL scripture, not just the ones I carefully excise from the text.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Well, I don't believe what you teach, if that is what you mean. I do believe what I find written in the Bible...

2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

Mat 19:16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
Mat 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

1Jn 5:2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
1Jn 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

Difference is I believe ALL scripture, not just the ones I carefully excise from the text.

If you set the words of Moses above the words of Christ by not believing them, you don't believe any of it.

Do not think that I will accuse you before the Father! The one who accuses you is Moses, in whom you have put your hope! For if you had believed Moses, you would believe me, for that one wrote about me. But if you do not believe that one’s writings, how will you believe my words?” John 5:45-47​

 

[john832]

If you set the words of Moses above the words of Christ by not believing them, you don't believe any of it.

Do not think that I will accuse you before the Father! The one who accuses you is Moses, in whom you have put your hope! For if you had believed Moses, you would believe me, for that one wrote about me. But if you do not believe that one’s writings, how will you believe my words?” John 5:45-47​

I do believe Christ. I believe that He paid the price for my sins. I believe that we are saved by grace through the faith of Christ. I also believe the rest of the story (apologies to the late Paul Harvey), that God requires us to keep His Commandments...

Mat 19:16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
Mat 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

You see, I believe this...

Mat 4:4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

I do believe Christ. I believe that He paid the price for my sins. I believe that we are saved by grace through the faith of Christ. I also believe the rest of the story (apologies to the late Paul Harvey), that God requires us to keep His Commandments...

Mat 19:16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
Mat 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

You see, I believe this...

Mat 4:4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

You called faith lawlessness. Therefore, you are lawless for disregarding the ultimate commandment of GOD.

 

[RuthHannah]

You called faith lawlessness. Therefore, you are lawless for disregarding the ultimate commandment of GOD.

Shoul we have faith in the blood of Jesus ? Why

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Shoul we have faith in the blood of Jesus ? Why

Of course. Because that is what saves.

 

[doseofreality]

According to the bible, the sabbath day was the seventh day in the week. It did not specify what day the seventh day was. Therefore, any person can pick their seventh day and call it sabbath. In conclusion, it doesn't matter what specific day the sabbath was or is on.

 

[Josh321]

I'm more concerned for the harm lawless teachers do to the weak in the faith.

because we are under the grace of God we are considered lawless?

 

[Josh321]

You just have no clue what grace is. Or faith for that matter. Grace and law are mutually exclusive. I know that's a stumbling stone to you and other law-cultists, but that's the way it was designed to exclude from the kingdom those who glory in laws (that they don't even keep), but don't have faith.

when we have faith to accept christ GOD himself makes us Holy, because his spirit is living in the believers, since we are righteous from the holy spirit that is why all that is required is to love your neighbor as you would yourself and love does no ill treatment against your neighbor, the first testament which was the keeping of the commandments Physically was a shadow of things to come because God fulfills the commandment through his spirit from the death of the cross so when anyone have faith to believe on him they are made righteous immediately that is why the law is not required to be kept physically anymore it has already been fulfilled in us through the holy spirit all we have to do is deny ourselves daily and surrender to the will of God, at brother John832 i love you bro but there is only one way you will be able to experience the grace of God just deny whatever you believe it doesn't matter what it is and just surrender to go spiritually and mentally you will not experience the grace of God if you keep putting a shadow infront in him then i'm sure you will truly experience what it means when the righteousness of the law is fulfilled in us, you see christianity is a super natural thing but how can you experience the supernatural event when your relying on dead works? that's why your confused about what we are saying and thinking that we are " lawless " but it's not like that God supernaturally puts his righteousness in us through salvation

 

[Josh321]

if one person can change and understand this i'm sure the others will see the change and realize something is different that they never knew, i'm off to work God bless everyone

 

[zone]

Gen 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
Gen 2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Exo 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

You left the part out about sanctifying and hallowingh the very first Sabbath, the seventh day of creation week. It has been in effect ever since.



Interesting you should bring up Ex 16:26 without quoting verses 17 and 18...

Exo 16:26 Six days ye shall gather it; but on the seventh day, which is the sabbath, in it there shall be none.
Exo 16:27 And it came to pass, that there went out some of the people on the seventh day for to gather, and they found none.
Exo 16:28 And the LORD said unto Moses, How long refuse ye to keep my commandments and my laws?

Now this was stated prior to the "giving of the Law" on Mt. Sinai. God asked how long they would refuse to keep His Commandments and His Laws. Laws and Commandments that were already in force.



It doesn't hlep when you leave out important imformation...

First of all, Christ did NOT die on the first day of the week. The Passover He died on occured on Wedesday, April 25, 31AD (by today's calendar). He was buried at sunset and was in the tomb three days and three nights. He arose at/about sunset on Sabbath afternoon.

The three days and three nights should not really be discussed in this thread, it needs a thread of it's own.

Acts 20:7 from the Diaglott...

Act 20:7 In and the first of the sabbaths, having been assembled of us to break bread, the Paul discoursed to them, being about to depart on the morrow; continued and the discourse till midnight.

Dr. Bullinger sheds some light on what the first of the Sabbaths is...

"first, &c. = first day of the sabbaths, i.e. the first day for reckoning the seven sabbaths to Pentecost. It depended upon the harvest (Deu_16:9), and was always from the morrow after the weekly sabbath when the wave sheaf was presented (Lev_23:15)."

Again, that is outside the one point of this thread and needs a separate thread to address it.

Suffice it to say, Acts 20:7 is not speaking to church service on the first day of the week.

dat's right, john. it doesn't help when you leave out important information.
are you SACRIFICING ANIMALS like you are commanded to OR NOT?

a Bullinger man.
surprise surprise.

 

[john832]

You just have no clue what grace is. Or faith for that matter. Grace and law are mutually exclusive. I know that's a stumbling stone to you and other law-cultists, but that's the way it was designed to exclude from the kingdom those who glory in laws (that they don't even keep), but don't have faith.

You called faith lawlessness. Therefore, you are lawless for disregarding the ultimate commandment of GOD.

Who called Faith and Grace lawlessness? I have always stated that Faith and Grace and Law are mutually INCLUSIVE. You gotta get your story straight here.

 

[john832]

because we are under the grace of God we are considered lawless?

No Josh, we must be under Grace, else the curse of the Law (the punishment: death) is on us. Grace is the free, unearned, undeserved forgiveness (pardon) for breaking the Law. That does not do away with the Law, it simply says that Christ was willing to pay that price for us.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Who called Faith and Grace lawlessness? I have always stated that Faith and Grace and Law are mutually INCLUSIVE. You gotta get your story straight here.

No, grace and the law of Moses are not mutually inclusive. One precludes the other. You simply don't know the nature of law. The law of Moses condemns unrighteouseness. You think the law is your friend because you think you are righteous.

And as I said (because Paul said it) grace is not lawless because it is through faith, which is the ultimate law.