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Wherefore I give you to understand that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and no man can say that Jesus is the Lord by the holy Spirit. 1 Cor. 12:3
When you speak in tongues, you are in control of your voice, your vocal cords, your tongue, i.e. the mechanics of speaking - God gives you the language that you speak - God does not possess people nor over step anyone's will.
It just flows forth . . . .
When you speak in tongues, you are in control of your voice, your vocal cords, your tongue, i.e. the mechanics of speaking - God gives you the language that you speak - God does not possess people nor over step anyone's will.
It just flows forth . . . .
Jaybird,
I've written quite well on the subject matter. I've sufficiently covered the important questions using scripture. Occasionally, I use examples to help illustrate a point, but I have used the bible and handled it rightly.
At this point, your writings beg the question: Have you been born again, and if so, could you elaborate on your experience?
I've written quite well on the subject matter. I've sufficiently covered the important questions using scripture. Occasionally, I use examples to help illustrate a point, but I have used the bible and handled it rightly.
At this point, your writings beg the question: Have you been born again, and if so, could you elaborate on your experience?
J
i read some of what you wrote. my questions were not answered in it.
2 very simple fundamental questions yet no answer, interesting. you also ignored my other response on free will.
but none the less i have nothing to hide and would be happy to answer your questions even if you choose to avoid mine.
i accept Jesus as the Son sent by the Almighty Himself. elaborate - I study, i am rather fond of studying where it teaches to beware of false teachers and to test all things.
2 very simple fundamental questions yet no answer, interesting. you also ignored my other response on free will.
but none the less i have nothing to hide and would be happy to answer your questions even if you choose to avoid mine.
i accept Jesus as the Son sent by the Almighty Himself. elaborate - I study, i am rather fond of studying where it teaches to beware of false teachers and to test all things.
I did not avoid your questions. I answered them, twice.
Regarding free-will, I thought your statement rhetorical. Were you serious in thinking that any of us have not used our free-will to step forward in faith? Everybody has a free-will, and it goes without saying that we are all using it, all the time.
Likewise, when we obey the Holy Spirit, we use our free will. And Peacefulbeliever answered your question, too. She stated correctly that we are in control of our body while we pray "in the spirit".
You say you study your bible, well these things are written about by Paul in 1 Cor 14:15 "I pray with my mind and I pray with my spirit, too."
It gets silly to say, "I'm going to exercise my free will now and drink this glass of water. Oh, I'm going to exercise my free will now and read the bible. I'm now going to exercise my free will and pray to Christ."
So your "question" seemed not serious, to me. But I'm not trying to offend you at all.
When I asked you to elaborate on your born again experience, you failed to speak of your encounter with Jesus. Did you meet Jesus? Or... did you have a spiritual "eye opening" experience?
I'm only asking because it may be that you think are a Christian, but may not be. Allow me to pursue the inquiry.
A Christian is a new species - born of the Spirit. A Christian is not a person who has taken their energies which use to be used in one direction, and now has turned them into a different, better, religious direction. Not at all.
The whole bible teaches that only a new type of man can come into the kingdom, one who is born of the Spirit. Nicodemus asked about this, and Jesus taught such.
And now, when you become a born again of the Spirit creature, you continue in the same way you began... by the Spirit!
It is NOT a taking of your powers (free will, energy, will power, thinking, all your soul power) and now applying that to "a good direction". NO!
And so, this helps to explain how the countless millions who have answered an "altar call", or responded to a psychological persuasion, or philosophized into christianity , really is not the thing. Perhaps God uses these things, but the real deal is if God calls a person and gives them miracle birth.
Not a single true christian has ever chosen God. God does all the choosing and calling. It is ever so.
Regarding free-will, I thought your statement rhetorical. Were you serious in thinking that any of us have not used our free-will to step forward in faith? Everybody has a free-will, and it goes without saying that we are all using it, all the time.
Likewise, when we obey the Holy Spirit, we use our free will. And Peacefulbeliever answered your question, too. She stated correctly that we are in control of our body while we pray "in the spirit".
You say you study your bible, well these things are written about by Paul in 1 Cor 14:15 "I pray with my mind and I pray with my spirit, too."
It gets silly to say, "I'm going to exercise my free will now and drink this glass of water. Oh, I'm going to exercise my free will now and read the bible. I'm now going to exercise my free will and pray to Christ."
So your "question" seemed not serious, to me. But I'm not trying to offend you at all.
When I asked you to elaborate on your born again experience, you failed to speak of your encounter with Jesus. Did you meet Jesus? Or... did you have a spiritual "eye opening" experience?
I'm only asking because it may be that you think are a Christian, but may not be. Allow me to pursue the inquiry.
A Christian is a new species - born of the Spirit. A Christian is not a person who has taken their energies which use to be used in one direction, and now has turned them into a different, better, religious direction. Not at all.
The whole bible teaches that only a new type of man can come into the kingdom, one who is born of the Spirit. Nicodemus asked about this, and Jesus taught such.
And now, when you become a born again of the Spirit creature, you continue in the same way you began... by the Spirit!
It is NOT a taking of your powers (free will, energy, will power, thinking, all your soul power) and now applying that to "a good direction". NO!
And so, this helps to explain how the countless millions who have answered an "altar call", or responded to a psychological persuasion, or philosophized into christianity , really is not the thing. Perhaps God uses these things, but the real deal is if God calls a person and gives them miracle birth.
Not a single true christian has ever chosen God. God does all the choosing and calling. It is ever so.
John 15:16 "You did not choose Me but I chose you, and appointed you that you would go and bear fruit, and that your fruit would remain, so that whatever you ask of the Father in My name He may give to you.
John 15:17 "This I command you, that you love one another.
John 15:18 "If the world hates you, you know that it has hated Me before it hated you.
John 15:19 "If you were of the world, the world would love its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, because of this the world hates you.
and
John 6:44 "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up on the last day.
John 15:17 "This I command you, that you love one another.
John 15:18 "If the world hates you, you know that it has hated Me before it hated you.
John 15:19 "If you were of the world, the world would love its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, because of this the world hates you.
and
John 6:44 "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up on the last day.
J
i didnt see where u said yes or no or any bible verses so im assuming your answers are no.
if Jesus didnt speak in tongues nor instruct anyone to do this, why would you practice this?
you didnt understand the free will question. the point i was making, if you give up your free will you have no free will to worship.
Jesus did not visit me, i believe Jesus said next time he comes it will be in the end times.
if Jesus didnt speak in tongues nor instruct anyone to do this, why would you practice this?
you didnt understand the free will question. the point i was making, if you give up your free will you have no free will to worship.
Jesus did not visit me, i believe Jesus said next time he comes it will be in the end times.
Amen! 1 Corinthians 12:27 - Now you are the body of Christ, and members individually. 28 And God has appointed these in the church: first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, administrations, varieties of tongues. 29 Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Are all workers of miracles? 30 Do all have gifts of healings? Do all speak with tongues? Do all interpret? The answer is no.
1) I practice it because it is a very good thing, that the apostles wrote about, which the Holy Spirit has brought to Jesus' Body. There are good reasons why the Holy Spirit did this, and they are explained by the apostle(s).
2) I have not given up my free will, ever. IN fact, that's an impossibility. Even if you enslave yourself to somebody or something, your free will is doing such. So it's silly to think we don't have our free will in any kind of a situation. Your bringing up this point must mean that somehow, you really do not understand what has been written in this thread, and everything that pertains to a life in the Spirit. Even while giving the Holy Spirit supreme obedience, does not mean my free will has stopped.
3) It's probable that you are not a Christian, but think yourself to be one. No offense. Millions think they are a Christian because they give mental ascent to the story of Christ. But that does not make a person a Christian. It takes a miracle birth, i.e. be born again. When this happens, you will go from the kingdom of darkness to the kingdom of light. There can be no mistaking it.
2) I have not given up my free will, ever. IN fact, that's an impossibility. Even if you enslave yourself to somebody or something, your free will is doing such. So it's silly to think we don't have our free will in any kind of a situation. Your bringing up this point must mean that somehow, you really do not understand what has been written in this thread, and everything that pertains to a life in the Spirit. Even while giving the Holy Spirit supreme obedience, does not mean my free will has stopped.
3) It's probable that you are not a Christian, but think yourself to be one. No offense. Millions think they are a Christian because they give mental ascent to the story of Christ. But that does not make a person a Christian. It takes a miracle birth, i.e. be born again. When this happens, you will go from the kingdom of darkness to the kingdom of light. There can be no mistaking it.
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The reason the answer is no, is not because the Holy Spirit is withholding, but because Christians are unbelieving and are either afraid or misinformed. Paul stated that he wanted ALL of the saints there to speak in tongues, and that he spoke in tongues more than all of them. And at every recorded occurrence of Christians getting filled with the Holy Spirit in the book of Acts, it was evidenced by Tongues and Prophecy.
I agree there are Christians who do not speak in tongues, but it is not God's will for such.
If I am wrong on this last point, at least Christians should be earnestly seeking the Lord about the gifts, and get correct instruction regarding the filling of the Holy Spirit, which this whole thread is about.
C
I remember the Pentecostal church I use to attend put a fair bit of emphasis on speaking in tongues and I can tell you anyone I bought to church thought it was wacky.
I felt like some of these things are forced upon you. Like falling over under the power of the Holy Spirit and tongues etc. If you didn't do these things you weren't accepting what was happening. Its like they even tried to push you over sometimes.
It was in the bible sure but I wonder if it's the same now as it was then. I think in Acts they seen fires upon their head too. Have not heard of that happening in the modern day church though.
I felt like it was kinda forced on me. I loved God and wanted whatever he had and thought if I wasn't speaking in tongues I haven't 'made it'. On reflection I think it was a false teaching. If it happens sure let it happen but it didn't just happen for me. I was kind of forced to babble it out. Not sure if anyone else had that type of experience?
I felt like some of these things are forced upon you. Like falling over under the power of the Holy Spirit and tongues etc. If you didn't do these things you weren't accepting what was happening. Its like they even tried to push you over sometimes.
It was in the bible sure but I wonder if it's the same now as it was then. I think in Acts they seen fires upon their head too. Have not heard of that happening in the modern day church though.
I felt like it was kinda forced on me. I loved God and wanted whatever he had and thought if I wasn't speaking in tongues I haven't 'made it'. On reflection I think it was a false teaching. If it happens sure let it happen but it didn't just happen for me. I was kind of forced to babble it out. Not sure if anyone else had that type of experience?
Nope . . . . not at all.
It is not putting the Lord to any test. God says: the manifestation of the Spirit is given to each believer . . . (1 Cor. 12:7) I want you all to speak in tongues. . . (1 Cor. 14:5a) and it is being poured out by Jesus Christ (Acts 2:33). Speaking in tongues edifies the Christian's spirit within - it builds us up spiritually. It is speaking to God (1 Cor. 14:2)- an intimate personal conversation with god. It is praying in the Spirit (1 Cor. 14:14,15) It is praise to God, it is giving thanks well, it is lifting up and praising God.
It is not putting the Lord to any test. God says: the manifestation of the Spirit is given to each believer . . . (1 Cor. 12:7) I want you all to speak in tongues. . . (1 Cor. 14:5a) and it is being poured out by Jesus Christ (Acts 2:33). Speaking in tongues edifies the Christian's spirit within - it builds us up spiritually. It is speaking to God (1 Cor. 14:2)- an intimate personal conversation with god. It is praying in the Spirit (1 Cor. 14:14,15) It is praise to God, it is giving thanks well, it is lifting up and praising God.
Speaking in tongues is a gift given to some but not to all. As Paul says, 'not all speak in tongues'. Whilst it was a sign of receiving the Holy Spirit in three well known cases (Acts 2, 10, 19), that was for special reasons. It linked the Apostles with the Gentiles and the disciples of John the Baptist in an unquestionable way. Prophecy was the sign in the case of the Samaritans. It is not insignificant that these four groups were the four, each of which might have gone their own way. But there is nowhere any statement that speaking with tongues is necessary on being filled with the Holy Spirit. Had that been so it would have been clearly stated.
It will be noted that in cases like the Ethiopian Eunuch there is no suggestion of speaking in tongues. It rather occurred when it had a specific purpose, identification of groups with Pentecost. Once it had done that it had fulfilled its purpose as a specific sign. It had fulfilled its unique purpose.
Anyone today can be filled with the Holy Spirit and not speak in tongues. In Eph 5 it is revealed by singing hymns and psalms and spiritual songs in praise to God. In Acts 13.52 it is revealed by the joy shown. Thus the great sign of being filled with the Holy Spirit is the manifesting of the fruit of the Spirit. That is not to say that we despise tongues when they are of the Holy Spirit (people in many religions speak in tongues, as indeed happened in Paul's day. That is why he warned, 'No man speaking by the Spirit calls Jesus accursed' - 1 Cor 12.3). As Paul said, 'I thank God that I speak in tongues more than you all'. But it is unscriptural to see them as 'necessary'. There is no justification for that anywhere in Scripture.
It will be noted that in cases like the Ethiopian Eunuch there is no suggestion of speaking in tongues. It rather occurred when it had a specific purpose, identification of groups with Pentecost. Once it had done that it had fulfilled its purpose as a specific sign. It had fulfilled its unique purpose.
Anyone today can be filled with the Holy Spirit and not speak in tongues. In Eph 5 it is revealed by singing hymns and psalms and spiritual songs in praise to God. In Acts 13.52 it is revealed by the joy shown. Thus the great sign of being filled with the Holy Spirit is the manifesting of the fruit of the Spirit. That is not to say that we despise tongues when they are of the Holy Spirit (people in many religions speak in tongues, as indeed happened in Paul's day. That is why he warned, 'No man speaking by the Spirit calls Jesus accursed' - 1 Cor 12.3). As Paul said, 'I thank God that I speak in tongues more than you all'. But it is unscriptural to see them as 'necessary'. There is no justification for that anywhere in Scripture.
Cruisyazz,
I have heard many through the years, speak of the similar experience, and it is unfortunate.
The writing of Paul in 1 Cor 14 teaches perfectly why tongues should not be done in the assembly of the saints, with one exception.
1 Cor 14 is not about content, but context. And the Pentecostal churches, well, many of them, do seem to violate the wisdom that Paul wrote about.
I have heard many through the years, speak of the similar experience, and it is unfortunate.
The writing of Paul in 1 Cor 14 teaches perfectly why tongues should not be done in the assembly of the saints, with one exception.
1 Cor 14 is not about content, but context. And the Pentecostal churches, well, many of them, do seem to violate the wisdom that Paul wrote about.
I first experienced speaking in tongues in a Pentecostal church - I really wanted to speak in tongues but I didn't want to do all the other things I saw happening, i.e. slain in the Spirit, dancing in the Spirit etc. I just wanted to speak in tongues. At that time, I thought that God "possessed" us or "made" us speak so I just opened my mouth - nothing came out!! The more I read 1 Cor. 12 - 14 and especially 14 - the question was: If God does "possess" or "make" Christians speak in tongues then why would He have to teach us HOW it was to be done? And the verse - The spirits of the prophets [men of God] are subject to the control of prophets [men of God]. If Christians had control in the matter of prophecy then I also should have control in the matter of speaking in tongues both come from the gift of holy Spirit. So I had control - God does not overstep a person's will.
When I first spoke in tongues - it was only small syllables and I didn't understand it at all (which scripture tells us we will not understand) and I also had doubt as to whether it was a language or not . . BUT I continued with the syllables and noticed that the more I spoke in tongues the more developed it became - you know - where it finally sounded like a language and not just syllables! Praise God and that is what I did!!!!
When I first spoke in tongues - it was only small syllables and I didn't understand it at all (which scripture tells us we will not understand) and I also had doubt as to whether it was a language or not . . BUT I continued with the syllables and noticed that the more I spoke in tongues the more developed it became - you know - where it finally sounded like a language and not just syllables! Praise God and that is what I did!!!!
E
Why would Jesus have spoken in tongues?
Do YOU do everything that Jesus did? Do you heal everyone? Do you turn water into wine? Do you walk on water and cannot have a bath because you would simply float?
Jesus was/is God...Jesus, after His crucifixion, promised the believers that His Father would send the Holy Spirit, which happened on the day of Pentecost
The Holy Spirit is as active now as He was when He was first sent and just like then, you choose to receive or not
So, the smart aleck answer of whether or not Jesus spoke in tongues is really not that smart at all
The believer in the NT has a different experience than the OT believers
E
If you are interpreting the Holy Spirit through your personal filter, you do not have the correct answer as to the Holy Spirit is
The Holy Spirit is the One who teaches us from the Word about the Father and the Son...if you do not receive or accept His instruction, then you refuse the ONLY One who actually KNOWS them
The Holy Spirit is the One who teaches us from the Word about the Father and the Son...if you do not receive or accept His instruction, then you refuse the ONLY One who actually KNOWS them
