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J
Jesus made a statement in John 8:24
I told you that you would die in your sins; if you do not believe that I am the one I claim to be, you will indeed die in your sins."
So who did Jesus claimed to be? Claimed to be a Messiah? King? Redeemer? Savior? or in fact God?
If the Redeemer is Jesus Christ, then Isaiah 54:5 says Redeemer is God. If the King is Jesus Christ, then there is Only One King over all the Earth, and it God. If Jesus Christ is the Savior, then Ps. 89:26, Isa.43:11 and Hos. 13:4 claimed that God is the Savior. So, therefore Jesus is God.
Many time in the OT, stated that God is the Father, one of my favorite verse is Malachi 2:10
Have we not all one Father ? Did not one God create us? Why do we profane the covenant of our fathers by breaking faith with one another?
And Jesus claimed Himself to be the Son of God, the angels known this when He was born, when Peter said "You are the Son of the Living God" Jesus blessed him, and when the priests asked Jesus the question, He replied by saying Yes when he was arrested, mention in the first three Gospels.
And the Holy Spirit, You can read about the Holy Spirit from Jesus own words in John 14 and 15. But however since God is spirit as Jesus said, and God is holy...would God be the Holy Spirit?
Those are my beliefs
I told you that you would die in your sins; if you do not believe that I am the one I claim to be, you will indeed die in your sins."
So who did Jesus claimed to be? Claimed to be a Messiah? King? Redeemer? Savior? or in fact God?
If the Redeemer is Jesus Christ, then Isaiah 54:5 says Redeemer is God. If the King is Jesus Christ, then there is Only One King over all the Earth, and it God. If Jesus Christ is the Savior, then Ps. 89:26, Isa.43:11 and Hos. 13:4 claimed that God is the Savior. So, therefore Jesus is God.
Many time in the OT, stated that God is the Father, one of my favorite verse is Malachi 2:10
Have we not all one Father ? Did not one God create us? Why do we profane the covenant of our fathers by breaking faith with one another?
And Jesus claimed Himself to be the Son of God, the angels known this when He was born, when Peter said "You are the Son of the Living God" Jesus blessed him, and when the priests asked Jesus the question, He replied by saying Yes when he was arrested, mention in the first three Gospels.
And the Holy Spirit, You can read about the Holy Spirit from Jesus own words in John 14 and 15. But however since God is spirit as Jesus said, and God is holy...would God be the Holy Spirit?
Those are my beliefs
S
God= X
Father= A
Son= B
Holy Spirit= C
A=X and B=X, but A does not equal B
B=X and C=X, but B does not equal C
A=X and C=X, but A does not equal C
But all are equal to X.
And for as many scriptures as a Trinitarian can quote to prove their belief, there exist the same number or more verses that prove the Oneness theory. Each unable to address the alternate scriptures without simply quoting their own.
Yup it's a mystery!
Father= A
Son= B
Holy Spirit= C
A=X and B=X, but A does not equal B
B=X and C=X, but B does not equal C
A=X and C=X, but A does not equal C
But all are equal to X.
And for as many scriptures as a Trinitarian can quote to prove their belief, there exist the same number or more verses that prove the Oneness theory. Each unable to address the alternate scriptures without simply quoting their own.
Yup it's a mystery!
I cannot give any name to beliving in what is in the scriptures. I never have seen trinity anywhere in the scriptures or the other assigned names.
I believe in God Our Father, His son Jesus Our Lord and savior, and the Holy Spirit which is in us.
Jesus said I am one with the Father, he also said we can be one with him and the Father .
Through the Holy Spirit we are one with Him.
I have always trusted this understanding to Jesus. Just as we believe in Jesus , this is also a belief of faith.
Many have pondered this over the years. Some things we cannot understand because this is not in the understanding of the world, but the understanding of God, and I think we need to simply believe.
God bless, pickles
I believe in God Our Father, His son Jesus Our Lord and savior, and the Holy Spirit which is in us.
Jesus said I am one with the Father, he also said we can be one with him and the Father .
Through the Holy Spirit we are one with Him.
I have always trusted this understanding to Jesus. Just as we believe in Jesus , this is also a belief of faith.
Many have pondered this over the years. Some things we cannot understand because this is not in the understanding of the world, but the understanding of God, and I think we need to simply believe.
God bless, pickles
D
The Fathers Name is Jesus: "Joh 5:43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive. "
The Son's Name is Jesus: "Mat 1:21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins. "
The Holy Ghost's Name is Jesus: "Joh 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you."
A 2 year old could see that if three TITLES have the same name that they are all one person.
IE: Take H2O it exists in 3 forms, Gas, Liquid, Solid. But it is still the same chemical makeup. Varying on the temperature though it changes it's state.
IE: I am a Son, a Brother, and a Nephew. But I am Still David. I cannot go to the bank and sign a cheque "Son".
If someone goes to the store and they want to put it on my charge account, who do they have to say? Do they say, oh put it on my nephews account? Sure that's all fine and dandy to you, because you know what nephew your talking about and what his NAME is. The sales clerk behind the counter doesn't know this though. They need to know whose NAME it is under. Therefore you must say "Put this on My Nephew David Murray's account."
"Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Joh 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God. ....
.... Joh 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth."
1Ti 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
"Mat 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: "
Well if you look at what I posted above. The NAME of the father is Jesus, the name of the son is Jesus, and the name of the Holy Ghost is Jesus.
They are not three separate entities. They are not co-eternal co-existent beings. They are ONE.
Jesus said "Mar 12:29 And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: "
If Jesus Is our Lord, and our Lord is God; then can't we conclude that Jesus is God, God in the flesh. He wasn't there during the creation as a separate entity, he is one with God.
"Rev 1:8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty. "
I think it's a simple context to understand, and don't see why there is so much debate about it. The Apostles knew that Jesus was God, were they doing it wrong? I don't think so, as they were to spread the gospel teaching all nations.
The Son's Name is Jesus: "Mat 1:21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins. "
The Holy Ghost's Name is Jesus: "Joh 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you."
A 2 year old could see that if three TITLES have the same name that they are all one person.
IE: Take H2O it exists in 3 forms, Gas, Liquid, Solid. But it is still the same chemical makeup. Varying on the temperature though it changes it's state.
IE: I am a Son, a Brother, and a Nephew. But I am Still David. I cannot go to the bank and sign a cheque "Son".
If someone goes to the store and they want to put it on my charge account, who do they have to say? Do they say, oh put it on my nephews account? Sure that's all fine and dandy to you, because you know what nephew your talking about and what his NAME is. The sales clerk behind the counter doesn't know this though. They need to know whose NAME it is under. Therefore you must say "Put this on My Nephew David Murray's account."
"Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Joh 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God. ....
.... Joh 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth."
1Ti 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
"Mat 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: "
Well if you look at what I posted above. The NAME of the father is Jesus, the name of the son is Jesus, and the name of the Holy Ghost is Jesus.
They are not three separate entities. They are not co-eternal co-existent beings. They are ONE.
Jesus said "Mar 12:29 And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: "
If Jesus Is our Lord, and our Lord is God; then can't we conclude that Jesus is God, God in the flesh. He wasn't there during the creation as a separate entity, he is one with God.
"Rev 1:8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty. "
I think it's a simple context to understand, and don't see why there is so much debate about it. The Apostles knew that Jesus was God, were they doing it wrong? I don't think so, as they were to spread the gospel teaching all nations.
1
Precision Semantics leaving out the context of many of these verses...
In general, I believe that the Oneness approach to the scriptures leaves us with a schizophrenic God. Jesus can pray to no one else since in oneness theology he is not the Father when on earth as Jesus, and yet he does pray to the Father. The way oneness then defend this is to then do harm to the incarnation by making the person of Christ schizophrenic, causing one nature (flesh) to speak at some points and the divine nature to speak at others and dividing the Christ's will and spirit. This last view is then what does damage to the atonement of God for man.
Rather...That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, concerning the Word of life— the life was manifested, and we have seen, and bear witness, and declare to you that eternal life which was with the Father and was manifested to us— that which we have seen and heard we declare to you, that you also may have fellowship with us; and truly our fellowship is with the Father and with His Son Jesus Christ. And these things we write to you that your joy may be full.
The Word of Life also called the eternal life, herein, which was with the Father and obviously eternally distinguishable from the Father was made manifest to us... and truly our fellowship is with the Father and with Jesus in distinction. For one cannot have an eternal father before all things and after all things unless there is eternal son, otherwise he is only a temporary father to himself such as in oneness theology.
In general, I believe that the Oneness approach to the scriptures leaves us with a schizophrenic God. Jesus can pray to no one else since in oneness theology he is not the Father when on earth as Jesus, and yet he does pray to the Father. The way oneness then defend this is to then do harm to the incarnation by making the person of Christ schizophrenic, causing one nature (flesh) to speak at some points and the divine nature to speak at others and dividing the Christ's will and spirit. This last view is then what does damage to the atonement of God for man.
Rather...That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, concerning the Word of life— the life was manifested, and we have seen, and bear witness, and declare to you that eternal life which was with the Father and was manifested to us— that which we have seen and heard we declare to you, that you also may have fellowship with us; and truly our fellowship is with the Father and with His Son Jesus Christ. And these things we write to you that your joy may be full.
The Word of Life also called the eternal life, herein, which was with the Father and obviously eternally distinguishable from the Father was made manifest to us... and truly our fellowship is with the Father and with Jesus in distinction. For one cannot have an eternal father before all things and after all things unless there is eternal son, otherwise he is only a temporary father to himself such as in oneness theology.
There is no scripture a person that believes in a trinity can quote to support their trinity,if they knew the truth about God.
God is an omnipresent Spirit and is the same throughout His omnipresent Spirit with no distinction of persons.
Before God created anything He is a Holy Spirit.
When He created mankind God became the Father of all the believers.
God manifest all His attributes to His Son,the man Christ Jesus.
It is the same God with no distinction of persons that created all things,gave all His attributes to the Son,the man Christ Jesus,and dwells in the saints.
When we say Father,we are acknowledging that God is our Father.
When we say Son,we acknowledge that God manifest all His attributes to the Son,the man Christ Jesus,and the only way we will see the invisible God,and the Spirit in Jesus is still connected to the omnipresent Spirit of God.
When we say Holy Spirit,we acknowledge that God dwells in His saints.
Matt
God is an omnipresent Spirit and is the same throughout His omnipresent Spirit with no distinction of persons.
Before God created anything He is a Holy Spirit.
When He created mankind God became the Father of all the believers.
God manifest all His attributes to His Son,the man Christ Jesus.
It is the same God with no distinction of persons that created all things,gave all His attributes to the Son,the man Christ Jesus,and dwells in the saints.
When we say Father,we are acknowledging that God is our Father.
When we say Son,we acknowledge that God manifest all His attributes to the Son,the man Christ Jesus,and the only way we will see the invisible God,and the Spirit in Jesus is still connected to the omnipresent Spirit of God.
When we say Holy Spirit,we acknowledge that God dwells in His saints.
Matt
D
Jesus prayed to the Father because he still had a carnal mind. What do we do to overcome our carnal mind? We fast and pray. What did Jesus do? He fasted and prayed? Who is our example? Jesus. Henceforth, if Jesus wouldn't have prayed, then we wouldn't know that we must also pray. Father is a ROLE just like the son is a ROLE. They are RELATIONSHIPS between God and Humanity. Not separate beings.
As far as thinking that God would be schitzophrenic that is just absurd. Have you not ever thought or said to yourself "What am I going to do today? Why am I doing this?" Etc... we all do it, does that make us all schitzophrenics? Even so. If God would be like that it would lead me to believe that we would also, if God made us in his Image.
Does a Spirit have a right hand? No. So how would someone be able to sit on the right hand of a Spirit, who doesn't have right or left?
It is a metaphor. Jesus is the right hand man. The go to guy if you will. As he says "no man can come to the father except through me" "I am the way the truth and the life" This is because we call upon the name of our Lord JESUS when we need help, in baptism, healing, prophecying, performing miracles, etc. It's not enough to say God or to say Father, Son, Holy Ghost. We must say JESUS I NEED YOU.
I ask that you seek after God and ask him to reveal himself to you. This is what I did, and it worked marvelously. God Bless.
As far as thinking that God would be schitzophrenic that is just absurd. Have you not ever thought or said to yourself "What am I going to do today? Why am I doing this?" Etc... we all do it, does that make us all schitzophrenics? Even so. If God would be like that it would lead me to believe that we would also, if God made us in his Image.
Does a Spirit have a right hand? No. So how would someone be able to sit on the right hand of a Spirit, who doesn't have right or left?
It is a metaphor. Jesus is the right hand man. The go to guy if you will. As he says "no man can come to the father except through me" "I am the way the truth and the life" This is because we call upon the name of our Lord JESUS when we need help, in baptism, healing, prophecying, performing miracles, etc. It's not enough to say God or to say Father, Son, Holy Ghost. We must say JESUS I NEED YOU.
I ask that you seek after God and ask him to reveal himself to you. This is what I did, and it worked marvelously. God Bless.
D
I have answered your questions already. There is one being.
It doesn't come right out and say that we fast to control our flesh. But we fast to control temptation. Temptation can be caused by our flesh, and by the enemy. But it is because of our flesh that we give into the temptation of the enemy. Henceforth we fast to control our flesh.
"Mat 4:1 Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.
Mat 4:2 And when he had fasted forty days and forty nights, he was afterward an hungred."
Why was he fasting while being tempted? To control his temptations. Temptations that are caused by the devil, and of the flesh. The flesh likes the things the enemy does. The flesh is like oil and the spirit is like water the 2 do not mix. How do we solve that? Make the flesh weaker. How? By fasting and praying.
It doesn't come right out and say that we fast to control our flesh. But we fast to control temptation. Temptation can be caused by our flesh, and by the enemy. But it is because of our flesh that we give into the temptation of the enemy. Henceforth we fast to control our flesh.
"Mat 4:1 Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.
Mat 4:2 And when he had fasted forty days and forty nights, he was afterward an hungred."
Why was he fasting while being tempted? To control his temptations. Temptations that are caused by the devil, and of the flesh. The flesh likes the things the enemy does. The flesh is like oil and the spirit is like water the 2 do not mix. How do we solve that? Make the flesh weaker. How? By fasting and praying.
No, it says nowhere in scripture that we fast to control the flesh. This is your own personal opinion. It is not backed up by scripture. Nor do we fast to overcome temptation.
Let me ask you something concerning this subject. Jesus was discussing fasting with the Pharisees. He told them a parable and finished by saying
'And no-one after drinking the old wine wants the new, for he says. 'The old is better.'
What do you think Jesus meant by those words?
'Then the end will come when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power. For he must reign until he has putr all his enemies under his feet. The last enemy to be destroyed is death. For he has put everything under his feet
Now when it says that everything has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God Himself, who put everything under Christ. When he has done this, then the son himself will be made subject to Him who put everything under him, so that God will be all in all. 1Cor15:24-28
You have clearly stated there is one being now in Heaven of Father and son. Paul is talking here of things that are happening once Jesus has returned to Heaven. It is impossible to say only one being is being spoken of by Paul in these five continuous verses.
Therefore, who would you believe? Someone who told you something scriptural? Or the Apostle Paul who wrote nearly half the books of the NT?
I hope you will not try and bend this scripture. I become weary at times of people in order to try and justify their opinions will not hesitate to try and bend plainly written scripture
Let me ask you something concerning this subject. Jesus was discussing fasting with the Pharisees. He told them a parable and finished by saying
'And no-one after drinking the old wine wants the new, for he says. 'The old is better.'
What do you think Jesus meant by those words?
'Then the end will come when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power. For he must reign until he has putr all his enemies under his feet. The last enemy to be destroyed is death. For he has put everything under his feet
Now when it says that everything has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God Himself, who put everything under Christ. When he has done this, then the son himself will be made subject to Him who put everything under him, so that God will be all in all. 1Cor15:24-28
You have clearly stated there is one being now in Heaven of Father and son. Paul is talking here of things that are happening once Jesus has returned to Heaven. It is impossible to say only one being is being spoken of by Paul in these five continuous verses.
Therefore, who would you believe? Someone who told you something scriptural? Or the Apostle Paul who wrote nearly half the books of the NT?
I hope you will not try and bend this scripture. I become weary at times of people in order to try and justify their opinions will not hesitate to try and bend plainly written scripture
S
I found that this was a good explanation of fasting... "Biblically, fasting is abstaining from food, drink, sleep or sex to focus on a period of spiritual growth. Specifically, we humbly deny something of the flesh to glorify God, enhance our spirit, and go deeper in our prayer life."
It's not necessarily to "control" the flesh, but I can see how his use of the word could be interpreted by some as having a similar meaning. We deny our flesh, in order to become more receptive to spiritual things (which could be a complete thread in itself).
I don't think there is scripture specifically stating the reason for fasting, but if you look at the occurences of fasting throughout the Bible, it's clear that fasting was used as a way to remove fleshly focus so that would be more receptive spiritually.
He's on his own with the other question!
It's not necessarily to "control" the flesh, but I can see how his use of the word could be interpreted by some as having a similar meaning. We deny our flesh, in order to become more receptive to spiritual things (which could be a complete thread in itself).
I don't think there is scripture specifically stating the reason for fasting, but if you look at the occurences of fasting throughout the Bible, it's clear that fasting was used as a way to remove fleshly focus so that would be more receptive spiritually.
He's on his own with the other question!
Why have you not commented on ther fact that according to Paul over five continuous verses there cannot now be one being in Heaven of Jesus and God the Father? Yet you say there is only one being.
But I do not mind answering your question.
Jesus is the Son of God, not God the Father, but God gave him the name God.
But about the Son He says
Your throne o God will last for ever and ever
And righteousness will be a sceptre of your kingdom
Youb have loved righteousness and hated wickedness
Therefore, God, your God has set you above your co0mpanions
By annointing you with the oil of Joy
Heb1:8&9
J
Either Jesus Christ is God or isn't, God can't give him the name then we are worshiping two gods, Jesus and God, the Father.
The bible said that Jesus created the heaven and the earth, making Jesus a Creator. And also the bible said that God appeared in the flesh, meaning God became a baby, became a young boy and lasting God became a man.
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