What you call the cops on Jesus?

[kayem77]

I would like to think every action a christian does is filtered through biblical principle.

When does help become destructive...as a parent and grandparent I know. As someone who pays bills I know.

Where in the bible does it force others to be charitable? The only example of socialism in the bible was when Joseph prepared for the famine.....but that was led by God for His purpose. I do not see socialism, which hates christianity by the way, being under God's will.

The church in Acts willingly gave to one another, because of severe persecution. Its used by socialists to excuse socialism but it is not socialist at all.

You do know conservatives give 30% more to charity than liberals do?

Stewardship and unlimited charity do not go hand in hand. If unlimited charity existed, and in the past it did, it was called communism, the only thing it would accomplish is poverty on grand scales.

I was not advocating for socialism or communism in my post. As I've said before, I don't support Socialism. My point is that I'm afraid some Christians see an action that appears to be Socialist, and automatically think it's bad. Instead of filtering actions through a biblical lens, they do it through a political lens. It is a sad thing when the gospel gets marred by political interest. We shouldn't be so quick to judge the poor, the homeless, and even the liberals that Christians think is okay to despise. The world will hate Christians, but that doesn't allow us to hate back.

 

[JimJimmers]

I was not advocating for socialism or communism in my post. As I've said before, I don't support Socialism. My point is that I'm afraid some Christians see an action that appears to be Socialist, and automatically think it's bad. Instead of filtering actions through a biblical lens, they do it through a political lens. It is a sad thing when the gospel gets marred by political interest. We shouldn't be so quick to judge the poor, the homeless, and even the liberals that Christians think is okay to despise. The world will hate Christians, but that doesn't allow us to hate back.

I'll just leave this here... "Therefore, whenever we have the opportunity, we should do good to everyone--especially to those in the family of faith."

The only thing is, as pointed out, many homeless people need help beyond being allowed to live in a public restroom.

 

[kayem77]

I'll just leave this here... "Therefore, whenever we have the opportunity, we should do good to everyone--especially to those in the family of faith."

The only thing is, as pointed out, many homeless people need help beyond being allowed to live in a public restroom.

The truth is, I don't know what the solution is. I know giving $5 to a homeless person won't solve their life, but just ignoring them and counting them hopeless will help even less (btw, I'm not saying that's what you're advocating for ). While we find a durable solution, we can show them mercy. While they try to fix their lives, we can ease the pain of their journey to a better life. We can offer them work, counseling, or just a glass of cold water. Maybe a glass of cold water won't fix their lives, but it will get them through the day.

 

[crossnote]

The only thing is, as pointed out, many homeless people need help beyond being allowed to live in a public restroom.

...or a porta potty

Man found dead in Port-A-Potty | PIX 11

 

[SonInMe]

We are not going to cure homelessness. Some people choose it.

What we can do is help those who do not want to be homeless by giving them a job ( aforementioned other criteria notwithstanding )

The best way to give someone a job is to kick government out and let people make money, and spend it.

I do not see why that is so hard to comprehend

 

[oldernotwiser]

wonderful .... are you hiring? many of the people sleeping under bridges are suffering from a variety of mental health issues. i spent 2 years as a salvation army officer on the bowery in the 70's then another ten years as pastor of northern new england churches. i could take you to places where families live in old camping trailers northern winters. they are there for a variety of problems ranging from developmental disabilities to the sheer hopelessness of generational poverty. "get a job" isn't so simple for a lot of people. are you hiring?

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

Good post. When our economy was properly managed and good paying work plentiful, it was easy to say "get a job." Not so easy anymore.

Today, our economy is mismanaged primarily for a few up top and the number of actual unemployed, underemployed, and underpaid is staggering.

My grandfather graduated from high school and worked for one company in a blue collar role for thirty years retiring with a ridiculously good pension, 100% healthcare for the rest of his life and the life of his spouse, a gold watch, etc... at a nice house he bought and paid off before his retirement on one income as his wife was a homemaker.

Where did that dream go for most Americans?

Gone for most. But how is borrowing another $20 trillion from China going to fix our mismanaged economy (e.g. monopoly capitalism, broken trade paradigm, failing education system, degraded domestic labor market, broken immigration system, elitist political corruption, financial corruption, etc...)?

That just sucks the revenue away from the budget to pay the Chinese interest. Read this:

Interest on debt to nearly quadruple over decade - CBO - Feb. 4, 2014

"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the majority discovers it can vote itself largess out of the public treasury. After that, the majority always votes for the candidate promising the most benefits with the result the democracy collapses because of the loose fiscal policy ensuing." -Elmer T. Peterson

wonderful .... are you hiring? many of the people sleeping under bridges are suffering from a variety of mental health issues. i spent 2 years as a salvation army officer on the bowery in the 70's then another ten years as pastor of northern new england churches. i could take you to places where families live in old camping trailers northern winters. they are there for a variety of problems ranging from developmental disabilities to the sheer hopelessness of generational poverty. "get a job" isn't so simple for a lot of people. are you hiring?

 

[Ecclesiastik]

"If we would just do etc it would fix all our problems!"

People sitting on the sidelines watching the players play sure like to over-simplify things and call everyone idiots who don't do what they think the team should do. Kinda reminds me of backseat driving. I don't reckon anyone here would fare much better if they took the wheel. So how about we admit that things are complex and that we do not fully understand the political/economical machine so we can't really make strong judgement calls?

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

I would agree with you except to do so, in my case would be to lie.

I'm a straight A MBA with a bachelor's of science and a second philosophy/theology master's degree and about twenty technology certifications who has studied political science, economics, finance, technology, etc... etc... etc... for many many years.

I've networked with top level participants and become deeply involved with reputable organizations like Economy In Crisis dedicated to correcting our problems. I understand the "political/economic machine," as you call it, despite its complexity.

I understand the "machine," know what went wrong, why it went wrong, and more importantly what steps need to be taken to fix it. No offence brother but speak for yourself .

"If we would just do etc it would fix all our problems!"

People sitting on the sidelines watching the players play sure like to over-simplify things and call everyone idiots who don't do what they think the team should do. Kinda reminds me of backseat driving. I don't reckon anyone here would fare much better if they took the wheel. So how about we admit that things are complex and that we do not fully understand the political/economical machine so we can't really make strong judgement calls?

 

[Ecclesiastik]

I would agree with you except to do so, in my case would be to lie.

I'm a straight A MBA with a bachelor's of science and a second philosophy/theology master's degree and about twenty technology certifications who has studied political science, economics, finance, technology, etc... etc... etc... for many many years.

I've networked with top level participants and become deeply involved with reputable organizations like Economy In Crisis dedicated to correcting our problems. I understand the "political/economic machine," as you call it, despite its complexity.

I understand the "machine," know what went wrong, why it went wrong, and more importantly what steps need to be taken to fix it. No offence brother but speak for yourself .

Alright, well this is exactly what I was referring to. With your study, you do have a very good knowledge of the machine. However, there are more aspects (that perhaps you know) than those you have named. It seems like everyone thinks the government is running around like a chicken with its head cut off. All I can imagine is that it knows exactly what it is doing but it wouldn't be very smart to share with everyone it's exact strategy.

You have a lot of study. Okay let's compare your study with a one star general commander in the military. This is a person who knows a vast amount about military strategy, politics, and funding (or economics). If he was a good Christian and he was put in charge of the United States, do you think he would fix the economy?

I don't think so. Because there is still a lot that a one star general doesn't know. There's still a lot that a 4 star general doesn't know.

Would you agree? Or do you have some other impressive feats such as Top Secret Security Clearance and foreign ambassador status? I'm not trying to say I'm unimpressed with all your credentials. I'm just saying if there was a quick fix, it would probably have been done by now. This simple truth seems to elude people.

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

If you took a person like myself and made them president, they would be unable to fix our economy for the simple reason that our framework of government is a federal republic with a division of powers and no one person has the authority or power to do it.

In order to fix our economy, a large number of elected representatives possessing the will, the integrity, and the competency to fix it would need to work together and take the correct steps with the blessing of the judiciary.

^ If this is what you are saying: I agree with you.

Furthermore, there are not even remotely enough elected representatives in our government that simultaneously possess all three of those attributes. Lawyers comprise the largest demographic for Congress persons and Senators with bankers and corporate business persons coming in second.

They are busy exploiting their position to increase their personal wealth by abdicating their responsibility to guard the "the people's" vote instead marketing it to the highest bidders to increase the personal wealth of themselves, their friends, their families; and the wealthy elitists, trans-nationals, and foreign interests who pay them to vote the way they want them to.

Where does that leave us? My advice is to buckle up, because it's going to be quite a ride moving forward... lol.

[video=youtube_share;nWu6OThkq14]http://youtu.be/nWu6OThkq14?t=21s[/video]

Alright, well this is exactly what I was referring to. With your study, you do have a very good knowledge of the machine. However, there are more aspects (that perhaps you know) than those you have named. It seems like everyone thinks the government is running around like a chicken with its head cut off. All I can imagine is that it knows exactly what it is doing but it wouldn't be very smart to share with everyone it's exact strategy.

You have a lot of study. Okay let's compare your study with a one star general commander in the military. This is a person who knows a vast amount about military strategy, politics, and funding (or economics). If he was a good Christian and he was put in charge of the United States, do you think he would fix the economy?

I don't think so. Because there is still a lot that a one star general doesn't know. There's still a lot that a 4 star general doesn't know.

Would you agree? Or do you have some other impressive feats such as Top Secret Security Clearance and foreign ambassador status? I'm not trying to say I'm unimpressed with all your credentials. I'm just saying if there was a quick fix, it would probably have been done by now. This simple truth seems to elude people.

 

[JimJimmers]

The truth is, I don't know what the solution is. I know giving $5 to a homeless person won't solve their life, but just ignoring them and counting them hopeless will help even less (btw, I'm not saying that's what you're advocating for ). While we find a durable solution, we can show them mercy. While they try to fix their lives, we can ease the pain of their journey to a better life. We can offer them work, counseling, or just a glass of cold water. Maybe a glass of cold water won't fix their lives, but it will get them through the day.

Oh, the thing about the public restrooms wasn't directed at you, by the way. I was just saying, it's hard to find a balance (for the treatment of mentally ill people) between involuntary commitment and allowing them to live in a park bathroom. It indeed shows mercy to not kick them out of the bathroom, but it still seems like we can do better. Anyway, I was just saying, aside from the fact that is indeed Biblical to do good to everyone, that there are no easy answers on homelessness.

 

[kayem77]

Oh, the thing about the public restrooms wasn't directed at you, by the way. I was just saying, it's hard to find a balance (for the treatment of mentally ill people) between involuntary commitment and allowing them to live in a park bathroom. It indeed shows mercy to not kick them out of the bathroom, but it still seems like we can do better. Anyway, I was just saying, aside from the fact that is indeed Biblical to do good to everyone, that there are no easy answers on homelessness.

I completely agree with this statement!

 

[SonInMe]

Jesus said we would always have the poor amungst us.

He was right. There are no cures for poverty until He comes back.

The best we can do is what is best for people and.....that.....is.......never......a.......handout.

It might be a stop gap, a bandaid but for those who can get out of poverty and who are able a good economy is the best thing. ( Of course Jesus is the best thing but since we are strictly talking about finances here I'll presume this is a given )

This is the bottom line...what is being done today to, supposedly help people is causing the reason why they need help.

That's insane. Are we really talking about helping people, truly helping those who can and want to get out of poverty, or are we just making ourselves feel better by throwing money at people and thinking we are good people?

I am just a man. I believe when there is a problem we try to stop the problem. Solutions. Doing the best we can to help.

I can suggest one thing. If you can create a business, do it. I kinda think many christians, especially today think owning businesses or having economic success is something evil. God certainly can bless someone with financial ability.

Maybe God can even bring forth politicians whoa re more interested in the country than in self. Might be too late, but ya never know.

 

[shrimp]

Jesus said we would always have the poor amungst us.

He was right. There are no cures for poverty until He comes back.

The best we can do is what is best for people and.....that.....is.......never......a.......handout.

It might be a stop gap, a bandaid but for those who can get out of poverty and who are able a good economy is the best thing. ( Of course Jesus is the best thing but since we are strictly talking about finances here I'll presume this is a given )

This is the bottom line...what is being done today to, supposedly help people is causing the reason why they need help.

That's insane. Are we really talking about helping people, truly helping those who can and want to get out of poverty, or are we just making ourselves feel better by throwing money at people and thinking we are good people?

I am just a man. I believe when there is a problem we try to stop the problem. Solutions. Doing the best we can to help.

I can suggest one thing. If you can create a business, do it. I kinda think many christians, especially today think owning businesses or having economic success is something evil. God certainly can bless someone with financial ability.

Maybe God can even bring forth politicians whoa re more interested in the country than in self. Might be too late, but ya never know.

I agree with almost everything. I don't think christians think it's an evil thing to own a business or have economic success. I think that most are afraid to. some don't want government hassles, some are afraid of the trouble the sinful will cause. I know that is what keeps me from opening up shop.

 

[oldernotwiser]

government is not running around like a chicken with it's head cut off. the american government is moving directly towards fascism, an alliance of powerful government and powerful corporate interests and that's how mussolini defined fascism.

 

[MsSpratt]

We are not going to cure homelessness. Some people choose it.

What we can do is help those who do not want to be homeless by giving them a job ( aforementioned other criteria notwithstanding )

The best way to give someone a job is to kick government out and let people make money, and spend it.

I do not see why that is so hard to comprehend

these guys had a job.

The 2013 Point-in-Time (PIT) count revealed that there were approximately 57,849 homeless Veterans on a single night in January 2013 in the United States.

 

[MsSpratt]

that statue of Jesus on the bench made me cry. he was despised, and we esteemed him not.