There seem to be a couple of guys here who have a hobby of claiming that Christians don't ever go to Heaven, so much of a hobby that they may insert the topic into unrelated threads. This denial of Heaven goes along with the soul-sleep theory (which has no basis in scripture). Of course this is not a damnable heresy. If you insist on soul-sleep & confine man's future bliss to the New Earth, rather than Heaven, that won't send you to Hell! Thus the debate is not all that important, except that the denial of Heaven might upset some brethren. What is important is that one trusts Christ as Savior & believe that He guarantees you a future of bliss with Him, whether in Heaven or New Earth, or a combination of the two.
As for me, I believe that
1) Thou shalt call His name Jesus, for He shall save His people from their sins.
2) Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, & you shall be saved.
3) My citizenship is in Heaven, & as a citizen I won't be excluded from Heaven, though the New Earth is the ultimate destiny of regenerate man in the Bible.
4) Really the issue of Earth vs New Heaven & Soul-Sleep vs absent from the body, present with the Lord & is an issue that logically should wait until we agree on the Plan of Salvation, as it may become a doctrinal doily to croquet, a theological tiddly-wink, a waste of time to argue on when we don't even agree on how to be saved. And one cannot expect the unregenerate carnal mind to understand spiritual matters.
The standard Christian doctrine is that Christians go to Heaven when they die because that is where Christ is when they die. The thief on the cross that very day went to Paradise with Christ. At least by the time that Paul wrote later, Paradise is evidently identified with the 3rd Heaven, where Paul was raptured (and evidently also John in Rev 4), if only in vision. Probably the most popular evangelical view of Paradise is that it was one of 2 compartments in Sheol/Hades, same as "Abraham's Bosom" in the Luke parable, where the deceased in intermediate state are conscious. Then the idea is that Christ moved Paradise to Heaven after His death (cf. He led captivity captive).
At death the Christian's spirit leaves his body and goes to Heaven, where Christ is. Our destiny is more tied to a person than to a place. "That where I am, there you may be also" (John 14).
Man's normal state is to be a body/spirit unity. The Bible doesn't have the Greek dualism whereby body is bad or unimportant vs soul being good or important. In Heaven Christians are not to be merely disembodied spirits, for 2 Cor 5 explains that the Christian in Heaven will not be a "naked spirit."
The earthly body is called a σκήνη (tabernacle) for the body.
The Heavenly body-substitute is not called a "tabernacle, but
1) a building [οἰκοδομὴν] from God,
2) a house [οἰκίαν] not made with hands, eternal, in the heavens, and
3) our habitation [οἰκητήριον].
Having this habitation constitutes
4) being clothed [ἐvδυσάμενοι] is the and thus
not naked.
[Strangely enough, the UBS editors chose to read ἐκδυσάμενοι " (having undressed ourselves") apparently with the support of only one major Greek manuscript D✱ (the original hand, which apparently was later changed or "corrected") -- the main textual variant depends upon the change of only 1 letter for another, both letters being similar in shape.
F & G read ἐκλυσάμενοι.
ἐνδυσάμενοι has all this support: P46 ℵ B C D2 Y 075 0150 0243 6 33 81 104 256 263 365 424 436 459 1175 1241 1319 1573 1739 1852 1881 1912 1962 2127 2200 2464
Byz [K L P] ]
"For we know that if
the earthly house of our tabernacle [οἰκία τοῦ σκήνους] be dissolved,
we have
a building [οἰκοδομὴν] from God,
a house [οἰκίαν] not made with hands, eternal, in the heavens. 2 For verily in this we groan, longing to be clothed upon with
our habitation [οἰκητήριον] which is from heaven: 3 if so be that
being clothed [ἐvδυσάμενοι]
we shall not be found naked.
4 For indeed we that are in
this tabernacle [σκήνει] do groan,
being burdened; not for that we would be unclothed, but that we would be clothed upon, [ἐπενδύσασθαι],
that what is mortal may be swallowed up of life. 5 Now he that wrought us for this very thing is God, who gave unto us the earnest of the Spirit. 6 Being therefore always of good courage, and knowing that,
whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord 7 (for we walk by faith, not by sight); 8 we are of good courage, I say, and are willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be at home with the Lord.
[proof text for a Heavenly Intermediate State vs. the soul-sleep theory]
9 Wherefore also we make it our aim, whether at home or absent, to be well-pleasing unto him. 10 For we must all be made manifest before the judgment-seat of Christ; that each one may receive the things done in the body, according to what he hath done, whether it be good or bad.
< 2 Cor 5
"1 For we know that if the earthly oikia of our tabernacle be dissolved, we have a building from God, an oikia not made with hands, eternal, in the heavens.
Οἴδαμεν γὰρ ὅτι ἐὰν ἡ ἐπίγειος ἡμῶν οἰκία τοῦ σκήνους καταλυθῇ, οἰκοδομὴν ἐκ θεοῦ ἔχομεν, οἰκίαν ἀχειροποίητον αἰώνιον ἐν τοῖς οὐρανοῖς.
Οἴδαμεν γὰρ = for we know
ὅτι ἐὰν = that if
ἡ ἐπίγειος = the upon-earth(earthly)
ἡμῶν = our / of us
ἡ ἐπίγειος ἡμῶν = our earthly
οἰκία = house [oikia, not oikos!]
τοῦ σκήνους = of the tabernacle
(NIV: "the earthly tent we live in"
ESV: "the tent that is our earthly home")
καταλυθῇ = be dissolved,
οἰκοδομὴν = (a) building
ἐκ θεοῦ from God (God is the originator)
ἔχομεν = we have
οἰκίαν = a house (oikia, not oikos!)
ἀχειροποίητον = not made with hands
[ χειρ- = hand(s) ]
αἰώνιον = eternal
ἐν τοῖς οὐρανοῖς = in the Heavens
It is interesting that this oikia/habitation for the Christian is both received after death, before the resurrection; yet it is eternal, which means it exists after the resurrection. It is also interesting to ponder if there could be any relationship between this intermediate state habitation and the dwelling in the Father's House (John 14) which Christ prepares for the Christian. It would appear that this habitation is called a white robe in Rev. 6.
Rev 6, 5th Seal:
When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the witness they had borne. 10 They cried out with a loud voice, “O Sovereign Lord, holy and true, how long before you will judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?” 11 Then they were each given a white robe [cf. οἰκία] and told to rest a little longer, until the number of their fellow servants and their brothers should be complete, who were to be killed as they themselves had been.
[These guys' spirits are not sleeping.]
[οἰκίαν is accusative case of οἰκία;
in Greek a noun used as a direct object like οἰκία adds a nu (ν) at the end. -- The Greek n, called nu, looks like an English v].
As for me, I believe that
1) Thou shalt call His name Jesus, for He shall save His people from their sins.
2) Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, & you shall be saved.
3) My citizenship is in Heaven, & as a citizen I won't be excluded from Heaven, though the New Earth is the ultimate destiny of regenerate man in the Bible.
4) Really the issue of Earth vs New Heaven & Soul-Sleep vs absent from the body, present with the Lord & is an issue that logically should wait until we agree on the Plan of Salvation, as it may become a doctrinal doily to croquet, a theological tiddly-wink, a waste of time to argue on when we don't even agree on how to be saved. And one cannot expect the unregenerate carnal mind to understand spiritual matters.
The standard Christian doctrine is that Christians go to Heaven when they die because that is where Christ is when they die. The thief on the cross that very day went to Paradise with Christ. At least by the time that Paul wrote later, Paradise is evidently identified with the 3rd Heaven, where Paul was raptured (and evidently also John in Rev 4), if only in vision. Probably the most popular evangelical view of Paradise is that it was one of 2 compartments in Sheol/Hades, same as "Abraham's Bosom" in the Luke parable, where the deceased in intermediate state are conscious. Then the idea is that Christ moved Paradise to Heaven after His death (cf. He led captivity captive).
At death the Christian's spirit leaves his body and goes to Heaven, where Christ is. Our destiny is more tied to a person than to a place. "That where I am, there you may be also" (John 14).
Man's normal state is to be a body/spirit unity. The Bible doesn't have the Greek dualism whereby body is bad or unimportant vs soul being good or important. In Heaven Christians are not to be merely disembodied spirits, for 2 Cor 5 explains that the Christian in Heaven will not be a "naked spirit."
The earthly body is called a σκήνη (tabernacle) for the body.
The Heavenly body-substitute is not called a "tabernacle, but
1) a building [οἰκοδομὴν] from God,
2) a house [οἰκίαν] not made with hands, eternal, in the heavens, and
3) our habitation [οἰκητήριον].
Having this habitation constitutes
4) being clothed [ἐvδυσάμενοι] is the and thus
not naked.
[Strangely enough, the UBS editors chose to read ἐκδυσάμενοι " (having undressed ourselves") apparently with the support of only one major Greek manuscript D✱ (the original hand, which apparently was later changed or "corrected") -- the main textual variant depends upon the change of only 1 letter for another, both letters being similar in shape.
F & G read ἐκλυσάμενοι.
ἐνδυσάμενοι has all this support: P46 ℵ B C D2 Y 075 0150 0243 6 33 81 104 256 263 365 424 436 459 1175 1241 1319 1573 1739 1852 1881 1912 1962 2127 2200 2464
Byz [K L P] ]
"For we know that if
the earthly house of our tabernacle [οἰκία τοῦ σκήνους] be dissolved,
we have
a building [οἰκοδομὴν] from God,
a house [οἰκίαν] not made with hands, eternal, in the heavens. 2 For verily in this we groan, longing to be clothed upon with
our habitation [οἰκητήριον] which is from heaven: 3 if so be that
being clothed [ἐvδυσάμενοι]
we shall not be found naked.
4 For indeed we that are in
this tabernacle [σκήνει] do groan,
being burdened; not for that we would be unclothed, but that we would be clothed upon, [ἐπενδύσασθαι],
that what is mortal may be swallowed up of life. 5 Now he that wrought us for this very thing is God, who gave unto us the earnest of the Spirit. 6 Being therefore always of good courage, and knowing that,
whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord 7 (for we walk by faith, not by sight); 8 we are of good courage, I say, and are willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be at home with the Lord.
[proof text for a Heavenly Intermediate State vs. the soul-sleep theory]
9 Wherefore also we make it our aim, whether at home or absent, to be well-pleasing unto him. 10 For we must all be made manifest before the judgment-seat of Christ; that each one may receive the things done in the body, according to what he hath done, whether it be good or bad.
< 2 Cor 5
"1 For we know that if the earthly oikia of our tabernacle be dissolved, we have a building from God, an oikia not made with hands, eternal, in the heavens.
Οἴδαμεν γὰρ ὅτι ἐὰν ἡ ἐπίγειος ἡμῶν οἰκία τοῦ σκήνους καταλυθῇ, οἰκοδομὴν ἐκ θεοῦ ἔχομεν, οἰκίαν ἀχειροποίητον αἰώνιον ἐν τοῖς οὐρανοῖς.
Οἴδαμεν γὰρ = for we know
ὅτι ἐὰν = that if
ἡ ἐπίγειος = the upon-earth(earthly)
ἡμῶν = our / of us
ἡ ἐπίγειος ἡμῶν = our earthly
οἰκία = house [oikia, not oikos!]
τοῦ σκήνους = of the tabernacle
(NIV: "the earthly tent we live in"
ESV: "the tent that is our earthly home")
καταλυθῇ = be dissolved,
οἰκοδομὴν = (a) building
ἐκ θεοῦ from God (God is the originator)
ἔχομεν = we have
οἰκίαν = a house (oikia, not oikos!)
ἀχειροποίητον = not made with hands
[ χειρ- = hand(s) ]
αἰώνιον = eternal
ἐν τοῖς οὐρανοῖς = in the Heavens
It is interesting that this oikia/habitation for the Christian is both received after death, before the resurrection; yet it is eternal, which means it exists after the resurrection. It is also interesting to ponder if there could be any relationship between this intermediate state habitation and the dwelling in the Father's House (John 14) which Christ prepares for the Christian. It would appear that this habitation is called a white robe in Rev. 6.
Rev 6, 5th Seal:
When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the witness they had borne. 10 They cried out with a loud voice, “O Sovereign Lord, holy and true, how long before you will judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?” 11 Then they were each given a white robe [cf. οἰκία] and told to rest a little longer, until the number of their fellow servants and their brothers should be complete, who were to be killed as they themselves had been.
[These guys' spirits are not sleeping.]
[οἰκίαν is accusative case of οἰκία;
in Greek a noun used as a direct object like οἰκία adds a nu (ν) at the end. -- The Greek n, called nu, looks like an English v].
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