The revelation OF Jesus Christ

[followjesus]

rev 5....And I saw in the right hand of him that sat on the throne A BOOK written within and on the backside, SEALED with seven seals. 2And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, who is worthy to OPEN THE BOOK, and to loose the SEALS thereof? 3And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon. 4And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to OPEN and to read the book, neither to look thereon.
5And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the LION OF THE TRIBE OF JUDA, the Root of David, hath prevailed to OPEN THE BOOK, and to loose the SEVEN SEALS thereof.
6And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a LAMB as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth. 7And he came and took THE BOOK out of the right hand of him that sat upon the throne. 8And WHEN HE HAD TAKEN THE BOOK, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the PRAYERS OF THE SAINTS . 9And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy TO TAKE THE BOOK, and to open THE SEALS thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of EVERY kindred, and tongue, and PEOPLE, and nation; 10And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth."


REV....10:1 ""And I saw another mighty angel come down from heaven, CLOTHED WITH A CLOUD: and a RAINBOW was upon his head, and HIS FACE was as it WERE THE SUN, and his FEET AS PILLARS OF FIRE: 2And he had in HIS HAND A LITTLE BOOK OPEN: and he set his right FOOT upon the SEA, and his left FOOT on the EARTH, 3And cried with a loud voice, as when a LION ROARETH: and when he had cried, seven thunders uttered their voices.....


" This "Mighty angel is Jesus, every attribute is from prophecies beforhand or the gospels. a rainbow always signifies Gods glory in His throne on prophecy, Daniel says " I saw one like the son of man coming on the clouds of heaven" His face is always said to shine as the sun in prophecy and at the transfiguration, his legs of fire are set upon the earth and sea representing His dominion and authority and His open book is the gospel, His voice is " as a lion roareth" the Lion of judah "the Christ" who overcame, we are given these attributes to recognize Jesus.


The revelation of Jesus Christ, He is the Lamb is slain yet lives, who takes the sealed book, opens it, and He is the Mighty angel who comes to earth and delivers The now OPEN book to John, the gospel and then commands Him to go prophecy to many nations. The sealed book unto the jews, fulfilled By Jesus, and now an open invitation to all who believe In the One who died to save us accoeding to the will of God.


Jesus again we are taught in Hebrews, is our Hight priest in the true rabernacle in Heaven.


Revelation 8 :3-5 "Another angel, who had a golden CENSER, came and stood at the ALTAR. He was given much INCENSE to offer, with the PRAYERS of all GODS PEOPLE, on the GOLDEN ALTAR in front of the throne. 4The smoke of the incense, together with the PRAYERS of God’s people, went up before God from the angel’s HAND. 5Then the angel took the CENSER, filled it with FIRE FROM THE ALTAR, and hurled it on the earth; and there came peals of thunder, rumblings, flashes of lightning and an earthquake."
This is the priestly duty of the High priest on the day of atonement in the levitical priesthood laws of moses.


LEVITICUS 16: 12"He is to take a CENSER FULL OF BURNING COALS FROM THE ALTAR before the Lord and two handfuls of finely ground fragrant INCENSE and take them BEHIND THE CURTAIN. "


The revelation OF Jesus Christ. Our High priest In Heaven.


again, Jesus The Lord, the Word


Rev. 19:11-16 " And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war. 12His EYES WERE LIKE FLAMES OF FIRE, and on his head were MANY CROWNS; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself. 13And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in BLOOD: and his name is called The WORD OF GOD. 14And the armies which WERE IN HEAVEN followed him upon white horses, clothed in FINE LINEN WHITE AND CLEAN. 15And out of HIS MOUTH goeth a SHARP SWORD, that with it he should smite the nations: and HE SHALL RULE THEM WITH A ROD OF IRON: and HE TREADETH THE WINEPRESS of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.""




The Revelation OF Jesus Christ, Our Lord and deliverer. The Living Word of God.


Jesus reappers again and again in revelation, it is not a chronilogical order of events but a revealing of Jesus in the heavenly realms, a vison of the new temple that is measured and described, a new jerusalem that is described. a spritual revelation of the forces of Evil in this world of darkness. spiritual vision of the war between good and evil. as things are done in Heaven, so they are done on earth. it is prophecy and revelation. I guess the point, revelation is a view in Heaven at things of Heaven and of earth John is taken to Heaven when the vision begins, always remember it is a Heavenly, spiritual vision a revelation.....

 

[Ahwatukee]

Hello followJesus,

And I saw [another mighty angel] come down from heaven

I would have to disagree with you here, for one, Jesus is never referred to as an angel in the book of Revelation. Also it is clear in Rev.5 that it is "a Lamb looking as if he had been slain" which is another designation of Jesus, who is taking the scroll from the Father's hand. And two, the words "another mighty angel" would infer that this an angelic being like the previous one and that because of the word "another" as in, same type or kind.

These are just mighty angels that share some of the same glorified characteristics that the Lord has.

it is not a chronilogical order of events but a revealing

It is indeed a chronological order of events, with the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments being referred to as "the things that must soon take place" as proclaimed in Rev.1:1. Another example of the chronology of events is revealed in the description of the bowl judgments:

"I saw in heaven another great and marvelous sign: seven angels with the seven last plagues—last, because with them God’s wrath is completed."

In the verse above, the seven bowls are treated as a unit and are referred to as "the last plagues" which would infer that other plagues of wrath would have to take place before them. If they are the last plagues of wrath, then there will have to be plagues of wrath that come before them, namely the seals and trumpets.

 

[followjesus]

rev 5....And I saw in the right hand of him that sat on the throne A BOOK written within and on the backside, SEALED with seven seals. 2And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, who is worthy to OPEN THE BOOK, and to loose the SEALS thereof? 3And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon. 4And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to OPEN and to read the book, neither to look thereon.
5And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the LION OF THE TRIBE OF JUDA, the Root of David, hath prevailed to OPEN THE BOOK, and to loose the SEVEN SEALS thereof.
6And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a LAMB as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth. 7And he came and took THE BOOK out of the right hand of him that sat upon the throne. 8And WHEN HE HAD TAKEN THE BOOK, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the PRAYERS OF THE SAINTS . 9And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy TO TAKE THE BOOK, and to open THE SEALS thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of EVERY kindred, and tongue, and PEOPLE, and nation; 10And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth."


REV....10:1 ""And I saw another mighty angel come down from heaven, CLOTHED WITH A CLOUD: and a RAINBOW was upon his head, and HIS FACE was as it WERE THE SUN, and his FEET AS PILLARS OF FIRE: 2And he had in HIS HAND A LITTLE BOOK OPEN: and he set his right FOOT upon the SEA, and his left FOOT on the EARTH, 3And cried with a loud voice, as when a LION ROARETH: and when he had cried, seven thunders uttered their voices.....


" This "Mighty angel is Jesus, every attribute is from prophecies beforhand or the gospels. a rainbow always signifies Gods glory in His throne on prophecy, Daniel says " I saw one like the son of man coming on the clouds of heaven" His face is always said to shine as the sun in prophecy and at the transfiguration, his legs of fire are set upon the earth and sea representing His dominion and authority and His open book is the gospel, His voice is " as a lion roareth" the Lion of judah "the Christ" who overcame, we are given these attributes to recognize Jesus.


The revelation of Jesus Christ, He is the Lamb is slain yet lives, who takes the sealed book, opens it, and He is the Mighty angel who comes to earth and delivers The now OPEN book to John, the gospel and then commands Him to go prophecy to many nations. The sealed book unto the jews, fulfilled By Jesus, and now an open invitation to all who believe In the One who died to save us accoeding to the will of God.


Jesus again we are taught in Hebrews, is our Hight priest in the true rabernacle in Heaven.


Revelation 8 :3-5 "Another angel, who had a golden CENSER, came and stood at the ALTAR. He was given much INCENSE to offer, with the PRAYERS of all GODS PEOPLE, on the GOLDEN ALTAR in front of the throne. 4The smoke of the incense, together with the PRAYERS of God’s people, went up before God from the angel’s HAND. 5Then the angel took the CENSER, filled it with FIRE FROM THE ALTAR, and hurled it on the earth; and there came peals of thunder, rumblings, flashes of lightning and an earthquake."
This is the priestly duty of the High priest on the day of atonement in the levitical priesthood laws of moses.


LEVITICUS 16: 12"He is to take a CENSER FULL OF BURNING COALS FROM THE ALTAR before the Lord and two handfuls of finely ground fragrant INCENSE and take them BEHIND THE CURTAIN. "


The revelation OF Jesus Christ. Our High priest In Heaven.


again, Jesus The Lord, the Word


Rev. 19:11-16 " And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war. 12His EYES WERE LIKE FLAMES OF FIRE, and on his head were MANY CROWNS; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself. 13And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in BLOOD: and his name is called The WORD OF GOD. 14And the armies which WERE IN HEAVEN followed him upon white horses, clothed in FINE LINEN WHITE AND CLEAN. 15And out of HIS MOUTH goeth a SHARP SWORD, that with it he should smite the nations: and HE SHALL RULE THEM WITH A ROD OF IRON: and HE TREADETH THE WINEPRESS of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.""




The Revelation OF Jesus Christ, Our Lord and deliverer. The Living Word of God.


Jesus reappers again and again in revelation, it is not a chronilogical order of events but a revealing of Jesus in the heavenly realms, a vison of the new temple that is measured and described, a new jerusalem that is described. a spritual revelation of the forces of Evil in this world of darkness. spiritual vision of the war between good and evil. as things are done in Heaven, so they are done on earth. it is prophecy and revelation. I guess the point, revelation is a view in Heaven at things of Heaven and of earth John is taken to Heaven when the vision begins, always remember it is a Heavenly, spiritual vision a revelation.....

After the resurrection He says this


John20: 17" Jesus saith unto her, TOUCH ME NOT; for I am not YET ASCENDED to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ASCEND UNTO MY FATHER, and YOUR FATHER; and to MY GOD, and YOUR GOD."




then you have to consider this happened in Heaven next


revelation 5: 5-6 "And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Juda ( Jesus), the Root of David ( Jesus), hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof. And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a LAMB AS IT HAD BEEN SLAIN, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven SPIRITS OF GOD SENT FORTH INTO ALL THE EARTH."


then v 7-10 "And he came and took the book out of the right hand of him that sat upon the throne. 8And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints. 9And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation; 10And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth."


This clearly is Jesus being given all authority, all judgement, in Heaven, clearly Him being brought into His heavenly glory that He spoke of so often in His ministry ....so then back on earth He appears to His disciples after He had been " slain" as the Lamb, but now He clearly says....


matthew 28:18-20 "Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, into a mountain where Jesus had appointed them. 17And when they saw him, they worshipped him: but some doubted. 18And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, ALL POWER IS GIVEN UNTO ME IN HEAVEN AND IN EARTH. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, BAPTIZING them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: TEACHING them to observe all things whatsoever I HAVE COMMANDED YOU: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the END OF THE WORLD. Amen."


Why did the jews who lived by the Laws of moses, Hate Jesus and plot against Him, try to trap Him for accusation so they could stone Him? was it because He was teaching things not from the Law and claiming to be the One God sent with His Word of authority, His christ, His Son, the " son of man" " the light of the world" the way the truth and the Life the Only way to the father".....Had Jesus been expounding the Law, He would have been expounding the same Law, Things shifted to the spiritual, as the earth had already been judged knowing that Gods word unfolds it is always spoken beforehand and then comes to pass in His time.all things are created new, the new creation is beginning with Jesus and the Gospel, the first creation is already Judged and condemned, christians are promised this " the present Heavens and earth are reserved for fire and the destruction of the ungodly" and we are promised new heavens and new earth"


If you really consider the promises the change in the covenant is evident, the first is a promise of long prosperous life on earth from obeying the book of the law then you went to " rest with the fathers and wait for the judgement, Jesus started promising eternal Life to His disciples saying I am the One, the way, the son of God, the truth, the savior, the Christ , the teacher, the shepherd....eternal Life to all who believe in me..all who believe in God whop sent me. if you really consider Jesus doctrine against all of moses doctrine the change is evident, then considering Jesus is the One who fulfilled the Law for christians, and Gave us Gods commands of the spirit to those who believe " this is hoe it is sent into all the earth" to those waiting for the promise of the spirit made By Jesus in john 14-15 "

this isnt a popular way to look at revelation, but scripture makes good sense considering revelation is a look from Heaven of Heavenly things, and events on earth.

 

[followjesus]

Hello followJesus,



I would have to disagree with you here, for one, Jesus is never referred to as an angel in the book of Revelation. Also it is clear in Rev.5 that it is "a Lamb looking as if he had been slain" which is another designation of Jesus, who is taking the scroll from the Father's hand. And two, the words "another mighty angel" would infer that this an angelic being like the previous one and that because of the word "another" as in, same type or kind.

These are just mighty angels that share some of the same glorified characteristics that the Lord has.



It is indeed a chronological order of events, with the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments being referred to as "the things that must soon take place" as proclaimed in Rev.1:1. Another example of the chronology of events is revealed in the description of the bowl judgments:

"I saw in heaven another great and marvelous sign: seven angels with the seven last plagues—last, because with them God’s wrath is completed."

In the verse above, the seven bowls are treated as a unit and are referred to as "the last plagues" which would infer that other plagues of wrath would have to take place before them. If they are the last plagues of wrath, then there will have to be plagues of wrath that come before them, namely the seals and trumpets.

Hey man, you have the right to disagree and have your views respected, i appologize i havent always done that with you. God bless, and disagreements often open eyes.

 

[Ahwatukee]

Hey man, you have the right to disagree and have your views respected, i appologize i havent always done that with you. God bless, and disagreements often open eyes.

Thank you for saying so and forgive me also If at anytime I have come across as being harsh. I try to present my reasons in a respectful, gentle and loving manner, but I'm sure they don't always come out that way.

 

[Hizikyah]

Revelation 3:10, “Because you have guarded My Word of endurance, I also shall guard you from the hour of trial which shall come upon all the world, to try those who dwell on the earth."

Ezekiyl 48:35, "The distance around the city will be eighteen thousand measures; and the name of the city from that day will be: YHWH SHAMMAH! (YHWH Is There)"



Revelation 21:3-4, "And I heard a great voice out of heaven, saying: Behold, the tabernacle of YHWH is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they will be His people, and YHWH Himself will be with them, and be their Father. And YHWH will wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there will be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, nor will there be any more pain, for the former things have passed away."


Hebrews 13:14, "For here have we no continuing city, but we seek one to come."

 

[tanakh]

After the resurrection He says this


John20: 17" Jesus saith unto her, TOUCH ME NOT; for I am not YET ASCENDED to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ASCEND UNTO MY FATHER, and YOUR FATHER; and to MY GOD, and YOUR GOD."




then you have to consider this happened in Heaven next


revelation 5: 5-6 "And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Juda ( Jesus), the Root of David ( Jesus), hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof. And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a LAMB AS IT HAD BEEN SLAIN, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven SPIRITS OF GOD SENT FORTH INTO ALL THE EARTH."


then v 7-10 "And he came and took the book out of the right hand of him that sat upon the throne. 8And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints. 9And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation; 10And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth."


This clearly is Jesus being given all authority, all judgement, in Heaven, clearly Him being brought into His heavenly glory that He spoke of so often in His ministry ....so then back on earth He appears to His disciples after He had been " slain" as the Lamb, but now He clearly says....


matthew 28:18-20 "Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, into a mountain where Jesus had appointed them. 17And when they saw him, they worshipped him: but some doubted. 18And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, ALL POWER IS GIVEN UNTO ME IN HEAVEN AND IN EARTH. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, BAPTIZING them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: TEACHING them to observe all things whatsoever I HAVE COMMANDED YOU: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the END OF THE WORLD. Amen."


Why did the jews who lived by the Laws of moses, Hate Jesus and plot against Him, try to trap Him for accusation so they could stone Him? was it because He was teaching things not from the Law and claiming to be the One God sent with His Word of authority, His christ, His Son, the " son of man" " the light of the world" the way the truth and the Life the Only way to the father".....Had Jesus been expounding the Law, He would have been expounding the same Law, Things shifted to the spiritual, as the earth had already been judged knowing that Gods word unfolds it is always spoken beforehand and then comes to pass in His time.all things are created new, the new creation is beginning with Jesus and the Gospel, the first creation is already Judged and condemned, christians are promised this " the present Heavens and earth are reserved for fire and the destruction of the ungodly" and we are promised new heavens and new earth"


If you really consider the promises the change in the covenant is evident, the first is a promise of long prosperous life on earth from obeying the book of the law then you went to " rest with the fathers and wait for the judgement, Jesus started promising eternal Life to His disciples saying I am the One, the way, the son of God, the truth, the savior, the Christ , the teacher, the shepherd....eternal Life to all who believe in me..all who believe in God whop sent me. if you really consider Jesus doctrine against all of moses doctrine the change is evident, then considering Jesus is the One who fulfilled the Law for christians, and Gave us Gods commands of the spirit to those who believe " this is hoe it is sent into all the earth" to those waiting for the promise of the spirit made By Jesus in john 14-15 "

this isnt a popular way to look at revelation, but scripture makes good sense considering revelation is a look from Heaven of Heavenly things, and events on earth.

Jesus appears at many places in the Bible including Revelation. The Angel you refer to is one of them. The Rainbow is a symbol of Christ. In the story of Noah the Rainbow in the sky is a sign of him. The story of Joseph depicts him and the
coat he has is another rainbow symbol. Jesus appears in many ways and forms throughout the Scriptures. He said that they speak of him and he explained to the Disciples on the road to Emmaus how this was so.

 

[followjesus]

Thank you for saying so and forgive me also If at anytime I have come across as being harsh. I try to present my reasons in a respectful, gentle and loving manner, but I'm sure they don't always come out that way.

honestly man, any friction between you and i has mostly been me youve always acted with me anyways, Just like you said you try to present yourself, a really good example for people Like myself, who sometimes is frustrated with others and ends up speaking to quickly. sincerely i appologize and appreciate your gentle spirit.

 

[followjesus]

Jesus appears at many places in the Bible including Revelation. The Angel you refer to is one of them. The Rainbow is a symbol of Christ. In the story of Noah the Rainbow in the sky is a sign of him. The story of Joseph depicts him and the
coat he has is another rainbow symbol. Jesus appears in many ways and forms throughout the Scriptures. He said that they speak of him and he explained to the Disciples on the road to Emmaus how this was so.

Yeah thats what im saying, but especially in revelation. regarding that angel

The rainbow in prophecy always represents Gods glory on the throne, ezekiel, daniel and john all when they see the throne see the rainbow around it, Jesus face has the appearance of the shining son, in daniel, at His transfiguraion, in revelation among other places, His legs in daniel and ezekiel have the appearance of burnished bronze looking as if it is burning, The fact that John talks of a book taken from Gods hand sealed and unable to be opened, yet the lamb is recognized as the only one in heaven or earth that is worthy to open the book and loose the seals, then the angel appears having a rainbow around His head with an open book and gives it to john. the legs of fire upon the earth and the sea, Jesus is given dominion over the earth and all in it and the sea and all in it.....His voice in prophecy is always Loud " Like the rushing of many waters" or like the roar of a lion" His eyes many times are blazing ect...


I believe when in prophecy we see details like this angel, they are there for a reason, to recognize something, and realizing either all the prophecies of these things elsewhere in the bible matching up, are all coincidences, or they are faith builders to know deeper the things of Heaven. The prophets always spoke from Gods spirit and the prophecies all fit together with revelation being what brings all of the end times prophets together

 

[followjesus]

Thank you for saying so and forgive me also If at anytime I have come across as being harsh. I try to present my reasons in a respectful, gentle and loving manner, but I'm sure they don't always come out that way.

this is one example of why i look at it like i do rather than chronilogical Just a consideration to offer
i believe this, were seeing things unfold in Heaven, and then later on Earth. the spiritual realm and the earthly realm are in the vision, events that happen in Heaven and on earth. what im saying is this


Revelation chapter 6:12-17 "And I beheld when he had opened the sixth SEAL, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; 13And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. 14And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. 15And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; 16And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: 17For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?"




But then Look at the final Judgement in chapter 20.


" And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. 12And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works."




These are both images of the same event from 2 different perspectives is what im saying.


Rev, 6 " the sun darkened and the moon as blood has always been a sign of the day of the Lord or the last day. as well as the stars falling as figs, as well as heaven and earth fleeing from the presence of God at Judgement. the fleeing and trying to hide calling to the mountains and rocks to hide them, but the mountains and rocks are gone, theres nowhere to Hide from Gods judgement is the idea, Nothing is hidden before God from our worst to our greatest deeds. the fact that all of the people are fleeing says judgement as well, the THRONE is mentioned, as well as the wrath of the Lamb which is the lake of fire.


This is why it isnt chronilogical to me but rather a spiritual heavenly vision of both events in Heaven and on Earth, the two natures of Jesus Christ, the Son of man who is fleah and blood, and the Son of God who is spirit. The Savior Lamb of earth, being exalted to power in Heaven after He is slain, appearing on earth woith the covenant including all nations. another off subject thing to consider is this regarding the sealed book, and then the open book.






ezekiel 2: 9-3:6" And when I looked, behold, an hand was sent unto me; and, lo, a roll of a book was therein; 10And he spread it before me; and it was written within and without: and there was written therein lamentations, and mourning, and woe.


Moreover he said unto me, Son of man, eat that thou findest; eat this roll, and go speak unto the house of Israel. 2So I opened my mouth, and he caused me to eat that roll. 3And he said unto me, Son of man, cause thy belly to eat, and fill thy bowels with this roll that I give thee. Then did I eat it; and it was in my mouth as honey for sweetness. 4And he said unto me, Son of man, go, get thee unto the house of Israel, and speak with my words unto them. 5For thou art not sent to a people of a strange speech and of an hard language, but to the house of Israel; 6Not to many people of a strange speech and of an hard language, whose words thou canst not understand."


Notice what John is told when He eats the scroll as opposed to ezekiel who is sent only to the house of isreal, where as John is told to prophecy to many nations and peoples. it is the old covenant that is sealed with the Judgements because in the old, God repeatedly said " if you do not repent i will utterly destroy my people isreal, Leave them naked and desloate, they will call and i will not hear, i will destroy thier children , thier city, thier temple ...ect... The prophets pronounce so many judgements against isreal that are pictured in revelation Like the horsemen, of famine, pestelence, war, death and hades...those are ALL things in the prophets God saying things like " surely these things will all come to pass , you wuld not repent and harken my people isreal...the seven seals are those judgements unfolding, it is the fulfilling of the Law and prophets for isreal."


the open book in the angel who has the apearance of Jesus, the radiance of Gods Glory appearing on earth to give man an open book, unsealed.




Now consider this


daniel 127-9 ":And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished. 8And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things? 9And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end."


Daniel is told to that the end of His vision is sealed until the time of the end.


John is told not to seal up His prophecy because the time is at hand.


rev 22:10 "And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand."


Revelation 10:5-7 "And the angel which I saw stand upon the sea and upon the earth lifted up his hand to heaven, 6And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer: 7But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as HE HATH DECLARED UNTO HIS SERVANTS THE PROPHETS."




"the fulfilling of the Law and prophets" Then handed back to mankind open after it is fulfilled. i got off subject but.....anyways man it never hurts to consider different things

 

[Ahwatukee]

Good day followJesus,

Revelation chapter 6:12-17 "And I beheld when he had opened the sixth SEAL, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; 13And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. 14And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. 15And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; 16And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: 17For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?"


But then Look at the final Judgement in chapter 20.


" And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. 12And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works."

Well, let's compare the events in both contexts:

The 6th Seal: - Rev.6:12-17

* There is a great earthquake, which causes the mountains and Islands to be stirred

* The sun becomes black like sackcloth

* The Moon turns blood red

* The stars (meteorites/asteroids) fall from heaven to the earth

* The sky rolls up like a scroll, which reveals the realm of heaven and the Father sitting on the throne

* Because of fear, the inhabitants want the mountains and the rocks to fall on them i.e. to kill them to get out of God's line of sight

* The announcement that the great day of their wrath has come (more wrath to follow)

======================================

The Great White Throne Judgment: - Rev.20:11-15

* The unrighteous dead are resurrected after the thousand reign of Christ, as revealed in Rev.20:5,7

* God is sitting on the great white throne to judge

* This current heaven and earth flee from God's presence/pass away

* The unsaved dead, great and small, are resurrected out of Sheol/Hades and stand before God and the great white throne

* The books are opened containing a record of every sin for each individual and are judged

* Death and Hades are thrown into the lake of fire (1 Cor.15:26)

* All of those unrighteous dead whose names will not be found in the book of life, will be thrown into the lake of fire

====================================

With just a cursory comparison of the two events of the 6th Seal and the great white throne judgment, I'm sure that you would agree, that they are two completely different events. The 6th Takes place on the earth as part of the other plagues of wrath, while the GWTJ takes place in heaven, where this current heaven and earth pass away (Rev.20.11, 21:1). The GWTJ takes place after the seven year tribulation, after thousand year reign of Christ and after Satan's last rebellion (Rev.20:.7-9)

At the 6th seal, the announcement is that the great day of their wrath has come (begun and continuing) and which is followed by the 7th seal, which is followed by the seven trumpets, with the seven bowl judgments completing God's wrath upon the earth. Where the GWTJ takes place after Satan's Gog and Magog rebellion, which takes place after the tribulation and at the end of the thousand year reign of Christ and is the final judgment of the unrighteous dead, which is followed by eternity


* You are here

* The Lord descends and gathers His church

* The ruler/antichrist establishes his seven agreement with Israel in fulfillment of the seventy sevens

* Seals (6th seal included), trumpets and bowl judgments take place throughout the seven years

* The Lord returns to the earth to end the age after the 7th bowl, with the church following on white horses (Rev.19:11-21)

* The beast and the false prophet are thrown alive into the lake of fire (Rev.19:20)

* Satan thrown into the Abyss and restricted there during the thousand years (Rev.20:1-3)

* Literal thousand year reign of Christ

* Satan released from the Abyss and rebels at the end of the thousand years (Rev.20:7-9)

* Satan thrown into the lake of fire (Rev.20:10)

* Great White Throne judgment takes place, where all of the unrighteous dead throughout all of history are resurrected out of Sheol/Hades and stand before God to be judged for their sins. (Rev.20:11-15)

* Death and Hades are thrown into the lake of fire (Rev:20:14)

* New heaven, new earth, new Jerusalem (Rev.21 & 22)

* Eternity .................................................................


The short version is that, the 6th seal is followed by the 7th seal, which is followed by the seven trumpets and the seven bowl judgments. All of these will take place on the earth in fulfillment of God's wrath.

The Great White Throne Judgment takes place after the announcement that the thousands years are over in Rev.20:7 and after Satan's Gog and Magog rebellion. Where immediately after that Rebellion, Satan is then thrown into the lake of fire where the beast and the false prophet will have been thrown a thousand years earlier.

The Great White Throne judgement takes place after the tribulation period and after the thousand year reign of Christ. While the 6th seal is just one of the events that takes place during the first 3 1/2 years of the seven year tribulation period, which would be over a thousand years earlier from when the GWTJ takes place.

At the 6th seal, the announcement is made that "the great day of their wrath has come" which would mean that there is more wrath that follows after the 6th seal. Where the GWTJ takes place after the tribulation period and after the thousand year reign of Christ and after Satan's rebellion, where at which time, all of the unrighteous death throughout all of history will be judged, which is then followed by the new heaven, new earth and new Jerusalem.

During the 6th seal, with the trumpets and bowls that follow, these take place on the earth. Where at the GWTJ, heaven and earth flees from God's presence. They pass away and no place is found for them.

 

[followjesus]

Good day followJesus,




Well, let's compare the events in both contexts:

The 6th Seal: - Rev.6:12-17

* There is a great earthquake, which causes the mountains and Islands to be stirred

* The sun becomes black like sackcloth

* The Moon turns blood red

* The stars (meteorites/asteroids) fall from heaven to the earth

* The sky rolls up like a scroll, which reveals the realm of heaven and the Father sitting on the throne

* Because of fear, the inhabitants want the mountains and the rocks to fall on them i.e. to kill them to get out of God's line of sight

* The announcement that the great day of their wrath has come (more wrath to follow)

======================================

The Great White Throne Judgment: - Rev.20:11-15

* The unrighteous dead are resurrected after the thousand reign of Christ, as revealed in Rev.20:5,7

* God is sitting on the great white throne to judge

* This current heaven and earth flee from God's presence/pass away

* The unsaved dead, great and small, are resurrected out of Sheol/Hades and stand before God and the great white throne

* The books are opened containing a record of every sin for each individual and are judged

* Death and Hades are thrown into the lake of fire (1 Cor.15:26)

* All of those unrighteous dead whose names will not be found in the book of life, will be thrown into the lake of fire

====================================

With just a cursory comparison of the two events of the 6th Seal and the great white throne judgment, I'm sure that you would agree, that they are two completely different events. The 6th Takes place on the earth as part of the other plagues of wrath, while the GWTJ takes place in heaven, where this current heaven and earth pass away (Rev.20.11, 21:1). The GWTJ takes place after the seven year tribulation, after thousand year reign of Christ and after Satan's last rebellion (Rev.20:.7-9)

At the 6th seal, the announcement is that the great day of their wrath has come (begun and continuing) and which is followed by the 7th seal, which is followed by the seven trumpets, with the seven bowl judgments completing God's wrath upon the earth. Where the GWTJ takes place after Satan's Gog and Magog rebellion, which takes place after the tribulation and at the end of the thousand year reign of Christ and is the final judgment of the unrighteous dead, which is followed by eternity


* You are here

* The Lord descends and gathers His church

* The ruler/antichrist establishes his seven agreement with Israel in fulfillment of the seventy sevens

* Seals (6th seal included), trumpets and bowl judgments take place throughout the seven years

* The Lord returns to the earth to end the age after the 7th bowl, with the church following on white horses (Rev.19:11-21)

* The beast and the false prophet are thrown alive into the lake of fire (Rev.19:20)

* Satan thrown into the Abyss and restricted there during the thousand years (Rev.20:1-3)

* Literal thousand year reign of Christ

* Satan released from the Abyss and rebels at the end of the thousand years (Rev.20:7-9)

* Satan thrown into the lake of fire (Rev.20:10)

* Great White Throne judgment takes place, where all of the unrighteous dead throughout all of history are resurrected out of Sheol/Hades and stand before God to be judged for their sins. (Rev.20:11-15)

* Death and Hades are thrown into the lake of fire (Rev:20:14)

* New heaven, new earth, new Jerusalem (Rev.21 & 22)

* Eternity .................................................................


The short version is that, the 6th seal is followed by the 7th seal, which is followed by the seven trumpets and the seven bowl judgments. All of these will take place on the earth in fulfillment of God's wrath.

The Great White Throne Judgment takes place after the announcement that the thousands years are over in Rev.20:7 and after Satan's Gog and Magog rebellion. Where immediately after that Rebellion, Satan is then thrown into the lake of fire where the beast and the false prophet will have been thrown a thousand years earlier.

The Great White Throne judgement takes place after the tribulation period and after the thousand year reign of Christ. While the 6th seal is just one of the events that takes place during the first 3 1/2 years of the seven year tribulation period, which would be over a thousand years earlier from when the GWTJ takes place.

At the 6th seal, the announcement is made that "the great day of their wrath has come" which would mean that there is more wrath that follows after the 6th seal. Where the GWTJ takes place after the tribulation period and after the thousand year reign of Christ and after Satan's rebellion, where at which time, all of the unrighteous death throughout all of history will be judged, which is then followed by the new heaven, new earth and new Jerusalem.

During the 6th seal, with the trumpets and bowls that follow, these take place on the earth. Where at the GWTJ, heaven and earth flees from God's presence. They pass away and no place is found for them.

No lol i wouldnt agree they are different events, im saying they are different perspectives. im saying the book of revelation is about what was at the time already, and what was to come. things in heaven, then manifesting on earth i think you missed my point, but again i think you are looking at it differently and thats ok i dont think alvation really depends on our understanding of revelation or anything, i do enjoy discussion tho.

im not really following alot of what you are saying who are you saying is part of the resurrection and thousand years reign?

and i think the different view is you look at it chronilogically, i see a recurring theme of events in Heaven, then causing events on earth. I see Jesus exalted first in Heaven after He is slain, taking the sealed book opening its seals and releasing judgements into the earth, spiritual Judgements that also rest on the same what Happens in the spiritual, happens in earth. were not going to actuall see a dragon thats the spirit of satan, or a beast with ten horns and blasphemies written on it, that is the beasts Kingdom, we wont see a lamb that speaks like a dragon, that is the spirit of false prophecy, the spirit of the dragon, who gives His authority the false prophet and those in his kingdom. its a mock Of God who is spirit, giving the authority to His Christ and those of His Kingdom. anyways, man at least we have different views to consider....

 

[followjesus]

this kind of exhibits how i see revelation

ezekiel 14 :12-23 "The word of the LORD came again to me, saying, Son of man, when the land sinneth against me by trespassing grievously, then will I stretch out mine hand upon it,...........v22For thus saith the Lord GOD; How much more when I send my FOUR SORE judgments upon Jerusalem, the SWORD, and the FAMINE, and the noisome BEAST, and the PESTILENCE, to cut off from it man and beast? ... thru v23"


If you consider this from the prophet of God long beforehand then consider this event of the horsemen seals.


rev. 6:1-8.........v7 . And when he had opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth beast say, Come and see. 8And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was DEATH, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with SWORD, and with HUNGER, and with DEATH, and with the BEASTS of the earth."


and then when you spend time searching the prophets from moses to malachi you find things like this about every time you read them Gods Judgements on isreal are still happening today, they are surrounded on every side by all nations who hate them, until early the last ceintury they were scattered among every nation of men on earth still many jews remain scattered to the 4 winds as God foretold, again in the prophets. If a person Knows revelation well, and then searches the prophets looking for understanding it is there.


you find things Like this


zechariah 6:1-5 "And I turned, and lifted up mine eyes, and looked, and, behold, there came four chariots out from between two mountains; and the mountains were mountains of brass. 2In the first chariot were red horses; and in the second chariot black horses; 3And in the third chariot white horses; and in the fourth chariot grisled and bay horses. 4Then I answered and said unto the angel that talked with me, What are these, my lord? 5And the angel answered and said unto me, These are the four spirits of the heavens, which go forth from standing before the Lord of all the earth. "


I find it too much of a coincidence that revelations imagery is found in the prophets, almost all of it

 

[followjesus]

Good day followJesus,




Well, let's compare the events in both contexts:

The 6th Seal: - Rev.6:12-17

* There is a great earthquake, which causes the mountains and Islands to be stirred

* The sun becomes black like sackcloth

* The Moon turns blood red

* The stars (meteorites/asteroids) fall from heaven to the earth

* The sky rolls up like a scroll, which reveals the realm of heaven and the Father sitting on the throne

* Because of fear, the inhabitants want the mountains and the rocks to fall on them i.e. to kill them to get out of God's line of sight

* The announcement that the great day of their wrath has come (more wrath to follow)

======================================

The Great White Throne Judgment: - Rev.20:11-15

* The unrighteous dead are resurrected after the thousand reign of Christ, as revealed in Rev.20:5,7

* God is sitting on the great white throne to judge

* This current heaven and earth flee from God's presence/pass away

* The unsaved dead, great and small, are resurrected out of Sheol/Hades and stand before God and the great white throne

* The books are opened containing a record of every sin for each individual and are judged

* Death and Hades are thrown into the lake of fire (1 Cor.15:26)

* All of those unrighteous dead whose names will not be found in the book of life, will be thrown into the lake of fire

====================================

With just a cursory comparison of the two events of the 6th Seal and the great white throne judgment, I'm sure that you would agree, that they are two completely different events. The 6th Takes place on the earth as part of the other plagues of wrath, while the GWTJ takes place in heaven, where this current heaven and earth pass away (Rev.20.11, 21:1). The GWTJ takes place after the seven year tribulation, after thousand year reign of Christ and after Satan's last rebellion (Rev.20:.7-9)

At the 6th seal, the announcement is that the great day of their wrath has come (begun and continuing) and which is followed by the 7th seal, which is followed by the seven trumpets, with the seven bowl judgments completing God's wrath upon the earth. Where the GWTJ takes place after Satan's Gog and Magog rebellion, which takes place after the tribulation and at the end of the thousand year reign of Christ and is the final judgment of the unrighteous dead, which is followed by eternity


* You are here

* The Lord descends and gathers His church

* The ruler/antichrist establishes his seven agreement with Israel in fulfillment of the seventy sevens

* Seals (6th seal included), trumpets and bowl judgments take place throughout the seven years

* The Lord returns to the earth to end the age after the 7th bowl, with the church following on white horses (Rev.19:11-21)

* The beast and the false prophet are thrown alive into the lake of fire (Rev.19:20)

* Satan thrown into the Abyss and restricted there during the thousand years (Rev.20:1-3)

* Literal thousand year reign of Christ

* Satan released from the Abyss and rebels at the end of the thousand years (Rev.20:7-9)

* Satan thrown into the lake of fire (Rev.20:10)

* Great White Throne judgment takes place, where all of the unrighteous dead throughout all of history are resurrected out of Sheol/Hades and stand before God to be judged for their sins. (Rev.20:11-15)

* Death and Hades are thrown into the lake of fire (Rev:20:14)

* New heaven, new earth, new Jerusalem (Rev.21 & 22)

* Eternity .................................................................


The short version is that, the 6th seal is followed by the 7th seal, which is followed by the seven trumpets and the seven bowl judgments. All of these will take place on the earth in fulfillment of God's wrath.

The Great White Throne Judgment takes place after the announcement that the thousands years are over in Rev.20:7 and after Satan's Gog and Magog rebellion. Where immediately after that Rebellion, Satan is then thrown into the lake of fire where the beast and the false prophet will have been thrown a thousand years earlier.

The Great White Throne judgement takes place after the tribulation period and after the thousand year reign of Christ. While the 6th seal is just one of the events that takes place during the first 3 1/2 years of the seven year tribulation period, which would be over a thousand years earlier from when the GWTJ takes place.

At the 6th seal, the announcement is made that "the great day of their wrath has come" which would mean that there is more wrath that follows after the 6th seal. Where the GWTJ takes place after the tribulation period and after the thousand year reign of Christ and after Satan's rebellion, where at which time, all of the unrighteous death throughout all of history will be judged, which is then followed by the new heaven, new earth and new Jerusalem.

During the 6th seal, with the trumpets and bowls that follow, these take place on the earth. Where at the GWTJ, heaven and earth flees from God's presence. They pass away and no place is found for them.

how about a third example to go with those 2?



the 6th seal ch 6 "And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; 13And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. 14And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. 15And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; 16And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: 17For the GREAT DAY OF HIS WRATH IS COME; and who shall be able to stand?"


THE 7TH trumpet....


Ch 11...."And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever. 16And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God, 17Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned. 18And the nations were angry, and THY WRATH IS COME, and the TIME OF THE DEAD, THAT THEY SHOULD BE JUDGED, and that thou shouldest GIVE REWARD unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth."


The Great throne...
chapter 20 "And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the EARTH AND the HEAVEN FLED AWAY; and there was found no place for them. 12And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the DEAD WERE JUDGED out of those things which were written in the books, according to THIER WORKS. 13And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged EVERY MAN according to THIER WORKSs. 14And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.'






To me, its 3 different visions of the same event.....notice they become clearer each time. its Just not a chronilogical system of events, all applying to a future happening in my own view but John seeing the events of all of creation. seeing things of Heaven and of earth shifting back and forth seeing things Like " the Lamb who was slain before creation" this being in Heaven before and then seeing Him come from Heaven bearing the express image of Gods glory and delivering the open covenant......some dont notice John is told to write things that are, and also things that will soon be. sometimes to explain to someone you have to tell the story, so the purpose is for future Hope and events but many events are not future but already were.

 

[JustWhoIAm]

"And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together"

Like a mushroom cloud?

 

[Ahwatukee]

No lol i wouldnt agree they are different events, im saying they are different perspectives. im saying the book of revelation is about what was at the time already, and what was to come. things in heaven, then manifesting on earth i think you missed my point, but again i think you are looking at it differently and thats ok i dont think alvation really depends on our understanding of revelation or anything, i do enjoy discussion tho.

im not really following alot of what you are saying who are you saying is part of the resurrection and thousand years reign?

and i think the different view is you look at it chronilogically, i see a recurring theme of events in Heaven, then causing events on earth. I see Jesus exalted first in Heaven after He is slain, taking the sealed book opening its seals and releasing judgements into the earth, spiritual Judgements that also rest on the same what Happens in the spiritual, happens in earth. were not going to actuall see a dragon thats the spirit of satan, or a beast with ten horns and blasphemies written on it, that is the beasts Kingdom, we wont see a lamb that speaks like a dragon, that is the spirit of false prophecy, the spirit of the dragon, who gives His authority the false prophet and those in his kingdom. its a mock Of God who is spirit, giving the authority to His Christ and those of His Kingdom. anyways, man at least we have different views to consider....

Good day followJesus,

I was thinking about it and think I see where you are coming from. Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe that you are linking the 6th seal as being the same event as the great white throne judgment of Rev.20:11-15 because both scriptures make reference to God sitting upon his throne.

If this is so, then I would remind you that, the reference to God sitting upon His throne is not unique to a specific event. By making the two events synonymous, you are ignoring the chronological order in which both events take place. For example, in Rev.5:1-8 we see that God the Father is sitting on the throne and is holding seven sealed scroll in His right hand. In the order of chronological events, this is neither taking place during the 6th seal nor the great white throne judgment. The Lamb/Jesus takes the scroll out of the Father's right hand prior to any of the seals being opened and over a thousand years prior to the GWTJ.

It is the same regarding the great white throne judgment. The reference to Rev.20:11-15 is of the great white throne judgment, which is not synonymous with the 6th seal. The GWTJ is not the same event of the 6th seal from a different perspective or otherwise, but are two completely separate events and take place at completely different times.

The 6th seal is a plague of wrath that is poured out upon the inhabitants of the earth, with the 7th seal, the trumpet judgments and bowl judgments to follow. And after those events of wrath, the thousand year reign of Christ must take place, then the GWTJ takes place after those.

The event of the 6th seal takes place on this current earth, where the GWTJ takes place in heaven, with this current heaven and earth passed away.

I'm just trying to get you to understand that the 6th seal and the great white throne judgment are two completely different events. I shouldn't even have to contend for this though, because scripture makes it very clear what the great white throne judgment is and when it takes place.

im not really following alot of what you are saying who are you saying is part of the resurrection and thousand years reign?

Forgive me but, how much study have you done in end-time events and the book of Revelation?

Regarding the resurrection, Jesus said, "I will build my church and gates of Hades shall not prevail against it." Currently, the church is still in the process of being built. Once the church is completed, then the fulfillment of John 14:1-3 and 1 Thes.4:13-17, 1 Cor.15:51-53 will take place, which is the gathering of the church, both the dead and living in Christ, where the entire group will be taken back to the Father's house to those dwelling places that Jesus went to prepare for all believers.

Following the event of the gathering of the church from the earth, the wrath of God will commence with the 1st seal being opened, which is representing that antichrist. He is the rider on the white horse. The rest of the seals will be opened, followed by the sounding of the trumpets and the pouring out of the bowls, with the 7th bowl ending bringing the wrath of God to an end.

Shorty after the 7th bowl judgment, the Lord returns to the earth to end the age and establish his millennial kingdom on this current earth. Those who are following the Lord out of heaven riding on white horses and wearing fine linen, white and clean, (Rev.19:14) will be those believers who will have previously been resurrected and were changed and caught up.

The thousand years (millennial kingdom) is listed in Rev.20:1-7.

I truly hope this gives you some understanding of the order of events

 

[Ahwatukee]

"And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together"

Like a mushroom cloud?

Hello JustWhoIam,

I have heard this possible interpretation before, but I am very confident that it is not describing a nuclear explosion. For if it was a nuclear explosion, the kings, the generals, the mighty and rich, would not be calling to the mountains and rocks to fall on them and hide them from "Him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb."

From the description in the context, "the sky rolling up like a scroll" it would appear that when this event takes place, the atmosphere is being pealed back, if you will, exposing the demension of the heavenly realm allowing the inhabitants of the earth to see God sitting on the throne, which is why they are calling to the mountains and the rocks to fall on them.

My point being that, the explosion of a nuclear device would not elicit their response in reference to God. It is because when the 6th seal takes place, they will actually be seeing God and that is what elicits their fear.

 

[Ahwatukee]

how about a third example to go with those 2?



the 6th seal ch 6 "And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; 13And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. 14And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. 15And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; 16And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: 17For the GREAT DAY OF HIS WRATH IS COME; and who shall be able to stand?"


THE 7TH trumpet....


Ch 11...."And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever. 16And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God, 17Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned. 18And the nations were angry, and THY WRATH IS COME, and the TIME OF THE DEAD, THAT THEY SHOULD BE JUDGED, and that thou shouldest GIVE REWARD unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth."


The Great throne...
chapter 20 "And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the EARTH AND the HEAVEN FLED AWAY; and there was found no place for them. 12And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the DEAD WERE JUDGED out of those things which were written in the books, according to THIER WORKS. 13And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged EVERY MAN according to THIER WORKSs. 14And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.'






To me, its 3 different visions of the same event.....notice they become clearer each time. its Just not a chronilogical system of events, all applying to a future happening in my own view but John seeing the events of all of creation. seeing things of Heaven and of earth shifting back and forth seeing things Like " the Lamb who was slain before creation" this being in Heaven before and then seeing Him come from Heaven bearing the express image of Gods glory and delivering the open covenant......some dont notice John is told to write things that are, and also things that will soon be. sometimes to explain to someone you have to tell the story, so the purpose is for future Hope and events but many events are not future but already were.

That's what I've been trying to get you to understand, none of them are regarding the same event.

 

[JustWhoIAm]

Hello JustWhoIam,

I have heard this possible interpretation before, but I am very confident that it is not describing a nuclear explosion. For if it was a nuclear explosion, the kings, the generals, the mighty and rich, would not be calling to the mountains and rocks to fall on them and hide them from "Him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb."

From the description in the context, "the sky rolling up like a scroll" it would appear that when this event takes place, the atmosphere is being pealed back, if you will, exposing the demension of the heavenly realm allowing the inhabitants of the earth to see God sitting on the throne, which is why they are calling to the mountains and the rocks to fall on them.

My point being that, the explosion of a nuclear device would not elicit their response in reference to God. It is because when the 6th seal takes place, they will actually be seeing God and that is what elicits their fear.

I think there might be a possibility that there are misinterpretations of the figures listed in the phrase "Him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb."

 

[Ahwatukee]

I think there might be a possibility that there are misinterpretations of the figures listed in the phrase "Him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb."

How so? Please explain