Cobus, I am not attempting to refute your view nor anyone else's here. I am just here to try to better understand everyone's differing opinions, as I am still a fairly new to all of this. But, if what you say is true what about what Paul says here in Romans 7:18-25?
18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
From what I'm getting out of it, Paul is pretty much saying "I am intending to serve the Lord my God with all my heart, but because I am human, I keep messing up and sinning, even though I despise sin."
Who is Paul speaking to in Romans 7?
Rom 7:1 Know ye not, brethren, (for
I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
What is the context of Romans 7?
Rom 7:4 Wherefore, my brethren,
ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.
Rom 7:6 But now
we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.
So when Paul gives the illustration of the wretch in verses 14-28 what is he speaking about?
Firstly he is speaking about a man who is...
Rom 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am
carnal, sold under sin.
Has this man been set free from sin? Is being "carnal and sold under sin" freedom?
Is this wretch captive to sin?
Rom 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for
to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
Rom 7:19 For the good that I would I do not: but
the evil which I would not, that I do.
Rom 7:20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:21
I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
Rom 7:23 But
I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
This wretched man who is carnal and sold under sin, who is in captivity to the law of sin in his members cries out for something...
Rom 7:24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
He is crying out for deliverance from the body of death. This captive man assents to the law of God that it is good in his mind but he cannot keep it. Remember Paul is speaking to those who "know the law."
Is it possible that Paul is attempting to make a case to those who "know the law" why they need to be raised up to newness of life via the Spirit of God? Is it possible that Paul is attempting to point out that "the law" cannot save?
So this wretched man serves the law of sin with his flesh but with his mind he serves the law of God.
Rom 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
So after writing all this Paul says this...
THEREFORE
Therefore means "because of this" or "due to this." In other words Paul is setting forth his CONCLUSION in Romans 8.
What is his conclusion?
Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Here it is taught that being IN Christ Jesus is associated with a WALK. What does "walk" mean? Isn't it what you do? How you live? Your actions?
So there is no condemnation to them which are IN Christ Jesus who WALK in a particular way.
Let's see what Paul writes next...
Rom 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
The law of the Spirit of life IN Christ Jesus has made the wretch free from what? The law of sin and death. Was the wretch free? Not according to Rom 7:23-24 where it says that he was "captive to the law of sin." In fact the wretch was "carnal and sold under sin" (Rom 7:14).
Paul doesn't stop with Romans 8:2, he continues on...
Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
So the law could not do something. What could it not do? I'll tell you. It could not set the wretch free, the wretch had the law but he could not find the means of "how to perform" (Rom 7:18) that which he desired to do.
Why is the law weak through the flesh? The law is weak through the flesh because the law cannot renew the heart of a man and it is from the heart that the walk of an individual is brought forth. Paul teaches in Rom 7:5-11 that the law brings death, not life.
Paul calls the law the "ministration of death" in 2Cor 3:7. This is because sin is empowered by the commandment (Rom 7:8) whereby that which is ordained to life (the law - which was given to direct the steps of men) was found to bring death (Rom 7:10). This is due to the lusts of the flesh (Jam 1:14-15) tempting an individual (1Cor 10:13) to disobey God (Gen 3:6) and the wages if sin is death (Rom 6:23, Gen 2:17).
This is why Paul writes in Rom 8:3 that "the law is weak through the flesh" and thus could not bring a man to life. So what did God do?
God sent Jesus Christ in the flesh who was tempted in all points as we are (Heb 4:15) but overcame sin in the flesh and thus condemned sin. How did Jesus overcome sin in the flesh? The answer is that Jesus WALKED IN THE SPIRIT. Thus by the Spirit Jesus put to death the deeds of the flesh (Rom 8:13) and lived a pure life of victory over sin.
Why did God send Jesus to do that? Paul tells us in Rom 8:4...
Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Was the righteousness of the law being fulfilled in the wretch of Romans 7? Was the wretch of Romans 7 walking after the Spirit? No he wasn't, he was carnal and sold under sin (Rom 7:14) whereby he was held captive to the law of sin (Rom 7:23).
Paul went on to write this...
Rom 8:5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
Rom 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
Rom 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Was the Romans wretch carnally minded or spiritually minded? He had his mind "set on the law" but NOT on the Spirit. You see the carnal mind is not subject to the law of God and neither can it be. This is why the Romans wretch was in captivity to sin, he could not find the means to perform that which is good due to being carnally minded.
Those who are "in the flesh cannot please God." Are Christian's in the flesh? Well we are in physical flesh bodies but is that what Paul is talking about?
Paul wrote this...
Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
What does that mean? Had the Romans wretch crucified his flesh with the affections and lusts?
Right before the Romans 7 passage Paul wrote Romans 6 and in that chapter we find this...
Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that
our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Rom 6:7 For
he that is dead is freed from sin.
Did the Romans wretch "serve sin"? Indeed he did for he was held captive to the law of sin in his members (Rom 7:23).
Paul taught that the "body of sin" is DESTROYED due to the old man being crucified with Christ. This destruction or death brings with it FREEDOM FROM SIN.
Paul then wrote this...
Rom 6:8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
Rom 6:9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
Rom 6:10 For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
Rom 6:11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Rom 6:12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
Rom 6:13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
Rom 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
So we are to reckon ourselves dead indeed to sin and alive to God THROUGH Jesus Christ and due to this we are not to let sin reign. The Romans wretch had sin reigning didn't he? He was held captive to sin. He was sins slave.
Paul writes in Rom 6:14 that sin shall not have dominion over us for we are not under the law but under grace. Was the Romans wretch under law or grace? The wretch ONLY speaks of the law and that passage was addressed to those who "know the law" (Rom 7:1). Again Paul was making a case for grace and the Spirit of God that is associated with grace.
You see under grace sin does not have dominion over us. Why is that?
Paul writes...
Eph 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath
quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved
We are "quickened together with Christ" and Paul calls this "salvation by grace." We see similar language in Colossians...
Col 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
Col 2:10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:
Col 2:11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
Col 2:12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also
ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
Col 2:13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh,
hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
Col 2:15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
Operation literally means ENERGY or POWER. Quickened literally means to be MADE ALIVE. Thus compare the above to this...
Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
Now bear in mind the parallel between Col 2:15 and Rom 8:3. Jesus overcame sin in the flesh by the Spirit and He did this in order that the righteousness of the law be fulfilled IN US who walk after the Spirit just like Jesus.
This is why the Bible says this...
Joh 1:12 But
as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
Joh 1:13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
Joh 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
Joh 1:15 John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me.
Joh 1:16
And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.
Joh 1:17 For
the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.
A clear parallel to Paul asserting this...
Rom 8:11 But
if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
Rom 8:12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.
Rom 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
Rom 8:14 For
as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
I hope what I have written gives you something to chew on. Let the God be true and every man a liar.
Opinions are worthless if they are not in harmony with Scripture thus we all must be diligent in seeking the truth. Remember the Bible warns about MASSIVE DECEPTION in the latter times therefore be like a Berean and dig deep to see if these things be true.
God bless.
