Sola Scripture -V- Traditions

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Jul 19, 2011
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#41
That reminds me of a quote from Martin Luther I read somewhere (i'm paraphrasing)

"I have gotten rid of one pope and created thousands!"
EXACTLY!!! Thank you. You summed up my entire point in one sentence. I'm going to look up the original quote and add it as my signature.
 
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zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
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#42
EXACTLY!!! Thank you. You summed up my entire point in one sentence. I'm going to look up the original quote and add it as my signature.

William Tyndale, before being strangled and burned at the stake, cries out, "Lord, open the King of England's eyes". woodcut from Foxe's Book of Martyrs (1563).
 
Jul 19, 2011
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#43
serious?
Philip walked with Jesus.
they had no NT scriptures yet.
what was the eunuch reading? what would Philip have told him that we don't have recorded now?
This is ironic in that you have inadvertently proved my very point by disagreeing with me.

The point is the Eunich is not able to understand the scripture without it being explained to him, thereby disproving Sola Scriptura.

You interpret this to mean because Phillip explained it to him and because the conversation is recorded, we have no further need of explanation.

I am interpret this to be an example: Unless someone in the know explains to us, we can't know what scriptures really mean.

The very fact that you disagree with my interpretation of this passage necessitates that we have to look for another source to interpret the true meaning. The point here is you can't argue against my interpretation of scripture without demonstrating the falseness of Sola Scriptura.

Paul was an Apostle and a prophet who was taught by Jesus and knew the OT.
they were still having the canon revealed. that's what he's talking about.
wow.
This is even more ironic than the first in that you are now appealing to the history of the event to interpret the verse and by doing so breaking with Sola Scriptura.

and we're going into scriptura looking for words like traditions to disprove sola scriptura?
WHAT?
Sounds like you don't have a clear understanding of what Sola scriptura is. Sola Scriptura means scripture alone. It does not mean without scripture. I believe in the Bible and that its the word of God. I just don't believe in private interpretation.

BTW, I take not that you only addressed the bible verses themselves and ignored the logical and historical problems of sola Scriptura
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#44
serious?
Philip walked with Jesus.
they had no NT scriptures yet.
what was the eunuch reading? what would Philip have told him that we don't have recorded now?

Paul was an Apostle and a prophet who was taught by Jesus and knew the OT.
they were still having the canon revealed. that's what he's talking about.
wow.
and we're going into scriptura looking for words like traditions to disprove sola scriptura?
WHAT?
lol. I hate to say it but sometimes their reasoning is almost laughable. I am amazed that even they believe some of the stuff they do and use to to prove thier points of view.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
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#45
This is ironic in that you have inadvertently proved my very point by disagreeing with me.

The point is the Eunich is not able to understand the scripture without it being explained to him, thereby disproving Sola Scriptura.

You interpret this to mean because Phillip explained it to him and because the conversation is recorded, we have no further need of explanation.

I am interpret this to be an example: Unless someone in the know explains to us, we can't know what scriptures really mean.

The very fact that you disagree with my interpretation of this passage necessitates that we have to look for another source to interpret the true meaning. The point here is you can't argue against my interpretation of scripture without demonstrating the falseness of Sola Scriptura.



This is even more ironic than the first in that you are now appealing to the history of the event to interpret the verse and by doing so breaking with Sola Scriptura.



Sounds like you don't have a clear understanding of what Sola scriptura is. Sola Scriptura means scripture alone. It does not mean without scripture. I believe in the Bible and that its the word of God. I just don't believe in private interpretation.

BTW, I take not that you only addressed the bible verses themselves and ignored the logical and historical problems of sola Scriptura
if you say so.
 
J

jimmydiggs

Guest
#46
The very fact that you disagree with my interpretation of this passage necessitates that we have to look for another source to interpret the true meaning. The point here is you can't argue against my interpretation of scripture without demonstrating the falseness of Sola Scriptura.

Presupposition induced disagreement =/= no right answer available
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#47
The biggest point is we do not know if all of what the apostles taught was written down or not. We either have to assume that it all was written down, or that it all wasn't.


No we don't. if we assume anything, we can assume the fact if God wanted us to know it. He would have put it in his word. It is the assumption that God wanted us to know it. But for some reason did not put it in his word that actually gives God a bad name. It is an assumption that says God did not finish what he started to do. I know you don't believe this. But I can see it no other way.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
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#48
lol. I hate to say it but sometimes their reasoning is almost laughable. I am amazed that even they believe some of the stuff they do and use to to prove thier points of view.
amazing huh?
the great round-a-bout to downgrade the scriptures and have me in a confessional.
maybe we should throw rocks in our hats or look at chicken entrails. what's the difference?
no thanks.

so, if we are sola scriptura, we are saying no one can preach.:rolleyes:
mkay.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#49
right. i keep hearing that from scotty too.
i'm okay with my Bible.
love zone.

lol. They don't get our point. They ASSuME it was passed on. But since it is not inspired in scripture. we have no proof what they claim to have been passed on was realy from them. all we have is the words of men.

We also have to ASSuME god did not complete his book. WHich I refuse to do.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#50
Presupposition induced disagreement =/= no right answer available

yet scripture does not leave us this way, It gives us checks and balances.


His reasoning is backwards. We can not agree. so we must look to men to settle our disagreement.

What did Jesus do when they disagreed? He went to scripture. What did Paul do? He went to scripture. This is what we should do. Not go to men.
 
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jimmydiggs

Guest
#51
@ eternal
This: =/= means "does not equate to"



Also, you're wrong. Pope says so. God whispers in his ear.

/sarcasm
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#52
amazing huh?
the great round-a-bout to downgrade the scriptures and have me in a confessional.
maybe we should throw rocks in our hats or look at chicken entrails. what's the difference?
no thanks.

so, if we are sola scriptura, we are saying no one can preach.:rolleyes:
mkay.
lol. Well this would go against Gods word. We are to teach and preach our younger. We are just not supposed to take what anyone teaches or preaches as gospel truth without first testing what they say and make sure it is from God. Of course what is our guide? Scripture! The only thing we can PROVE came directly from God>
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
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#53
yet scripture does not leave us this way, It gives us checks and balances.

His reasoning is backwards. We can not agree. so we must look to men to settle our disagreement.

What did Jesus do when they disagreed? He went to scripture. What did Paul do? He went to scripture. This is what we should do. Not go to men.
Ephesians 2
8For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

hello?
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#54
Ephesians 2
8For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

hello?
yeah, they believe this. But they do not practice what they believe. they believe in a sacrificial system of workjs. but do not call them works. call them faith working in love.. lol.. twist things to make them appear good and true. and so many fall for it. so sad.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
#55
lol. Well this would go against Gods word. We are to teach and preach our younger. We are just not supposed to take what anyone teaches or preaches as gospel truth without first testing what they say and make sure it is from God. Of course what is our guide? Scripture! The only thing we can PROVE came directly from God>
nah EG: i meant this old pony:

The point is the Eunich is not able to understand the scripture without it being explained to him, thereby disproving Sola Scriptura.

You interpret this to mean because Phillip explained it to him and because the conversation is recorded, we have no further need of explanation.

I am interpret this to be an example: Unless someone in the know explains to us, we can't know what scriptures really mean.
so, according to the works guys, we are silly sola scripturas because philip preaching Jesus to the eunech is not sola scriptura:rolleyes:

mmmmkay.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#56
@ eternal
This: =/= means "does not equate to"



Also, you're wrong. Pope says so. God whispers in his ear.


/sarcasm
Makes me wonder what the next "grave" sin they are gonna come up with (rolls eyes)
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#57
nah EG: i meant this old pony:



so, according to the works guys, we are silly sola scripturas because philip preaching Jesus to the eunech is not sola scriptura:rolleyes:

mmmmkay.
ah.. you mean philip teaching from scripture?? and this disproves sola scriptura.. ok I get it. :D
 
Jul 19, 2011
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#58


No we don't. if we assume anything, we can assume the fact if God wanted us to know it. He would have put it in his word. It is the assumption that God wanted us to know it. But for some reason did not put it in his word that actually gives God a bad name. It is an assumption that says God did not finish what he started to do. I know you don't believe this. But I can see it no other way.
Here's another way of looking at it then. The written word is not the best method to convey every single idea. As humans are multidimensional and learn in numerous ways, would it not make sense that God would use a multidimensional way to communicate His truths?

But for a moment, forget about what's in the Bible or whether or not its' complete. What if you can't read? What if you are illiterate for one reason or another? Suppose you are blind? What if I tell you "read the bible so you can learn to be save. All the answers are in the Bible." And you counter with "I can't read." And so I answer with "too bad for you. God communicates through his written word. If you can't read, I guess that means that God doesn't want to talk to you."

To the vast majority of all people everywhere, for the first 1500 years of Christianity, it didn't matter in the least if the Bible had all the answers or not because there was no way a person could read. Most people were illiterate and even if they weren't, copies of the Bible were scarce because they had to be hand copied.

What I would like to see is for someone to argue sola scriptura for a world without a printing press.
 
J

jimmydiggs

Guest
#59
Here's another way of looking at it then. The written word is not the best method to convey every single idea. As humans are multidimensional and learn in numerous ways, would it not make sense that God would use a multidimensional way to communicate His truths?
"... and he said, let there be Flannelgraph and Projector Screens! And so it was"

Yeah, taken care of.

But for a moment, forget about what's in the Bible or whether or not its' complete. What if you can't read?
Audio bible.


What if you are illiterate for one reason or another?
Repeat.

Suppose you are blind?
Braille is a wonderful language.


What if I tell you "read the bible so you can learn to be save. All the answers are in the Bible." And you counter with "I can't read." And so I answer with "too bad for you. God communicates through his written word. If you can't read, I guess that means that God doesn't want to talk to you."
Then your being a brat. You can read for them.


To the vast majority of all people everywhere, for the first 1500 years of Christianity, it didn't matter in the least if the Bible had all the answers or not because there was no way a person could read.
Did not the Catholic church teach Catechism at this time?

Most people were illiterate and even if they weren't, copies of the Bible were scarce because they had to be hand copied.
This isn't an argument against Sola Scriptura. It's just about Economics and technology.


What I would like to see is for someone to argue sola scriptura for a world without a printing press.
Audio bibles.