What is baptism of the Holy Spirit biblically?

wolfwint · Sep 12, 2016

Hm. I understand acts 2,2: And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting. 3 And there appeared unto them separated tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them. 4 And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance. 5 And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven. 6 Now when this was sounded abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because every man heard them speak in his own language. 7 And they were all amazed and marveled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these who speak Galileans? 8 And how hear we every man in our own tongue, in which we were born? 9 Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and the dwellers in Mesopotamia, and in Judea, and Cappadocia, in Pontus, and Asia, 10 Phrygia, and Pamphylia, in Egypt, and in the parts of Libya about Cyrene, and visitors from Rome, Jews and proselytes, 11 Cretans and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God.

and also acts 8,12: But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women. 13 Then Simon himself believed also: and when he was baptized, he continued with Philip, and wondered, beholding the miracles and signs which were done. 14 Now when the apostles who were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John: 15 Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Spirit: 16 (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.) 17 Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit.

10,44: While Peter yet spoke these words, the Holy Spirit fell on all them who heard the word. 45 And they of the circumcision who believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Spirit. 46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, 47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, who have received the Holy Spirit as well as we? 48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then they asked him to tarry certain days.

and 19,1: And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper country came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples, 2 He said unto them, Received you the Holy Spirit when you believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Spirit. 3 And he said unto them, Unto what then were you baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism. 4 Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him who should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus. 5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Spirit came on them; and they spoke with tongues, and prophesied. 7 And all the men were about twelve.

not as an example how baptising with the Holy Spirit looks like. I understand these events as an act to show the sourrounding world, that it has come what was told before from the Lord Jesus (acts 2); to show the jewish that the samaritians are also saved (acts 8), to show the jewish people that the gentiles are saved too (acts 10) and to show to the disciples of John the baptist that Jesus is the messaja (acts 19).

I understand water baptism as Paul describes it in Roman 6, 3-6 Know you not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? 4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that just as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. 5 For if we have been united with him in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection: 6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that we should no longer serve sin.

like an identifcation with the death and ressuraction of our Lord Jesus.

And verses like acts 2, 41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.

shows me that receiving the word of god, ( I understand with this, to be saved and getting the batising with the Holy Spirit. It reminds me to John 1,12: But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the children of God, even to them that believe on his name:

But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the children of God, even to them that believe on his name:

Becoming a christian is getting the Holy Spirit and be born again. In one Moment. The water baptism is according my understanding then an witness for before the seen and unseen world, that ones belonges to Jesus Christ and should follow automaticly (without long time of teaching) the event of be born again.

wattie · Sep 13, 2016

wolfwint said:

Hm. I understand acts 2,2: And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting. 3 And there appeared unto them separated tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them. 4 And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance. 5 And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven. 6 Now when this was sounded abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because every man heard them speak in his own language. 7 And they were all amazed and marveled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these who speak Galileans? 8 And how hear we every man in our own tongue, in which we were born? 9 Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and the dwellers in Mesopotamia, and in Judea, and Cappadocia, in Pontus, and Asia, 10 Phrygia, and Pamphylia, in Egypt, and in the parts of Libya about Cyrene, and visitors from Rome, Jews and proselytes, 11 Cretans and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God.

and also acts 8,12: But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women. 13 Then Simon himself believed also: and when he was baptized, he continued with Philip, and wondered, beholding the miracles and signs which were done. 14 Now when the apostles who were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John: 15 Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Spirit: 16 (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.) 17 Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit.

10,44: While Peter yet spoke these words, the Holy Spirit fell on all them who heard the word. 45 And they of the circumcision who believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Spirit. 46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, 47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, who have received the Holy Spirit as well as we? 48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then they asked him to tarry certain days.

and 19,1: And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper country came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples, 2 He said unto them, Received you the Holy Spirit when you believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Spirit. 3 And he said unto them, Unto what then were you baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism. 4 Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him who should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus. 5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Spirit came on them; and they spoke with tongues, and prophesied. 7 And all the men were about twelve.

not as an example how baptising with the Holy Spirit looks like. I understand these events as an act to show the sourrounding world, that it has come what was told before from the Lord Jesus (acts 2); to show the jewish that the samaritians are also saved (acts 8), to show the jewish people that the gentiles are saved too (acts 10) and to show to the disciples of John the baptist that Jesus is the messaja (acts 19).

I understand water baptism as Paul describes it in Roman 6, 3-6 Know you not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? 4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that just as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. 5 For if we have been united with him in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection: 6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that we should no longer serve sin.

like an identifcation with the death and ressuraction of our Lord Jesus.

And verses like acts 2, 41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.

shows me that receiving the word of god, ( I understand with this, to be saved and getting the batising with the Holy Spirit. It reminds me to John 1,12: But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the children of God, even to them that believe on his name:

But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the children of God, even to them that believe on his name:

Becoming a christian is getting the Holy Spirit and be born again. In one Moment. The water baptism is according my understanding then an witness for before the seen and unseen world, that ones belonges to Jesus Christ and should follow automaticly (without long time of teaching) the event of be born again.

Yes,

there is a difference between:

1 Receiving eternal life.. have the Holy Spirit indwell your spirit.

2 Being baptised by full immersion in water later.. which pictures eternal salvation but isn't eternal salvation.

3 Baptism of the Holy Spirit.

I can see how baptism of the Holy Spirit could be related to receiving eternal life.. as it could be figurative for salvation.. but the verse in 1 Corinthians 12:13...is referring to the local and visible church body at Corinth.

They had people being baptised as a pre-cursor to joining the Corinth body. Whether Jews, Greek, slaves or free.. all could join that local church body.

Why?

Because the surrounding passages are about unity in a local church. The picture of the body in that passage is of a visible local entity.

Do we really think that if I am ill.. another believer way over the other side of the world will be suffering with me?

The whole picture here in Corinthians is of the church at Corinth. It isn't describing a universal body of every believer.

It is also representative of any local church body as an example to other local churches. As the letter is meant to be as it distributed among other churches.

The letter is to .. the church at Corinth.. not to every believer. So the picture of a body applies to their congregation.

Baptism of the Holy Spirit isn't what is going on with the church at Corinth. Acts has the clear examples of baptism of the Holy Spirit.. and I can't see in those examples of individuals being baptised by the Holy Spirit seperate from the church body they are assembled with.

notuptome · Sep 13, 2016

wattie said:

Baptism of the Holy Spirit is the regeneration from dead in sin to new life in Christ. It is not corporate but individual.

1 Cor 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

This is individuals being added the invisible body which is the church the bride of Christ.

Tit 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

For the cause of Christ
Roger

OneFaith · Sep 13, 2016

When you are water baptized you are also Holy Spirit baptized. Peter said be baptized and you will receive the Holy Spirit. At Pentecost they were baptized with the Holy Spirit AND with fire- the firey tongues were a gift of the Holy Spirit- not the Holy Spirit Himself.

Understand this, having the Holy Spirit means that either you have been saved, or that God knows you will be saved- for the Holy Spirit marks us for salvation, but, and this is really important, it does not have to happen at the exact time you are saved. So when someone does get saved by baptism, they definitely get the Holy Spirit. Let me give you an example...

At some restaurants you have to pay before you get your food, but at other restaurants you can eat before you pay. Well in the same way, those in the Old Testament had the Holy Spirit before Christ paid for their sins. This is because they obeyed God, so God postponed their sin debt. So if you pay for your food right before you eat it, it is definitely yours. If you get baptized the Holy Spirit is definitely yours. Do you see?

The only thing that saves is to have our sins washed away, and the only thing that washes sins away is Christ's blood (which is God's grace), and the only way that we get that blood is for God to give it to us spiritually, and God gives it according to the covenant we live under- whether we lived under the old covenant or the new. Under the new covenant this is baptism into Christ. Long story short, after the apostles died and until Christ's return, you can only get the Holy Spirit through baptism. Now God does have a way for those who cannot get or understand the gospel message, they are a law unto themselves, but that's another topic.

But for those without excuse, who know and understand the gospel, they must obey it in order to be saved. For "With flames of fire (hell) God will take vengeance on those who know not God and who OBEY NOT the gospel of His Son." And what is the gospel? The good news of how Christ's death, burial, and resurrection saves us if we do the same by being baptized- we die to our own will, bury our old sinful self in the watery grave of baptism, and are raised a new creature with the Holy Spirit.

seed_time_harvest · Sep 13, 2016

I got this Information from Andrew Wommack.

It would be very difficult for someone who is not born again to understand the Holy Spirit. The bible tells us in I Corinthians that the natural mind can’t understand spiritual things. Here is Andrew’s commentary to help you understand this subject with greater clarity.

1 Corinthians 2:14

Life For Today Study Bible Notes

Note 1 at 1 Corinthians 2:14: This term “natural man” includes, but is not limited to, all people who are not born again (see note 2 at John 3:3). It literally means “a human being governed by his own natural, human powers and not by the Spirit of God” (Helps for Translators, p. 24). This is also descriptive of carnal Christians.

Note 2 at 1 Corinthians 2:14: Notice this word “receiveth.” God cannot be criticized for carnal man not having His wisdom. God has made His wisdom available through Christ, but the carnal mind will not receive it (see note 2 at 1 Corinthians 2:7).

Note 3 at 1 Corinthians 2:14: Spiritual truths can only be perceived by a person’s spirit. Therefore, it is impossible for those who are walking in the vanity of their minds (Ephesians 4:17) to ever understand the things of God.

The Word of God is a spiritual book, written under the direction of the Holy Spirit. It was not written to the head but to the innermost part of the heart. This is why some people find the Bible so hard to understand. They are trying to comprehend it using only their minds (see note 13 at John 6:63). The Word of God has to inspire our hearts before it can enlighten our heads.

Andrew Wommack's Living Commentary.

Every Christian is born of the Spirit (Jn. 3:5) and if he does not have the Spirit, he is not of God (Rom. 8:9). The born again experience joins us to God and we become one spirit with Him (1 Cor. 6:17). This can be compared to the well of living water that Jesus spoke of in Jn. 4:14.

Joh 4:14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.

There is another experience that Jesus speaks of as ‘rivers of living water’ that shall flow from within (Jn. 7:37-38).

Joh 7:38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.

At the moment of the new birth, the believer is baptized by the Spirit into the body of Christ (1 Cor. 12:13).

1Co 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body . . . . and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

However, being baptized BY the Spirit INTO the body is not the same as being baptized BY Jesus in or with the Spirit. In the first case, it is the Spirit who immerses us into the body of Christ. In the second case it is Jesus who fills us or immerses us into the Spirit. These are two different events.

Receiving the Holy Spirit at the new birth produces the character of Christ within us. Being baptized with the Spirit produces the power for the ministry of Christ.

The immersion of the born again believer into the Spirit can happen at any moment after being born again. It is called, the promise of the Father (Luke 24:49, Acts 1:4, Acts 2:39), being endued with power (Luke 24:29), receiving power (Acts 1:8), being baptized in or with the Holy Spirit (Acts 1:5 and many others), being filled with the Spirit (Acts 4:31), receiving the Holy Spirit (Acts 8:15-17), having the Holy Spirit fall on you (Acts 10:44) and having the Holy Spirit come upon you (Acts 19:6). This event happens subsequent to believing and being born again in every example mentioned.

Speaking in tongues (praying in the Spirit) is the normal manifestation and is available to all who are baptized in the Spirit, though not all step out in faith and release this gift. Prophecy is another manifestation mentioned in scripture.

There are three kinds of tongues mentioned in the New Testament. The first kind we see on the day of Pentecost when every man heard the gospel in his own language. These tongues needed no interpretation. The second kind we find in the church meeting when it must be interpreted and only two or three should give such a message in tongues.

The third kind involves praying in the Spirit and speaking mysteries that edify us and build us up on our most holy faith. Paul said he speaks in tongues more than all, but not in the church. So the question is, where? And then he says he wished that all spoke in tongues. So there is a prayer language that is available to all Christians who have been filled with the Holy Spirit.

When we ask for the Holy Spirit, in faith believing that we received when we ask (because God cannot lie), then we know we have it. The manifestations are different for every person. But we don't walk according to our feelings or lack of feelings. We walk by faith.

Lu 11:13 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?

When we believe that the anointing and power of the Spirit have been poured out upon us, we can begin to release the gifts of the Spirit in our lives.

The heavenly prayer language exists in the believer who has asked to be filled with the Holy Spirit. It’s just a matter of releasing it. As we praise God in English, we can simply switch over to a heavenly language that our mind won't comprehend.

It is similar to receiving the inspiration for a song. We hear it on the inside, but it is up to us to take paper and pen and write down the impressions that we have had. God doesn't force us to write, nor is it 'automatic handwriting.'

So it is with speaking in tongues. The inspiration of the Spirit is within, and we provide the vocal chords, the tongue, the lips and the will. We can start and stop and speak loudly or softly as we wish. The Spirit gives the inspiration but we control how much we want to release.

So it is with the other gifts as well. We have inspirations, 'ideas,' 'burdens,' etc., and we begin to step out in faith with words or actions to bless others. We know that we know that the ability of God is within us and that He wants to flow through us, but we must get out of the boat. God does not force these things, nor take over our bodies and make us do things without our cooperation.

For more on this topic, we encourage you to listen to Andrew's teaching, "The New You and the Holy Spirit." It is available to listen to for free here: Audio Teachings - Andrew Wommack Ministries.

Blessings,

Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God and our Lord Jesus Christ (2 Peter 1:2)

Preacha24-7 · Sep 13, 2016

Water baptism does not save you. It's a way you can pubilically proclaim your faith in Jesus. Showing your church family and those who haven't been born again how serious you are about living for God. When you get born again God makes you a new person. 2Cor5:17 Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new.Right before Jesus ascended into heaven he gave the disciples instructions. Matt28:19 Go ye therefore and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.Verse 20 Teaching them to observe and do all that I have commanded you. And lo, I am with you always even to the end of the age. The Holy Spirit gives Christian power to resist temptation. The Holy Spirit gives Christians power to obey God's Word and gives us power over Satan and his demonic forces. How do we defeat Satan? 3 easy steps. 1. The name of Jesus 2. The Word of God 3.The power of the Holy Ghost. Christians don't have any power without the Holy Ghost. When you receive the Holy Ghost God gives you power and preaching the gospel becomes easier because you are now operating in the power and Anointing of the Holy Ghost. The Holy Ghost is available to all
Christians. God is looking for clean vessels. The Anointing will not dwell in dirty vessels. Blessed are the pure in heart for they shall see God. Matt Chapter 5. To God be the Glory. Preacha24-7

ZacharyB · Sep 14, 2016

Below are the NT verses which talk about the experience of
"the baptism with the Holy Spirit".

Not everything that happened at the time was reported,
which is similar to the reporting of today, right?
Also, not all of the things listed below happened during each
experience, such as: the laying on of hands was not always done
because sometimes the Holy Spirit just moved (with no human involvement).

Luke 24:49 ---- promise, upon, power
Acts 1:4-8 ---- promise, baptism, upon, power
Acts 2:1-4 ---- upon, filled, tongues
Acts 2:33-39 -- promise, gift
Acts 4:8-16 --- filled, boldness, miracles
Acts 4:31 ----- filled, boldness
Acts 5:12-16 -- miracles
Acts 8:14-19 -- upon, hands, received, power
Acts 9:17-18 -- baptism, hands, filled
Acts 10:44-48 - gift, upon, received, tongues
Acts 11:15-17 - baptism, gift, upon
Acts 14:3 ----- hands, boldness, miracles
Acts 19:5-6 --- baptism, upon, hands, tongues

upon ------- the Holy Spirit fell upon
filled ----- filled with the Holy Spirit
received --- received the Holy Spirit
hands ------ the laying on of hands

Tonight, I will check all of this for accuracy and report back tomorrow.

ZacharyB · Sep 15, 2016

re: baptism with the H.S.

Below are the NT verses which talk about the experience of
"the baptism with the Holy Spirit".

Not everything that happened at the time was reported,
which is similar to the reporting of today, right?
Also, not all of the things listed below happened during each
experience, such as: the laying on of hands was not always done
because sometimes the Holy Spirit just moved (with no human involvement).
[SUB][SUP]
[/SUP][/SUB]re: baptism with the H.S.
Luke24:49 ---- wait for the baptism
Acts1:4-8 ---- wait for the baptism
Acts2:1-4 ---- the day of Pentecost
Acts2:37-39 –- how to receive this gift
Acts4:8-16 --- Peter’s boldness
Acts4:31 ----- Peter’s companions receive
Acts5:12 ----- results of the baptisms
Acts8:14-19 –- the Samarians receive
Acts9:17-18 –- Saul/Paul receives
Acts10:44-48 – many Gentiles receive
Acts11:15-17 – Gentiles receive, part 2
Acts14:3 ----- Paul & Barnabus miracles
Acts19:5-6 --- Ephesian disciples receive

---------------KEY WORDS in baptism passage
Luke24:49 ---- promise, upon, power
Acts1:4-8 ---- promise, baptism, upon, power
Acts2:1-4 ---- upon, filled, tongues
Acts2:37-39 -- promise, gift
Acts4:8-16 --- filled, boldness, miracles
Acts4:31 ----- filled, boldness
Acts5:12 ----- miracles
Acts8:14-19 -- upon, hands, received, power
Acts9:17-18 -- hands, filled
Acts10:44-48 - gift, upon, received, tongues
Acts11:15-17 - baptism, gift, upon
Acts14:3 ----- hands, boldness, miracles
Acts19:5-6 --- upon, hands, tongues

ZacharyB · Sep 15, 2016

Below are the NT verses which talk about the experience of
"the baptism with the Holy Spirit".

Not everything that happened at the time was reported,
which is similar to the reporting of today, right?
Also, not all of the things listed below happened during each
experience, such as: the laying on of hands was not always done
because sometimes the Holy Spirit just moved (with no human involvement).

re: baptism with the H.S.
Luke 24:49 ---- wait for the baptism
Acts 1:4-8 ---- wait for the baptism
Acts 2:1-4 ---- the day of Pentecost
Acts 2:37-39 –- how to receive this gift
Acts 4:8-16 --- Peter’s boldness
Acts 4:31 ----- Peter’s companions receive
Acts 5:12 ----- results of the baptisms
Acts 8:14-19 –- the Samarians receive
Acts 9:17-18 –- Saul/Paul receives
Acts 10:44-48 – many Gentiles receive
Acts 11:15-17 – Gentiles receive, part 2
Acts 14:3 ----- Paul & Barnabus miracles
Acts 19:5-6 --- Ephesian disciples receive

------------ ---KEY WORDS in baptism passage
Luke 24:49 ---- promise, upon, power
Acts 1:4-8 ---- promise, baptism, upon, power
Acts 2:1-4 ---- upon, filled, tongues
Acts 2:37-39 -- promise, gift
Acts 4:8-16 --- filled, boldness, miracles
Acts 4:31 ----- filled, boldness
Acts 5:12 ----- miracles
Acts 8:14-19 -- upon, hands, received, power
Acts 9:17-18 -- hands, filled
Acts 10:44-48 - gift, upon, received, tongues
Acts 11:15-17 - baptism, gift, upon
Acts 14:3 ----- hands, boldness, miracles
Acts 19:5-6 --- upon, hands, tongues

notuptome · Sep 15, 2016

Romans 5:1 ¶ Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:
2 By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.
3 And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience;
4 And patience, experience; and experience, hope:
5 And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.
6 ¶ For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.
7 For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die.
8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.
10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

If as scripture teaches God loved us while we were estranged from Him by sin how much more shall He love us now that we are reconciled to Him through the blood of His Son Jesus Christ?

For the cause of Christ
Roger

wattie · Sep 15, 2016

[FONT=&quot]Here is something to think about for you all: 984d - Spirit Baptism[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Baptized in the Spirit
B. H. Carroll
From The Baptist Challenge, February 2014
“I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with (in) the Holy Ghost” (Matt. 3:11).

[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]I have myself heard one and the same person use seriously every one of the following expressions:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]1. “Oh, I have received the Spirit baptism, and that is the main thing.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]2. “Whatever may be said of the mode of water baptism, it is certain the Spirit baptism was by pouring.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]3. “O Lord, baptize us in the Holy Ghost and in fire.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]4. The Spirit baptism is but another name for regeneration or conversion, as proved from the Scriptures (Eph. 4:5): “One Lord, one faith, one baptism,” and from1 Cor. 12:13: “For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free: and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.”

[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]I say that I have heard one person use all four of these expressions. Now listen to an analysis of them. Judging from the conditions and circumstances when these expressions were used, fairly analyzed, they mean as follows:

[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]First expression: There are now in the world two baptisms, by authority of Jesus Christ: Spirit baptism, the greater; water baptism, the less. If you receive the first it exempts you from any special obligation as to the second. I say that is what that first expression means when analyzed. “Oh, we have received the Spirit baptism, which is the main thing.” Analyze that expression and it means that if you have received the greater, the other is a matter of so small importance that there is no special obligation with reference to it.

[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Second expression: As the Spirit baptism, the greater, was by pouring, therefore the water baptism could not be an immersion. That is unquestionably a fair analysis of the second expression.

[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Third expression analyzed: The Spirit baptism comes in answer to prayer. Christians should pray for it. Spirit baptism and fire mean the same thing. The expression you remember was this: “O Lord, baptize us in the Holy Ghost and in fire.” That is a prayer. I say that when that expression is analyzed it means first, that the Spirit baptism comes in answer to prayer, and second, that Christians should pray for it; and third, that the baptism of the Holy Ghost and baptism in fire mean the same thing.

[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Fourth expression: As the Spirit baptism means regeneration or conversion, therefore all Christians have already received it, since one cannot be a Christian without regeneration or conversion, and as there is only one baptism, by the Scripture quoted, it cannot be received again by the same person. Hence, Christians may not pray for the baptism of the Spirit. Moreover, as there is only one baptism, and that is Spirit baptism, therefore water baptism is no baptism, and is not obligatory. That is a fair analysis of the fourth expression.

[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The last expression flatly contradicts the first and the third, and the second abuses etymology, rhetoric, and logic and yet the one who said these four things devoutly and religiously held to them all.[/FONT]

ZacharyB · Sep 16, 2016

ZacharyB said:

The above is explained more fully in POST #29.

Do you see how the KEY WORDS all link together
to give a full picture of the baptism with the Holy Spirit?

It obviously is a different experience than
when one receives the Holy Spirit INSIDE at the time
when he/she first believes (to God's satisfaction).

wattie · Sep 16, 2016

ZacharyB said:

Yes, this is not individual indwelling.

I would contend that it is a church.. a New Testament assembly being empowered by the Holy Spirit.

I am also thinking it is the Holy Spirit coming to be the Lampstand of one of His churches.. 'dwelling in the midst'.

1 Corinthians 12:13 is about the church at Corinth body. Whoever they are, anyone could join that church at Corinth with a pre-requisite of WATER baptism.

Water baptism is the subject of this one.

If the rest of the book is about the church at Corinth.. then therefore so is 1 Corinthians 12:13.

'Body' in the sense of the church at Corinth.. it's a local body.

So the Corinthians.. whatever background they were.. each member of that church was baptised by full immersion as a pre-requisite to membership to that local body.

I know.. most think the body of Christ is every believer.. but consider the passages surrounding this church at Corinth reference.

There will one body of all believers one day in heaven.. when we are all assembled in heaven.. but that is 'yet, future'

Now, here, on earth we have churches plural.. local bodies.

ZacharyB · Sep 17, 2016

Wattie, it might just be a good idea ...
to actually read the passages involved instead of guessing about everything!

wattie · Sep 17, 2016

ZacharyB said:

I'm not guessing.

The church of Corinth is the subject of the letter. The picture of the body of Christ in 1 Corinthians 12 is of something that is visible, knit together, local, framed together etc..

The word church in every other context in the NT is about a particular NT assembly.

1 Corinthians 12..when one members suffers.. all suffer with them.. that is a picture of a local NT assembly.. not every believer.

I don't suffer when a believer in Nigeria suffers.. not unless I look at a news item and see them being harmed.

A fellow church member in a local church.. that is immediate, close suffering.. that others members feel with the Holy Spirit stirring their hearts to care for them.

In Corinthians, Paul says to the church at Corinth 'ye (or YOU) are the body of Christ'

This statement is addressed to that particular local church body. The letter got distributed to other churches, yes.. but it is the example of a local body to other local bodies. A body in almost every context is of something connected, framed together, united, visible...

Every heard of the 'local wife'? 'local flock'?

So.. the use of local... I am using just to compare with the false idea of a church of every believer on earth now. In it's true sense.. there is no need to put local in front of church.. because it is local everytime.

ZacharyB · Sep 18, 2016

wattie said:

You're not thinking.
You're not understanding Scripture.
You're not following the Spirit.
You're not ... endless ...

wattie · Sep 18, 2016

ZacharyB said:

Well, then how is the picture of a body in the book of Corinthians.. one of every believer?

I'd like to know.

Stunnedbygrace · Sep 19, 2016

ZacharyB said:

Where did this come from dude?? Of course he's thinking. And he's discussing scripture. I admit I don't know what he's working toward but geezers man, why attack him like that...?

ZacharyB · Sep 19, 2016

Stunnedbygrace said:

God is sick and tired of His sheep being fast asleep, and He wants them to be woken up!!!
Time is short ... believe me!
Get right ... or get destroyed.

Stunnedbygrace · Sep 19, 2016

ZacharyB said:

And why exactly do you think this man is asleep?

What is baptism of the Holy Spirit biblically?

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