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And I hope you were sorry and apologized to your parents...if you didn't you learned nothing.
I think you are missing the difference between our position in Christ and Gods displeasure when we sin.. when my kids were naughty/bad whatever way you want to say it, I was displeased, and they new it...and I certainly wasn't going to give them the joy of playing with them or letting them play (an anology) until they apologized. And they were certainly not their usual joyful selves when I was displeased with them for they new in their hearts they where doing wrong. And they also new punishment was round the corner if they did no apologize and were sorry for their actions .
God will chastise his own children. Because he loves his own!
you've stated this with a snide tone, so I'm not sure how to respond.
if God is FOR US, we're going to be scourged when we do wrong.
you tacked "God harbors a lower view of us" on.
as you said parents don't stop loving their kids when they are punished - but to even suggest the parent (or God Himself) can't/won't/shouldn't have a severely negative response to sin is ridiculous.
why are you still debating the elementary principles?
when we fall short, we repent.
that's the way God set it up, including designing us with that amazing thing - the conscience.
if your conscience is always clean without repenting of your failures, I don't know how you managed it.
if God is FOR US, we're going to be scourged when we do wrong.
you tacked "God harbors a lower view of us" on.
as you said parents don't stop loving their kids when they are punished - but to even suggest the parent (or God Himself) can't/won't/shouldn't have a severely negative response to sin is ridiculous.
why are you still debating the elementary principles?
when we fall short, we repent.
that's the way God set it up, including designing us with that amazing thing - the conscience.
if your conscience is always clean without repenting of your failures, I don't know how you managed it.
Just a personal thought here of some of the teachings of man's ideas verses God's thoughts on the matter. We humans put a high premium on our feelings of guilt and sorrow. We also put a lot on our pride and our reasoning powers. So much so look at how many people in the world go to shrinks to relieve their guilt and fix their minds.
Guilt and shame are powerful factors in our lives. Many people go through their whole lives trying to gain some kind of release from these feelings of condemnation. It's painful and punishing even.
On the one hand we desire to be released from condemnation but on the other hand many believe that condemnation is needed to keep us on track. I believe as a Christian I have to walk differently and not as a child just learning. Taking the meaty things is also needed. There is no place for condemnation in my life anymore as I am learning how to mature in Christ. I cannot pay by my emotional pain in order to grow close to Christ.
Feeling the punishment for sin is no longer needed in order for me to walk in the path of faith. The gift of grace releases me from the former things like shame and guilt and the accompanying emotions. But I must chose to put those imaginations down and instead uplift the truths of the HolySpirit and His training me as a Christian who is growing up into adulthood.
This is however easier said than done. My usual emotions do not work that way and have to be bent in order to accept and think this way. I also see how confessing our sins one to another is a good thing from God for it gives us accountability., draws us closer to one another and to God corporately, and it helps us in our humanity. God has made us mutually dependent on each other for some reason.
But He also wants me to be assured in my inner man that His love is above human reason and when I am alone which is most of the time where I'm working and living., I must be able to counter the attacks of the enemy. Knowing condemnation will break the spirit, God tells us we are no longer condemned by Him. We have unconditional love and favor from Him and walking in that grace will lead us to a closer and intimate relationship with Him.
Perfect love casts out fear. Fear is an enemy and can lead to trusting in ourselves or others and not Jesus and His righteousness. He has not given us a spirit of fear but of power and love and a sound mind. We are in the process of developing that mind imo.
Even a mature psychologist or psychiatrist is not immune to falling into the devil's pit of shame and guilt and condemnation enough to cause hopelessness. Even though he/she knows how destructive it is from the inside out as they have daily observed their clients and patients.,yet they as doctors can't help being human and without hope since many (not all) who study human behavior don't have Christ. And even death as many a worldly wise man has killed himself in his hopelessness.
Just goes to show man needs Jesus in every way to survive now in his every day and on into eternity. And Jesus has made a new and living way.
Guilt and shame are powerful factors in our lives. Many people go through their whole lives trying to gain some kind of release from these feelings of condemnation. It's painful and punishing even.
On the one hand we desire to be released from condemnation but on the other hand many believe that condemnation is needed to keep us on track. I believe as a Christian I have to walk differently and not as a child just learning. Taking the meaty things is also needed. There is no place for condemnation in my life anymore as I am learning how to mature in Christ. I cannot pay by my emotional pain in order to grow close to Christ.
Feeling the punishment for sin is no longer needed in order for me to walk in the path of faith. The gift of grace releases me from the former things like shame and guilt and the accompanying emotions. But I must chose to put those imaginations down and instead uplift the truths of the HolySpirit and His training me as a Christian who is growing up into adulthood.
This is however easier said than done. My usual emotions do not work that way and have to be bent in order to accept and think this way. I also see how confessing our sins one to another is a good thing from God for it gives us accountability., draws us closer to one another and to God corporately, and it helps us in our humanity. God has made us mutually dependent on each other for some reason.
But He also wants me to be assured in my inner man that His love is above human reason and when I am alone which is most of the time where I'm working and living., I must be able to counter the attacks of the enemy. Knowing condemnation will break the spirit, God tells us we are no longer condemned by Him. We have unconditional love and favor from Him and walking in that grace will lead us to a closer and intimate relationship with Him.
Perfect love casts out fear. Fear is an enemy and can lead to trusting in ourselves or others and not Jesus and His righteousness. He has not given us a spirit of fear but of power and love and a sound mind. We are in the process of developing that mind imo.
Even a mature psychologist or psychiatrist is not immune to falling into the devil's pit of shame and guilt and condemnation enough to cause hopelessness. Even though he/she knows how destructive it is from the inside out as they have daily observed their clients and patients.,yet they as doctors can't help being human and without hope since many (not all) who study human behavior don't have Christ. And even death as many a worldly wise man has killed himself in his hopelessness.
Just goes to show man needs Jesus in every way to survive now in his every day and on into eternity. And Jesus has made a new and living way.
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Hi Wille: Did I read you right, you have not felt the need to ask God for forgiveness for anything in 40 years??? The word given to Christians is that if we confess our sins He is faithful and just to forgive us of our sins. That was given to CHRISTIANS. Are you saying that you only repent at conversion and you never need to again?
If we stop our own self effort in the flesh of trying to please God by whatever means we try outside of believing in the finished work of Christ for life and living - then we will have our conscience cleansed by the blood of Jesus if we believe by His grace through faith alone.
When you know that the blood of Jesus has brought redemption and the forgiveness of sins - does this knowledge make us want to go out and sin all we want? No a thousand times no - it does the opposite. It makes us fall in love with Him when we see Him for what He has done and for His true character.
Jesus said "He who is forgiven much - loves much."
Hebrews 9:14 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] how much more will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without blemish to God, cleanse your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?
As Paul says in Romans 1:9 - we serve God with our spirit. He is not a religion of rules - He is the living God whom we serve.
When you know that the blood of Jesus has brought redemption and the forgiveness of sins - does this knowledge make us want to go out and sin all we want? No a thousand times no - it does the opposite. It makes us fall in love with Him when we see Him for what He has done and for His true character.
Jesus said "He who is forgiven much - loves much."
Hebrews 9:14 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] how much more will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without blemish to God, cleanse your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?
As Paul says in Romans 1:9 - we serve God with our spirit. He is not a religion of rules - He is the living God whom we serve.
I am off to do some reading and hopefully repenting as the Holy Spirit reveals more of Christ and His love and grace towards me - that He would reveal more of His true nature to me.
Everyone have a great night!
We have a great salvation in Him - our Lord and Savior who has taken away the sin of the world. We have Him. He is our true treasure. For we have died and our life is hidden with Christ in God. We are joined to Christ as one spirit for all of eternity.
As He is - so are we in this earth. How does the Father view Jesus?
Remember this! As far as the heavens are above the earth - so are His ways above our ways.
Everyone have a great night!
We have a great salvation in Him - our Lord and Savior who has taken away the sin of the world. We have Him. He is our true treasure. For we have died and our life is hidden with Christ in God. We are joined to Christ as one spirit for all of eternity.
As He is - so are we in this earth. How does the Father view Jesus?
Remember this! As far as the heavens are above the earth - so are His ways above our ways.
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You heard me exactly right. I have, thousands and thousands of times been thankful for, and thanked God for, already forgiving me. I even sometimes thank Him for forgiving the stupid stuff I am going to do in the future. But I hope I never insult Him by asking Him to do again what He already died on a cross to do.
And I also hope I never ever, ever, ever change my mind (That is the Biblical meaning of the word, "repent.") about choosing to believe on Him.
He must think some people are schizoid with all their changing of their minds about..... one day trusting in Him, and the next day, changing their minds about that decision.... and then two days later, changing them back again.
It sounds like a sweet concept, but the word meant what it meant in the Bible. It never meant what we have changed it to mean, and I just can't follow along with those sorts of things. Even God "repented" 28 times in the Bible. What are we saying about Him if we insist on our new favorite meaning of the word, and claim that what He did was to feel bad about His sinning, and He quit doing it?
And I also hope I never ever, ever, ever change my mind (That is the Biblical meaning of the word, "repent.") about choosing to believe on Him.
He must think some people are schizoid with all their changing of their minds about..... one day trusting in Him, and the next day, changing their minds about that decision.... and then two days later, changing them back again.
It sounds like a sweet concept, but the word meant what it meant in the Bible. It never meant what we have changed it to mean, and I just can't follow along with those sorts of things. Even God "repented" 28 times in the Bible. What are we saying about Him if we insist on our new favorite meaning of the word, and claim that what He did was to feel bad about His sinning, and He quit doing it?
there's enough evidence in scripture to show that God DOES change the way He sees us, and it is according to our deeds.
He's provided the remedy - Jesus.
only through continuing; persevering in our struggles to stay faithful can we perform deeds pleasing to God - faith in the Lord Jesus for forgiveness of sins, and loving and caring for our neighbors is the goal.
He's provided the remedy - Jesus.
only through continuing; persevering in our struggles to stay faithful can we perform deeds pleasing to God - faith in the Lord Jesus for forgiveness of sins, and loving and caring for our neighbors is the goal.
D
Is it this?
[h=1]Mark 12:30-31 (ESV)[/h][FONT="]30 And you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.’ 31 The second is this: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.”[/FONT]
If it is that, then it's not sin. If it is not that, then it is sin. Easiest way for me to figure out if I'm sinning. Not-that is me centered, so it's sin.
[h=1]Mark 12:30-31 (ESV)[/h][FONT="]30 And you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.’ 31 The second is this: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.”[/FONT]
If it is that, then it's not sin. If it is not that, then it is sin. Easiest way for me to figure out if I'm sinning. Not-that is me centered, so it's sin.