Why dio Christians belive that Jesus had to die?
- Thread starter Baruch
- Start date
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I have been through something similar with my two brothers and sister as in the story of Joseph; that we have the same name and the stories are similar in the core, only makes it more personal to me, in an allegorical manner. So asking me what I think may produce a rather limiting personal view of the story that may not be as objective as it would have been 4 years ago.
yes Jesus respected all the Holy convocations, and the Lords Passover
The three Gospels of Matthew, Mark and Luke show that on the night Jesus Christ
was betrayed, He and His disciples prepared and kept the Passover
(Matthew 26:18,Mark 14:12, 16; Luke 22:15)
The Jews, however, kept it 24 hours later (John 18:28). why?
Who kept the right day? could Jesus Christ have kept the Passover on the wrong day?
Jesus Christ indeed kept the right day and that it is the Jews who today keep Passover
on the wrong day.
Christ Instructed Keeping Passover on the start 14th,
and the feast night to be most remembered of U.l.b. on the start 15th.
The three Gospels of Matthew, Mark and Luke show that on the night Jesus Christ
was betrayed, He and His disciples prepared and kept the Passover
(Matthew 26:18,Mark 14:12, 16; Luke 22:15)
The Jews, however, kept it 24 hours later (John 18:28). why?
Who kept the right day? could Jesus Christ have kept the Passover on the wrong day?
Jesus Christ indeed kept the right day and that it is the Jews who today keep Passover
on the wrong day.
Christ Instructed Keeping Passover on the start 14th,
and the feast night to be most remembered of U.l.b. on the start 15th.
Yes and no when they bow to him it was only because everyone that go to the palace had to bow to him it wasn't a bow of respect. In the other hand when Judah stood against him not knowing that he is challenging the most important man in Egypt it was Joseph that back down and mentally really bow to Judah.
Sorry Judah did not know that he is challenging his own brother
Sorry Judah did not know that he is challenging his own brother
yes it is sad that God gave us his holydays, but the world follows mans traditions.
they where defiling the Sabbath day, still do to this day. but someday again- Isaiah 66:23
The second coming is in actuality a continuation of the first.
Luk 4:17 And there was delivered unto him the book of the prophet Esaias.
And when he had opened the book, he found the place where it was written,
Luk 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me
to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted,
to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind,
to set at liberty them that are bruised,
Luk 4:19 To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.
Luk 4:20 And he closed the book, and he gave it again to the minister, and sat down.
And the eyes of all them that were in the synagogue were fastened on him.
He stop reading just there, close the book, and sit down?
Isa 61:1 The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me
to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted,
to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound;
Isa 61:2 To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD,
And here is where He stopped reading in mid sentence.
Now the passage He quoted continues...
and [the day of vengeance] of our God; to comfort all that mourn;
Isa 61:3 To appoint unto them that mourn in Zion, to give unto them beauty
for ashes, the oil of joy for mourning, the garment of praise for the spirit of heaviness;
that they might be called trees of righteousness, the planting of the LORD,
that he might be glorified.
Isa 61:4 And they shall build the old wastes, they shall raise up the former desolations,
and they shall repair the waste cities, the desolations of many generations.
Isa 61:5 And strangers shall stand and feed your flocks, and the sons of the alien shall
be your plowmen and your vinedressers.
Isa 61:6 But ye shall be named the Priests of the LORD: men shall call you the Ministers
of our God: ye shall eat the riches of the Gentiles, and in their glory shall ye boast yourselves.
Isa 61:7 For your shame ye shall have double; and for confusion they shall rejoice in their
portion: therefore in their land they shall possess the double: everlasting joy shall be unto them.
He came the first time to complete Isa 61:1-2 but not all of verse 2.
When He returns, He will complete verse 2 and forward through verse 7.
-
Isaiah the prophet also speaks of this kingdom: “For unto us a child is born, unto us
a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder.… Of the increase of
his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon
his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice” (Isaiah 9:6-7).
-
When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou
at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel? And he said unto them, It is not for you
to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.
They thought the kingdom would be restored to them then, but God had other plains first.
The message God sent by Jesus Christ was the “gospel of the comming Kingdom of God.
The kingdoms discussed in Daniel 2:37-40 all ruled over people here on Earth.
In the dream, God’s Kingdom is represented by the stone that struck the image in its feet.
and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces
and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever.”
the Kingdom of God will be a literal government, just as the Roman Empire was ruling over
people. That Kingdom will be set up when Jesus Christ returns at the last trump (Rev 11:15).
they where defiling the Sabbath day, still do to this day. but someday again- Isaiah 66:23
The second coming is in actuality a continuation of the first.
Luk 4:17 And there was delivered unto him the book of the prophet Esaias.
And when he had opened the book, he found the place where it was written,
Luk 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me
to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted,
to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind,
to set at liberty them that are bruised,
Luk 4:19 To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.
Luk 4:20 And he closed the book, and he gave it again to the minister, and sat down.
And the eyes of all them that were in the synagogue were fastened on him.
He stop reading just there, close the book, and sit down?
Isa 61:1 The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me
to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted,
to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound;
Isa 61:2 To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD,
And here is where He stopped reading in mid sentence.
Now the passage He quoted continues...
and [the day of vengeance] of our God; to comfort all that mourn;
Isa 61:3 To appoint unto them that mourn in Zion, to give unto them beauty
for ashes, the oil of joy for mourning, the garment of praise for the spirit of heaviness;
that they might be called trees of righteousness, the planting of the LORD,
that he might be glorified.
Isa 61:4 And they shall build the old wastes, they shall raise up the former desolations,
and they shall repair the waste cities, the desolations of many generations.
Isa 61:5 And strangers shall stand and feed your flocks, and the sons of the alien shall
be your plowmen and your vinedressers.
Isa 61:6 But ye shall be named the Priests of the LORD: men shall call you the Ministers
of our God: ye shall eat the riches of the Gentiles, and in their glory shall ye boast yourselves.
Isa 61:7 For your shame ye shall have double; and for confusion they shall rejoice in their
portion: therefore in their land they shall possess the double: everlasting joy shall be unto them.
He came the first time to complete Isa 61:1-2 but not all of verse 2.
When He returns, He will complete verse 2 and forward through verse 7.
-
Isaiah the prophet also speaks of this kingdom: “For unto us a child is born, unto us
a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder.… Of the increase of
his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon
his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice” (Isaiah 9:6-7).
-
When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou
at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel? And he said unto them, It is not for you
to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.
They thought the kingdom would be restored to them then, but God had other plains first.
The message God sent by Jesus Christ was the “gospel of the comming Kingdom of God.
The kingdoms discussed in Daniel 2:37-40 all ruled over people here on Earth.
In the dream, God’s Kingdom is represented by the stone that struck the image in its feet.
and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces
and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever.”
the Kingdom of God will be a literal government, just as the Roman Empire was ruling over
people. That Kingdom will be set up when Jesus Christ returns at the last trump (Rev 11:15).
It was then that Joseph revealed himself. Joseph was in control the whole time.
Judah was only speaking because he was the oldest.
Besides that, the only other significant part Judah had in the story was him being the ring leader in wanting to kill Joseph.
Thank God that Reuben protested, of they would have all had the blood of their brother on their hands as did Cain.
Judah was only speaking because he was the oldest.
Besides that, the only other significant part Judah had in the story was him being the ring leader in wanting to kill Joseph.
Thank God that Reuben protested, of they would have all had the blood of their brother on their hands as did Cain.
Jesus had been born in a Jewish colony that was subordinate to the Roman Empire.
“He came unto his own,” it says in John 1:11, “and his own received him not.”
The Jews rejected Jesus and so He turned to the Gentiles instead, [some assume].
But he didn’t! Notice what Jesus said to a Gentile woman in Matthew 15:24:
“I was not sent except to the lost sheep of the house of Israel”
Jesus said His mission was to reach the house of Israel (not the house of Judah)
and that Israel’s identity (obviously not Judah’s) had become lost.
The Jews did not lose there idenifing mark the Sabbaths, but Isreal had.
Christ’s life was cut short soon after He made that statement—was that mission fulfilled?
Matthew 10:5-6. In that account, Jesus commanded His disciples not to preach the gospel
in Gentile regions (Paul would take care of that—see Acts 18:6), but to go instead to
the “lost sheep” of the house of Israel.
In Jesus’s stead, all the original apostles were sent to the lost sheep of Israel.
This is why, after Acts 11, you read very little about the original 12.
Once they went to the lost sheep of Israel, history lost sight of them.
The Apostle James introduced his epistle: “James, a servant of God and of the
Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.”
James didn’t even address the Gentiles. Nor is his letter exclusively directed at
the house of Judah. His target audience was primarily the tribes of Israel that had
been “scattered abroad” during their Assyrian captivity eight centuries earlier!
God could have easily inspired James to include more details about the whereabouts
of the lost sheep. But maybe He didn’t want their identity revealed yet. So the book
of James ends without any closing salutations about the people he was writing to.
It’s one of just three New Testament books (the others are Acts and 3 John)
that abruptly finishes without so much as an “Amen”!
-
Afterward shall the children of Israel return, and seek the Lord their God,
and David their king; and shall fear the Lord and his goodness in the latter days.
“He came unto his own,” it says in John 1:11, “and his own received him not.”
The Jews rejected Jesus and so He turned to the Gentiles instead, [some assume].
But he didn’t! Notice what Jesus said to a Gentile woman in Matthew 15:24:
“I was not sent except to the lost sheep of the house of Israel”
Jesus said His mission was to reach the house of Israel (not the house of Judah)
and that Israel’s identity (obviously not Judah’s) had become lost.
The Jews did not lose there idenifing mark the Sabbaths, but Isreal had.
Christ’s life was cut short soon after He made that statement—was that mission fulfilled?
Matthew 10:5-6. In that account, Jesus commanded His disciples not to preach the gospel
in Gentile regions (Paul would take care of that—see Acts 18:6), but to go instead to
the “lost sheep” of the house of Israel.
In Jesus’s stead, all the original apostles were sent to the lost sheep of Israel.
This is why, after Acts 11, you read very little about the original 12.
Once they went to the lost sheep of Israel, history lost sight of them.
The Apostle James introduced his epistle: “James, a servant of God and of the
Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.”
James didn’t even address the Gentiles. Nor is his letter exclusively directed at
the house of Judah. His target audience was primarily the tribes of Israel that had
been “scattered abroad” during their Assyrian captivity eight centuries earlier!
God could have easily inspired James to include more details about the whereabouts
of the lost sheep. But maybe He didn’t want their identity revealed yet. So the book
of James ends without any closing salutations about the people he was writing to.
It’s one of just three New Testament books (the others are Acts and 3 John)
that abruptly finishes without so much as an “Amen”!
-
Afterward shall the children of Israel return, and seek the Lord their God,
and David their king; and shall fear the Lord and his goodness in the latter days.
[h=3]1 John 3:8 (KJV)[/h]
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning.
For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
Yes, Judah was taking a chance here, considering the times. But you also need to realize the guilt Judah had. He had already killed his brother Joseph, or so he thought. He saw that broke his fathers heart. Now Benjamin too? Again, Judah was the designated speaker here. He HAD to speak up on account of his father and brother. I am sure that if he could have, he would have asked another brother to speak, but he would have lost respect if he did.
So Judah was no hero. He was doing damage control, and reluctantly at that.
The best thing I can say here about Judah is that maybe he grew a conscience after all that time.
So Judah was no hero. He was doing damage control, and reluctantly at that.
The best thing I can say here about Judah is that maybe he grew a conscience after all that time.
Reuben was the oldest and Reuben was the real leader of that group. Joseph was losing control if he kept Benjamin it would of killed his own father and it would of killed Judah too.
Notice that Reuben was able to control his own brother to prevent them from killing Joseph. What do you think was Reuben's plan for Joseph?
Notice that Reuben was able to control his own brother to prevent them from killing Joseph. What do you think was Reuben's plan for Joseph?
You know your right, Reuben was the oldest. But Reuben was not the leader when it came to wanting to kill Joseph. Judah was.
And again, Judah was probably overcome with guilt. After all, it was at his urging to kill Joseph.
And like all sons, no matter what age, he probably was
A) not wanting to see his dad broken hearted again after what happened to Joseph
B) maybe was scared his dad was going to kill him if they came back empty handed.
He was no hero. None of them are in this story. The best thing one can say about Judah is that he had developed into a better man then he was.
But that does not make him a hero.
And again, Judah was probably overcome with guilt. After all, it was at his urging to kill Joseph.
And like all sons, no matter what age, he probably was
A) not wanting to see his dad broken hearted again after what happened to Joseph
B) maybe was scared his dad was going to kill him if they came back empty handed.
He was no hero. None of them are in this story. The best thing one can say about Judah is that he had developed into a better man then he was.
But that does not make him a hero.