Why did Christ need to deliver us from under law?

[onlinebuddy]

We come to Christ because we are sinners condemned by the law. To remain under law means death. That's a fundamental teaching.....

Whom is the Law applicable to?
Interpretation 1: All mankind without an exception
Interpretation 2: Only the Jews.
I believe in interpretation 2.
The Jews in their arrogance accepted the law (salvation by works).
The Jews had about 1500 years to prove that they could keep the law, and that salvation can be obtained by performance. They failed!

If the Law is not for us, why is it mentioned in the biblical cannon?
Ans: So that we may learn from it, lest we say, "I can do it on my own strength."

Once we study the Law, we learn that no man has an excuse for rejecting salvation by grace(Christ) by saying, "I can do it by myself." That boast has been removed.
Hence, the law teaches us that we need a Savior. The purpose of the law is to point us to Christ.

So, let us stop telling people that the entire world automatically comes under the law since birth. Rather let us preach Christ- the end of the law!

 

[TMS]

First, let's establish that Christ came to deliver the fallen human race from under law:

Gal 4:4 "When the fulness of the time came, God sent forth his Son, born of a woman, born under the law,5 that he might redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons."

Q: Why did we need to be delivered from under law?

A: Romans 3:22,23 "There is no difference between Jew and Gentile, for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God"

The glory of God is defined by Moses as God's goodness, i.e., His righteousness. See Ex 33:18,19

So all, both Jew and Gentile, have sinned and are failing to fully live (i.e., measure up) to the righteousness of Christ. That makes even believers sinners.

For sinners to be under law means death. The law brings wrath. The curse of the law is death, goodbye to life forever. That's why we needed to be delivered from under law.

Totally agree

 

[KennethC]

We come to Christ because we are sinners condemned by the law. To remain under law means death. That's a fundamental teaching.....

Yes now if people could just understand the fundamental teaching that Jesus teachings and commands are not the law then I think things would go better in the threads.

 

[seed_time_harvest]

Jesus came to bring people unto God. To deliver people from the consequences of sin and death.
I don't think Jesus came to specifically deliver people from being "under" the Law (whatever that means), but that might have been a means to an end.

The reason we we had to be delivered from the law Is because we all would have come up short trying to be righteous perfectly so GOD made a way.

GOD gave dominion of the earth to man and a man would have to fulfil the law perfectly because GOD requires perfection when It comes to keeping his law.

The law was given to man before JESUS came to earth In the flesh so then they would have had to keep the law perfectly on their own and no one was able to keep It.

After JESUS took back the power that Adam gave away he graced it to all who believe In the WORD of GOD and we have access to this Grace through faith.

 

[TMS]

Your unsaved for two reasons, because you tried to save themself, Salvation by works. Or because you didn't accept the free grace that Jesus gives, reject Gods gift. What is Grace? My understanding is "favour when we don't deserve it". If there is no law to judge us by we are all free from sin and don't need a saviour.

Is there or isn't there a law?, We all agree that we are not under the penalty of the law, (NOT UNDER THE LAW), but is the law useless, is it completely thrown away, riped up, or not? If there isn't a law standing, we are not accountable to it in any way at all, we don't need redemption from sin because there is no law to call us sinners and we don''t need to worry about judgement day because we could stand up and say there is no law to judge us by, so God has no case. But if the law is still there we have a guide to explain what sin is and what unrighteousness is, and on judgement day the unsaved will have something to worry about because the law still applies to those that don't accept Jesus and His Grace.

 

[onlinebuddy]

I can't believe that you have a problem reading Paul because he is very clear:

Romans 3:9 What then? Are we better than they? Not at all. For we have previously charged both Jews and Gentiles that they are all under sin. 10 As it is written: “There is none righteous, no, not one;...19 Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world (not Just the Jew) may become guilty before God. 20 Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Both Jew and Gentile stand guilty of sin under law. To remain under law means death.

Why are the Jews no better than the gentiles?
Ans: because both are under sin!

Under what?? under the Law?
Ans: No, under sin!

Whom does the law speak to and condemn?
Ans: To those who are under the law; the Jews!..not to everyone!

What is "all the world" guilty of?
Ans: guilty of sin! ...wilful sin.
All the world cannot be guilty of breaking the law, since only the Jews were under the jurisdiction of the law.

Who gains knowledge of sin due to the law?
Ans: The Jews; those who have the law, and are under the law, and the law tells teaches them what sin is...

Do gentiles have the law?
Ans: No, they don't!
Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law,..[Romans 2:14]

How then do gentiles know what sin is?
Ans: by the law God has written on their hearts, their consciences [Romans 2:15]

Both Jew and Gentile stand guilty of sin under law. To remain under law means death.

[/QUOTE] Both Jew and Gentile stand guilty of sin. Period. (Let us not add anything to it..)
The wages of sin is death.[Romans 6:23]

 

[TMS]

Do we than make void the law? God doesn't judge one person by one law and another person by another law that is unjust. The same law is condemns us all. Jesus fulfilled the law perfectly so we can be freed from it on judgement day. Which law did Jesus fulfil perfectly? I obey the law not to be saved, because Jesus has already done that, i keep the law because my conscience tells me i should, and Jesus said If you love Me keep my commandments. John 14:15, John 15:10, 1 John 5:2,3

 

[onlinebuddy]

If there isn't a law standing, we are not accountable to it

What law are you and I accountable to? Where is it written?

 

[Roberth]

Both Jew and Gentile stand guilty of sin. Period. (Let us not add anything to it..) The wages of sin is death.[Romans 6:23]

Rom 3:19 "Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God." [NKJV]

"All the world" includes Gentiles. Sin is what? The transgression of the law. See 1 John 3:4

How then do gentiles know what sin is? Ans: by the law God has written on their hearts, their consciences [Romans 2:15]

And what does the rest of it say?

All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. [Rom 2:12]

So if a Gentiles do not know the law, God has revealed it to them through their conscience.

Keep in mind Paul is dealing with Gentiles who didn't know the written law about 2000 years ago. That is not true today. Bibles are everywhere. Practically everyone knows of the Ten Commandments by radio or TV. Practically no one is ignorant today.

 

[onlinebuddy]

Do we than make void the law? God doesn't judge one person by one law and another person by another law that is unjust. The same law is condemns us all. Jesus fulfilled the law perfectly so we can be freed from it on judgement day. Which law did Jesus fulfil perfectly? I obey the law not to be saved, because Jesus has already done that, i keep the law because my conscience tells me i should, and Jesus said If you love Me keep my commandments. John 14:15, John 15:10, 1 John 5:2,3

You say you obey the law? What law? Where do you find the law in the Bible?

 

[onlinebuddy]

Rom 3:19 "Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God." [NKJV]

What law was Paul talking about in Romans 3:19? The moral law, the ceremonial law....?

 

[onlinebuddy]

So if a Gentiles do not know the law, God has revealed it to them through their conscience.

Agree! and that law that was revealed through the conscience corresponds to the moral law of God or the 10 commandments.

 

[james57]

What law was Paul talking about in Romans 3:19? The moral law, the ceremonial law....?

It must be the law no one could keep. Would that be the moral law or ceremonial law?

 

[onlinebuddy]

Keep in mind Paul is dealing with Gentiles who didn't know the written law about 2000 years ago.

What tells you that Paul is dealing with gentiles in Romans 2 and 3(The chapters we are examining)?

 

[GandalfTheWhite]

for the very reason the law was given.

Moses made it clear.

Deuteronomy 27:26
‘Cursed is the one who does not confirm all the words of this law by observing them.’ “And all the people shall say, ‘Amen!’

God was not stupid. He knew when he gave it, the only one who would ever live up to its standard (perfection) was his future son. Yet he still gave it.

Men agreed with the standard, and agreed that they should be cursed if they do not confirm and obey every word written. In which agrees with romans 1, I might add, which says men know the sin they commit is worthy of condemnation, but love doing it) So in order for mankind to be redeemed. the CURSE of the law must be removed.

So he came to remove the curse. because we all are cursed by the law. Period.

"Curse - Arar - meaning to execrate, to bring great harm or trouble upon someone.

Broken down to its Latin root, the word execrate means the opposite of being sacred or devoted to. When you execrate something you, are cursing it instead of making it holy. The word is not used all that often. If you say to someone, "I execrate you!" they might think you're casting an evil spell on them. Which in a way, by cursing them, you are." - (from dictionaries)



So if we don't keep the law we are not the sacred people anymore

God is not a god sitting with a little wand saying "curse, curse, curse" LOL what a ridiculous argument

 

[onlinebuddy]

It must be the law no one could keep. Would that be the moral law or ceremonial law?

Can you please tell me what you undestand?

 

[james57]

Can you please tell me what you undestand?

The ceremonial law could faultlessly be kept(phil3:6) so Paul could not have been referring to that particular aspect of the law in rom3:19 What law did Paul give as an example of why hs had to die to a law of righteousness? Rom7:8
Which law therefore I being spoken of in rom ch7? The law that pertains to the inner man predominantly

The Pharisees believed kept the law, because they kept it on the outside. They would not have had affairs, nor got drunk or used foul language etc it was on the inside however they could not keep the moral law, ad Paul admitted he could not as a Pharisee.

If you do not have affairs, get drunk, steal, murder,bear false witness Thi does not mean you have completely kept the moral law. If you break the moral law on the inside, in ways only you and God need know if you break it, you have failed to keep the moral law.
I think that is what Paul is chiefly referring to in rom3:19. No one on the inside can perfectly keep the moral law. Therefore the whole world is guilty before God according to the standard the law sets.

 

[james57]

Can you please tell me what you undestand?

If I may explain a bit further.
I responded to an altar call at the age of ten. In accordance with the terms of the new covenant I then became conscious of my sin in my heart and mind(whatever sin a ten year old may have) When I reached puberty I was acutely aware I was not keeping the moral law on the inside(thou shalt not covet) I was not sleeping with girls, getting drunk, using foul language, stealing, or bearing false witness that i much recall, yet on the inside I felt huge guilt by not obeying the moral law. The following perfectly describes my predicament:

I know that the law is spiritual, but I am unspiritual, sold as a slave to sin. I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it I sin living I me.
I know that nothing good lives in me that I in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do, no the evil I do not want to do, this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it I sin living in me that does it
So I find this law at work. When i want to do good evil is right there with me.
For in my inner being I delight in Gods law, but I see another law at work in the members of my body waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members.
What a wretched man I am rom 7:14-24

 

[PeterJens]

Images - The Lord likes images because they must work

We are far from God, but we do not know it or understand it. We need a map. We need a way of seeing what the problem is, how we can achieve the goal, and where to start.

The law is the definition of the problem. The puzzle that cannot be solved. So first you need to see the problem, know the failure, understand personally where we stand, not the person next to us but ourselves.

What is the answer? A sacrifice for sin or failure. The shedding of blood, a life for a life. So substitutional atonement.

But the key problem is why? Who is God, what is His heart and nature? Why do all this if it is just to get eternal life? Eternal life might be eternal boredom. Is God some picky bureaucrat who enjoys putting people down?

For the story to be really complete God had to become our friend, face to face, so we could learn, He is worthy, "Holy Holy Holy is the Lord God of hosts to receiver honour and glory and power."

The law is cold, hard, unyielding, a set of rules with no apparent purpose but to be a good school behaviour enforcer.
Jesus gave the insight, the law is for our guidance and protection, a warning of harm, a giver of boundaries.
We are empowered to overcome because love is worth it, Jesus is the best, the ideal, the friend I could never dream of having. And the cross is His crowning glory, the statement of complete humbleness and sacrifice, the pain and cost beyond our understanding or power, to give us life. By this very act, seeing who Jesus is we are both healed and transformed, loved and protected.

So Jesus takes us from being under the law like being under a task master, to being free in the Spirit, an overcomer.
The law does not have regard because our hearts desire to follow its precepts and boundaries. So we expand the ways to bring glory to the Lord, to use what we have to bring praise to Him and His message. Amen.

 

[posthuman]

Romans 8:
1 Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, 2 because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit who gives life has set you free from the law of sin and death. 3 For what the law was powerless to do because it was weakened by the flesh, God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh to be a sin offering. And so he condemned sin in the flesh, 4 in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fully met in us, who do not live according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
5 Those who live according to the flesh have their minds set on what the flesh desires; but those who live in accordance with the Spirit have their minds set on what the Spirit desires. 6 The mind governed by the flesh is death, but the mind governed by the Spirit is life and peace. 7 The mind governed by the flesh is hostile to God; it does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so. 8 Those who are in the realm of the flesh cannot please God.

the law cannot save. (verse 3) the law is powerless to overcome the desire of the flesh - it condemns that desire and establishes our unrighteousness, but does not change us.
to meet the righteous requirement of the law, our minds must be set on what the Spirit desires - not the flesh. the law cannot change our desire.
you might say - but if i desire to obey the law, and do the things it requires, then isn't my desire what the Spirit desires?


Romans 9:
30 What then shall we say? That the Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have obtained it, a righteousness that is by faith; 31 but the people of Israel, who pursued the law as the way of righteousness, have not attained their goal. 32 Why not? Because they pursued it not by faith but as if it were by works. They stumbled over the stumbling stone.

no. pursuing righteousness as though it is by works - as though it is by obedience to the law - does not make one righteous. it does not change the inner man; it covers up the inner man like whitewashing a tomb. the righteousness of God is revealed in Christ and it is not by obedience in the flesh but by conforming of the spirit - which produces obedience, but not as though the obedience is the thing that perfects.
the righteousness of God is attained from the inside out, not from the outside in. the spirit is changed and renewed, that the flesh can be brought into subjection to the spirit. if we try to be righteous by obedience, we are trying to renew the flesh as though the spirit could be brought into subjection to it.

it is like putting lipstick on a pig and passing it off for a woman. this doesn't change the fact that it's a pig, and no amount of prettying up a pig can change it into a woman - even if you go to such lengths that the pig develops a psychosis and believes it is a woman, and even if others are fooled -- it is still a pig; a pig with a psychosis and strong delusions.
the only way is to swap out the pig for an actual woman. and that is not something that man can do - only the Lord can change us; only the One who Created you can recreate you and conform your spirit to righteousness.
that is why Christ had to deliver us - so that we can be changed. because the old saying is a lie - the clothes do not make the man. in fact, a righteous man is righteous no matter what clothes he wears.