the ten commandments

crossnote · Oct 12, 2017

I never said anything about ‘magically happening’. I was referring to the new birth, where we are given a new nature...His nature.
Sure, there is the ongoing warfare with the flesh, satan and the world but that does not preclude the fact that God’s moral laws/nature are written on our hearts as born again believers...even as babes in the Lord.

followjesus · Oct 13, 2017

crossnote said:

naw i wasnt meaning to say you were saying it lol

that new nature we receive <<<< that comes through believing Jesus and His Gospel. Our Minds are shaped By the Gospel, the teachings Of Jesus Christ. thats where our righteousness comes from, the tangible righteousness that people talk of being " Imputed" that happens through Gods Word. because we Believe in the One who is Lord, the One who said the things He said, faith works in us as His word is accepted. it shaoes our thinking, Our conscience, Our Heart, the new nature is that of a child of God, that Comes through accepting the Knowledge of Gods Son. its the doctrine of God.

it happens because Jesus is teaching the spoiritual things, he teaches to rid our Lives of the inner issues Like Lust, pride, vengance, Jealousy.....Our new nature comes from this spiritual design of His ministry. it is the circumcision of the Heart promised for so Long on the Ot. How do sinners change? Jesus changes thier Hearts and thinking, thier perception, thier inner workings, are re made into His image through His word, thats why He constantly talked of keeping His words, His teachings, His sayings, doing them, abiding in them, Learning them.....thats what changes us in reality so that our actions change by the same power that Created all things....Gods Word.

followjesus · Oct 13, 2017

beta said:

yes if only man could learn the truth that what God teaches man to do, is Life, and the things He teaches man to not do, is death.

If we understood God Loves us and His word is not opposed to us, it is there to Heal and teach and change us where we need changes, to lead and guide us, instruct and prepare us, train us to be as God would have us be to One another.

followjesus · Oct 13, 2017

beta said:

amen all of the Bible comes from Israels Line. all of the covenants were made with Jewish People, Our messiah was Born a Jew, all the apostles were Jews......the truth is that all of Gods covenants come through Israel, to all people of the earth. so much in the prophets would Help this subject so many repetitious truths spoken forward about How God was sending the messiah to all people gentile and Jew alike things like this

isaiah 49 "And now, saith the LORD that formed me from the womb to be his servant, to bring Jacob again to him, Though Israel be not gathered, yet shall I be glorious in the eyes of the LORD, and my God shall be my strength.
6And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth.
7Thus saith the LORD, the Redeemer of Israel, and his Holy One, to him whom man despiseth, to him whom the nation abhorreth, to a servant of rulers, Kings shall see and arise, princes also shall worship, because of the LORD that is faithful, and the Holy One of Israel, and he shall choose thee."

and like this

psalm 2 "Yet have I set my king upon my holy hill of Zion.7I will declare the decree: the LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee.
8Ask of me, and I shall give thee the heathen for thine inheritance, and the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession.9Thou shalt break them with a rod of iron; thou shalt dash them in pieces like a potter's vessel.10Be wise now therefore, O ye kings: be instructed, ye judges of the earth.11Serve the LORD with fear, and rejoice with trembling.12Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put their trust in him."

and again

isaiah 11" They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the LORD, as the waters cover the sea.10And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious."

Gods Plan was always to reach out to all people, its Just that His plan was to reach out through Israel to all the earth, He does this through Jesus, the seed of Promise who would bless the earth and all peoples. The Law though Guiven to Israel, still applies to Gods People Now, its only that Now His people have the Spirit of Holiness to teach, Lead , comfort and guide them. and those People are Now Not trying to reach to God through the Law....they understand that God reached to them, through Jesus Christ, and the ways of God are good, right, true, dependable, fruitful, just and pleasing to God.

He taught us How to Live and treat each other, How to Behave and not cause issues for others, How to help with a glad Heart those who need Help......the Law teaches brotherly Love as well, its Just veiled By the curse aspect of it for sinners, that is the part Jesus took away, the Curse because He takes away the sinner in us and replaces it with new Life.

followjesus · Oct 13, 2017

hornetguy said:

If we, as believers, will do our best to follow the "two greatest commands" given to us by Jesus, we have NO NEED for the 10 commandments. None. "

this i have to disagree with completely, you are saying on one hand " believers need to follow the two greatest commands"

One is Love God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength"

the Other is Like it, Love thy Neighbor as thyself"

and at the same time you are saying, the commandments have zero to do with it? Love thy Neighboe is not a replacement for the Law it is a summary statement of what the Law is.

you see you are missing that Jesus asks Him " How do you interpret the Law?" and He answers " Love the Lord...and Love thy neighbor"...Jesus says He answered correctly. the man learned what He learned from the commandments and the entire Law. His interpretation of the Law, was to Love God above all and Love thy neighbor as thyself" Love doesnt exist without the commandments. its not Love if a person is Killing another, or a husband is commiting adultery , or if im stealing from you, even if i say i love you bro...im not actually Loving you.

you say Love God with all you have in you"

The Bible says

1 john 5:2-3 "By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.3For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous."

Love cant be seperated from the commandments, to say " Just Love God with all your Heart, mind, soul and sstrength, and Love your neighbor as yourself" that is Just a brief way to say Obey God and Keep His commandments. its a summary thats why paul identifies several of the ten commandments in the examople He is using. the Law is an outline of what real Love is, it treats others right, thats what most of the Law teaches people to do, How to treat other poeople is the main focus of the Moisaic Law.

when a person ois treating People Like God says tio treat them, at that Point a person themselves may no Longer need to study the Law and Learn and grow, but the More you learn the More becomes evident, you arent quite complete Yet and Need to continue moving forward in the things of God. the Law is an excellent tutor and the commandments are so very valuable to even a life time christian who may think they have it all worked out.

if we Love each other, we will not steal, Lie, cheat, leave in need, commit adultery, bear false witness ,,,and if we Love God, we will certainly Have no gods before Him.....the commandments and Love =go together Like a blueprint and a House

hornetguy · Oct 13, 2017

And that is the whole point.

It almost sounds as if you believe that without the OT, nobody can be saved? If I met a person that knew NOTHING about God, or His plan for us, and I taught them strictly from the NT, including the two greatest commandments, they would need nothing else.

I'm not saying there is no value in reading and understanding the 10, I'm simply saying (much like Jesus did) that ALL of those old laws and commandments are wrapped up in, and covered by, the two greatest commandments he gave us. And that if a person lives their life by those two commandments, they don't NEED to hear "you shall not kill" etc....

That's the reason we were told that the law would be written in our hearts, and not on stone tablets.

beta · Oct 13, 2017

hornetguy said:

But HOW would you know 'in detail' HOW to love God and neighbour if all you have are the 2 greatest Commands with no explanation ?
All a natural man has to go by is 'human love' which is basically selfish and unloving toward others....from whence come wars and fighting among us Jas 4.
ALL scripture is given to work together for our good...even the 10 Commandments !

hornetguy · Oct 13, 2017

beta said:

The 10 commandments certainly don't define love. They define behavior. What's acceptable, and what is not.

Even if all we had to go on was "natural love" (which I disagree with, by the way)... Jesus didn't tell us to just love each other. He told us to love each other just like we love ourselves.

And he told us to love God with all our heart... that transcends "natural love", and takes the "selfish" out of it.

Huge difference.

And, I think you must have come to the conclusion that I want to throw away parts of the OT.... I do not. I believe that verse that says that all scripture is profitable.... I just disagree with using the 10 Commandments as our defining list. They have been superseded.... improved.... fulfilled. Jesus didn't come to abolish it, he came to fulfill it.

Studyman · Oct 13, 2017

hornetguy said:

But isn't God's Commandments HIS Love? I mean, what better way to show His Love than to give His creation His Perfect instruction?

1 John 5:2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

But this very thought is taught against in this very thread. Not only does Mainstream Christianity preach that God's Laws are grievous, but that they are "against" us and that Jesus nailed His "LOVE" to the cross.

What spirit would want us to reject God's Love? Could this be part of the reason Jesus warned about taking heed we are not deceived by those who come in His name?

Food for thought

hornetguy · Oct 13, 2017

Studyman said:

I don't know anyone that teaches we don't have to obey Jesus' commandments.

We are simply not bound to obey the OT Mosaic covenant laws.

If we are supposed to keep observing them, why did Jesus come in the first place? He came to set us FREE from the old law. He gave us new laws, or commandments, which are much more all-encompassing than the Mosaic laws.

Magenta · Oct 13, 2017

hornetguy said:

I don't know anyone that teaches we don't have to obey Jesus' commandments.

We are simply not bound to obey the OT Mosaic covenant laws.

If we are supposed to keep observing them, why did Jesus come in the first place? He came to set us FREE from the old law. He gave us new laws, or commandments, which are much more all-encompassing than the Mosaic laws.

He also gave us a new and better covenant

Studyman · Oct 13, 2017

hornetguy said:

That is Mainstream Christian preaching in a nutshell. That Jesus "freed us from God's Laws". But the Scriptures teach a different doctrine. The scriptures teach Jesus freed us from death that disobedience and rebellion caused. Jesus said why He came.

Matt. 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

And why were they lost?

Is. 56:10 His watchmen are blind: they are all ignorant, they are all dumb dogs, they cannot bark; sleeping, lying down, loving to slumber.

Jer. 50:6 My people hath been lost sheep: their shepherds have caused them to go astray, they have turned them away on the mountains: they have gone from mountain to hill, they have forgotten their resting place.

These Shepherds are the Pharisees who "Taught for doctrines the Commandments of Men". They led God's people astray by teaching them doctrines and traditions of men, not of God.

Jesus came to expose their Mainstream Church leaders as "false shepherds" and to teach us the right way to walk.

The teaching that Jesus came to free you from God's Righteousness is a false teaching. Jesus warned us about this over and over.Jesus didn't teach new Commandments. He taught the same thing all the prophets taught. The only thing that has changed is the way in which sins are forgiven. The Old Covenant had the Levitical Priesthood ceremonial, sacrificial "Works or Deeds of the Law" for remission and justification of sins. Now it is by Grace through faith in the Jesus of the Bible that we are forgiven. The definition of sin has not changed. We are freed from death and deception if we repent and bring "Works" worthy of repentance as the scriptures teach.

We are not freed from God's righteous judgments and Commandments.

I know this is the universal church preaching. I am hoping to show that as prophesied by Jesus Himself, this teaching is false. I understand this is not a popular message and I fully expect most to reject. It is my sincere hope that you will at least consider that maybe Jesus knew what He was talking about when he warned us to "Take Heed".

Matt. 24:4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.5
For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

I don't believe satan tries to deceive people into obeying God's Commandments. Remember what Jesus said:

Luke 16:29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.

30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.

31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

hornetguy · Oct 13, 2017

Really? Then why did he give us all these clarifications, with NEW standards of behavior?

According to you, all we have to do is not physically murder someone, and we're righteous.
According to you, all we have to do is refrain from the physical act of adultery, and we're righteous.
According to you, we can make all kinds of vows, swearing on our mother's grave, no problem.

NONE of that is true, according to Jesus.

[SUP]21 [/SUP]“You have heard that [SUP][k][/SUP]the ancients were told, ‘You shall not commit murder’ and ‘Whoever commits murder shall be [SUP][l][/SUP]liable to the court.’ [SUP]22 [/SUP]But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother shall be [SUP][m][/SUP]guilty before the court; and whoever says to his brother, ‘[SUP][n][/SUP]You good-for-nothing,’ shall be [SUP][o][/SUP]guilty before [SUP][p][/SUP]the supreme court; and whoever says, ‘You fool,’ shall be [SUP][q][/SUP]guilty enough to go into the [SUP][r][/SUP]fiery hell. [SUP]23 [/SUP]Therefore if you are presenting your [SUP][s][/SUP]offering at the altar, and there remember that your brother has something against you, [SUP]24 [/SUP]leave your [SUP][t][/SUP]offering there before the altar and go; first be reconciled to your brother, and then come and present your [SUP][u][/SUP]offering. [SUP]25 [/SUP]Make friends quickly with your opponent at law while you are with him on the way, so that your opponent may not hand you over to the judge, and the judge to the officer, and you be thrown into prison. [SUP]26 [/SUP]Truly I say to you, you will not come out of there until you have paid up the last [SUP][v][/SUP]cent.
[SUP]27 [/SUP]“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery’; [SUP]28 [/SUP]but I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart. [SUP]29 [/SUP]If your right eye makes you [SUP][w][/SUP]stumble, tear it out and throw it from you; for it is better for you [SUP][x][/SUP]to lose one of the parts of your body, [SUP][y][/SUP]than for your whole body to be thrown into [SUP][z][/SUP]hell. [SUP]30 [/SUP]If your right hand makes you [SUP][aa][/SUP]stumble, cut it off and throw it from you; for it is better for you [SUP][ab][/SUP]to lose one of the parts of your body, [SUP][ac][/SUP]than for your whole body to go into [SUP][ad][/SUP]hell.
[SUP]31 [/SUP]“It was said, ‘Whoever sends his wife away, let him give her a certificate of divorce’; [SUP]32 [/SUP]but I say to you that everyone who [SUP][ae][/SUP]divorces his wife, except for the reason of unchastity, makes her commit adultery; and whoever marries a [SUP][af][/SUP]divorced woman commits adultery.
[SUP]33 [/SUP]“Again, you have heard that [SUP][ag][/SUP]the ancients were told, ‘[SUP][ah][/SUP]You shall not [SUP][ai][/SUP]make false vows, but shall fulfill your [SUP][aj][/SUP]vows to the Lord.’ [SUP]34 [/SUP]But I say to you, make no oath at all, either by heaven, for it is the throne of God, [SUP]35 [/SUP]or by the earth, for it is the footstool of His feet, or [SUP][ak][/SUP]by Jerusalem, for it is the city of the great King. [SUP]36 [/SUP]Nor shall you make an oath by your head, for you cannot make one hair white or black. [SUP]37 [/SUP]But let your statement be, ‘Yes, yes’ or ‘No, no’; anything beyond these is [SUP][al][/SUP]of evil.
[SUP]38 [/SUP]“You have heard that it was said, ‘An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth.’ [SUP]39 [/SUP]But I say to you, do not resist an evil person; but whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also. [SUP]40 [/SUP]If anyone wants to sue you and take your [SUP][am][/SUP]shirt, let him have your [SUP][an][/SUP]coat also. [SUP]41 [/SUP]Whoever [SUP][ao][/SUP]forces you to go one mile, go with him two. [SUP]42 [/SUP]Give to him who asks of you, and do not turn away from him who wants to borrow from you.
[SUP]43 [/SUP]“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ [SUP]44 [/SUP]But I say to you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, [SUP]45 [/SUP]so that you may [SUP][ap][/SUP]be sons of your Father who is in heaven; for He causes His sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. [SUP]46 [/SUP]For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? [SUP]47 [/SUP]If you greet only your brothers, what more are you doing than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same? [SUP]48 [/SUP]Therefore [SUP][aq][/SUP]you are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.

followjesus · Oct 13, 2017

hornetguy said:

It almost sounds as if you believe that without the OT, nobody can be saved?"

correct that is what Im saying, yet, do yu Not understand that the Law is part of mans conscience and nature to begin with? because Man was made in Gods Image? the righteousness or morality of the Law in the beginning didnt need to be written down and read aloud and Heard, because Man was mae in the Image of God, His nature of holiness, was the nature of Man, that is the whole Point of it all, its why man needs salvation, its what we need salvation from. many will tell you " Im saved" yet have never even come to the truth of what they need salvation from. or that they indeed are a sinner and under sentance of death according to the Law of Moses.

until a person grasps that they are in danger, why would they Listen to thier need for a savior? savior from what? what is salvation to you my friend? what is it that man is saved from, redeemed from, restored unto? in the beginning the Law was already "written" on mans Heart. then deception came and changed mans perception of Gods Word that is good, that is actually there to protect man from evil. after the deception satan had twisted adams Mind, to see Gods Word, as Untrue, doubtful, questionable and even oppressive and restrictive of good things to man.

thats also part of the result you see in the immediate change in adams relationship with God, as soon as they realize thier shame and nakedness, adam says " I heard you in the Garden and I was afraid, because I was Naked, so I hid from you"

that shows that the change is clearly mans perception of Gods Word, Gods Voice and presence Had changed from One who was blessed and given all things By His Loving creator Instructed as a parent would a child, warning of danger....to a man who hears God coming Near, is afraid and Hides from Him...thats what sin causes us to do. thats what the Power of a clear conscience strengthens us in, its why we confess and repent to clear Our conscience of the sin we are aware we have commited, because a guilty conscience doesnt allow One to remain in Gods Presence.

its Why the Law appears so strict and anyeilding to a sinner, because when you really look at what Godly Morals are, you instantly by nature see your shortcomings, your sin and when you see that, you understand that Jesus came to call sinners, to repentance, and why you even need a savior to begin with. the Law and its Morality is part of mankind

romans 2 "For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law; 13(For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified. 14For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:15Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another 16In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel."

romans 3 "What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin; <<< if all are under sin, all are under Law, because without the Law sin doesnt come into account10As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:11There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God."

v20 "Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

the Law is in all man, it is what we call the conscience, after we became sinners according to the Law, the Law appeared as a witness against us, a testimony of Our Guilt before God. both the example of the Mosaic Law, and the Inner law of conscience, and Morality. the Law of Moses Has been preached in all nations on earth, do you think that is coincidental? or a Necassary part of Gods Plan so that all can be Judged, and all can Be redeemed and released from that Judgement and therefore Have a Savior and Lord whom we Love in truth seing Gods true Love for us.

so yes the Law is necassary, is still necassary. not that every believer has to Know every detail in order to " Be saved" but what Happens is that it gives deeper undrstanding of what the New covenant really means for mankind, rather than Just saying " Jesus died for my sins Im saved" for our Lifetime, were Meant to grow in the Knowledge of God, and that is found in the Law as Much as anywhere, and that Knowledge when believed shapes the Conscience through the teachings of Jesus Christ, so the Law is not everything by any Means, and equally, the Law is not abolished, or of no value or use the apostles made this clear in thier writings though we arr not Judged By the Law, it is of immense value for Learning, reproach, correction, training in righteousness ect...

Man Has made " righteousness" just something we believe, rather than what it really is which is something we do. it is a gift through Faith in Gods Word, through Belieiving what He is preaching to mankind and always Has been. " Im God, Im for yu, trust My Word if I say it will kill you...it will. if I say do whats Right, do whats right......there is a teaching aspect to the Bible that really gets Left out alot these days, because we make it a theology rather than a way of Life, which is what the Bible clearly teaches christianity is, a Life of following the ways taught by The Lord Jesus.

sure there is the crucifixion and resurrection many other things necassary to salvation, Gods Teachings of what to do, and what Not to do, will always Be and Have always been of utmost importance and Value to His people. its not a good argument when the Position is the lack of Value to the Law of God, God didnt change, Mankind changed from His image to sinners with ciorrupt Hearts and Natures. thats why the Law seems oppressive because Man fell from the Grace of Gods Image because of sin.

His character will never change, the Gospel is sent to change those who realize they Have fallen and need saving, and the Life is found that Leads to a Love and natural affection for Gods Ways Having His Spirit. simply by the beginning Kowledge ...If God says something importantto man, such as an instruction, it is rather important to believe what Has Been said, take it to Heart and keep it in Mind and Heart. Because its All meant to redeem us from Our fallen Image and result in

ephesians 4 Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart: 19Who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanness with greediness.20But ye have not so learned Christ; 21If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus:

22That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;

23And be renewed in the spirit of your mind; 24And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness."

we were Gods Image, through sin we were fallen to Mortality and sinful rebellion, Jesus Has come to restore Our Life through restoring the Image of God in us, righteousness, truthfulness, godly, upright, Hinest, trustworthy to make children who have the thoughts and attitudes of His Son Jesus.

thats the whole idea the gospel is the renewing of the spirit of Our Mind, it teaches us to think His Way, Learn His values and principles, to follow in the steps of Our teacher because we are desciples......its all relevant and necassary its the reason both the Law and prophets were preached n the earth and the Gospel is preached in the earth afterward. to undo what satan did to mans mind, and God does that Like people do it. to correct false information...you send the true Information.

dcontroversal · Oct 13, 2017

All the LAW and prophets are condensed into 2........and then to 1

Love God
Love your neighbor

Love your neighbor

followjesus · Oct 13, 2017

hornetguy said:

Really? Then why did he give us all these clarifications, with NEW standards of behavior?

According to you, all we have to do is not physically murder someone, and we're righteous. <<< that is very incorrect to anyone who knows the Law.

according to the Law No One is righteous, it was never intended to make someone righteous, it is to show man what we have fallen from, its a picture of what mans nature is meant to be. we should all have the ten commandments inscribed as basic limits of Human behavior, but never is anyone declared righteous because they simply werent a Murderer, according to the Law if you have broken One commandment of the Many, you are guilty, the Law was never meant to save, or delcare anyone righteous. you are not seeing the purpose of the Law, you are looking at it Like the Law came first, it didnt man made in Gods Image came first. then we fell through sin and became what is seen in genesis 6, and elsewhere in the prophets " the deceitfulnes of Mens heart and imaginations" a great evil caused by deception.

the Law was a response to fallen sinful man, it was Meant to reveal right and wrong, what man should desire and what we are meant to do......and also show us evil, what man is tempted By, and what comes from the will of satan, it shows us sin. its not 2 seperate plans the first failed, so then God made up a new Plan, the fall of man, rewuired man to be made aware of His fall what we were and what we had become. in order to ever Be restored to the Image of the Son of God. to a Place where we actually arent under the Law, because we repent of Our sins and walk in the right things...we do what cain didnt do, what adam didnt do we Hear Gods Word of instruction, and trust that He is speaking the truth and it is meant to Help and save us.

the Law is where the promise of the Gospel begins it was always Meant to prepare the World for a savior, Jesus was always Meant to Be the savior and Messiah, even before His birth, even Before the Law was given Gods Plan was to reveal Mans sin and need for salvation through the Law, and then to offer salvation to all mankind through the Gospel. God Plan is ultimately to exalt Jesus Christ Our Lord and redeem Mankind through Him alone.

there is nothing that will ever make the Law wrong it will never be right to steal, Kill, lie, cheat....it seems simple really the Law is a good thing even in society. the thieves dont Like or want the Law that says its a crime to steal and you will be punished according to the Law." ...but the hard working People who never steal from others, they are glad to have a Law that protects thier belongings from thieves.

Murderers dont Like the Law that says Killing another person is a crime and you will be punished accordingly" but the people who dont Harm others, dont want to Kill or have thier Loved Ones Killed...they actually appreciate and endorse the Law. thats the same thing with Christians. Im Glad there is a Law of Morality, a standard of right and Wrong to learn, thankful that God offers So Much of His wisdom and His ways in His Word. so glad He teaches us and doesnt leave us ignorant or struggling for correct information. all sufficient, even in the matters we dont Like to adress because of Our own sin, His word is all sufficient to heal the sinners and raise up children who are free to walk in His Ways.

followjesus · Oct 13, 2017

dcontroversal said:

Not at all condensed, but summarized, into a phrase that includes all of it.

romans 13 "Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.9For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 10Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law."

are you saying that Love thy neighbor replaces the Law??? or is it a summary to briefly comprehend the Law ? Paul specifically names 5 of the ten commandments and says " and if there be any other commandment it is breifly comprehended in this saying " Love thy neighbor as thyself" for the One who works no ill toward His neighbor has fulfilled the Law."

so what is it to work ill? and what is it to act in Love?

to Love is to Not steal from, cheat on, Lie about, kill, hurt, slander, covet things....... Love is the fulfilment of the Law, in other words if yu are really Keeping the Law, you will really be Loving others. if you are saying Just Love and also treating them as God says not to, its Not really Love. Love doesnt replace everything, it is what the fulfillment of everything is.

it shows us that Gods commandments are a good thing for us, not an oppression, they are God teaching People about eternal Life and the ways of Gods children who will Live forever. the commandments are summarized in the phrase "Love one another" to Love will always be the same

1 john 5:2-3 "By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.3For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous."

theres no way to seperate the two Love is Only a brief way of saying all thats in the Law, a Brief way to comprehend the Law is to understand the Law teaches man How to Love each other, and the Gospel gives us the ability to do so. to Love is to walk in the ways of God, to walk in the ways God has taught, is to Love One another and Love God first. the Bible is a Lesson book, Not merely a History book or theology sun=bjest, it is what teaches the character and nature of Gods People. its Menat to be Learned accepted and Lived, that is the Best Kept secret in the Modern Church, the Word of God is Meant to Learn and do.

MarcR · Oct 13, 2017

followjesus said:

seems that so many continue to remove these commandments of God from christianity, can anyone really disagree with them though? who can say its irrelevant whether you have a different god than the only true God? or its irrelevant whether you steal? Kill? commit adultery? Lie? covet? its sad that so few see the value of God the Creator and final authorities Words goven to His creation, when He has made it of utmost importance from the start. imagine if all people looked at these as the Law and obeyed it......a world of peace and Harmony would result...think it through before you tell people the covenant Law doesnt apply, think about what you are saying doesnt apply. Gods Word is good and right, and for mankinds good.

exodus 20:1-17 "And God spake all these words, saying,
2I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.3Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
4Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: 5Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;6And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.
7Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain; for the LORD will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.
8Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:10But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: 11For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
12Honour thy father and thy mother: that thy days may be long upon the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee.
13Thou shalt not kill.
14Thou shalt not commit adultery.
15Thou shalt not steal.
16Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour.
17Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's.

God bless you and enlighten the Mind within you and teach you to Love His ways beginning with the ten commandments, i would encourage you to share more of what God said, rather than opinions and popular ways of man.

As I see it:

The issue is that the 10 Commandments, like the Law, can't be kept to God's standard by our own efforts. Regardless how much we might agree with them we understand that in our own strength we are unable to obey them.
Jesus kept them perfectly on our behalf; so we are free from the consequence of our failings. The Holy spirit within us works to cause us both to will and to do His good pleasure. Our obedience comes not from our conscious effort; but, rather, from The Spirit working in and through us. We need not have the 10 commandments on our mind because the Holy Spirit puts them into our behavior.

dcontroversal · Oct 13, 2017

followjesus said:

Not at all condensed, but summarized, into a phrase that includes all of it.

romans 13 "Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.9For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 10Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law."

are you saying that Love thy neighbor replaces the Law??? or is it a summary to briefly comprehend the Law ? Paul specifically names 5 of the ten commandments and says " and if there be any other commandment it is breifly comprehended in this saying " Love thy neighbor as thyself" for the One who works no ill toward His neighbor has fulfilled the Law."

so what is it to work ill? and what is it to act in Love?

to Love is to Not steal from, cheat on, Lie about, kill, hurt, slander, covet things....... Love is the fulfilment of the Law, in other words if yu are really Keeping the Law, you will really be Loving others. if you are saying Just Love and also treating them as God says not to, its Not really Love. Love doesnt replace everything, it is what the fulfillment of everything is.

it shows us that Gods commandments are a good thing for us, not an oppression, they are God teaching People about eternal Life and the ways of Gods children who will Live forever. the commandments are summarized in the phrase "Love one another" to Love will always be the same

1 john 5:2-3 "By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.3For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous."

theres no way to seperate the two Love is Only a brief way of saying all thats in the Law, a Brief way to comprehend the Law is to understand the Law teaches man How to Love each other, and the Gospel gives us the ability to do so. to Love is to walk in the ways of God, to walk in the ways God has taught, is to Love One another and Love God first. the Bible is a Lesson book, Not merely a History book or theology sun=bjest, it is what teaches the character and nature of Gods People. its Menat to be Learned accepted and Lived, that is the Best Kept secret in the Modern Church, the Word of God is Meant to Learn and do.

The law condemns and points to guilt Romans 3....and yes they are condensed into 2....if a man loves God and their neighbor by default will be doing the 5 that Paul speaks to........regardless.....the Law by design proves guilt because no man except Jesus can keep them 24/7/365.......hence the law being our schoolmaster which takes us by the hand straight to the promise land like MOSES DID and yet it takes a SAVIOR "Joshua" to lead into that land of rest!

Nehemiah6 · Oct 13, 2017

Magenta said:

Just keep in mind that in the Old Covenant the Ten Commandments were written in stone. But the same commandments are written on hearts and minds in the New Covenant, and expressed through perfect love for God and neighbor by the power of the Holy Spirit.

the ten commandments

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