Veganism: Moral Superiority?

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Tommy379

Notorious Member
Jan 12, 2016
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Personally, I would rather not eat meat if I could. I agree with Megiddo...it wasn't mean't to be in the beginning.

What I see as an animal lover, and that is all animals..is that they all have personalities and can relate to us in some way if we take the time to look.

And I doubt we eat meat in heaven. That's ok with me. If we do? I hope its from trees.
Animals don't have personalities. Studies have been done on dogs, all they are doing is mimicking the person in front of them. You can google it.
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
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Animals don't have personalities. Studies have been done on dogs, all they are doing is mimicking the person in front of them. You can google it.
Everybody who had some animal (cat, dog, horse etc) will tell you they have personalities.

Every creature is mimicking, human children too. Thats not against personality.
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
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Personally, I would rather not eat meat if I could. I agree with Megiddo...it wasn't mean't to be in the beginning.

What I see as an animal lover, and that is all animals..is that they all have personalities and can relate to us in some way if we take the time to look.

And I doubt we eat meat in heaven. That's ok with me. If we do? I hope its from trees.
Can you explain to me how it was meant in the beginning?

If animals were not to die ever and they were also meant to multiply?
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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Animals don't have personalities. Studies have been done on dogs, all they are doing is mimicking the person in front of them. You can google it.
You don't have pets do you?
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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Can you explain to me how it was meant in the beginning?

If animals were not to die ever and they were also meant to multiply?
I don't know trofimus. I just know what Genesis says.
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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Rom 8:18  For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed to us.
 

Rom 8:19  For the creation is eagerly awaiting the revelation of God's children, 


Rom 8:20  because the creation has become subject to futility, though not by anything it did. The one who subjected it did so in the certainty
 

Rom 8:21  that the creation itself would also be set free from corrupting bondage in order to share the glorious freedom of God's children. 


Rom 8:22  For we know that all the rest of creation has been groaning with the pains of childbirth up to the present time. 


Rom 8:23  However, not only the creation, but we who have the first fruits of the Spirit also groan inwardly as we eagerly await our adoption, the redemption of our bodies. 

What do you think about these scriptures trofimus?




 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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On the Ark the animals ate the same things stored by Noah. Didn't Megiddo already speak of this?
 
May 12, 2017
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On the Ark the animals ate the same things stored by Noah. Didn't Megiddo already speak of this?
It is quite evident we are discussing things with Theistic Evolutionists and/or secular humanist's on the history of the world.
 

Tommy379

Notorious Member
Jan 12, 2016
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You don't have pets do you?
I have a cat, keeps mice and snakes away. Has a purpose. I had a dog as a child. It kept me company, but I know it was just an animal and not a person.
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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I have a cat, keeps mice and snakes away. Has a purpose. I had a dog as a child. It kept me company, but I know it was just an animal and not a person.
Having a personality doesn't mean they are persons. And I've found that the mindset of "just an animal" will sometimes be cruel to animals.

Hence the living conditions of animals for marketing only. Farmers who are honest in heart care for those that are his.
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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It is quite evident we are discussing things with Theistic Evolutionists and/or secular humanist's on the history of the world.
Not sure what those big words mean...lol

But, lack of vision...lack of spiritual knowledge maybe?
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
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It is quite evident we are discussing things with Theistic Evolutionists and/or secular humanist's on the history of the world.
You cannot avoid obvious problems with your theories just by giving names to your opponents.
 
May 12, 2017
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You cannot avoid obvious problems with your theories just by giving names to your opponents.
Sure I can! You do it all the time with people who do not believe in your TULIP reformed Calvinist theology.

I do not view you as an opponent at all. I am not about to get into hours long of silly debates that will not change the mind of either side.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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I do not think they would be allowed to eat eggs of other creatures in the thinking of young Earth proponents... and vegetarians do eat eggs, right? So probably something between those two terms :)

The Bible actually does not state that the first animals or people were not eating meat.

"Now Abel was a keeper of sheep, but Cain was a tiller of the ground.
And in the process of time it came to pass that Cain brought an offering of the fruit of the ground to the Lord.
Abel also brought of the firstborn of his flock and of their fat.
And the Lord respected Abel and his offering."


Also notice that Noah took into ark both clean and unclean animals. This distinction is made because of diet.
Vegans eat nothing of animals (beyond the prohibition against meat, hence no eggs, dairy, honey etc) nor even use any product that has any animal ingredient, for instance jello, because jello has gelatin which comes from hoof. Vegetarians however allow themselves to eat any food that is not meat, even that which would eventually become meat, such as eggs.

You say the Bible does not state that animals or people were not eating meat, but neither does it state that they were, and that is important, because what actually is stated and has been repeated over and over again is the fact that only vegetation was given to all creatures as food until after the flood. Both man and animals were vegetarians originally, and both will be vegetarians ultimately.

"God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat. And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to every thing that creepeth upon the earth, wherein there is life, I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so." (See Genesis 1:29-30) Notice that this food itself is called meat, even though it is not from animals :)

The distinction made between clean and unclean animals must be more than diet, because all scaled and finned fish are acceptable as food, and yet they are carnivores that eat unclean animals. Diet may be a large factor, though. Do you have any Scriptures that elucidate the reason for distinction beyond cud chewing and split hoof?

Here is a list of clean and unclean foods :D

https://www.ucg.org/bible-study-too...out-clean-and-unclean-meats/infographic-which
 
Dec 3, 2016
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They all tell slightly different versions of the same history.
Check it out, it's fascinating.
Why??? Who wants to open the door to the devil to start tempting one's self to consider other religions and satan muddies the waters leading the masses into the ecumenical movement where everyone believes we all serve the same god and there are many ways unto salvation?

Why not just start off with and stay with the truth in God's Word that Jesus is the only Way unto Salvation and all else is garbage???





God did not create animals to be used for food at first, he released that after the flood.
God never changes, so if He "released" that after the flood then it was His plan all along.

Jesus ate fish, so we know eating animals is not a sin.

Plus... did anyone post this yet???

1 Timothy 4:14
Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:





shall all return to non meat diets in the world to come
Got scripture for that?



And I doubt we eat meat in heaven. That's ok with me. If we do? I hope its from trees
I went out and checked... none of the trees in my yard have any meat on them...
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
10,684
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Sure I can! You do it all the time with people who do not believe in your TULIP reformed Calvinist theology.

I do not view you as an opponent at all. I am not about to get into hours long of silly debates that will not change the mind of either side.
No,you cant :)

There are serious flaws in your position and this is a discussion forum... so if you are so tired of "silly debates", its better to not get involved at all.