Something that has been bothering me

[Joshua_Riley]

My question to you is this. Someone i know is having an open relationship. They are also into BDSM. If they are not family and i tell them that they are wrong and ask them not to practice it around me is this okay as long as they dont bring any of that around me. What if it was a family member should the saem precaution be taken to seperate ourselves from them?

 

[ChosenbyHim]

My question to you is this. Someone i know is having an open relationship. They are also into BDSM. If they are not family and i tell them that they are wrong and ask them not to practice it around me is this okay as long as they dont bring any of that around me. What if it was a family member should the saem precaution be taken to seperate ourselves from them?

Joshua, the Bible says that we are to be separate. It is clear.

14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness? - 2 Corinthians 6:14 (KJV)


What you should do is rebuke them strongly, and let them know that they are wrong and in serious error. And that they need to repent and get saved.

Don't even fellowship with people who are living in open sin like that. It will hurt your testimony.


We are also commanded to abstain from all appearance of evil.


22 Abstain from all appearance of evil. - 1 Thessalonians 5:22 (KJV)


And yes, even if it was your family member that was involved in this sin, you would still need to rebuke them in love and let them know that they are in error in their living. And share the Gospel with them.

And also make sure that you separate from them. That way they are not causing you to compromise on your walk with the Lord.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Separation theology is from the devil. We are to use Jesus as our example. He lived with sinners, Fellowshipped with them. And loved them. He did nto even judge them, even though HE has the right too (and I might add, the Only man who ever had the right to, as he was without sin and is God)

The church is told to go into the world (where sinners are)

The church is told to make disciples (help get them saved, so they have the ABILITY to stop sin.

The church was NEVER told to hide itself in it safe littel building and separate itself from the world.

What the passage means, is do not PARTICIPATE in their sin. Not Separate yourself from them.

 

[Joshua_Riley]

do you think that it is okay to have friends that sin as long as they dont practice the sin around you and if they do you leave.

 

[Jon4TheCross]

If you really want to know your next step....

The call was also to follow Jesus. If you are following without looking back, then the only way you are going to see anyone again is if they are in your path. Follow Jesus, and let the dead bury their dead.

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Mat 10:34
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[TD]¶Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
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Mat 10:35
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[TD]For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.
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Mat 10:36
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[TD]And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.
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Mat 10:37
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[TD]He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.
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Mat 10:38
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[TD]And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.
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Mat 10:39
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[TD]He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it.
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Mat 10:40
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[TD]¶He that receiveth you receiveth me, and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.
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Mat 10:41
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[TD]He that receiveth a prophet in the name of a prophet shall receive a prophet's reward; and he that receiveth a righteous man in the name of a righteous man shall receive a righteous man's reward.
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Mat 10:42
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[TD]And whosoever shall give to drink unto one of these little ones a cup of cold water only in the name of a disciple, verily I say unto you, he shall in no wise lose his reward.
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[ChosenbyHim]

Separation theology is from the devil.

No it is not sir. I recommend that you further study the Holy Scriptures and see what they have to say on the matter.

We are commanded to be separate from the world and from false religions (See 2 Corinthians 6)


We are also exhorted and commanded to not have fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness but that we are to reprove them ( See Ephesians 5:11)



11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.
12 For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret.
13 But all things that are reproved are made manifest by the light: for whatsoever doth make manifest is light.
14 Wherefore he saith, Awake thou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ shall give thee light.
15 See then that ye walk circumspectly, not as fools, but as wise,
16 Redeeming the time, because the days are evil. - Ephesians 5:11-16 (KJV)



14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?
15 And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?
16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you.
18 And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty. - 2 Corinthians 6:14-18 (KJV)


It is the New Evangelicalism and the Emerging church movement that have sought to get Evangelical Christians to forsake the Biblical Doctrine of separation. It was Harold Ockenga started this whole unbiblical movement (New Evangelicalism) for the main purpose of repudiating the Biblical Doctrine of Separation. It was Ockenga and this Neo Evangelicalism that led the way for abandoning a strict Biblical stance and to reject the old traditional and Biblical standards of separation from the world. That is why today, you have this New Age, Apostate, "Christian rock & roll", hippie culture so prevalent in the churches of America and other places around the world.
Eternally-gratefull; the bottom line is that the Holy Bible teaches Biblical Separation. There is no getting around that. If you want to reject that truth, then that is on you. You will have to answer for that at the Judgment Seat of Christ.

But you cannot deny the fact that the teaching of separation is there in the Scriptures.

We are to use Jesus as our example. He lived with sinners, Fellowshipped with them.

Well when He sat and fellowshipped with them, He convicted them of their sin and reproved them. And He did not condone their lifestyle. He was there to seek and to save that which was lost.

And loved them. He did nto even judge them, even though HE has the right too (and I might add, the Only man who ever had the right to, as he was without sin and is God)

Well yes, he loved them and that is why he preached the truth to them. He warned them about Hell and coming Judgment.

The church is told to go into the world (where sinners are)

We are told to go into the world and to preach the Gospel. We are commanded to preach the word. To be instant in season, and out of season. To reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.


We are not told to fellowship or to hang out with the world. We are reach them with the Gospel, while at the same time keeping our good distance from the fashions, philosophies and the lusts that are in the world. Again, remember we are in the world, but we are not of the world.

The church is told to make disciples (help get them saved, so they have the ABILITY to stop sin.

Well again, yes we are to reach the lost with the Gospel. We are ambassadors for Jesus Christ. We have been given the word and ministry of reconciliation:


18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;
19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.
21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him. - 2 Corinthians 5:18-21 (KJV)



And again, we are still to remain separate from the world:
12 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God. - Romans 12:1-2 (KJV)



5 Be ye therefore followers of God, as dear children;
2 And walk in love, as Christ also hath loved us, and hath given himself for us an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweetsmelling savour.
3 But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints;
4 Neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks.
5 For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.
6 Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.
7 Be not ye therefore partakers with them.
8 For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light:
9 (For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth
10 Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord.
11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.
12 For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret.
13 But all things that are reproved are made manifest by the light: for whatsoever doth make manifest is light.
14 Wherefore he saith, Awake thou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ shall give thee light.
15 See then that ye walk circumspectly, not as fools, but as wise,
16 Redeeming the time, because the days are evil. - Ephesians 5:1-16 (KJV)

The church was NEVER told to hide itself in it safe littel building and separate itself from the world.

Well first off, the church is not the building or a building. The Church is the Body of Christ (1 Cor. 12:27).

And yes, we are told to be separate from the world. Again, read the Scriptures which were given ( 2 Corinthians 6, Ephesians 5, Romans 12).


Also you should consider the following Scriptures also:


15 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.
17 And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever. - 1 John 2:15-17 (KJV)



4 Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.
5 Do ye think that the scripture saith in vain, The spirit that dwelleth in us lusteth to envy?
6 But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble. - James 4:4-6 (KJV)

What the passage means, is do not PARTICIPATE in their sin. Not Separate yourself from them.

It means both sir.

It not only means to not participate in their sin, but it also means to also SEPARATE from them as well. Again, go back and read 2 Corinthians 6:14-18. The teaching of Biblical Separation is there.

 

[Josh321]

i think in order to get the anwser we gotta look at a few verses back to see what is going on 2 Corinthians 6:14-17King James Version (KJV)
14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?


15 And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?


16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.


17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you.


it's simple really the nature of a born again believer is changed which means it's almost impossible to still hang around people like that, it's like you know better why would you go among and part take with people that just smoke and talk about things in the world?

 

[Ariel82]

2 Corinthians 6:17

King James Version (KJV)

[SUP]17 [/SUP]Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you.

i'm not sure how you got that reading....I just kept reading the rest of the letter and came to this verse:

"
2 Corinthians 7

New King James Version (NKJV)

7 Therefore, having these promises, beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God."


the point is that we are to cleanse ourselves, to not worship idols and not to live a sinful life as the world does. I'm not sure how you got that we should isolate ourselves from other people...

For example you have these verses to clarify the meaning..


I believe its about HYPOCRITES who claim to be Christian but still practice sexual immorality and refuse to admit that its a sin.:

1 Corinthians 5

[SUP]9 [/SUP]I wrote to you in my epistle not to keep company with sexually immoral people. [SUP]10 [/SUP]Yet I certainly did not mean with the sexually immoral people of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. [SUP]11 [/SUP]But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortioner—not even to eat with such a person.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside? [SUP]13 [/SUP]But those who are outside God judges. Therefore “put away from yourselves the evil person.”[SUP][d]



[/SUP]

 

[Hizikyah]

Luke 9:5, "And whoever will not accept you, when you leave that city, shake off the very dust from your feet as a testimony against them."

Mattithyah 18:21-22, "Then Kepha came to him, and asked; Teacher, how often shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? For seven times? Yahshua said to him: I do not say to you, for seven times, but for seventy times seven!"

In my opinion if they are not open to listen, reason, learn, etc, I keep it moving. If they are open to these things, I think we are to be ready anytime as much as needed to share the truth.

2 Timothy 4:2, "Preach the word Be instant; ready to take your positions in season, out of season. Reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine."

But any time the focus is not on Yahweh, I remove myself Yahweh willing.

1 Corinthians 15:33, "Do not be deceived: Bad company corrupts righteous character!"

To me bottom line is:

1 Yahchanan :2-15-17, "Do not love the world, nor the things that are in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world: the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world. And the world passes away, with the lust that is in it; but he who does the will of Yahweh abides forever."

 

[john832]

2 Corinthians 6:17

King James Version (KJV)

[SUP]17 [/SUP]Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you.



I have a question about this verse. I talk to people and they seem to think that if a person; for example is gay; that you talk to them, and try to explain to them that they are wrong and why. After you do this you tell them that you cant associate with them because of there ways. I feel in my heart that this cant be so. The bible also tells use to love one and other as we love ourselves and as Jesus loves us. If this is so how can you not want to keep in contact with these people? Yes they are wrong in there way of thinking but hiding in your house and church house isn't shinning your light to the people of the world because if you don't want to associate with people that are sinful you might a well not leave your door step. I have no problem walking in a park with a sinner gay or other wise incorrect, or going to there house as long as they dot practice there ways around me. Ive been told that im wrong for thinking this and i wanted to get more opinions about this and proof as to why i might be wrong. Please help this really bothers me.

Speaking of two different subjects here. Paul does not say we must avoid all sinners, he says to avoid those who are unrepentant in the church...

1Co 5:9 I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:
1Co 5:10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world.
1Co 5:11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.
1Co 5:12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?
1Co 5:13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.

Yet, one does not make close friends with those of the world...

2Co 6:14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?

Doesn't say to completely avoid all, says to avoid those in the church who are unrepentant. In fact, those in the church who are unrepentant are to be cast out...

1Co 5:1 It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife.
1Co 5:2 And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you.
1Co 5:3 For I verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged already, as though I were present, concerning him that hath so done this deed,
1Co 5:4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ,
1Co 5:5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

 

[texascowgirl]

this is untrue. sorry, tex. if this were true Paul would not have had to have written around 2/3 of the new testament. we must strive for the mark. Just because we are under grace doesn't give us warrant to live like hecky-pinecky! If we do that we turn God's grace into a prostitute. Not cool. Paul said " I die daily" He was talking about his fleshly nature, the "old man". we all who are saved still have it and occasionally it rears it's ugly head. It's up to us to recognize that and ask God's forgiveness once again and for help not to do it again.

Some born again verses
ohn 1:13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of theflesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
That means not born of our human natural parents. No humanmother and father. You are not reborn as long as it’s the flesh that gave birth to you. John 3:6 Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spiritgives birth to spirit. We are flesh and will remain born of Flesh until we passaway/physically die from this earth and are born of God in resurrection. Letslook at these verses below:

1john 3:9 No one who is born of God will continue to sin,because God's seed remains in him; he cannot go on sinning, because he has been born of God.

1 John 3:6 No one who lives in him keeps on sinning. No one who continues to sin has either seen him orknown him.

1John 5:18 We know that anyoneborn of God does not continue to sin; the one who was born of God keeps him safe, andthe evil one cannot harm him.

many people will say they are a sinner but born again and the two do not mix.You cannot be a born again sinner. You are one or the other but you cannot beboth at the same time.

Are men falsely claiming to be without sin? the bible says if you say you are without sinyou are deceived and the truth is not in you. A sinner claiming to be reborn isa lie. There is no such thing as a reborn sinner. A reborn man is not a sinner.

John 1:13 children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or ahusband's will, but born of God.

Was it your natural parents [your carnal mother and father] that put you here.yes it was. you were born of human decision. Therefore you are not reborn yet and when we are reborn, we cannot sin. Scriptures do not say try not to sin, they say cannot sin. Totally unable to sin.

Man cannot follow the law, and man cannot change himself. man simply can do nothing.

 

[texascowgirl]

So when I stated this....."When one is born again they will be unable to sin at all. There is no need for someone who is unable to sin to try not to sin" I was telling the truth although you stated its untrue. The only one I know born of God is Jesus Christ.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

No it is not sir. I recommend that you further study the Holy Scriptures and see what they have to say on the matter.

lol sir.

Then Jesus was the worse sinner around. Because he did exactly what you claim we must not do.

You my friend should study the life of Christ more.

We are commanded to be separate from the world and from false religions (See 2 Corinthians 6)

Being separate from the world and false religions does NOT mean we do not go into the world and try to get them saved. Your not going to spread the gospel being trapped in your little church building and trying to allienate yourself from them.

We are also exhorted and commanded to not have fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness but that we are to reprove them ( See Ephesians 5:11)

lol.. it is obvious you have not read. the word reprove their means to expose. Paul tells us how to do this.

1. Be immitators of God. How did Jesus do this? He was a light into them. this exposed their darkness. And shamed them. He did not judge them nor stay away from. What did he do with people like you who want to judge them? He demanded that you must have NO SIN to cast the first stone. so why are you casting stones my friend?

2. Manifest darkness by walking in light. this EXPOSES the darkness.

nothing in the passage tells us to separate ourselves completely to them. we can not expose them if we hide in our little church groups and buildings and never walk among them.

It is the New Evangelicalism and the Emerging church movement that have sought to get Evangelical Christians to forsake the Biblical Doctrine of separation. It was Harold Ockenga started this whole unbiblical movement (New Evangelicalism) for the main purpose of repudiating the Biblical Doctrine of Separation. It was Ockenga and this Neo Evangelicalism that led the way for abandoning a strict Biblical stance and to reject the old traditional and Biblical standards of separation from the world. That is why today, you have this New Age, Apostate, "Christian rock & roll", hippie culture so prevalent in the churches of America and other places around the world.

Eternally-gratefull; the bottom line is that the Holy Bible teaches Biblical Separation. There is no getting around that. If you want to reject that truth, then that is on you. You will have to answer for that at the Judgment Seat of Christ.

You sound so much like a pharisee, If Christ was here today and acted as he did. You would judge him.

Put on the mind of Christ. do not be like the pharisee. who seems righteous on the outside, but inside they are full of filth and unrighteousness. This is what separationalists are. they try to protect themselves. when God said the gates of hell will never prevail. Instead of going into the world they expect trhe world to come to them. If the church did not come to many of us, but separated from us, people like us would not be here, we would still be dead in our sin.

But you cannot deny the fact that the teaching of separation is there in the Scriptures

I can deny your form of separation is taught. We are told to GO INTO THE WORLD. You want to hide from the world. You are NOT obeying the word of God. .

well when He sat and fellowshipped with them, He convicted them of their sin and reproved them. And He did not condone their lifestyle. He was there to seek and to save that which was lost.

1. He did not judge them
2. He did not separate from them. he continued to go to them
3. He did fellowship with them.

Going into the world is not condoning sin, It is being a light, SHowing LOVE, and this exposes their darkness. This is what Christ did. And what you are telling us not to do.


If you want to hide in your church, go ahead.. As for my church, we will go into the world. And be a light into the world.

God did not come to judge, he came to save. we should put on this mind which was in Christ.

All have sinned and fall short. Non of us deserved eternal life when we were saved. Non of us deserve it now. Nothing gives us the right to judge anyone. all we can do is what Christ did. Show love, compassion. and be a light, God will expose their sin, he does not need us to do this.

 

[reject-tech]

OP, I believe the passage that includes your verse is about something totally unrelated to physical sin.
It's about whether Jesus is far way in another place as nothing more than a token dude to bow before, or inside the follower making peace with all but religious zealots.

Jesus spent His time and meals with sinners. He was homeless, so that means He was chillin' in their houses.
We should be doing that instead of "inviting them to church" and passing or failing them on whether they show up on day one ready to throw down 20 years of drinking or homosexuality and jump into monkey suit salvation.