Repentance when you don't know if you've sinned?

[Grace777x70]

repenting means stopping the sin.
it just does, no matter how we finesse it.
ultimately, the purpose of repentance is to stop the sin.
it's a hard go, especially if one comes to Christ later in life with all the baggage in tow.
nevertheless....changing one's mind is evidenced by the ceasing of sin.

I'm not claiming sinless perfection, God knows.
but the crushed spirit resulting from sin is something I am sick and tired of.
sick and tired of sin.

I reckon that's the starting point for repentance.
sick and tired of being sick and tired

Sinning is destructive and thank God that Jesus came to save us from our sins!

Sin distorts our view of God, others and ourselves and will destroy everything that it can but thank God for the love and grace of God manifested in Christ that sets us free from it's tyranny.

We have a great salvation in Him!

 

[Grace777x70]

I actually lied about only repenting once, 40 years ago. As I read more and understand more, I find that I repent at least every six months, or so, as I begin to see things that I had earlier totally misunderstood and believed all wrong about.

I repented today and it was exciting. I did that today as a matter of fact as the Holy Spirit showed me a facet of the nature of God that I had wrong believing in ( wrong belief is sin..is it not? ).

I was over-joyed with His love and grace as I saw His true character. I almost jumped out of my skin in excitement. It's exciting to behold the goodness/glory of the Lord for who He really is. 2 Cor. 3:17-18. The Holy Spirit transforms us that way as we see Him for who He really is.

I don't know if I can go to sleep now as I am so excited about the Lord. He makes me want to bring back things I didn't even steal!

 

[Ariel82]

I actually lied about only repenting once, 40 years ago. As I read more and understand more, I find that I repent at least every six months, or so, as I begin to see things that I had earlier totally misunderstood and believed all wrong about.

Still in the process myself. Looking back at past held beliefs and wondering....was I really that deceived?+

 

[Grace777x70]

You correct with this statement.

However, you fail to get to the crux of the matter, Yes positionally we re forgiven past, present and future. Yet when we do sin our relationship is not growing in fact it hinders our relationship with God, we grieve the Holy Spirit. This is why we confess our sins and apologize ... I love that old saying 'contrite heart'.

When we hear new teachings that don't take into account ll of scripture then we must reject them as a 'religious tradition' that hi-jacks the real meaning [your words paraphrased ] or just plainly in error. Its a mistake when we over emphasize one thing over another.

Most mature Christians realize this and they know when they have grieved the Holy Spirit, they will know that the relationship isn't quite right, they also know that positionally they are forgiven in Christ once for all.

Isaiah 66:2

All these things my hand has made, and so all these things came to be, declares the LORD. But this is the one to whom I will look: he who is humble and contrite in spirit and trembles at my word.

I agree Phil...grieving the Holy Spirit is not a good thing. BTW ..no one says that they don't confess sins....

What grieves God is not giving out words of grace to people or allowing grace to be manifested. ( of course this is a form of sinning and it will affect our minds and hearts)

Ephesians 4:29-30 (NASB)

Let no unwholesome word proceed from your mouth, but only such a word as is good for edification according to the need of the moment, so that it will give grace to those who hear. Do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.

The only time recorded that Jesus was angered ..was when the religious people refused to allow grace to be shown to someone....the religious folk had "their" holiness rules.....and in so..were refusing the grace of God to come to people..but Jesus our Lord stepped in as He always will for us,


Mark 3:4-5 (KJV)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] And he saith unto them, Is it lawful to do good on the sabbath days, or to do evil? to save life, or to kill? But they held their peace.

[SUP]5 [/SUP] And when he had looked round about on them with anger, being grieved for the hardness of their hearts, he saith unto the man, Stretch forth thine hand. And he stretched it out: and his hand was restored whole as the other.

This is the exact same Greek word for "grieving" the Holy Spirit in Ephesians 4:30.

 

[zone]

Still in the process myself. Looking back at past held beliefs and wondering....was I really that deceived?+

one of the very first bible studies I did (with my spankin' new Concordance) was word studies:

deceive
deceived

mind blowing....a huge study.

 

[Ariel82]

one of the very first bible studies I did (with my spankin' new Concordance) was word studies:

deceive
deceived

mind blowing....a huge study.

3884. paralogizomai -- to miscalculate, to reason falsely
... reason falsely. Part of Speech: Verb Transliteration: paralogizomai Phonetic Spelling:
(par-al-og-id'-zom-ahee) Short Definition: I deceive, beguile Definition

Topical Bible: Deceive

Would make an interesting study, but I don't feel like starting any new threads so will make a private study of it. Thanks for the idea. Love you, zone. Always.

 

[Grace777x70]

Sometimes people mis-interpret what is really being said and other times they deliberately mis-represent what is said too, so I will say this to hopefully stop both from occurring.

Here is what I do when I sin.

I love to kneel quickly and tell my Father how I trust in Him. How what I did was wrong.

Sometimes I use the word sin and sometimes I don't. I think that is irrelevant. I run to my Father and tell Him how that His Son is my Lord and is my life and my righteousness - that Jesus' Blood has secured my redemption and forgiveness of sins. I confess what God says about me. I tell Him I love Him and trust in Him.

I have not asked for forgiveness in order to be forgiven for quite some time now because I believe in what Christ has already done for me on the cross and resurrection....but I always talk with my Lord about what I do or don't do.

You know - He always loves on me and tells me He loves me and that He is my life and strength. Sometimes I have felt a warm liquid like feeling of pure love fall on me and I just sit there in His presence and weep. I can't move a muscle. He is so mighty in power yet His love and total acceptance is the most overwhelming aspect of His presence.


To me - all sin is relational. All sin is a failure to see the life of Christ in me. I am ignorant of His life in me. To me - most outward sin is just a "fruit" of the real sin.

For example - If I steal something - that is a sin but the real sin behind that is the failure to recognize my Father will take care of me. I am operating in the flesh. I want to take things into my own hand and "do" things.

The other part is when you see how horrid it really is when we mess up....sin....transgress.... whatever term you want to use.

..what I see is my unbelief in the goodness and love of my Father and Lord Jesus for me. That is the horrid part because I know that is not Their character nor is it really my true nature now and what He has made me in Christ.

 

[joaniemarie]

one of the very first bible studies I did (with my spankin' new Concordance) was word studies:

deceive
deceived

mind blowing....a huge study.

So true. And to know how to recognize the difference between the voice of the Holy Spirit and the accusing voice of our enemy. The Holy Spirit never condemns the believer. Never causes the believer to walk in confusion. He draws us in to the love and grace of God in Christ. He always points to Jesus the remedy for our sin, not ourselves and sin.,the problem.

Our eyes are to always be on Jesus but especially when we fail. To run to Him and not from Him. This is only part of the gift of salvation. There is so much more in His grace.

 

[zone]

3884. paralogizomai -- to miscalculate, to reason falsely
... reason falsely. Part of Speech: Verb Transliteration: paralogizomai Phonetic Spelling:
(par-al-og-id'-zom-ahee) Short Definition: I deceive, beguile Definition

Topical Bible: Deceive

Would make an interesting study, but I don't feel like starting any new threads so will make a private study of it. Thanks for the idea. Love you, zone. Always.

I think I've mentioned this to you before Ariel, but i used to say a prayer that was extremely effective. I passed it on to others and they had the same result. I suppose God is pleased to shine light into darkness.

Heavenly Father
if I have been deceived in any way, I pray you reveal it to me, so that I might be free from darkness and deceit.
Amen

(warning: be prepared for the answer!)

 

[Willie-T]

Still in the process myself. Looking back at past held beliefs and wondering....was I really that deceived?+

Were the Jews Jesus told to repent, deceived? No, they were going by sound doctrine, and right on track for what they knew at that point in time. He was telling them a new way was now there, and to rethink their future Salvation.... to "change their minds" about whether they were going to be saved by the old law, OR by belief in Him.

 

[phil36]

I agree Phil...grieving the Holy Spirit is not a good thing. BTW ..no one says that they don't confess sins....

What grieves God is not giving out words of grace to people or allowing grace to be manifested. ( of course this is a form of sinning and it will affect our minds and hearts)

I would agree confessing with a ''Contrite Heart'' renews our relationship (not position) in wonderful ways... being contrite is key wouldnt you agree?

And yes When we sin - in other words the opposite of your statement 'manifesting grace' we grieve the Holy Spirit who lives in us. A contrite heart confessing and apologizing for our sins restores our relationship with God. I can say confessing my sins with sorrow brings great Joy in that restored relationship... for christians we can use the word repent not in the sense of position in Christ but in the familial.

 

[zone]

I would agree confessing with a ''Contrite Heart'' renews our relationship (not position) in wonderful ways... being contrite is key wouldnt you agree?

And yes When we sin - in other words the opposite of your statement 'manifesting grace' we grieve the Holy Spirit who lives in us. A contrite heart confessing and apologizing for our sins restores our relationship with God. I can say confessing my sins with sorrow brings great Joy in that restored relationship... for christians we can use the word repent not in the sense of position in Christ but in the familial.

 

[Willie-T]

Renewing (or RESTORING) our relationship with God................

Does that mean something (anything) we do changes how God sees us?

Or does that mean us doing something or feeling a certain way changes OUR perception of the relationship?

 

[Grace777x70]

I would agree confessing with a ''Contrite Heart'' renews our relationship (not position) in wonderful ways... being contrite is key wouldnt you agree?

And yes When we sin - in other words the opposite of your statement 'manifesting grace' we grieve the Holy Spirit who lives in us. A contrite heart confessing and apologizing for our sins restores our relationship with God. I can say confessing my sins with sorrow brings great Joy in that restored relationship... for christians we can use the word repent not in the sense of position in Christ but in the familial.

Sinning is bad, bad , bad. As I heard one preacher say one time - " Stop it stupid - it'll destroy you and warp your mind".

Personally I don't see any change in the relationship aspect of things other than in our own minds as sin distorts our view of the Father and of ourselves. God doesn't change towards us.

We can see this happening in the garden when God walked down to be with Adam and Eve. They hid from Him. The sin had distorted their view of Him and they were afraid. He wasn't withdrawing Himself from them as their diseased hearts and minds now thought.

That was one of the things I had to repent of - believing that God changes His relationship to me. It's not true. This type of thinking is a product of eating from the wrong tree. We need to repent and believe the gospel.

We are not living in the Old Covenant any more. We have a new heart which has been created in righteousness and holiness.

Now we are learning how to live from the life of Another in us. it is exciting to know the Lord for who is actually is......I just "typed myself happy"...lol

 

[zone]

Renewing (or RESTORING) our relationship with God................[/SIZE]

Does that mean something (anything) we do changes how God sees us?

Or does that mean us doing something or feeling a certain way changes OUR perception of the relationship?

Hebrews 12
6For the Lord disciplines the one He loves, and He chastises everyone He receives as a son.” 7Endure suffering as discipline; God is treating you as sons. For what son is not disciplined by his father?…

 

[zone]

Personally I don't see any change in the relationship aspect of things other than in our own minds as sin distorts our view of the Father and of ourselves. God doesn't change towards us.

We can see this happening in the garden when God walked down to be with Adam and Eve. They hid from Him. The sin had distorted their view of Him and they were afraid. He wasn't withdrawing Himself from them as their diseased hearts and minds now thought.....

but the curses (including eternal damnation) were the result, and those from God.
so yes, even though He is reconciling whomsoever will to Himself, Hebrews (and many other passages) make it plain that God DOES react when we sin.
devastating.

 

[Willie-T]

Hebrews 12
6For the Lord disciplines the one He loves, and He chastises everyone He receives as a son.” 7Endure suffering as discipline; God is treating you as sons. For what son is not disciplined by his father?…

I got a few spankings as a kid. I am quite sure my parents didn't view my relationship to them as being one bit different before, during, or after the chastisement.

 

[Grace777x70]

Hebrews 12
6For the Lord disciplines the one He loves, and He chastises everyone He receives as a son.” 7Endure suffering as discipline; God is treating you as sons. For what son is not disciplined by his father?…

I love that verse in Hebrews. It shows we are His children because He does discipline us.

But how does He do it? We have been told lot's of things - depending on our religious upbringing.

Jesus is perfect theology. Jesus said that He came to reveal the Father as no one knows Him. Jesus came to do the will of the Father.

Hebrews 1:1-2 says that Jesus is the exact representation of the nature of the Father.

If we want to see how our Father disciplines us - look to see how Jesus disciplined His disciples while He was here on this earth. What did He do? He chastised them with His words.

 

[zone]

I got a few spankings as a kid. I am quite sure my parents didn't view my relationship to them as being one bit different before, during, or after the chastisement.

don't go that far, I didn't say that.
chastisement HURTS, and is intended to result in repentance, and from there, renewal.
if you're never chastised, are you a son?

 

[Grace777x70]

but the curses (including eternal damnation) were the result, and those from God.
so yes, even though He is reconciling whomsoever will to Himself, Hebrews (and many other passages) make it plain that God DOES react when we sin.
devastating.

Yes...Our Lord hates the very thing that is destroying His children.