Nice Guys and Nice Girls Rock!

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ServantStrike

Guest
#21
I'm not sure what the stigma is with nice guys and nice girls, but the thing that I think is important is that you shouldn't make your crush/significant other/spouse the center of your world. I've seen people metaphorically chop off an arm and leg for their crush, while giving no indication that they have a life of their own, only for the other person to take them for granted. Maybe I'm only seeing one side of things...
No you're seeing it clearly.


Nice guy = doormat in many cases. In others nice guy = passive aggressive d-bag. I mean don't get me wrong, I can be passive aggressive too, but in general I'm more active-active and when pushed to far I get into are-we-going-to-have-a-problem-here territory.

The sheer number of threads about this drivel from both genders is mind boggling though. People must like clinging to imagery of people that don't (and cannot) exist healthily.
 

IBDesmond

Senior Member
Jan 25, 2013
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#22
I feel to crack my knuckles, poor myself a brew and get to work on this thread.....

STORY OF MY LIFE!!!! Only now in my 24 years of singleness (sorry to harp on about that...I've mentioned that a few times in other threads) am I understanding this concept.

I agree with what so many of you have said about this word "nice"....it does display some level of inaccuracy but it's still a fitting term (maybe because my thinking has adapted to it).
I found myself being substituted for the "on the fringes of church" "not even in church at all" guys so many times and could never understand it but like a lot of you have said....the problem was that I was too passive. In the back of these girl's minds, they were probably thinking I was a push over, a wimp, a back-seater and....well yeh....just generally passive. I found myself trying to stray so far away from my past that I just became....pretty much all of those things. I became a guy that was so cautious of hurting a girl/woman that I found myself compromising and being too laid back and just being a bit of a melt.

I'm currently in a situation where I like a girl and I did some things that almost jeopardised her attraction to me. This girl is SOOOOOO into...I'm relishing in it so much right now. She appreciate so much about me that I've never really had from a girl whom I mutually was attracted to. But she's so into me right now....why??? Is it because I'm a jerk now? Is it because I'm a bad boy???....JAMAIS!!!!
I'm still very nice and sincere and I make her feel good about herself even in this short space of time that we've been talking (literally I'm talking weeks...I've known this girl weeks!!!). I uplift her and encourage her and speak life into....I'm very much a nice guy. But I nearly messed things up by being TOO nice. TOO nice is by giving up too much too soon. Being TOO honest. Being TOO forward. Getting attached TOO quickly. I realised that I needed to relax a little bit. Let's say that I was to spend the rest of my life with this girl (hypothetically.....I'm not being too NICE now)......I HAVE THE REST OF MY LIFE WITH HER. The rest of my life to confess my insecurities. The rest of my life to progress with her and get to know her and for her to get to know me. I have the rest of my life to compliment her and adorn her and speak life into her. If I get her all I have now....what am I left with later in life? I know that we change daily and grow daily and there are new things to discover about ourselves let alone other people but if we give up too much too soon....a girl can just get bored.

There is nothing wrong with being a nice guy and as long as I play my cards right, I sincerely can't see this girl getting bored of me any time soon.
If you're a nice guy....do you! Be you! Be yourself! But be yourself in dribs and drabs. Leave some stuff blank and fill in those blanks later!


I hope that makes sense and I hope that helped somebody
 

violakat

Senior Member
Apr 23, 2014
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#23
I'm the type that doesn't want a "nice boy". I want to marry a man. Honestly, imo, the so called "nice boys" are really just passive bad boys. They let people walk over them and then whine about it. And quite frequently, they expect favors if they do favors for you. They often try to manipulate women into feeling sorry for themselves because no women "supposedly" wants them.

A real man has a spine and they are kind. They don't expect tit for tat. They just do things, because that's who they are. They don't believe in manipulating, trying to play the suave game, (okay this is mostly the bad boys playing suave), etc. Instead, they are the ones who hold the door open for you when you have ten thousand things in your hand, and are grateful when you hold the door for them, because they are carrying multiple things themselves. They don't come across as having to do every little thing for you, making it seem to come across that you are not able to do the job. Instead, they allow you to do your job, and assist you when you need the help, mainly because they believe in you. They are not knights in shiny armors, because, that have been to battle and have been proven. They are not your so called Disney prince. They are instead men who are men. Real men are kind, not nice.

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Edited:
I would say that many of the same things that hold up for a real man, also holds up for a real women.
 

Chopper

Senior Member
Nov 8, 2014
402
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#24
Nah, that's not me. I'm a nerd and proud to be one. I'm usually in the back making the computer work despite itself.
LOL... that is so much like me too! I know where you're coming from there!
 
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Elijah19

Guest
#25
When I said "nice guy" I didn't mean a wipe. To me, the term "nice guy" never describes a doormat. It means a strong man who chooses not to be an animal and act with courtesy/consideration.

Perhaps I should clarify. When I used the term "nice guy" on here, I am not describing someone who is spineless and lets people walk all over them. I am describing a true gentleman who puts morals before animal desire and higher principles before self. That, to me, is the "real" definition of a nice guy.

Same thing goes for a nice girl. To me the term nice girl means a strong girl who chooses not to become one with the world, but one with Christ.

The definitions of "Nice Guy" and "Nice Girl" I am implying on this thread winnow out the common misconception that "nice guys" or "nice girls" are doormats.

violakat, I can definitely see where you're coming from, though. But my definition of Nice people actually pre-assumes that such people have the necessary strength and edge. The last part of what you said I didn't really get. What do you mean by real men are kind and not nice? The words mean roughly the same thing.
 
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Elijah19

Guest
#26
Also, violakat, the ideal guy you just described in your reply is actually my definition exact of a nice guy. To me, bad boy means criminal.
 

violakat

Senior Member
Apr 23, 2014
1,236
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#27
violakat, I can definitely see where you're coming from, though. But my definition of Nice people actually pre-assumes that such people have the necessary strength and edge. The last part of what you said I didn't really get. What do you mean by real men are kind and not nice? The words mean roughly the same thing.
Actually, they are very different. Kindness comes from the heart. Niceness, doesn't necessarily come from the heart. Sometimes, people are nice, just to well, keep peace. Sometimes they are nice because they have an ulterior motive.

Someone who is kind, though, they aren't doing things to keep peace, or because of an ulterior motive. They do things, because they care.
 
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INTJer

Guest
#28
Our culture favors big boys instead of men.
 

ArtsieSteph

Senior Member
Apr 1, 2014
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#29
Our culture favors big boys instead of men.
I totally agree with you,but that brings another question. What's the real definition of a "man?"

Some think it's a man who drinks, smokes, acts tough, drives a Harley, knows how to survive outdoors, ect. Others think it's someone who takes responsibility, who keeps their household together, but still knows how to have fun a little :D
 
Jun 25, 2010
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#30
Someone once told me that the best way to get woman's attention is to ignore them.lol Sadly I think that worked out well for him. o_O
 
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AgeofKnowledge

Guest
#31
Oh I wouldn't go that far. I know a couple that's been happily married for going on thirty years that began as a poor pastor's daughter and a rich entrepreneur jerk and they've been happy together ;).

I suppose the fact they're both genuine deeply committed Christians is what made the difference. He honed his behavior as time went on. Now he's just a jerk to me but never her... lol.


...and if there is just a hint of a jerk in a man, he is a no go.
 

Desdichado

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2014
8,768
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#32
Oh I wouldn't go that far. I know a couple that's been happily married for going on thirty years that began as a poor pastor's daughter and a rich entrepreneur jerk and they've been happy together ;).

I suppose the fact they're both genuine deeply committed Christians is what made the difference. He honed his behavior as time went on. Now he's just a jerk to me but never her... lol.
This is good to hear the same day your sister compares you to a Parisian.
 

ArtsieSteph

Senior Member
Apr 1, 2014
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#33
Maybe sometimes too some people think that if a guy is "nice" then that means that they're blind to the person's faults. So when that doesn't happen, when the nice person actually comments on the behavior of their significant other, then the girl gets all uppity and doesn't want to go out with a nice guy again.
 
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INTJer

Guest
#34
I totally agree with you,but that brings another question. What's the real definition of a "man?"

Some think it's a man who drinks, smokes, acts tough, drives a Harley, knows how to survive outdoors, ect. Others think it's someone who takes responsibility, who keeps their household together, but still knows how to have fun a little :D
I think a man is first of all an adult. He is comfortable being himself so he doesn't feel compelled to try to pretend to be someone else. He has a core to him. Of course, someone who is busy being an ordinary person doing ordinary things won't look as "exciting" as some guy who is desperately trying to live out some fantasy.
 
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Mar 6, 2014
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#35
Here's my ultimatum people. Listen up: Nice Guys and Nice Girls will not hurt you. They are better for your health. Give them a chance to shine...
No. Just ... No. And here's why: I require niceness from distant relatives and acquaintances with whom I interact at least once a month. I require niceness in addition to several other positive qualities from someone with whom I am going to have a committed romantic relationship. Sure, the guy I'm drooling over might be a bit more snarky or sardonic than the average nice guy, but he's also witty, charming, funny, and ambitious.

David Wong summed up my views on the "nice guy syndrome" much better than I could, so I'm just going to let him take the floor:

#4. What You Produce Does Not Have to Make Money, But It Does Have to Benefit People

Getty

Let's try a non-money example so you don't get hung up on that. The demographic that Cracked writes for is heavy on 20-something males. So on our message boards and in my many inboxes I read several dozen stories a year from miserable, lonely guys who insist that women won't come near them despite the fact that they are just the nicest guys in the world. I can explain what is wrong with this mindset, but it would probably be better if I let Alec Baldwin explain it: [video not included]

In this case, Baldwin is playing the part of the attractive women in your life. They won't put it as bluntly as he does -- society has trained us not to be this honest with people -- but the equation is the same. "Nice guy? Who gives a ****? If you want to work here, close."

So, what do you bring to the table? Because the Zooey Deschanel lookalike in the bookstore that you've been daydreaming about moisturizes her face for an hour every night and feels guilty when she eats anything other than salad for lunch. She's going to be a surgeon in 10 years. What do you do?
Getty

"Well, I'm wicked at capture the flag."
"What, so you're saying that I can't get girls like that unless I have a nice job and make lots of money?"
No, your brain jumps to that conclusion so you have an excuse to write off everyone who rejects you by thinking that they're just being shallow and selfish. I'm asking what do you offer? Are you smart? Funny? Interesting? Talented? Ambitious? Creative? OK, now what do you do to demonstrate those attributes to the world? Don't say that you're a nice guy -- that's the bare minimum. Pretty girls have guys being nice to them 36 times a day. The patient is bleeding in the street. Do you know how to operate or not?
"Well, I'm not sexist or racist or greedy or shallow or abusive! Not like those other jerks!"
I'm sorry, I know that this is hard to hear, but if all you can do is list a bunch of faults you don't have, then back away from the patient. There's a witty, handsome guy with a promising career ready to step in and operate.
Getty

"Wait, I said I wouldn't hit you!"
Does that break your heart? OK, so now what? Are you going to mope about it, or are you going to learn how to do surgery? It's up to you, but don't complain about how girls fall for jerks; they fall for those jerks because those jerks have other things they can offer. "But I'm a great listener!" Are you? Because you're willing to sit quietly in exchange for the chance to be in the proximity of a pretty girl (and spend every second imagining how soft her skin must be)? Well guess what, there's another guy in her life who also knows how to do that, and he can play the guitar. Saying that you're a nice guy is like a restaurant whose only selling point is that the food doesn't make you sick. You're like a new movie whose title is This Movie Is in English, and its tagline is "The actors are clearly visible."
I think this is why you can be a "nice guy" and still feel terrible about yourself.

Read more (disclaimer - full article has a number of profanities which I edited out): 6 Harsh Truths That Will Make You a Better Person (Updated) | Cracked.com
 
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ChandlerFan

Senior Member
Jan 8, 2013
1,148
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#36
^Taking inventory of one's talents and maximizing them in all possible areas of life is good advice, but there are way too many generalizations in that article for it to really be helpful. There are plenty of individuals who are incredibly successful--and single. Plus, anyone who heeded the advice of this article would walk away thinking that if they just utilize their talents more and become successful, they will find a spouse. You can be the most attractive or successful person in the world and still be single. There is a point where any guy has to step up, be a man, and ask the woman out, but there is no silver bullet in life to falling in love.
 
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Mar 6, 2014
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#37
^Taking inventory of one's talents and maximizing them in all possible areas of life is good advice, but there are way too many generalizations in that article for it to really be helpful. There are plenty of individuals who are incredibly successful--and single. Plus, anyone who heeded the advice of this article would walk away thinking that if they just utilize their talents more and become successful, they will find a spouse. You can be the most attractive or successful person in the world and still be single. There is a point where any guy has to step up, be a man, and ask the woman out, but there is no silver bullet in life to falling in love.
Not seeing your point. Wong isn't guaranteeing that you'll find a mate if you learn how to perform surgery or close a deal. And anyone who does guarantee that you will find a mate if you do action x is a dirty liar because there simply are no guarantees. He's merely saying that niceness alone doesn't cut it, and he is not wrong.

I'm also not sure what asking someone out has to do with it. Most of the guys Wong speaks of had asked a woman out at some point, and their advances were rejected. Those men then complained that "girls only like jerks, not nice guys like me." The whole point of Wong's rant was to explain the flaws in that mentality.
 

ChandlerFan

Senior Member
Jan 8, 2013
1,148
102
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#38
Not seeing your point. Wong isn't guaranteeing that you'll find a mate if you learn how to perform surgery or close a deal. And anyone who does guarantee that you will find a mate if you do action x is a dirty liar because there simply are no guarantees. He's merely saying that niceness alone doesn't cut it, and he is not wrong.

I'm also not sure what asking someone out has to do with it. Most of the guys Wong speaks of had asked a woman out at some point, and their advances were rejected. Those men then complained that "girls only like jerks, not nice guys like me." The whole point of Wong's rant was to explain the flaws in that mentality.
I was just saying that it would be very easy to draw other wrong conclusions from that article than the ones the author is actually trying to convey because his points are not communicated well.

And I don't know if you can make a call regarding any romance-related history for the guys Wong talks about because no specific individual stories are told, but the article, or at least that portion of it, is way too generalized, oversimplified, and sarcastic to really be considered good advice. You can't just tell a whole range of people, albeit in a douchebag manner, to quit thinking one way and start thinking another with no additional advice whatsoever and expect it to be helpful. I wonder how many women actually exist in the world who look like Zooey Deschanel, frequent bookstores, moisturize their face for an hour every night, feel guilty about eating anything other than salad, and are aspiring surgeons. Probably very few.

Anyways, I'm not trying to attack you, I just think it would be possible to offer significantly better advice in fewer words. That is my point.
 
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DCrawshawJr

Guest
#39
I wonder how many women actually exist in the world who look like Zooey Deschanel, frequent bookstores, moisturize their face for an hour every night, feel guilty about eating anything other than salad, and are aspiring surgeons. Probably very few.

Did you read the same article I did? (Warning, it's NSFW because of language)
 
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DCrawshawJr

Guest
#40
Oh wait, never mind. I didn't read the last part.