Please Answer Sabbath Question

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

Meaning of Daniyl 7:25

  • Daniyl 7:25 is not talking about Sabbath/Feasts but I dont know what it istalking about

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    14
A

Ariel82

Guest
I'm sorry but your logic does not make sense. Before Paul was converted he was Saul, a Pharisee. He kept the law, the Sabbath and the feast days according to the Old testament.

They did not celebrate Christmas or Easter. Truthfully I don't care to defend either holiday. Nor do I wish to argue if you or others want to keep any of the feast or those two holidays.

It doesn't really matter to me and I don't think it matters to God.

If we go into the fulfillment of the feasts, then we go into that doubtful things categories. which i'm not sure you really want to talk about. To often its just a jumping stone to preach about how you want to keep them. Which is fine but I don't think you should judge those who chose not to keep them.

In addition, I believe they all have been fulfilled through Christ's life, death and resurrection. However, I don't want to spend a lot of time jumping through hoops to show you, just to be disregarded.

I know we both can agree that Jesus was the Passover lamb, who died for our sins.

I found this from a website:

1) Passover (Leviticus 23:5) – Pointed to the Messiah as our Passover lamb (1 Corinthians 5:7) whose blood would be shed for our sins. Jesus was crucified on the day of preparation for the Passover at the same hour that the lambs were being slaughtered for the Passover meal that evening (John 19:14).

2) Unleavened Bread (Leviticus 23:6) – Pointed to the Messiah's sinless life (as leaven is a picture of sin in the Bible), making Him the perfect sacrifice for our sins. Jesus' body was in the grave during the first days of this feast, like a kernel of wheat planted and waiting to burst forth as the bread of life.

3) First Fruits (Leviticus 23:10) – Pointed to the Messiah's resurrection as the first fruits of the righteous. Jesus was resurrected on this very day, which is one of the reasons that Paul refers to him in 1 Corinthians 15:20 as the "first fruits from the dead."

4) Weeks or Pentecost (Leviticus 23:16) – Occurred fifty days after the beginning of the Feast of Unleavened Bread and pointed to the great harvest of souls and the gift of the Holy Spirit for both Jew and Gentile, who would be brought into the kingdom of God during the Church Age (see Acts 2). The Church was actually established on this day when God poured out His Holy Spirit and 3,000 Jews responded to Peter's great sermon and his first proclamation of the gospel.



however I do believe the Fall feast have already been fulfilled in this manner:

5) Trumpets (Leviticus 23:24) –Jesus birth,

Luke 2 "
[SUP]13 [/SUP]And suddenly there was with the angel a multitude of the heavenly host praising God and saying:
[SUP]14 [/SUP]“Glory to God in the highest,
And on earth peace, goodwill toward men!”[SUP][c]"[/SUP]



6) Day of Atonement (Leviticus 23:27): death of the infants in Bethlehem , Tears of repentance of those John the Baptist baptized with water

7) Tabernacles or Booths (Leviticus 23:34): Jesus being physically on earth and His preaching.

1 Corinthians 6:19-20 [Full Chapter]
Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own? For you were bought at a price; therefore glorify God in your body and in your spirit, which are God’s.


*******
not quite in line with the OP but you asked.
 
Y

Yearn2learn

Guest
Isaiah 40:8 " The grass withers, the flower fades, But the word of our God stands forever."
The ten commandments were written by Gods own hand in rock, this demonstrates that they were to last forever.
Matthew 5:18 "...till Heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled."
1 John 2:3 "Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, "I know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him."
Hebrews 13:8 "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever."
Revelation 14:12 "here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus."

Heb 4:4,5. Rev 12:17; 22:14.
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
Isaiah 40:8 " The grass withers, the flower fades, But the word of our God stands forever."
The ten commandments were written by Gods own hand in rock, this demonstrates that they were to last forever.
Matthew 5:18 "...till Heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled."
1 John 2:3 "Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, "I know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him."
Hebrews 13:8 "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever."
Revelation 14:12 "here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus."

Heb 4:4,5. Rev 12:17; 22:14.
But you confuse me when you then change the Sabbath it is one of the 10.

Changing it removes it and replaces it with another.

The REAL rest or Sabbath is in Messiah when He returns.

That is the real Sabbath, the 1,000 years.

Until then there is no real Sabbath, the 7th day is training Yahweh style.
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
[h=2]Daniyl 7:25[/h]
"And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time"
 
Nov 21, 2014
167
1
0
Philippians 3:5: Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the. Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;

Philippians 3:6: Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.

Philippians 3:7: But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ.

Philippians 3:8: Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do. count them but dung, that I may win Christ,

This is so clear.

When studing you need to ask three things.
1 Who said it
2 Who was he talking to.
3 when did he say it. Before or after the cross ie new covanant.
everything changed after the cross.
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
Philippians 3:5: Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the. Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;

Philippians 3:6: Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.

Philippians 3:7: But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ.

Philippians 3:8: Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do. count them but dung, that I may win Christ,

This is so clear.

When studing you need to ask three things.
1 Who said it
2 Who was he talking to.
3 when did he say it. Before or after the cross ie new covanant.
everything changed after the cross.
Ok, so the Prophet the "we must obey" everything He said goes away as soon as He "dies"

WOW

John (Yahchanan) 8:31, "...If you continue in My doctrine, then you are truly My disciples."

Revelation 12:17, "And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and went to make war with those who forsook her seed; her seed being those who keep the Laws of Yahweh, and have the testimony of Yahshua Messiah."

"Laws" is word #1785 entolé
Definition: an ordinance, injunction, command, law.

Revelation is the FINAL MESSAGE given to mankind:

Revelation 14:12, "In this manner are the saints purified--by keeping the Laws of Yahweh, (in conformity) with the faith in Yahshua Messiah."

"Laws" is word #1785 entolé
Definition: an ordinance, injunction, command, law.

Yahchanan (John) 14:23, "Yahshua answered, and said to him: If a man loves Me, he will keep My teachings and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him."

Mattithyah 24:35, “Heaven and earth may pass away, but My teachings will not pass away.

Yahchanan (John) 5:28-30, “Do not be astonished at this-for the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice, and will come forth. Those who have practiced righteousness will be resurrected in order to live; and those who have practiced wickedness will be resurrected in order to be damned."
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
Ok, so the Prophet the "we must obey" everything He said goes away as soon as He "dies" WOW


Yahchanan (John) 4:25-26, "The woman said to Him; I know that the Messiah comes, and when He comes, He will tell us all things. Yahshua said to her: I am He speaking to you."

Deuteronomy 18:18-19, "I will raise up for them a Prophet like you from among their brothers, and I will put My words in His mouth, and He will tell them everything I command Him. Whoever will not listen to My words, which He speaks in My Name, I will judge him for it"

"listen" is word #8085 שָׁמַע shama` {shaw-mah'}

Brown-Driver-Briggs (Old Testament Hebrew-English Lexicon)
A primitive root; to hear intelligently (often with implication of attention, obedience, etc.; causatively to tell, etc.)

Hebrew Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar) - 1) to hear, listen to, obey
 
H

Hoffco

Guest
Sorry, Ariel, your logic is stupid. You say the LAST three feasts are fulfilled by Jesus birth and the first 4 are fulfilled by Jesus death. Is God so stupid as to get the order wrong? Love to all Hoffco
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
I was told the post Messiah's Sacrifice doctrine completely changes.

So I pointed out the the Messiah is the prophet we must obey.

Deuteronomy 18:18-19, "I will raise up for them a Prophet like you from among their brothers, and I will put My words in His mouth, and He will tell them everything I command Him. Whoever will not listen to My words, which He speaks in My Name, I will judge him for it"

"listen" is word #8085 שָׁמַע shama` {shaw-mah'}

Brown-Driver-Briggs (Old Testament Hebrew-English Lexicon)
A primitive root; to hear intelligently (often with implication of attention, obedience, etc.; causatively to tell, etc.)

Hebrew Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar) - 1) to hear, listen to, obey

Yahchanan (John) 4:25-26, "The woman said to Him; I know that the Messiah comes, and when He comes, He will tell us all things. Yahshua said to her: I am He speaking to you."
 
H

Hoffco

Guest
Hizikyah, you are not accepting the New Testament as the WORD of GOD. So, you don't accept the changes, the New T. makes of the O.T. rituals and ordinances and replaced them by freedom of conscience to make our own days of worshiping Jesus, a new way, showing the big brake from the old ways. traditions are remade by the N.T. and by us , for us to worship
God in the new way . So, because the Jewish nation refused to obey they were "KILLED" by
God and the rest were scattered to the 4 winds to grow and wait for the end time , now regathered, 2,000 yrs. later, to do it again, and be killed again, by GOD, thru a different antichrist. and his beast; The first antichrist was Rome and more came after Caesar. God will then convert the Jewish nation at Jesus 2nd coming, never again to go astray, but to help rule the world in peace as a part of the Church of Christ. The Church of Christ,God, started in the garden with Adam and Eve. Love to all, Hoffco
 
H

Hoffco

Guest
Obviously, Hiaikyah means "when Jesus died". Because Hiz, thinks the apostles changed Jesus' teaching by conspiracy . Hiz, will not accept the N.T. of JESUS CHRIST written by JESUS' disciple, inspired by God Himself. Love to all, Hoffco
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
Obviously, Hiaikyah means "when Jesus died". Because Hiz, thinks the apostles changed Jesus' teaching by conspiracy . Hiz, will not accept the N.T. of JESUS CHRIST written by JESUS' disciple, inspired by God Himself. Love to all, Hoffco
Hizikyah means YHWH will prevail.
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
Hizikyah, you are not accepting the New Testament as the WORD of GOD. So, you don't accept the changes, the New T. makes of the O.T. rituals and ordinances and replaced them by freedom of conscience to make our own days of worshiping Jesus, a new way, showing the big brake from the old ways. traditions are remade by the N.T. and by us , for us to worship
God in the new way . So, because the Jewish nation refused to obey they were "KILLED" by
God and the rest were scattered to the 4 winds to grow and wait for the end time , now regathered, 2,000 yrs. later, to do it again, and be killed again, by GOD, thru a different antichrist. and his beast; The first antichrist was Rome and more came after Caesar. God will then convert the Jewish nation at Jesus 2nd coming, never again to go astray, but to help rule the world in peace as a part of the Church of Christ. The Church of Christ,God, started in the garden with Adam and Eve. Love to all, Hoffco
Mattithyah 24:35, “Heaven and earth may pass away, but My teachings will not pass away.

Mattithyah 24:35, “Heaven and earth may pass away, but My teachings will not pass away.

The gospel of Messiah or the gospel about Messiah?

Luke 6:46, "And why call Me; Ruler! Ruler! and do not the things which I say?"

Yahchanan (John) 4:25-26, "The woman said to Him; I know that the Messiah comes, and when He comes, He will tell us all things. Yahshua said to her: I am He speaking to you."

Deuteronomy 18:18-19, "I will raise up for them a Prophet like you from among their brothers, and I will put My words in His mouth, and He will tell them everything I command Him. Whoever will not listen to My words, which He speaks in My Name, I will judge him for it"

"listen" is word #8085 שָׁמַע shama` {shaw-mah'}

Brown-Driver-Briggs (Old Testament Hebrew-English Lexicon)
A primitive root; to hear intelligently (often with implication of attention, obedience, etc.; causatively to tell, etc.)

Hebrew Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar) - 1) to hear, listen to, obey

Isayah 42:21, "Yahweh is well-pleased, for His righteousness' sake, to magnify the Law, and make it honorable"

Mattithyah 5:19, "Whosoever, therefore, will break one of the least of these Laws, and will teach men so, he will be called the least in the Kingdom of Yahweh; but whosoever will do and teach them, the same will be called great in the Kingdom of Yahweh."

Yahchanan (John) 14:15, "If you love Me, keep My commandments."

Mattithyah 5:18, "For truly I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh--the smallest of the letters--will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."

Luke 16:17, "But it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one yodh of the Law to fail."

Mattithyah 7:23, "But then I will declare to them; I never knew you. Get away from Me, you who practice iniquity."

iniquity is:#0458 anomia {an-om-ee'-ah} from G0459

Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)
1) the condition of without law
1a) because ignorant of it
1b) because of violating it
2) contempt and violation of law, iniquity, wickedness

Luke 6:46, "And why call Me; Ruler! Ruler! and do not the things which I say?"

Revelation 22:12-15, "And behold, I come quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give every man according as his work will be. I am the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End. Blessed are those who keep His Laws, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. For outside are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and worshipers of gods and everyone who professes to love, yet practices falsehood."

Yahchanan 8:31, "...If you continue in My doctrine, then you are truly My disciples."

Mattithyah 24:12, "And because iniquity will abound, the love of the many will grow cold."

"iniquity" is:#0458 anomia {an-om-ee'-ah} from G0459

Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)
1) the condition of without law
1a) because ignorant of it
1b) because of violating it
2) contempt and violation of law, iniquity, wickedness

Isayah 42:21, "Yahweh is well-pleased, for His righteousness' sake, to magnify the Law, and make it honorable"

Mattithyah 19-17-21, "But He said to him: Why do you question Me about righteousness? There is only One Who is the standard of perfection, and that is Yahweh; so if you would enter into life, keep the Laws of Yahweh. He then asked Yahshua; Which ones? Yahshua said: You shall not murder. You shall not commit adultery. You shall not steal. You shall not bear false testimony. Honor your efather and mother, and; You shall love your neighbor as yourself. The young man said to Him; All these things I have kept from my youth up; what do I yet lack? Yahshua said to him: If you want to come to the perfection of Yahweh, go and sell of what you have, and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and you will be walking in Yahweh's ways, and following Me."

Mattithyah 5:20-30, ""For I say to you: Unless your righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you will certainly not enter into the Kingdom of Yahweh. You have heard that it was said by the people of ancient times: You shall not murder, and whoever murders will be in danger of the judgment; But I say to you: Whoever is angry with his brother will be in danger of the judgment! Again, anyone who says; Raca! insulting your brother, will be in danger of the Sanhedrin, but whoever says: Nabel! desiring them to fall away, will be in danger of the fire of Gehenna. Therefore, if you are offering your gift at the altar, and there you remember that your brother has something against you; Leave your gift there before the altar, and go first and be reconciled with your brother; then come and offer your gift. Settle a controversy with your accuser quickly, before he gets you into court; or your adversary may deliver you to the judge, the judge deliver you to the officer, and you be put into prison. Truly I say to you: You will never come out of there until you have paid the last penny. You have heard that it was said by the people of ancient times: You shall not commit adultery; But I say to you: Whoever looks on a woman with lust for her, has already committed adultery with her in his heart. So if your right eye causes you to offend; sin, gouge it out and throw it from you! For it is better for you that one of your members perish, than for the whole body to be cast into Gehenna. Or if your right hand causes you to offend, cut it off and throw it from you! For it is better for you that one of your members perish, than for the whole body to be cast into Gehenna."

Isayah 8:20, "To the Law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them."

Revelation 12:17, "And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and went to make war with those who forsook her seed; her seed being those who keep the Laws of Yahweh, and have the testimony of Yahshua Messiah."

"Laws" is word #1785 entolé
Definition: an ordinance, injunction, command, law.

Revelation 14:12, "In this manner are the saints purified--by keeping the Laws of Yahweh, (in conformity) with the faith in Yahshua Messiah."

"Laws" is word #1785 entolé
Definition: an ordinance, injunction, command, law.

Yahchanan (John) 14:23, "Yahshua answered, and said to him: If a man loves Me, he will keep My teachings and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him."

Mattithyah 24:35, “Heaven and earth may pass away, but My teachings will not pass away.

Yahchanan (John) 5:28-30, “Do not be astonished at this-for the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice, and will come forth. Those who have practiced righteousness will be resurrected in order to live; and those who have practiced wickedness will be resurrected in order to be damned."
 
H

Hoffco

Guest
Please keep in mind that all nation are created by God and are used by God to do His dirt work in this world. In the end time, God will bring all nations of the world to fight Israel and then will rain fire on them and destroy their armies. as Jesus brings in His 1,000yrs. of peace. And after the rule of Jesus, God will do it again, by allowing Satan out of the pit, to deceive the nation and God will destroy them again, just before God recreates the Heavens and the earth. Love to all, Hoffco
 
H

Hoffco

Guest
OK< SO< Hizikyah, maybe you accept just the parts of the N.T. that fit with your diabolical plans. Sorry, but that is how I see you. Love to all, Hoffco
 
C

ChristIsGod

Guest
To Hizikyah, What do you think of the discourse in Acts 15?
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
To Hizikyah, What do you think of the discourse in Acts 15?
I have given a full break down a number of times here.

I will sum it up.

This was about entering the congregation. In those days IT WAS NOT COME AS YOU ARE. They were very strict, if you think this is all one had to do, this is it!!!!! that is silly We can do any other foul thing just not strangle animals with blood. LOL really. No this was the starting point.

explain why a select few "laws" are chosen to follow but not all?


20 But rather, write to them that they abstain from defilements: such as idolatry, from all sexual impurity, from that which has been cooked with the blood still in it, and from bloodshed by violence


20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
OK< SO< Hizikyah, maybe you accept just the parts of the N.T. that fit with your diabolical plans. Sorry, but that is how I see you. Love to all, Hoffco
Yahchanan (John) 14:15, "If you love Me, keep My commandments."
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
Sorry, Ariel, your logic is stupid. You say the LAST three feasts are fulfilled by Jesus birth and the first 4 are fulfilled by Jesus death. Is God so stupid as to get the order wrong? Love to all Hoffco
the year is cyclic. why can the Fall feast not be the first three and the spring feast the last?

Is man so arrogant to blame their mistakes on God?

I may be mistaken but that is what I believe and calling me stupid does not make for a logical or coherent argument for your case. Instead it shows the immaturity of your spirit.

When I speak to others I freely say I do not understand their position. If they show me scripture and walk me through their logic, I take it to God in prayer. I do not call them stupid or degrade their intelligence and I expect the same from those who name Christ Jesus as savior and Lord. Though I forgive those young in the faith, I still find it offensive when people who call upon my Father to use such childish tactics.

I don't expect for many to agree with me, but I do expect respect and a searching of scriptures. I'm sorry if you feel insecure and must lash out because your cherished doctrines are questioned, but I believe God demands we seek always the Truth despite our pride or unease.