ROMANS, CHAPTER 8
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nonsense...as usual you are saying something different and twisting what is being said. First of all - don't we have to believe we are born again because of Christ? Well, I know you don't believing being born again until we get a new body so this will be a mystery to you for sure. Paul says to "behold" new things have come. If anyone is in Christ - they are a new creation.
And as far as "obedience is to the new creation " - the person that wrote that said that he made an error in his typing because he was using his phone and fixed it to say "Obedience is through the new creation".
At some point you will have to start representating things that are the truth about what people are really saying and not keep saying other things to make it "appear" something else entirely is being said.
This scripture in Romans 1:18-25 is talking about people worshipping creation - things in this world. My goodness the lengths people will take to distort things and to try to "validate" their original false representations.
And as far as "obedience is to the new creation " - the person that wrote that said that he made an error in his typing because he was using his phone and fixed it to say "Obedience is through the new creation".
At some point you will have to start representating things that are the truth about what people are really saying and not keep saying other things to make it "appear" something else entirely is being said.
This scripture in Romans 1:18-25 is talking about people worshipping creation - things in this world. My goodness the lengths people will take to distort things and to try to "validate" their original false representations.
Maybe we have different Greek interlinears? As the verb in 2 Cor 5:17 "are become new " = perfect tense - ( perhaps you don't know what the perfect tense means?)
The perfect tense in Greek is used to describe a completed action which produced results which are still in effect all the way up to the present.
Source: The Tenses Explained
2 Corinthians 5:17 - has emerged - have become - perfect tense
1096 [e]
gegonen
γέγονεν
has emerged
V-RIA-3S
Tense: Perfect
Mood: Indicative
Voice: Active
Please show me in your references that the Greek word here for " have become" is a different tense they the perfect. Thank you...
L
actually, we need to co-operate with the Holy Spirit
passivity leads to deception
we are to be active in our pursuit of the truth and that includes renewing our minds with the word of God
when we renew our minds, we align ourselves with God's thoughts on a matter
this is not a simple matter as can be seen from the many threads wherein disagreement is the main subject and self-righteousness the apparent goal
Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. Phil 2:12
this does not mean we save ourselves of course, but it really is up to us how much of God's salvation we appropriate
the work of Jesus on the cross is a completed work. we cannot add to it but it seems many try to subtract from it
we need to APPROPRIATE it and believe that God has actually done everything for us. we need to believe it and act on it in faith and not allow the devil to condemn us or make us unsure of our salvation which, we did nothing to earn in the first place
Of course I believe in the new creation in Christ. I do believe what 2 Cor. 5:17 says....how could you not and be a Christian?
2 Corinthians 5:17 (NASB)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Therefore if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creature; the old things passed away; behold, new things have come.
Here is another one I believe in which talks about being born again in Christ which you say does not happen to a believer until they get a new body. With this kind of a belief I can see that the new creation and spiritual new birth in Christ would be a complete mystery.
1 Peter 1:23 (KJV)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
There is even great news about that too...Being born again = perfect passive.
- Perfect passive is something that is a past event that it's results are in full effect continuously in the present.
- Passive - means something was done to you - you did not do it to yourself
Isn't all this good news? Don't you just love what the Lord has done for us? Doesn't it make you fall deeper in love with Him?
2 Corinthians 5:17 (NASB)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Therefore if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creature; the old things passed away; behold, new things have come.
Here is another one I believe in which talks about being born again in Christ which you say does not happen to a believer until they get a new body. With this kind of a belief I can see that the new creation and spiritual new birth in Christ would be a complete mystery.
1 Peter 1:23 (KJV)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
There is even great news about that too...Being born again = perfect passive.
- Perfect passive is something that is a past event that it's results are in full effect continuously in the present.
- Passive - means something was done to you - you did not do it to yourself
Isn't all this good news? Don't you just love what the Lord has done for us? Doesn't it make you fall deeper in love with Him?
Believing that something exists is different than believing in something. Believing that Christ exists doesn't save anyone; only believing in him does.
So that's why I'm curious if you mean that you actually believe in the new creation, or simply believe that it exists. I personally believe the latter, but not the former.
So that's why I'm curious if you mean that you actually believe in the new creation, or simply believe that it exists. I personally believe the latter, but not the former.
Of course I believe that the person that is in Christ exists.....how could you not? I believe that because I believe Christ and what He has done.
I'm a "believer" in Christ Himself and He is alive. I talk with Him every day. Christ is in me. I hope He is in you too.
I believe in my earthy mother and I also believe what she made too -[SUB] me[/SUB]. It's the same for the new birth in Christ and that He has made us new creations in Him.
Before you can believe "in " someone or something - you have to believe they exist first....We are called "believers" for a reason.....just sayin'....
I'm a "believer" in Christ Himself and He is alive. I talk with Him every day. Christ is in me. I hope He is in you too.
I believe in my earthy mother and I also believe what she made too -[SUB] me[/SUB]. It's the same for the new birth in Christ and that He has made us new creations in Him.
Before you can believe "in " someone or something - you have to believe they exist first....We are called "believers" for a reason.....just sayin'....
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Of course I believe that the person that is in Christ exists.....how could you not? I believe that because I believe Christ and what He has done.
I'm a "believer" in Christ Himself and He is alive. I talk with Him every day. Christ is in me. I hope He is in you too.
I believe in my earthy mother and I also believe what she made too -[SUB] me[/SUB]. It's the same for the new birth in Christ and that He has made us new creations in Him.
Before you can believe "in " someone or something - you have to believe they exist first....We are called "believers" for a reason.....just sayin'....[/B]
I'm a "believer" in Christ Himself and He is alive. I talk with Him every day. Christ is in me. I hope He is in you too.
I believe in my earthy mother and I also believe what she made too -[SUB] me[/SUB]. It's the same for the new birth in Christ and that He has made us new creations in Him.
Before you can believe "in " someone or something - you have to believe they exist first....We are called "believers" for a reason.....just sayin'....
[/B]
Tell that to those whose works proceeded them as described in Revelation...
That Passivity led to deception.
Exactly what "works" did you think that those in Revelation 12 did that proceeded them?
They weren't active but were indeed passive.
There is a new thread...whatever is lovely? I am not sure...but it is in line to Philippians 2...
This is what we are called to do...
And our work, in the day of evil is to NOT GO OUT from HIS SPIRIT but to REMAIN IN HIM with our eyes set above and beyond to HIM who is faithful and true..in and out of season
A time will come when we won't be able to do the "works of light" in that we won't be able to take the time to read HIS WORD..
Therefore, in all things pray and let the peace of GOD which surpasses ALL UNDERSTANDING guard our hearts and our minds in CHRIST JESUS...
AND HOLD TO THE TESTIMONY of JESUS...
Which will be made manifest in the days of darkness to identify those who held and clung to CHRIST and those who simply did lip service to HIS NAME...
That Passivity led to deception.
Exactly what "works" did you think that those in Revelation 12 did that proceeded them?
They weren't active but were indeed passive.
There is a new thread...whatever is lovely? I am not sure...but it is in line to Philippians 2...
This is what we are called to do...
And our work, in the day of evil is to NOT GO OUT from HIS SPIRIT but to REMAIN IN HIM with our eyes set above and beyond to HIM who is faithful and true..in and out of season
A time will come when we won't be able to do the "works of light" in that we won't be able to take the time to read HIS WORD..
Therefore, in all things pray and let the peace of GOD which surpasses ALL UNDERSTANDING guard our hearts and our minds in CHRIST JESUS...
AND HOLD TO THE TESTIMONY of JESUS...
Which will be made manifest in the days of darkness to identify those who held and clung to CHRIST and those who simply did lip service to HIS NAME...
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Rahab the prostitute did one thing in the end...and because of it, she received salvation.
She tied a red ribbon, "marking her house" and did not "GO OUT".
To you, GOD4ME, she might have appeared by the standards of the world, on the outside as unclean...but, because of her faith and obedience in listening to GOD, she was before GOD, clean...
That woman in the bar, her testimony?
You should have told her, it isn't the outside that GOD cleans, but the inside....
And then after the inside is clean she will begin to see manifested (slowly but surely, provided she holds firm to HIM and the confidence that HE who began the good work will bring it to completion if she will only put her trust and hope and confidence in HIM that GOD does NOT lie, GOD'S WORD and PROMISES are steadfast and all GOD'S WORD and PROMISES are a resounding AMEN for those who are IN CHRIST JESUS)...on the outside the result and effects of HIS INWARD WASHING...
IF HE does not wash us, how can we have a part with HIM?
She tied a red ribbon, "marking her house" and did not "GO OUT".
To you, GOD4ME, she might have appeared by the standards of the world, on the outside as unclean...but, because of her faith and obedience in listening to GOD, she was before GOD, clean...
That woman in the bar, her testimony?
You should have told her, it isn't the outside that GOD cleans, but the inside....
And then after the inside is clean she will begin to see manifested (slowly but surely, provided she holds firm to HIM and the confidence that HE who began the good work will bring it to completion if she will only put her trust and hope and confidence in HIM that GOD does NOT lie, GOD'S WORD and PROMISES are steadfast and all GOD'S WORD and PROMISES are a resounding AMEN for those who are IN CHRIST JESUS)...on the outside the result and effects of HIS INWARD WASHING...
IF HE does not wash us, how can we have a part with HIM?
Naaman did one thing in the end.
Gehazzi did one thing in the end.
Who was washed and saved?
Make sure to know the difference between TRUE TREASURE and "treasures" that are NOT treasures at all.
You see Naaman had many things...but he lacked one thing and could not, even with all the treasures which he had, do for himself anything to clean what had been made manifest on the outside a sickness..
But, after he finally listened to go and wash, he obeyed...and the outer flesh was restored to the skin of a child.
Now Gehazzi had his eyes on the wrong treasure, though he thought outwardly his flesh was clean...
When he revealed that he had his eyes on the wrong treasures, what he thought outwardly as clean, was clearly made manifest that what was inward was not...
The thief on the cross did one thing...acknowledged JESUS believed and was told TODAY you will be with ME in paradise
What exactly did the thief "do" to earn for himself salvation?
What did the rich man who had all things, think that he needed to "do" to earn his salvation?
Gehazzi did one thing in the end.
Who was washed and saved?
Make sure to know the difference between TRUE TREASURE and "treasures" that are NOT treasures at all.
You see Naaman had many things...but he lacked one thing and could not, even with all the treasures which he had, do for himself anything to clean what had been made manifest on the outside a sickness..
But, after he finally listened to go and wash, he obeyed...and the outer flesh was restored to the skin of a child.
Now Gehazzi had his eyes on the wrong treasure, though he thought outwardly his flesh was clean...
When he revealed that he had his eyes on the wrong treasures, what he thought outwardly as clean, was clearly made manifest that what was inward was not...
The thief on the cross did one thing...acknowledged JESUS believed and was told TODAY you will be with ME in paradise
What exactly did the thief "do" to earn for himself salvation?
What did the rich man who had all things, think that he needed to "do" to earn his salvation?
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You are just like your mate, J Prince, He twists the scriptures and the Greek by only quoting half of it, in order to misguide people.
I have various Hebrew and Greek study Bibles, with the fullness of the Greek meanings, as I have proved from Rom 6: 4.
Rom 6: 4 Doesn't say we walk in newness of life, DOES IT??, It says we SHOULD walk in the new life.
And we should live out the new creation, And if you were honest, you would admit that not every Christians is living like they are a new creature.
T
Yeah, even before I realized that the last part of Romans 8:1 was not in many of the original Greek manuscripts I thought it was weird. Why would someone have condemnation on them while they were walking after the Spirit? The only reason we ever filled condemned it when we walked after the flesh anyway. But many people do NOT get it. Oh well, just thought I'd mention that.
Maybe we have different Greek interlinears? As the verb in 2 Cor 5:17 "are become new " = perfect tense - ( perhaps you don't know what the perfect tense means?)
The perfect tense in Greek is used to describe a completed action which produced results which are still in effect all the way up to the present.
Source: The Tenses Explained
2 Corinthians 5:17 - has emerged - have become - perfect tense
1096 [e]
gegonen
γέγονεν
has emerged
V-RIA-3S
Tense: Perfect
Mood: Indicative
Voice: Active
Please show me in your references that the Greek word here for " have become" is a different tense they the perfect. Thank you...
Stick to the topic at hand ...don't go off on rabbit trails...
Show me what your "Greek Bible" gives for the verb in 2 Cor 5:17 " have become" as I have asked now for the 3rd time.
You keep making these assertions that the Greek in 2 Cor 5:17 is different from what I have said. I want to learn from you so it should be no problem to show me....show me the "fullness of your Greek meanings" from the verb "have become" in that verse we have been talking about.
In the Greek interlinear I use it has 2 Cor 5:17 as the perfect tense.
The perfect tense in Greek is used to describe a completed action which produced results which are still in effect all the way up to the present.