I would like to Dialog with a Seventh-day Adventist

[Jackson123]

Mat_10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

This verse clearly shows that the soul can be destroyed.

1Ti 6:14 That thou keep this commandment without spot, unrebukeable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ:
1Ti 6:15 Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords;
1Ti 6:16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.

only God has immortality and no other.

Eze 18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

souls can die.

Mat 16:25 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it.
Mat 16:26 For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?

Jesus says that the soul can be lost.

Mat_26:38 Then saith he unto them, My soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death: tarry ye here, and watch with me.

Jesus said His soul was headed to death. Luke says that Jesus was sweating blood which is a condition of great stress that can cause death.

The soul can die.

Gen 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

a soul is the combination of dust of the ground and the breath of life. when ones breath leaves he becomes simply dead thus no more soul.

1. God can destroy the soul in hell forever. I don't think God eliminate the soul.


Revelation 20:10And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.


2.Gen 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.


In my interpretation of this verse is:

God make a body use a dust.

The body was dead man, can not move, not growth just a dead like statue.

Then God breath it. the breath become soul.

Than men become living soul.

Mean men become living and have a soul.

That way Jesus said man can not kill the soul. but yes man kill the body.

Body without soul is dead body.

 

[Jackson123]

[h=3]Psalm 103[/h]King James Version (KJV)

103 Bless the Lord, O my soul: and all that is within me, bless his holy name.
2 Bless the Lord, O my soul, and forget not all his benefits:

This verse prove that in me there is my soul.

Mean that soul is part of me.

If body and breath is soul than soul is not part of me

But soul is me.

we have to distinguish between part of me and me.







1 Thessalonians 5:23 - And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and [I pray God] your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.


If soul and body = soul then this verse is confusing Just say soul not soul and body.


James 2:26 - For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.









Matthew 16:26 - For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?


Man lost his soul. mean man have soul.

If man mean soul why man have a soul.




Genesis 35:18 - And it came to pass, as her soul was in departing, (for she died) that she called his name Benoni: but his father called him Benjamin.


Her soul departing, mean going some where, just like dead people, his body there but his soul departing. so body and soul is two different thing.

If body and breath = soul than this verse must be. and her soul die.


And many more verse that give us clue that soul and body is two different thing

Body is not part of soul and soul is not part of the body

 

[TruthFromFrank]

The law of God was there from day one. It was not a law for the Jews as such. It was a law to mankind, to everybody. To obey the law of God shows your love to God and your neighbor. If Jesus could hold the law, so can anybody who really wants to. The person that says it cannot be done needs to try it first because it is obvious that he has not. The law of God can be held because it has been written on the believer's heart and it is not a burden to obey them as the grace of God leads you on the right path and gives you the strength to do it. It becomes such a joy to hold it as you know that you are that one step closer to God than the others who do not even try but always find excuses why they should not hold the law of God. Obviously,the first step to take is to become a child of God. Try it, it works.

 

[gotime]

1. God can destroy the soul in hell forever. I don't think God eliminate the soul.


Revelation 20:10And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.


2.Gen 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.


In my interpretation of this verse is:

God make a body use a dust.

The body was dead man, can not move, not growth just a dead like statue.

Then God breath it. the breath become soul.

Than men become living soul.

Mean men become living and have a soul.

That way Jesus said man can not kill the soul. but yes man kill the body.

Body without soul is dead body.

you said the breath became a soul, Interesting view but none the less it is not supported in scripture. You have to put your own ideas in the verse to come up with that. I prefer to read it as it is. The verse does not convey that Idea at all nor is it hinted at.

as to Revelation,

Rev 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Do you know the range of meanings that the words "for ever and ever" convey?

The word can mean without end which you ascribe to it. but it can also mean until it is finished.

the question is which meaning is meant here?

Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

contextually the bible calls this the "Second death" and again to solidify the argument.

Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

We have already established in past posts what death is according to the bible.

remember what the wages of sin are?

Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

this again matches with revelation's second death. eternal life is only for the saved not the unsaved.

Eze_18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

sinners will die not live for ever in torment. but they will be tormented for a time.

notice scripture supports the latter meaning above. not eternal without end burning but a burning till it is finished and the consequences of death are eternal.

but if that is not enough notice this.

notice what Abraham saw after Sodom was destroyed for its sin.

Gen_19:28 And he looked toward Sodom and Gomorrah, and toward all the land of the plain, and beheld, and, lo, the smoke of the country went up as the smoke of a furnace.

Jud 1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

notice that Sodom is our example and they suffered the vengeance of eternal fire. question is Sodom still burning today?

No it burned till it was destroyed. again the meaning fits the latter option. and again:

2Pe 2:6 And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;

Sodom is our example or one of them and they are dead made to ashes. as JEsus said:

Luk_17:29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.

notice they were destroyed. remember Sodom is likened to the lake of fire.

notice this in Isaiah:

Isa_34:10 It shall not be quenched night nor day; the smoke thereof shall go up for ever: from generation to generation it shall lie waste; none shall pass through it for ever and ever.

notice the smoke go up for ever and ever yet it lies wast. in other words the people and the place is gone destroyed. have you ever asked yourself where the lake of fire in revelation is?

Rev 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

its next to the city do really think God is going to have an eternal hell within ear shot?

notice who is thrown in hell.

Rev 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

notice the devil is also cast in yet the old testament says that the devil will be destroyed.

Eze 28:18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.

Speaking of Satan who was a covering cherub, Fire will devour Him and he will be ashes on the earth. so the fire burns him up.






notice this passage speaking of the day of the lord

Mal 4:1 For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch.
Mal 4:2 But unto you that fear my name shall the Sun of righteousness arise with healing in his wings; and ye shall go forth, and grow up as calves of the stall.
Mal 4:3 And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in the day that I shall do this, saith the LORD of hosts.

notice that they shall be left with no root or branch. If you destroy the root and branch of a tree what do you have?

nothing but a dead and gone tree. but notice also it says that the wicked will be ashes under our feet.

so again the wicked like Satan are destroyed fully and reduced to ashes.

hope this helps.

 

[Larry_Stotle]

I would like to speak to a member of the SDA church who is very well versed in his beliefs.

If you speak to an SDA you will be speaking indirectly to Ellen G. White and I've found in the past it's a waste of time in my opinion. They are right up there with the JW's.

 

[gotime]

If you speak to an SDA you will be speaking indirectly to Ellen G. White and I've found in the past it's a waste of time in my opinion. They are right up there with the JW's.

It is all well and good to say that but where is your proof. Has anyone here used Ellen White to prove a point? If you read the posts there is not a mention of Her until you. but there is plenty of Bible texts used.

Exo 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour.

 

[Jackson123]

you said the breath became a soul, Interesting view but none the less it is not supported in scripture. You have to put your own ideas in the verse to come up with that. I prefer to read it as it is. The verse does not convey that Idea at all nor is it hinted at.

as to Revelation,

Rev 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Do you know the range of meanings that the words "for ever and ever" convey?

The word can mean without end which you ascribe to it. but it can also mean until it is finished.

the question is which meaning is meant here?

Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

contextually the bible calls this the "Second death" and again to solidify the argument.

Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

We have already established in past posts what death is according to the bible.

remember what the wages of sin are?

Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

this again matches with revelation's second death. eternal life is only for the saved not the unsaved.

Eze_18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

sinners will die not live for ever in torment. but they will be tormented for a time.

notice scripture supports the latter meaning above. not eternal without end burning but a burning till it is finished and the consequences of death are eternal.

but if that is not enough notice this.

notice what Abraham saw after Sodom was destroyed for its sin.

Gen_19:28 And he looked toward Sodom and Gomorrah, and toward all the land of the plain, and beheld, and, lo, the smoke of the country went up as the smoke of a furnace.

Jud 1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

notice that Sodom is our example and they suffered the vengeance of eternal fire. question is Sodom still burning today?

No it burned till it was destroyed. again the meaning fits the latter option. and again:

2Pe 2:6 And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;

Sodom is our example or one of them and they are dead made to ashes. as JEsus said:

Luk_17:29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.

notice they were destroyed. remember Sodom is likened to the lake of fire.

notice this in Isaiah:

Isa_34:10 It shall not be quenched night nor day; the smoke thereof shall go up for ever: from generation to generation it shall lie waste; none shall pass through it for ever and ever.

notice the smoke go up for ever and ever yet it lies wast. in other words the people and the place is gone destroyed. have you ever asked yourself where the lake of fire in revelation is?

Rev 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

its next to the city do really think God is going to have an eternal hell within ear shot?

notice who is thrown in hell.

Rev 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

notice the devil is also cast in yet the old testament says that the devil will be destroyed.

Eze 28:18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.

Speaking of Satan who was a covering cherub, Fire will devour Him and he will be ashes on the earth. so the fire burns him up.






notice this passage speaking of the day of the lord

Mal 4:1 For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch.
Mal 4:2 But unto you that fear my name shall the Sun of righteousness arise with healing in his wings; and ye shall go forth, and grow up as calves of the stall.
Mal 4:3 And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in the day that I shall do this, saith the LORD of hosts.

notice that they shall be left with no root or branch. If you destroy the root and branch of a tree what do you have?

nothing but a dead and gone tree. but notice also it says that the wicked will be ashes under our feet.

so again the wicked like Satan are destroyed fully and reduced to ashes.

hope this helps.

Brother Go time,

1. Breath become soul.

I am interpreted Breath become soul base on some verse in the bible that indirectly said so.

Matt 10:28
And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

this verse imply that we as living being have body and soul.

Where the soul come from, or how the Lord make a soul?

Genesis imply the Lord make soul by his breath.


2. Do the Lord have ability to eliminate the soul?

The ability is there but do the Lord will eliminate the soul? I do not see that destroy mean eliminate. The Bible said hell is forever and ever. from what I know, forever and ever mean eternal.

3. You say forever and ever has ending.

Can you provide me with literature that the word forever and ever mean temporary?

 

[Laodicea]

Brother Go time,

1. Breath become soul.

I am interpreted Breath become soul base on some verse in the bible that indirectly said so.

Matt 10:28
And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

this verse imply that we as living being have body and soul.

Where the soul come from, or how the Lord make a soul?

Genesis imply the Lord make soul by his breath.


2. Do the Lord have ability to eliminate the soul?

The ability is there but do the Lord will eliminate the soul? I do not see that destroy mean eliminate. The Bible said hell is forever and ever. from what I know, forever and ever mean eternal.

3. You say forever and ever has ending.

Can you provide me with literature that the word forever and ever mean temporary?

Strongs
G622
ἀπόλλυμι
apollumi
ap-ol'-loo-mee
From G575 and the base of G3639; to destroy fully (reflexively to perish, or lose), literally or figuratively: - destroy, die, lose, mar, perish.

 

[Laodicea]

3. You say forever and ever has ending.

Can you provide me with literature that the word forever and ever mean temporary?

Jonah 2:5-6 KJV
(5) The waters compassed me about, even to the soul: the depth closed me round about, the weeds were wrapped about my head.
(6) I went down to the bottoms of the mountains; the earth with her bars was about me for ever: yet hast thou brought up my life from corruption, O LORD my God.


Jonah was in the belly of the whale 3 days yet he says forever

 

[Jackson123]

Strongs
G622
ἀπόλλυμι
apollumi
ap-ol'-loo-mee
From G575 and the base of G3639; to destroy fully (reflexively to perish, or lose), literally or figuratively: - destroy, die, lose, mar, perish.

I think destroy and to destroy fully is two different thing.

 

[Kerry]

Jonah 2:5-6 KJV
(5) The waters compassed me about, even to the soul: the depth closed me round about, the weeds were wrapped about my head.
(6) I went down to the bottoms of the mountains; the earth with her bars was about me for ever: yet hast thou brought up my life from corruption, O LORD my God.


Jonah was in the belly of the whale 3 days yet he says forever

If you were the belly of a whale for three days wouldn't that seem like eternity for you. I meant 3 hours at the doc's office seems like forever.

 

[Jackson123]

Jonah 2:5-6 KJV
(5) The waters compassed me about, even to the soul: the depth closed me round about, the weeds were wrapped about my head.
(6) I went down to the bottoms of the mountains; the earth with her bars was about me for ever: yet hast thou brought up my life from corruption, O LORD my God.


Jonah was in the belly of the whale 3 days yet he says forever

Revelation 11:15

(Aol.On)





Viewing the King James Version. Click to switch to 1611 King James Version of Revelation 11:15.


And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.



Depend on the context

It not always that way sister. In general forever and ever mean eternal.

 

[Laodicea]

I think destroy and to destroy fully is two different thing.

Even though you may think that but the meaning of the word destroy in Matthew 10:28 is to destroy fully. Understanding the Bible is not putting what we think first.

 

[Laodicea]

If you were the belly of a whale for three days wouldn't that seem like eternity for you. I meant 3 hours at the doc's office seems like forever.

That is true

 

[JesusLives]

Jackson123

Hi - I just wanted to mention a few things for you to consider.

When Satan used the snake to deceive Eve in the tree he told her you will not die it was a lie to Eve. God in the bible has plainly told us that the wages of sin is death. Also God told Adam and Eve if they ate of the tree of knowledge of good and evil that they would die.

So I ask you - who was telling the truth? In popular teachings today when a person dies they go to heaven or they go to hell are they not still alive? I thought only God was immortal with no beginning and no end - Alpha and Omega. So who is the liar? Is it God who said you will surly die? Or is it Satan who said you will not die? My bible tells me that Satan is the Father of lies. So then God must be telling us the truth when He says the wages of sin is death.

Jesus referred to death as a sleep and when you are asleep you are not aware of anything. The living know that they shall die but the dead know not anything. We aren't souls with knowledge floating around waiting for our bodies we are resting in the grave until Jesus comes and raises the righteous from the dead at His second coming.

Fire and brimstone will fall after Jesus third coming and Satan, evil angels and those who did not accept Jesus sacrifice for them will be burned up and once the fuel for the fire is gone the fire will go out. Those who are destroyed by this fire will be extinct and gone forever and ever throughout all eternity.

Malachi 4:3

21st Century King James Version (KJ21)

[SUP]3 [/SUP]And ye shall tread down the wicked, for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in the day that I shall do this,” saith the Lord of hosts.

 

[Jackson123]

Jackson123

Hi - I just wanted to mention a few things for you to consider.

When Satan used the snake to deceive Eve in the tree he told her you will not die it was a lie to Eve. God in the bible has plainly told us that the wages of sin is death. Also God told Adam and Eve if they ate of the tree of knowledge of good and evil that they would die.

So I ask you - who was telling the truth? In popular teachings today when a person dies they go to heaven or they go to hell are they not still alive? I thought only God was immortal with no beginning and no end - Alpha and Omega. So who is the liar? Is it God who said you will surly die? Or is it Satan who said you will not die? My bible tells me that Satan is the Father of lies. So then God must be telling us the truth when He says the wages of sin is death.

Jesus referred to death as a sleep and when you are asleep you are not aware of anything. The living know that they shall die but the dead know not anything. We aren't souls with knowledge floating around waiting for our bodies we are resting in the grave until Jesus comes and raises the righteous from the dead at His second coming.

Fire and brimstone will fall after Jesus third coming and Satan, evil angels and those who did not accept Jesus sacrifice for them will be burned up and once the fuel for the fire is gone the fire will go out. Those who are destroyed by this fire will be extinct and gone forever and ever throughout all eternity.

Malachi 4:3

21st Century King James Version (KJ21)

[SUP]3 [/SUP]And ye shall tread down the wicked, for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in the day that I shall do this,” saith the Lord of hosts.

Brother,

Let the Holy spirit enlighten us.

You said that only Jesus live forever and ever.

Jesus is no beginning and that I agree. No end I am agree too.

But on the no end part I don't think that only God. He who believe in God will go to heaven forever/no ending.

In the same manner he who go to hell will be forever like what is in the bible

Matt 18:8

"And if your hand or your foot causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it from you; it is better for you to enter life crippled or lame, than having two hands or two feet, to be cast into the eternal fire,"

 

[Jackson123]

I Google for the word forever and ever and found:


Is "forever and ever" without end?
The phrase "forever and ever" is used both of describing God's eternal worth and the duration of eternal damnation. The exact same Greek phrase is used in each of the verses in the table below.
[TABLE]
[TR]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD][TABLE="class: carm-table-with-border, width: 146, align: center"]
[TR]
[TD="colspan: 2"]forever and ever

aionas ton aionon
"ages of the ages"[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="width: 50%"]Eternal - without end[/TD]
[TD="width: 50%"]Eternal Damnation[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="width: 50%"]"Now to the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only God, be honor and gloryforever and ever. Amen," (1 Tim. 1:17).". . . To Him who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb, be blessing and honor and glory and dominionforever and ever" (Rev. 5:13).
[/TD]
[TD="width: 50%"]"And a second time they said, "Hallelujah! Her smoke rises upforever and ever" (Rev. 19:3).
"And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are also; and they will be tormented day and nightforever and ever," (Rev. 20:10).
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
he phrase "forever and ever" is used both of describing God's eternal worth and the duration of eternal damnation. The exact same Greek phrase is used in each of the verses in the table below.The Greek phrase aionas ton aionon, which is translated "forever and ever," occurs 18 times in the Greek New Testament. In 17 of them, the phrase means without end, extending into infinity. In Rev. 19:3, the phrase is used to describe the destruction of the great whore of Babylon (Rev. 17:1,4) whose smoke ascends forever and ever. It too is eternal and it signifies the beginning of the eternal judgment that comes upon her.
Also worth examining is Rev. 14:11: "And the smoke of their torment goes upforever and ever; and they have no rest day and night, those who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name."
The Greek in Rev. 14:11 is only slightly different. In the table above, "forever and ever" is translated from the Greek, aionas ton aionon, which is literally "ages of the of ages." In Rev. 14:11, the Greek is aionas aionon which is literally, "ages of ages." In the latter, the single Greek word "of the" is missing. But it is not necessary and does not change the meaning of the text. Therefore, the scripture teaches the smoke of their torment goes up forever, without end.

 

[gotime]

Brother,

Let the Holy spirit enlighten us.

You said that only Jesus live forever and ever.

Jesus is no beginning and that I agree. No end I am agree too.

But on the no end part I don't think that only God. He who believe in God will go to heaven forever/no ending.

In the same manner he who go to hell will be forever like what is in the bible

Matt 18:8

"And if your hand or your foot causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it from you; it is better for you to enter life crippled or lame, than having two hands or two feet, to be cast into the eternal fire,"

I thought that eternal life is only given to those who accept Jesus. whey then Do you say that those who reject Jesus also get eternal life?

to be tormented for eternity requires an eternal life. read posts before these the issue of forever and ever is delt with throughout the bible. there are many example where the term is used and the result ended.

 

[Jackson123]

I thought that eternal life is only given to those who accept Jesus. whey then Do you say that those who reject Jesus also get eternal life?

to be tormented for eternity requires an eternal life. read posts before these the issue of forever and ever is delt with throughout the bible. there are many example where the term is used and the result ended.

Brother Gotime.

Bible has his own term. second dead in the bible mean go to eternal hell.

God is just, demonstrate in the ot eyes for eyes.

If He who accept Jesus to to eternal heaven,

equal with eternal heaven, he who refuse Jesus go to eternal hell.

I remain you what I found from Google.


Is "forever and ever" without end?
The phrase "forever and ever" is used both of describing God's eternal worth and the duration of eternal damnation. The exact same Greek phrase is used in each of the verses in the table below.
[TABLE="class: cms_table"]
[TR]
[TD][/TD]
[TD][TABLE="class: cms_table_carm-table-with-border, width: 146, align: center"]
[TR]
[TD="colspan: 2"]forever and ever

aionas ton aionon
"ages of the ages"[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="width: 50%"]Eternal - without end[/TD]
[TD="width: 50%"]Eternal Damnation[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="width: 50%"]"Now to the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only God, be honor and gloryforever and ever. Amen," (1 Tim. 1:17).". . . To Him who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb, be blessing and honor and glory and dominionforever and ever" (Rev. 5:13).[/TD]
[TD="width: 50%"]"And a second time they said, "Hallelujah! Her smoke rises upforever and ever" (Rev. 19:3).
"And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are also; and they will be tormented day and nightforever and ever," (Rev. 20:10).[/TD]
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he phrase "forever and ever" is used both of describing God's eternal worth and the duration of eternal damnation. The exact same Greek phrase is used in each of the verses in the table below.The Greek phrase aionas ton aionon, which is translated "forever and ever," occurs 18 times in the Greek New Testament. In 17 of them, the phrase means without end, extending into infinity. In Rev. 19:3, the phrase is used to describe the destruction of the great whore of Babylon (Rev. 17:1,4) whose smoke ascends forever and ever. It too is eternal and it signifies the beginning of the eternal judgment that comes upon her.
Also worth examining is Rev. 14:11: "And the smoke of their torment goes upforever and ever; and they have no rest day and night, those who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name."
The Greek in Rev. 14:11 is only slightly different. In the table above, "forever and ever" is translated from the Greek, aionas ton aionon, which is literally "ages of the of ages." In Rev. 14:11, the Greek is aionas aionon which is literally, "ages of ages." In the latter, the single Greek word "of the" is missing. But it is not necessary and does not change the meaning of the text. Therefore, the scripture teaches the smoke of their torment goes up forever, without end.

 

[gotime]

Brother Gotime.

Bible has his own term. second dead in the bible mean go to eternal hell.

God is just, demonstrate in the ot eyes for eyes.

If He who accept Jesus to to eternal heaven,

equal with eternal heaven, he who refuse Jesus go to eternal hell.

I remain you what I found from Google.


Is "forever and ever" without end?
The phrase "forever and ever" is used both of describing God's eternal worth and the duration of eternal damnation. The exact same Greek phrase is used in each of the verses in the table below.
[TABLE="class: cms_table"]
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[TD][/TD]
[TD][TABLE="class: cms_table_carm-table-with-border, width: 146, align: center"]
[TR]
[TD="colspan: 2"]forever and ever

aionas ton aionon
"ages of the ages"[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="width: 50%"]Eternal - without end[/TD]
[TD="width: 50%"]Eternal Damnation[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="width: 50%"]"Now to the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only God, be honor and gloryforever and ever. Amen," (1 Tim. 1:17).". . . To Him who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb, be blessing and honor and glory and dominionforever and ever" (Rev. 5:13).[/TD]
[TD="width: 50%"]"And a second time they said, "Hallelujah! Her smoke rises upforever and ever" (Rev. 19:3).
"And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are also; and they will be tormented day and nightforever and ever," (Rev. 20:10).[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

he phrase "forever and ever" is used both of describing God's eternal worth and the duration of eternal damnation. The exact same Greek phrase is used in each of the verses in the table below.The Greek phrase aionas ton aionon, which is translated "forever and ever," occurs 18 times in the Greek New Testament. In 17 of them, the phrase means without end, extending into infinity. In Rev. 19:3, the phrase is used to describe the destruction of the great whore of Babylon (Rev. 17:1,4) whose smoke ascends forever and ever. It too is eternal and it signifies the beginning of the eternal judgment that comes upon her.
Also worth examining is Rev. 14:11: "And the smoke of their torment goes upforever and ever; and they have no rest day and night, those who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name."
The Greek in Rev. 14:11 is only slightly different. In the table above, "forever and ever" is translated from the Greek, aionas ton aionon, which is literally "ages of the of ages." In Rev. 14:11, the Greek is aionas aionon which is literally, "ages of ages." In the latter, the single Greek word "of the" is missing. But it is not necessary and does not change the meaning of the text. Therefore, the scripture teaches the smoke of their torment goes up forever, without end.

The problem is your understanding of death. Death to you seems to still mean life. I question that.

I believe death is dead and life is alive.

as to for ever and ever there are many instances where the same term is used to describe a burning till its all burned up etc. Your google search is inaccurate and some what wanting. read posts that have shown the term forever being used in a setting where there is an end.