Can you be a liberal Christian?

Mitspa · Nov 17, 2015

Well love has nothing to do with the points you was making...so you can use the term "love" all you want..but clearly you don't understand what that term means in a real biblical way.

Funny how you made false charges against others as you tried to teach others about your ideas of "love" Not sure folks will listen to that sort of logic?

shlee23 · Nov 17, 2015

Mitspa said:

Pretty sure every point I made was to love people and not hate people.

GodIsSalvation · Nov 17, 2015

You can be a liberal Christian. Keep in mind though what they call liberal and conservative today in America is not so, but is even a parody of both. Personally I was once a staunch conservative until I read the Bible. Now I don't really see the point in being a leftist or a rightist when in America by default they have to recognize us as kings, and kings can play both parties and not be a part of them at the same time. I suppose the monarchist ideology has its own challenges though, like trying to keep the GOP and the Democrats from persecuting each other and taking everyone else down with them.

Interesting portion of the Bible that some so-called conservatives might pause and consider:

Isaiah 32:1-8

1 Behold, a king shall reign in righteousness, and princes shall rule in judgment.
[SUP]2 [/SUP]And a man shall be as an hiding place from the wind, and a covert from the tempest; as rivers of water in a dry place, as the shadow of a great rock in a weary land.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]And the eyes of them that see shall not be dim, and the ears of them that hear shall hearken.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]The heart also of the rash shall understand knowledge, and the tongue of the stammerers shall be ready to speak plainly.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]The vile person shall be no more called liberal, nor the churl said to be bountiful.
[SUP]6 [/SUP]For the vile person will speak villany, and his heart will work iniquity, to practise hypocrisy, and to utter error against the Lord, to make empty the soul of the hungry, and he will cause the drink of the thirsty to fail.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]The instruments also of the churl are evil: he deviseth wicked devices to destroy the poor with lying words, even when the needy speaketh right.
[SUP]8 [/SUP]But the liberal deviseth liberal things; and by liberal things shall he stand.

Mitspa · Nov 17, 2015

shlee23 said:

Good don't hate people ...no one there was ....but many hate a false and evil religion and the evil that comes from that evil religion...that's not hateful...that's love

Did you have to lie to show your love?

James4redemption · Nov 17, 2015

I can't call it....The concept of political parties and my current mind set on the world don't even mix. I mean I'd have to go down every law or aspiring law and attempt to decide according to God's will. Who knows what I may be labeled at the end. This place is a kook-haven though, so I mean I'm not stressin' to be apart of any Political party to begin with. The world is pants on head crazy atm.

Ahwatukee · Nov 17, 2015

shlee23 said:

The following is officially what Liberal Christian theology believes:

1) The Bible is not “God-breathed” and has errors

2) The virgin birth of Christ is a mythological false teaching

3) Jesus did not rise again from the grave in bodily form

4) Jesus was a good moral teacher, but His followers and their followers have taken liberties with the history of His life (there were no “supernatural” miracles),

5) Hell is not real. Man is not lost in sin and is not doomed to some future judgment without a relationship with Christ through faith.

6) Most of the human authors of the Bible are not who they are traditionally believed to be

7) The most important thing for man to do is to “love” his neighbor. What is the loving thing to do in any situation is not what the Bible says is good, but what the liberal theologians decide is good.

Taking the above into consideration, anyone who is in agreement with them is believing in a different Lord and a different gospel.

Shammy · Nov 17, 2015

shlee23 said:

The M.O. of Mitspa and those like him are to attack everyone and does not contribute any meaningful dialogue. Do not try to engage or rationalize with an unreasonable person, you won't make any headway and you'll anger and frustrate yourself.

The answer to your question is God is not a liberal or a conservative, so the distinction is irrelevant. Jesus said that you will know his followers by their actions. Clothing the naked, feeding the hungry and taking care of your neighbors. He also ordered his followers to love their enemies as well, to pray for those who persecute you and not to seek revenge. He said he who lives by the sword shall die by the sword, if someone sues you for your shirt to give him your cloak as well and if they force you to carry their gear one mile then carry it two.

Not exactly "conservative" positions in the way the term is used in modern discourse. Jesus ate with the worst people in society... tax collectors thieves and prostitutes without judging them and being heavy handed.

You are going to find that a lot of people in the U.S. are trying to make "Christian" and "conservative" interchangeable terms. They are doing this because they want to scare you into voting against your own and your neighbors best interests. The same people who want to take away health care from the poor and cripple education. The same people who want to take your money and give it to the wealthy while calling you a "socialist" for protesting.

They do this because they want to make you scared that you are going against God by not doing things their way. Even on this forum you are going to meet some people who will insult you, will snarl and snap and hiss while questioning your faith and character. These people are anti-Christs, workers of inequity who reject what Christ taught while claiming his name to embolden their hateful worldview. All they understand is fear and hate, Jesus said they would not enter Gods kingdom.

Don't worry about towing some party line or offending ideologues because in the end it's all irrelevant. If you follow the teaching of Christ, where ever they lay on the political spectrum you are doing Gods will. Anyone who doesn't like it is saying more about themselves then you.

Mitspa · Nov 17, 2015

Ahwatukee said:

The following is officially what Liberal Christian theology believes:

1) The Bible is not “God-breathed” and has errors

2) The virgin birth of Christ is a mythological false teaching

3) Jesus did not rise again from the grave in bodily form

4) Jesus was a good moral teacher, but His followers and their followers have taken liberties with the history of His life (there were no “supernatural” miracles),

5) Hell is not real. Man is not lost in sin and is not doomed to some future judgment without a relationship with Christ through faith.

6) Most of the human authors of the Bible are not who they are traditionally believed to be

7) The most important thing for man to do is to “love” his neighbor. What is the loving thing to do in any situation is not what the Bible says is good, but what the liberal theologians decide is good.

Taking the above into consideration, anyone who is in agreement with them is believing in a different Lord and a different gospel.

Oh ok this answers some questions I had about the ideas that some seem to have.

Mitspa · Nov 17, 2015

Shammy said:

The M.O. of Mitspa and those like him are to attack everyone and does not contribute any meaningful dialogue. Do not try to engage or rationalize with an unreasonable person, you won't make any headway and you'll anger and frustrate yourself.

The answer to your question is God is not a liberal or a conservative, so the distinction is irrelevant. Jesus said that you will know his followers by their actions. Clothing the naked, feeding the hungry and taking care of your neighbors. He also ordered his followers to love their enemies as well, to pray for those who persecute you and not to seek revenge. He said he who lives by the sword shall die by the sword, if someone sues you for your shirt to give him your cloak as well and if they force you to carry their gear one mile then carry it two.

Not exactly "conservative" positions in the way the term is used in modern discourse. Jesus ate with the worst people in society... tax collectors thieves and prostitutes without judging them and being heavy handed.

You are going to find that a lot of people in the U.S. are trying to make "Christian" and "conservative" interchangeable terms. They are doing this because they want to scare you into voting against your own and your neighbors best interests. The same people who want to take away health care from the poor and cripple education. The same people who want to take your money and give it to the wealthy while calling you a "socialist" for protesting.

They do this because they want to make you scared that you are going against God by not doing things their way. Even on this forum you are going to meet some people who will insult you, will snarl and snap and hiss while questioning your faith and character. These people are anti-Christs, workers of inequity who reject what Christ taught while claiming his name to embolden their hateful worldview. All they understand is fear and hate, Jesus said they would not enter Gods kingdom.

Don't worry about towing some party line or offending ideologues because in the end it's all irrelevant. If you follow the teaching of Christ, where ever they lay on the political spectrum you are doing Gods will. Anyone who doesn't like it is saying more about themselves then you.

Does this mean the bible is not true?

Ahwatukee · Nov 17, 2015

Shammy said:

The M.O. of Mitspa and those like him are to attack everyone and does not contribute any meaningful dialogue. Do not try to engage or rationalize with an unreasonable person, you won't make any headway and you'll anger and frustrate yourself.

The answer to your question is God is not a liberal or a conservative, so the distinction is irrelevant. Jesus said that you will know his followers by their actions. Clothing the naked, feeding the hungry and taking care of your neighbors. He also ordered his followers to love their enemies as well, to pray for those who persecute you and not to seek revenge. He said he who lives by the sword shall die by the sword, if someone sues you for your shirt to give him your cloak as well and if they force you to carry their gear one mile then carry it two.

Not exactly "conservative" positions in the way the term is used in modern discourse. Jesus ate with the worst people in society... tax collectors thieves and prostitutes without judging them and being heavy handed.

You are going to find that a lot of people in the U.S. are trying to make "Christian" and "conservative" interchangeable terms. They are doing this because they want to scare you into voting against your own and your neighbors best interests. The same people who want to take away health care from the poor and cripple education. The same people who want to take your money and give it to the wealthy while calling you a "socialist" for protesting.

They do this because they want to make you scared that you are going against God by not doing things their way. Even on this forum you are going to meet some people who will insult you, will snarl and snap and hiss while questioning your faith and character. These people are anti-Christs, workers of inequity who reject what Christ taught while claiming his name to embolden their hateful worldview. All they understand is fear and hate, Jesus said they would not enter Gods kingdom.

Don't worry about towing some party line or offending ideologues because in the end it's all irrelevant. If you follow the teaching of Christ, where ever they lay on the political spectrum you are doing Gods will. Anyone who doesn't like it is saying more about themselves then you.

Did you read the list there Shammy? It has nothing to do with one's political views, but has everything to do with having the right Lord and the right gospel.

cinder · Nov 17, 2015

Shammy said:

They do what they do because they believe that the individual person is the one who knows what is their own best interests and should be allowed to make those choices, not the government and not a corporation. They object to the government deciding what values should be taught to their children that they want to raise in accordance with their beliefs. And they think their hard work, sacrifice, and good money management should be rewarded by letting them keep the money they have earned. Right now there is a whole lot more of giving government money (most of which comes from the rich) to poor people because they are poor and need it, than there is of trying to take money away from poor people to give it to the rich.

There are problems on both sides; there are those on all sides who want to make you think that God is on their side and to oppose them is to oppose God. But certainly those who follow the God that commands you to love your enemies should speak justly and accurately about those with opposing views, not vilify them with sweeping statements and no facts.

Tintin · Nov 17, 2015

If the Jesus you believe and worship looks like the Jesus of the Bible (all of it), then you're doing it right. I don't know where you lean, but I know Progressive Christianity looks nothing like Christianity (besides the social justice bit). It's a works-based salvation based on an unbiblical Jesus.

Shammy · Nov 17, 2015

Tintin said:

Jesus said faith without works is dead.

PoetMary · Nov 17, 2015

Ahwatukee said:

So here's the problem with this post:

It predisposes that there's some kind of oversite committee that defines what "liberal Christian" means. If you're going to get your LIBERAL CHRISTIAN CARD then you must go to this committee and accede to their stated beliefs.

Of course, that doesn't exist.

For the purposes of Ahwatukee's ideas, it's more accurate to use terms like "orthodox" and "unorthodox."

Most of the Christians that I know that identify as liberal agree with ORTHODOXY, but they simply are more politically liberal.

It's a bit of a mistake to apply political terms to religious philosophy....IMO.

Tintin · Nov 17, 2015

Shammy said:

We are saved by grace through faith alone. Works are our response of obedience to Christ. Can I also add, Progressive Christians seem to have an incredibly disturbing lack of faith in the authority of God's Word and anything associated with God. As such, they seem to be flummoxed by the most orthodox of Christian beliefs.

Yeraza_Bats · Nov 17, 2015

I have wondered this question too : p I dont consider myself a liberal, or anything. I mean I do in some ways, kinda?

I dont agree with some of the social issues they focus on currently. I agree, all people of every race and sex and nationality and all that should have equal rights. But the focus on personal life choices, and throwing that in there, I think its meaningless, and is leading many many young people away from God.

I agree with social programs that aid the poor. And I agree with them known people who do purposely keep their income level low enough to receive it in order to work less. But I also know someone who has worked hard her whole life, has a college degree, worked a full time job, raised four children on her own, and is now hurt and needs assistance in order to live, and cant take care of herself. I agree with rules to help prevent people from misusing the system, but not when it gets in the way of people who do need help.

I think it depends on what you mean by "liberal". I avoid the path of the world. I dont believe that nonstop smiles and never saying anything that people dont wanna hear will bring peace on earth, I think it will actually open the way for evil to take advantage of it. I think it is right to practice self restraint as a society and turn from lewd and evil things. I dont believe that sexual freedom is in /any way/ an important issue that needs to be worked on. I believe in freedom, and equality, and loving everyone. But I also believe 100% that Gods way is the best way. And instead of trying to fit my political beliefs with God, I make God the deciding factor of my political beliefs.

Dunno if that helps you, its just what I have come to at this point : p

Shammy · Nov 17, 2015

Tintin said:

Jesus said faith without works is dead, it has nothing to do with faith. When I last checked he was the author of the Christian faith and therefore the authority I should listen to. Nowhere in the bible does Jesus say faith alone is all that is required and flat out stated the opposite when asked.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke 18:18-30

Utah · Nov 17, 2015

shlee23 said:

Like what? Besides the islamic thing that we'll put to rest.

Utah · Nov 17, 2015

cinder said:

They do what they do because they believe that the individual person is the one who knows what is their own best interests and should be allowed to make those choices, not the government and not a corporation. They object to the government deciding what values should be taught to their children that they want to raise in accordance with their beliefs. And they think their hard work, sacrifice, and good money management should be rewarded by letting them keep the money they have earned. Right now there is a whole lot more of giving government money (most of which comes from the rich) to poor people because they are poor and need it, than there is of trying to take money away from poor people to give it to the rich.

There are problems on both sides; there are those on all sides who want to make you think that God is on their side and to oppose them is to oppose God. But certainly those who follow the God that commands you to love your enemies should speak justly and accurately about those with opposing views, not vilify them with sweeping statements and no facts.

I think I love you!

Donkeyfish07 · Nov 17, 2015

Little tip about how the human brain works. We all absorb beliefs about the world, other people, and political perspectives subconciously without even thinking about them. Things slip through your concious mind and there is no way around it. Marketing techniques and political campaigns are designed to exploit this concept. Sometimes when a belief is challenged that we can't really even define we act emotionally and objectivity goes out the window. Every single one of us has these issues to varying degrees and unless you are 100% in submission to the will of God 24/7 persuing no conversation of interest of your own, you are affected by it. All you can do is lessen the negative effects of it by being extremely vigilant and self aware and examine why you feel a certain way when you feel it and why you think the thoughts you think instead of just cruising around on autopilot.

Autopilot makes you stupid

Can you be a liberal Christian?

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