Revolution, not terror, not Jihad, the motive for Boston Marathon bombing?

[Markum1972]

So the Muslims who fought for America against Iraq were also doing it to kill the infidels who happened to be fellow non-infidels?

What I asserted in this thread is way outside of the normal paradigm.

Some folks are bound and determined to view things inside a given paradigm.

*shrugs*

They are not supposed to kill ALL infidels until the appearance of the 12th Imam. Until that time, they are instructed to breed and convert to breed out and convert as many infidel as possible. I don't know why this is so difficult to understand.

LOOK

Revelations 17
[SUP]14 [/SUP]These (10 kings that have no kingdom) shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

Daniel 7
[SUP]25 [/SUP]And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

Revelations 6
[SUP]7 [/SUP]And when he had opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth beast say, Come and see.
[SUP]8 [/SUP]And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.
[SUP]9 [/SUP]And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
[SUP]10 [/SUP]And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
[SUP]11 [/SUP]And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

2 Thessalonians 2
[SUP]3 [/SUP]Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

 

[1still_waters]

They are not supposed to kill ALL infidels until the appearance of the 12th Imam. Until that time, they are instructed to breed and convert to breed out and convert as many infidel as possible. I don't know why this is so difficult to understand.

LOOK

Revelations 17
[SUP]14 [/SUP]These (10 kings that have no kingdom) shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

Daniel 7
[SUP]25 [/SUP]And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

Revelations 6
[SUP]7 [/SUP]And when he had opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth beast say, Come and see.
[SUP]8 [/SUP]And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.
[SUP]9 [/SUP]And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
[SUP]10 [/SUP]And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
[SUP]11 [/SUP]And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

2 Thessalonians 2
[SUP]3 [/SUP]Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

Lol folks used to say those were about the Roman Catholic Church or revived Roman Empire. Ie. the EU.

Newspaper exegesis is yummy.

 

[Powemm]

1 John 2:18
[ Warnings Against Denying the Son ] Dear children, this is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour.
1 John 2:22
Who is the liar? It is whoever denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a person is the antichrist—denying the Father and the Son.
1 John 4:3
but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world.
2 John 1:7
I say this because many deceivers, who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh, have gone out into the world. Any such person is the deceiver and the antichrist.

 

[Markum1972]

Lol folks used to say those were about the Roman Catholic Church or revived Roman Empire. Ie. the EU.

Newspaper exegesis is yummy.

I have never heard the 10 horns (kings without kingdoms) interpreted as the Roman Catholic church.

I HAVE heard the woman that rides upon the beast (kings and kingdoms of the earth) described as the remnant of the churches of the Babylonian empire though.

After all, the Roman Catholic church is the only remaining remnant of Rome and has taken on both the traditions of Babylon and Rome. They changed the sabbath to Sunday to appease the Pagans; the day of sun worship which was introduced by Babylonian belief that Nimrod's spirit went and dwelt in the sun. They also adopted the worship of the mother and child which was also introduced by Babylon churches as well. It was quite a crafty adoption by making it Mary and Jesus to appease both Christians and Pagans. Yet nonetheless, the fornication through idol worship is clearly there and it is written that Babylon is the mother of all harlots and abominations. So there is no argument that ANY idol worship or abomination is the product of its mother, Babylon.

How many people that have been martyred by the Roman Catholic church were later declared to be saints by them? Quite interesting when you consider...

Revelations 17
[SUP]6 [/SUP]And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.

It also says that she (Babylon) is a great city that sits on seven mountains. Another interesting detail since Vatican City, is in Rome which is known as the city on seven hills.

So I really have no issue with this interpretation at all since it all seems to measure up and does appear that the Babylonian empire has ridden upon the many kingdoms of the earth throughout the ages and remains to this day in its most magnificent form as the Roman Catholic church.

 

[Powemm]

John 11:48
If we let him go on like this, everyone will believe in him, and then the Romans will come and take away both our temple and our nation.”

 

[Powemm]

Acts 28:17
[ Paul Preaches at Rome Under Guard ] Three days later he called together the local Jewish leaders. When they had assembled, Paul said to them: “My brothers, although I have done nothing against our people or against the customs of our ancestors, I was arrested in Jerusalem and handed over to the Romans.


There are old roots never dealt with in Rome .,

 

[Markum1972]

I have never heard the 10 horns (kings without kingdoms) interpreted as the Roman Catholic church.

I HAVE heard the woman that rides upon the beast (kings and kingdoms of the earth) described as the remnant of the churches of the Babylonian empire though.

After all, the Roman Catholic church is the only remaining remnant of Rome and has taken on both the traditions of Babylon and Rome. They changed the sabbath to Sunday to appease the Pagans; the day of sun worship which was introduced by Babylonian belief that Nimrod's spirit went and dwelt in the sun. They also adopted the worship of the mother and child which was also introduced by Babylon churches as well. It was quite a crafty adoption by making it Mary and Jesus to appease both Christians and Pagans. Yet nonetheless, the fornication through idol worship is clearly there and it is written that Babylon is the mother of all harlots and abominations. So there is no argument that ANY idol worship or abomination is the product of its mother, Babylon.

How many people that have been martyred by the Roman Catholic church were later declared to be saints by them? Quite interesting when you consider...

Revelations 17
[SUP]6 [/SUP]And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.

It also says that she (Babylon) is a great city that sits on seven mountains. Another interesting detail since Vatican City, is in Rome which is known as the city on seven hills.

So I really have no issue with this interpretation at all since it all seems to measure up and does appear that the Babylonian empire has ridden upon the many kingdoms of the earth throughout the ages and remains to this day in its most magnificent form as the Roman Catholic church.

CORRECTION: "the Roman Catholic church is the only remaining remnant of Rome"
TO: "the Roman Catholic church is a remaining remnant of Rome"

For example, the United States could be seen as such also.

Albany, New York is one of the oldest surviving settlements from the original thirteen colonies, and the longest continuously chartered city in the United States. Also sits upon seven hills in a nation that has given itself over to idolatry. A nation that has even been referred to as "New Rome".
A nation that did similar as the Babylonians having created high towers (showing the greatness of man and the love of money/Mammon) that were also destroyed by fire.
You can see that she has spread her fornication with all other nations of the world; being a leader in gay marriage, idol worship (even things as subtle as "American Idol"), and every other thing that exalts itself against God. Through things such as Hollywood movies and media, she has desensitized the people to those things that are an abomination to God.

So, I can see the remains of Babylon manifested as a church and as a nation in the two aforementioned instances.

 

[Powemm]

Trojan on board ... With a priestly disguise ..

 

[Markum1972]

Trojan on board ... With a priestly disguise ..

Wow! That really sums it up! That is a great description of Babylon, the mother of all harlots. Disguising itself as holy and magnified despite the sin that is found within her. Thank you for sharing that.

 

[Powemm]

Welcome

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

i doubt 'revolution' or chechnyan separatism was a motivation for the marathon bombings...it just doesn't make sense... for chechnyan nationalists their problem is with russia...not the united states...if anything we might even be called somewhat sympathetic... chechnyan nationalists would have no motivation to attack us...

i can't rule out jihad as the motivation yet...though usually when jihadist organizations do a terrorist attack they immediately brag about it...and so far no jihadist group has taken credit for the attack...

another possibility is that the two suspects were just lashing out without any real understanding of what they were doing... we know that they were upset by the civil war in syria...which they saw as a conflict between muslims and secular forces...and they sympathized with the rebel or 'muslim' side against assad... maybe they were 'low information' people and didn't realize that it was russia and not the united states that was propping up assad...so they just lashed out at the nearest 'unbelievers'... however according to some reports the bombs and their placement at the scene were possibly too advanced simply to be the work of two young people and google...

one fact that has recently come to light is that the older suspect was a close acquaintance of one of the three jews who were found with their throats slashed in their apartment two years ago...the murders took place on the tenth anniversary of the 9/11 attacks... if this is at all related then the jihad possibility or the confused lashing out possibility become more likely...

there is one more scenario that i consider plausible...and that is that iran was responsible for the marathon bombings... we know that iran has supplied weapons to chechnyan rebels before...and also the bombing in many ways resembled a hezbollah operation... hezbollah is the lebanese militant organization sponsored by iran...and they are also one of the few terrorist organizations that -don't- take credit for their attacks... maybe iran recruited from the chechnyan separatist movement with the intent of creating a small hezbollah like terrorist cell...training them in the same methods they taught to hezbollah...

i heard that the surviving suspect was shot in the throat and may never be able to speak again...i wonder if we will ever know for sure what happened...

 

[PeteWaldo]

i can't rule out jihad as the motivation yet...though usually when jihadist organizations do a terrorist attack they immediately brag about it...and so far no jihadist group has taken credit for the attack...

another possibility is that the two suspects were just lashing out without any real understanding of what they were doing... we know that they were upset by the civil war in syria...which they saw as a conflict between muslims and secular forces...

Which describes 1400 years of Islamic history. A conflict between Muslims and all non-Muslims, through Muhammad's commands.

Surah 9.29 Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued. 30 The Jews call 'Uzair a son of Allah, and the Christians call Christ the son of Allah. That is a saying from their mouth; (in this) they but imitate what the unbelievers of old used to say. Allah's curse be on them: how they are deluded away from the Truth!

This article gives us an idea as to just how twisted so much of the world has become.

Tsarnaev’s condition improves; brothers reportedly motivated by U.S. wars

"Boston Marathon bombing suspect Dzhokhar Tsarnaev informed investigators that he and his brother were not directed by a foreign terrorist organization. Instead, they were “self-radicalized” and motivated to kill, in part, by U.S. wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, the Washington Post reported."

Which is of course, the same couple decade old excuse - along with Zionism - that Satan inspires Islamic Jihadists to fool ignorant westerners into believing, to mask imperialistic Islamic conquest and Islam's 1400 year goal, which is terrorizing the world toward the eventual global conquest and subjugation of all non-Muslims to Islam. The dar al-Salaam VS the dar al-Harb. If you are a Muslim you are in the dar al-Salaam or "house of peace". But if you are a non-Muslim you are in the dar al-Harb or "house of war", and while you may not be at war against Islam, Islam has been at war against you for 1400 years.
JIHAD

"A Change.org petition to "guarantee Dzhokhar Tsarnaev the right to a fair trial," addressed to President Barack Obama, has more than 6,000 supporters."

"We believe that within the chaos caused by the Boston Marathon explosion, two young men were wrongfully accused of something they did not do, and one of them has lost his life before even getting the opportunity of a proper trial," Anita Temisheva, the user who launched the petition, wrote. "We do not wish to see blood of yet another innocent victim, someone who, by U.S. law, is innocent until proven guilty. It is vital to end this persecution, as all the conflicting information shown by the media, and footage from the incident, seen by people from all corners of the world, doesn't manifest itself as enough evidence to condemn Dzhokhar Tsarnaev of this heinous crime."

So young men who are "wrongfully accused of something they did not do" tried to remedy the situation by engaging in a shootout with police, and throwing bombs that they just happened to have on hand, that were the very same style bombs that were used at the Marathon bombings (that they apparently didn't get an opportunity to use on yet more innocent civilians). Let alone that the surviving "innocent" terrorist hid in a boat, and then engaged in yet another shootout from there, but is characterized as "yet another innocent victim".

 

[1still_waters]

Wow! That really sums it up! That is a great description of Babylon, the mother of all harlots. Disguising itself as holy and magnified despite the sin that is found within her. Thank you for sharing that.

How about we define Babylon.

The Great City = Jerusalem

Jerusalem = Babylon

Follow along...

Rev 11:8
8 And their dead bodies will lie in the street of the great city which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our[a] Lord was crucified.

Rev 18
9 “The kings of the earth who committed fornication and lived luxuriously with her will weep and lament for her, when they see the smoke of her burning, 10 standing at a distance for fear of her torment, saying, ‘Alas, alas, that great city Babylon, that mighty city! For in one hour your judgment has come.’


21 Then a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone and threw it into the sea, saying, “Thus with violence the great city Babylon shall be thrown down, and shall not be found anymore.

 

[doulos]

How about we define Babylon.

The Great City = Jerusalem

Jerusalem = Babylon

Follow along...

Rev 11:8
8 And their dead bodies will lie in the street of the great city which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our[a] Lord was crucified.

Rev 18
9 “The kings of the earth who committed fornication and lived luxuriously with her will weep and lament for her, when they see the smoke of her burning, 10 standing at a distance for fear of her torment, saying, ‘Alas, alas, that great city Babylon, that mighty city! For in one hour your judgment has come.’


21 Then a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone and threw it into the sea, saying, “Thus with violence the great city Babylon shall be thrown down, and shall not be found anymore.

Rev 18:24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

For the above verse to be true Babylon can not be constrained by time, or location. For her to contain the blood of all that were slain upon the earth she must contain the blood of all slain from Abel until the llast person to be slain is slain. Jerusalem does not fit.

 

[1still_waters]

Rev 18:24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

For the above verse to be true Babylon can not be constrained by time, or location. For her to contain the blood of all that were slain upon the earth she must contain the blood of all slain from Abel until the llast person to be slain is slain. Jerusalem does not fit.

Matthew 23

[SUP]31 [/SUP]“Therefore you are witnesses against yourselves that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets. [SUP]32 [/SUP]Fill up, then, the measure of your fathers’ guilt. [SUP]33 [/SUP]Serpents, brood of vipers! How can you escape the condemnation of hell? [SUP]34 [/SUP]Therefore, indeed, I send you prophets, wise men, and scribes:some of them you will kill and crucify, and some of them you will scourge in your synagogues and persecute from city to city, [SUP]35 [/SUP]that on you may come all the righteous blood shed on the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah, son of Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. [SUP]36 [/SUP]Assuredly, I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation.

 

[1still_waters]

Greek word for land in these two verses is gē.


That can mean a region of land with fixed borders.

Given what is said in Matth 23
and some of them you will scourge in your synagogues

This indicates a very local interpretation.

 

[Markum1972]

How about we define Babylon.

The Great City = Jerusalem

Jerusalem = Babylon

Follow along...

Rev 11:8
8 And their dead bodies will lie in the street of the great city which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our[a] Lord was crucified.

Rev 18
9 “The kings of the earth who committed fornication and lived luxuriously with her will weep and lament for her, when they see the smoke of her burning, 10 standing at a distance for fear of her torment, saying, ‘Alas, alas, that great city Babylon, that mighty city! For in one hour your judgment has come.’


21 Then a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone and threw it into the sea, saying, “Thus with violence the great city Babylon shall be thrown down, and shall not be found anymore.

Revelations 11 is talking about the great city Sodom and Egypt; not Babylon.

No where is the great city Babylon mentioned in Revelations until chapter 14 and thereafter.

 

[leonardronaldo]

Blaming the terror on Islam is misguided to me.
Are they Muslims?
YES!

But that's not the motive.

They're revolutionaries who happen to be Muslim.

There were Christians who fought in the Iraq war.
But that was done under the American banner.
It had nothing to do with Christianity.
It's kinda the same thing with these Muslims.

have to disagree, admin. Islam does teach and command terror.

 

[leonardronaldo]

Chechen Muslims, like all Muslims believe they are born Muslims, and that's why they are Muslims. Any Chechens non-Muslims that choose Islam are choosing Satan, just as Satan has chosen them. Being compelled to DISbelieve the crucifixion of Christ, DENY the Son of God and REJECT His shed blood, as articles of faith in the false prophet Muhammad alone. The mirror opposite of the Gospel. The only anti-a-specific-religion cult on earth. Commanded to fight and subjugate all non Muslims to Muhammad's followers.

Surah 9.29 Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued. 30 The Jews call 'Uzair a son of Allah, and the Christians call Christ the son of Allah. That is a saying from their mouth; (in this) they but imitate what the unbelievers of old used to say. Allah's curse be on them: how they are deluded away from the Truth!



All Muslims are under obligation to fight, conquer and subjugate non-Muslims to Islam, whether they are Chechen, U.S. or Israeli Muslims. "A promise binding" on them "in the Quran". That some Islamic hypocrites let others do the heavy lifting only makes them less Muslim. I even posted the words of the group, that our U.S. based Islamic terrorist that bombed the Marathon, mentioned in his website. Why do Christians continue to refuse to accept this simple and undeniable truth? It isn't about what Muslims say, but about what the Quran and Hadith commands Muhammad's TRUE followers to do.

JIHAD

Quran Sura 9.111 Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on Him in truth, through the Law, the Gospel, and the Qur'an: and who is more faithful to his covenant than Allah. then rejoice in the bargain which ye have concluded: that is the achievement supreme.

"Summarized Sahih Al-Bukhari" - Maktba Dar-us-Salam's page 580
Chapter 2. The best among the people is that believer who strives his utmost in Allah's Cause with both his life and property.
footnotes:
[1] "Al-Jihad (the holy fighting) in Allah's Cause (with full force of number and weaponry) is given the utmost importance in Islam and is one of its pillars (on which it stands). By Jihad Islam is established, Allah's Word is made superior, [His Word being La ilaha ill-Allah (which means: none has the right to be worshipped by Allah] and His Religion (Islam) is propagated. By abandoning Jihad (may Allah protect us from that) Islam is destroyed and the Muslims fall into an inferior position; there honour is lost, their lands are stolen, their rule and authority vanish. Jihad is an obligatory duty in Islam on every Muslim, and he who tries to escape from this duty, or does not in his innermost heart wish to fulfill this duty, dies with one of the qualities of a hypocrite.
[2] Of course, nobody can offer Salat (prayer) and observe Saum (fast) incessantly, and since the Muslim fighter is rewarded as if he was doing such good impossible deeds, no possible deed equals Jihad in reward.

The young man did not want to die a hypocrite. The reason so many young Muslims are so willing to travel to foreign countries to engage in foreign wars, is because they believe that if they are killed while so doing, they get fast-tracked to the chicken and wine serving bordello of the false prophet Muhammad's overactive imagination:
ISLAM 101

Is there something about all of that which is too difficult to understand? Particularly in light of 1400 years of evidence, and conquest of nearly the whole known world, once already?
The U.S. isn't some sort of a freaky exception. What happened in Boston happens around the rest of the world every day. Please click on these links and review the lists and see if it isn't just more of the same.

TheReligionOfPeace.com

Islamic Terror Attacks for First Part of 2013​

Islamic Terror Attacks for 2012​

Islamic Terror Attacks for 2011​

Islamic Terror Attacks for 2010​

Islamic Terror Attacks for 2009​

Islamic Terror Attacks for 2008
​

Islamic Terror Attacks for 2007​

Islamic Terror Attacks for 2006​

Islamic Terror Attacks for 2005​

Islamic Terror Attacks for 2004​

Islamic Attacks from September 11th, 2001 through 2003​

TRUE Muslims that GET Islam and follow the commands, and the deeds, of one of the most consummate - and conveniently self-admitted terrorists - in world history.

Sura 8:12 I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them



Exactly, the Boston bombers efforts at "freeing" U.S. citizens from the oppression of our representative republic, just as Muslims desire to free Israeli Jews, Christians, non-Muslim Arabs and Muslims, from the freedom, liberty and right to self determination protected by the democracy of the Israeli Jewish State.
And free Nigerians of Christianity as well. With 2 million innocents killed or displaced in the Sudan alone.
nigeriacalabash.com
Then the whole world can be just one big happy Sharia law ruled, multiple wife and concubine beating, little girl circumcising (FGM), little girl doing, slave making and trading, Islamic "apostate" killing, Christian and Jew persecuting and murdering, church and synagogue burning, Islamic slave state.

[video=youtube;6fbXvq_ZIbw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fbXvq_ZIbw[/video]

you might forget to add that sura 9 is the second last chapter revealed to muhammad, so according to nasikh/mansoukh doctrine, sura 9 abrogates any other contradicting verses revealed before.

 

[leonardronaldo]

Let me restate this another way.

There were Muslims who fought for America in the Iraq war.
They weren't fighting for Islam, they were fighting for America.

All Muslims who go to war(In a broad sense.) aren't doing it for Jihad or Islam.

These are Chechens who happen to be Muslims.
But being Muslims doesn't mean it's being done for Islam.
Just like Muslim American troops who fought for the USA in Iraq. For them it wasn't about Islam either.

But according to quran, a muslim can't live under the guardian of the kafir, let alone fighting for America.