Defence of the Catholics

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Jason0047

Jason0047

Banned
#141
Jul 22, 2014
10,350
51
0
#141
MrMike85 said:
catholics follow our lord jesus and accept him as saviour, they are our family.

God be with them
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So you believe that Jesus would allow you to:

(1) Pray to Mary?
(2) Bow down to a statue?
(3) Think of Mary as sinless? (Whereby she is our co-redeemer)?
(4) Give money to an institution that doesn't really need your money?
(Because you do realize that they have great amounts of wealth already, right?)
In other words, it would be like giving your money to a Casino. Casinos are already wealthy. Why make them richer? What about all the folks out there who could be helped with the money that the RCC is holding onto? Did not Jesus say to put our treasures in Heaven and not here upon this Earth?)
(5) To uplift a holy man in religious garb as if he was a god? (i.e. the pope)?

You believe these things are marks of a true believer?
I could go on. But hopefully this short list should make it obvious.
 
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Jason0047

Jason0047

Banned
#142
Jul 22, 2014
10,350
51
0
#142
Vernon said:
Jason,

You deny the authority of the Bishop of Rome, who has been preaching the gospel since the days of the apostles, and place your own interpretation of what you have called scripture above his teaching and the teaching of many others. By whose authority do you claim to make such proclamations? Has God spoken to you and told you such things? Has Jesus Christ revealed himself to you? Has the Holy Spirit told you to condemn the catholic church and other christians?

Your personnel interpretation of scripture is not authoritative on anyone but yourself, God has not given you the authority to judge other faiths and traditions as being in error while you remain in the perfect truth.

None of us have perfect knowledge and wisdom, the great schisms and divisions of the church have left us lacking in so many things most of all unity in love. Until you realize it is not about being right, but about loving one another regardless of our different traditions that is what God has commanded us to do.

"It is hard for you to kick against the goads." Acts 26:14

Just a thought.
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You deny Sola Scriptura or the authority that God and His Word alone is our authority for our lives. For you add oral tradition to Scripture when we are not to add anymore words to His Holy written Word (Revelation 22:18-19).

In fact, I am in the process of compiling Scripture for Sola Scriptura and it has been very enlightening. It has helped me to understand other topics and verses better. Hopefully soon, I will be posting a thread on Sola Scriptura. Well, it will be a Sola Scriptura / Inerrancy of Present Day Scripture type thread.

Anyways, may the Lord's love shine upon you.
 
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notuptome

notuptome

Senior Member
#143
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
#143
Elin said:
I dunno.

The saints in heaven are the body of Christ just as we are.

It's one body, and it's hard to think they are not concerned about his body on earth.
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The purity of heavens light is too great to behold the darkness of this worlds evils. To depart from this body of flesh and enter into the presence of the Lord is to leave all sin behind. We are not to turn and look back on sin again. Lots wife comes to mind.

When the Lord wipes all tears from our eyes we will not behold the sorrow of this world. Our Saviors love will fill the void in our hearts.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
ThomistColin

ThomistColin

Banned
#144
Nov 30, 2012
2,396
26
0
#144
Jason0047 said:
(4) Give money to an institution that doesn't really need your money?
(Because you do realize that they have great amounts of wealth already, right?)
In other words, it would be like giving your money to a Casino. Casinos are already wealthy. Why make them richer? What about all the folks out there who could be helped with the money that the RCC is holding onto? Did not Jesus say to put our treasures in Heaven and not here upon this Earth?)
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Where is it then? Pray tell me. Where are these riches? Do you mean the artwork that is priceless, created by the masters for the beautification of God's Holy Church? Can't sell it, how do you sell priceless art? Do you mean the artifacts? The Relics? Should those be sold so that any Satanist or Demon worshipper may take it and do vile things with them? Or the property? How shall the Vatican sell the Vatican? Should they sell every cathedral and church? Every monastry and cloister? In doing that, they would make millions homeless, remove millions of soup kitchens, remove millions of homeless shelters, remove millions of kids from an education.

Here's something! THINK BEFORE YOU ACTUALLY COMMENT! You want to attack the wealth of the Church? Realize very little of it is liquid. Realize that the majority of it is healing the sick, feeding the homeless, visiting people in prison!
 
Maynard

Maynard

Banned
#145
Jan 17, 2013
612
19
18
#145
The Catholic Church is the largest and most charitable organization in the world.

She also safeguards the most precious and priceless art in the world, and everyone can enjoy it.
Jason wants her to sell the art to private collectors though where it would be lost forever.

PLACE YOUR BIDS!! crazy.gif

The first item up for auction is,,,

Michelangelo's 'Pieta'
Michelangelo's_Pieta_5450_cropncleaned_edit.jpg
 
ThomistColin

ThomistColin

Banned
#146
Nov 30, 2012
2,396
26
0
#146
Not to mention that tours of the Vatican, the Vatican Museum, and the Sistine Chapel are always first come, first serve and FREE!
 
notuptome

notuptome

Senior Member
#147
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
#147
ThomistColin said:
Where is it then? Pray tell me. Where are these riches? Do you mean the artwork that is priceless, created by the masters for the beautification of God's Holy Church? Can't sell it, how do you sell priceless art? Do you mean the artifacts? The Relics? Should those be sold so that any Satanist or Demon worshipper may take it and do vile things with them? Or the property? How shall the Vatican sell the Vatican? Should they sell every cathedral and church? Every monastry and cloister? In doing that, they would make millions homeless, remove millions of soup kitchens, remove millions of homeless shelters, remove millions of kids from an education.

Here's something! THINK BEFORE YOU ACTUALLY COMMENT! You want to attack the wealth of the Church? Realize very little of it is liquid. Realize that the majority of it is healing the sick, feeding the homeless, visiting people in prison!
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Wealth obtained from the poorest of the poor. Rome made herself wealthy from the mites of billions of widows. She builds golden cathedrals in places where abject poverty abounds. That you to cry poverty while Rome adorns herself in great opulent riches is beyond words.

Rome makes even the worst protestant mega evangelists blush with her obvious wealth.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
notuptome

notuptome

Senior Member
#148
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
#148
ThomistColin said:
Not to mention that tours of the Vatican, the Vatican Museum, and the Sistine Chapel are always first come, first serve and FREE!
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How generous.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
E

Elin

Banned
#149
Jan 19, 2013
11,909
141
0
#149
notuptome said:
The purity of heavens light is too great to behold the darkness of this worlds evils. To depart from this body of flesh and enter into the presence of the Lord is to leave all sin behind. We are not to turn and look back on sin again. Lots wife comes to mind.

When the Lord wipes all tears from our eyes we will not behold the sorrow of this world. Our Saviors love will fill the void in our hearts.
Click to expand...
Love of the body of Christ does not end when one dies. It is for all eternity,

as is the love within the Trinity, after which love in the body of Christ is patterned.

Your thoughts of God are too human.
 
Jason0047

Jason0047

Banned
#150
Jul 22, 2014
10,350
51
0
#150
ThomistColin said:
Where is it then? Pray tell me. Where are these riches? Do you mean the artwork that is priceless, created by the masters for the beautification of God's Holy Church? Can't sell it, how do you sell priceless art? Do you mean the artifacts? The Relics? Should those be sold so that any Satanist or Demon worshipper may take it and do vile things with them? Or the property? How shall the Vatican sell the Vatican? Should they sell every cathedral and church? Every monastry and cloister? In doing that, they would make millions homeless, remove millions of soup kitchens, remove millions of homeless shelters, remove millions of kids from an education.

Here's something! THINK BEFORE YOU ACTUALLY COMMENT! You want to attack the wealth of the Church? Realize very little of it is liquid. Realize that the majority of it is healing the sick, feeding the homeless, visiting people in prison!
Click to expand...
First, Movie stars who do not have faith help the poor and visit the sick and those who are in prison. Doesn't mean they are saved. Second, Jesus said do not put your treasure in Heaven. They could sell the art to the right person and help the poor. As for the cathedrals and or places that provide for people: They could first relocate them to a more modest establishment and either sell or rebuild the property to accommodate those who are less fortunate. Third, then there is all the money they have in the bank, too.
 
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L

Last

Guest
#151
#151
I like how protestants think money collected at Mass goes directly to the Vatican.
 
L

Last

Guest
#152
#152
notuptome said:
Wealth obtained from the poorest of the poor. Rome made herself wealthy from the mites of billions of widows. She builds golden cathedrals in places where abject poverty abounds. That you to cry poverty while Rome adorns herself in great opulent riches is beyond words.

Rome makes even the worst protestant mega evangelists blush with her obvious wealth.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
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You have no idea how the church is structured, do you?
 
S

skipp

Senior Member
#153
Mar 6, 2014
654
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0
#153
I'm not sure we should be throwing stones at the Catholics on this issue of riches. Let's not pretend that there aren't plenty of wealthy Protestant denominations and churches out there. A Baptist church near my home spent thousands of dollars recently on an elaborate scrolling electronic sign.
 
R

RachelBibleStudent

Guest
#154
#154
i am not roman catholic and i strongly disagree with several of rome's doctrines...

however i understand that there are both true christians and apostates in the roman church...just like in any other denomination...the church of rome is no different...

i know of many roman catholics that i am convinced are true christians...and it does bother me to see fellow christians being condemned or accused simply because of their denominational affiliation...

finally i want to say that some protestants are mistaken to take an attitude of 'if rome does it then it must be false'...there is a lot in the roman tradition that we can benefit from...
 
V

Vernon

Banned
#155
Jan 6, 2014
991
27
0
#155
Jason0047 quote: "Anyways, may the Lord's love shine upon you."

Thank you, Jason. The Lord's love does shine upon me and I am so humbled by his love that I am unable to condemn others because I recognize my own depravity. God has no business revealing himself to me and telling me that He loves me and wants me to be with him for eternity. God knows my heart and how dark and full of iniquity I am. Paul said he was the least of the apostles and I am the least of the saved. If God can save me he can truly save all of humanity.

You mention that you base your ideology on 'sola scriptura' (scripture alone) and while such a concept is a noble task because the sacred scripture is holy and from God, You are incapable of doing so because the scripture you now study has been handed down from the generation of the apostles to our modern translations. The body of Christ has been preserving and translating the sacred scripture for 2,000 years. The vast majority of that preservation and translating has come from the Catholic Church. If you remove the Catholic Church from history then you have no sacred scripture to base your ideology on.

i write this to you with tears and complete sincerity, may the Lord's love shine upon you.

Christ be with you always.
 
S

skipp

Senior Member
#156
Mar 6, 2014
654
7
0
#156
RachelBibleStudent said:
i am not roman catholic and i strongly disagree with several of rome's doctrines...

however i understand that there are both true christians and apostates in the roman church...just like in any other denomination...the church of rome is no different...

i know of many roman catholics that i am convinced are true christians...and it does bother me to see fellow christians being condemned or accused simply because of their denominational affiliation...

finally i want to say that some protestants are mistaken to take an attitude of 'if rome does it then it must be false'...there is a lot in the roman tradition that we can benefit from...
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This tends to be my own view on the subject.
 
E

Ella85

Senior Member
#157
May 9, 2014
1,414
106
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#157
Jason0047 said:
So there are Catholics in the RCC who do not agree with those who bow down to idols within their own church? Sorry. I do not see that at all. If it was wrong, they would speak out against it and strive to change it. Besides, all Catholics pray to Mary (Which is what folks are doing when they are bowing down to the statues). In fact, I remember when I was a little kid (Before I received Christ as my Savior later in life): I instinctively knew that praying to another entity besides God was wrong. I was raised in a Christian home that was very liberal and where we did not talk about God (But we would decorate our home with the things of the Lord and sing about Him during Christmas time). I remember one of my close childhood friends back then had prayed to Mary. I remember trying to convince him not to pray to Mary but just to pray to God instead. I knew it was wrong. I was not sucked up or swept into the deception of the dark spirit that is behind the RCC church.
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Dude.....


I get your point. I agreed about 10 posts back that worshipping idols is wrong.

Why can't you agree that

1. Not all Catholics do it.
2. Other religions worship idols also.


I told you I was a Catholic.....and I did not worship Mary or any form of statue......and to answer your question.... why has no one spoken out about it...

1. I have
2. I can only spread the word to so many people
3. I'm sure other people have
4. The RCC is so big, goodluck.
 
H

Hashe

Guest
#158
#158
Ella85 said:
Dude.....


I get your point. I agreed about 10 posts back that worshipping idols is wrong.

Why can't you agree that

1. Not all Catholics do it.
2. Other religions worship idols also.


I told you I was a Catholic.....and I did not worship Mary or any form of statue......and to answer your question.... why has no one spoken out about it...

1. I have
2. I can only spread the word to so many people
3. I'm sure other people have
4. The RCC is so big, goodluck.
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People have no idea about the Catholic church. They heard one person say something, or read one book and think they understand 2000 years of history.

There are good people in the Catholic church, who will be in the new earth, and others who won't. The same as in all other churches.
 
notuptome

notuptome

Senior Member
#159
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
#159
Hashe said:
People have no idea about the Catholic church. They heard one person say something, or read one book and think they understand 2000 years of history.

There are good people in the Catholic church, who will be in the new earth, and others who won't. The same as in all other churches.
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Firstly if the book is the bible one can understand more than the ancients.

Secondly the lake of fire will be full of good people. Good people are not good enough in the presence of God. Only those who have been redeemed by the blood of Christ will see eternal life in heaven.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
Patnubay

Patnubay

Senior Member
#160
May 27, 2014
498
8
18
#160
Jason0047 said:
So you believe that Jesus would allow you to:


(4) Give money to an institution that doesn't really need your money?
(Because you do realize that they have great amounts of wealth already, right?)
In other words, it would be like giving your money to a Casino. Casinos are already wealthy. Why make them richer? What about all the folks out there who could be helped with the money that the RCC is holding onto? Did not Jesus say to put our treasures in Heaven and not here upon this Earth?)

You believe these things are marks of a true believer?
I could go on. But hopefully this short list should make it obvious.
Click to expand...

Jason,

How do you think Benny Hinn, Joel Osteen, Joyce Meyers, Creflo Dollar and Brian Houston got so rich. There are a lot of us ,Christians, who do the same.
 
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